Banks and immigration. A short story

[1happykamper]

This story was born all because of the idea of renewing my Thai drivers license and opening a bank account. Two items which are fairly easy to do in most countries that I have visited or lived in. I've lived in seven countries and visited forty... so I'm familiar with "change".

 

I've lived in Thailand since 2015 and Jomtien Beach since June 2021. 

 

So the first step is learning about the requirements. What do you need for a driver's license and a bank account? Both had one thing in common, a "certificate of residency", which is only issued by Thailand immigration. I visited Pattaya branch of Thailand immigration for the first time. I only stayed 10 minutes because it was obvious, at 3:00 PM in the afternoon, that the office was chaotic and full. I planned to return a few days later when things would be calmer.

 

Certificate of Residency.. Thailand immigration is certifying my address. Remember this. 

 

I returned a few days later at 1:15 PM. Things were far from calm... . maybe 200 people outside and god knows how many inside the building. Yes, I counted them. Approximately 200 people were waiting outside. 100 people in the same line as me. I call them Disney lines... the lines that weave up and down. I waited one hour and 30 minutes just to enter the building. Keep in mind that I'm 72 years old outside in Thailand steam bath. Then I waited another 10 minutes and a line to get information inside the office. I thought I had all the required documents, but they changed the requirement, instead of a lease agreement, now they wanted a TM-30 as proof of my address. An address which, by the way, I could move from tomorrow. They sent me to a room which would duplicate my TM-30. I waited 40 minutes for that duplicate. Right above the window where I collected this all important certificate was the requirements.... which offered a lease agreement as proof of address. Give me a break.. 

 

They sent me back to information, information, looked at all my documentation. They said everything was fine. It is now 3:50 and they sent me home. Come back tomorrow they said, even though I insisted I stay because they don't close until 4:30. Geeeeeez 

 

I returned the next day. I returned this time at 3:00 PM. I went straight into the building this time since I had a fast pass now. Slightly less crowded now. I also needed a photograph of me for each certificate 555. One hour and 10 minutes of waiting and I was asked to pay 900 baht for the three original certificate of residency. No copies (could be different in Chon Buri) are accepted at DLT or the bank. One for my motorbike, one for my car, one for the bank. Then they told me they wanted money. And I said, oh, I'm in no hurry. I had read online that if you want to wait one or two weeks, then it's free. No, they stopped that I was informed. So I paid 900 baht and I asked her receipt. No receipt, they said go away! Seriously 555. Krabi.. completely free.. wait 20 minutes and no photo needed. 

 

 The first time I visited immigration here in Jomtien... the security man, a volunteer, prodded my chest two times. You, you. You wear your mask. I'm surprised I didn't break his f#cking fingers off. Very bad guy. If a Thai man did that to another Thai man... what do you think would happen? A big fight. Maybe death. 

 

So now I have my residency certificate which was required by Bank of Bangkok. 

I went to the bank... Confident I had the required docs.. Passport... Retirement stamp.. Certificate of residency. Easy enough. They wanted a letter from my landlord. Why I asked ? Then they said they wanted the original lease. I don't have that. You told me (a week earlier) I needed the certificate of residency. That confirms THAT! That's the whole point of the certification! I lost my sh#t in that branch on Beach Road. The woman was a complete c#nt. Very disrespectful. Other ridiculous questions and forms were required at 2 other branches! Finally got a new account. Funny thing is... I HAVE a Bank of Bangkok account.. In Chiang Mai... at a branch that was  closed down! 

 

This whole bureaucratic system in Thailand is a bunch of horse manure. It's absolutely ridiculous. Nobody in Thailand government follows the same rules. 

In immigration this morning, for example.. and this is  funny, I needed to use the toilet. An immigration staff pointed me to the door. Go there he said. Well. The door said "staff only".That's OK, the immigration staff said. So I went inside and a different immigration officer man kicked me out as I'm waiting inside to use the toilet! Funny but pathetic. 

 

Foreigners in Thailand remember how well they were treated in their home country and there was.... Consistency.

 

Here in Thailand maybe those that smash up 7-11 shops, or get drunk and pick fights with 5 Thai men have had a tough day in Thailand... all they wanted was Certificate of residency but just never got it. Just guessing. 

 

That's how bad the organization is. They don't know even who is allowed to use the toilet! I can see why people leave Thailand because it's a totally f#cked up, bureaucratic nightmare of a country. But I've been here eight years and I've stayed here 80% of the time. There are no better alternatives. Believe me, I've traveled to Bali.. Vietnam... Portugal... Spain... all the current hot spots. Mexico was good from 2012 until 2015... then the cartel threw away the rule book on leaving expats and tourists alone.

Thailand. A love hate, codependent relationship.

 

Next week... Renew my Licenses. What could go wrong! 5555 5555

[Leaver]

37 minutes ago, 1happykamper said:

This whole bureaucratic system in Thailand is a bunch of horse manure.

 

No.  The whole bureaucratic system in Thailand is designed to have you seek out the services of an agent. 

 

Pay the agent, simple and easy for everything.  Don't pay the agent, and you get f*#ked around. 

 

How much do you value your sanity? 

[Furioso]

NGL Leaver has a great point, the agents are interwoven into all the Thai bureaucracy. I wanted to do everything myself too, but in the end I hired an agent and guess what? I got First Class service.

 

I consider living here in Thailand a priviledge, I can see most of these Thai's are struggling. I tip well and I pay agents for excellent service. What I save in just ONE MONTH pays for a year of what I pay out. 

 

I even befriended my agent, one day she told me one of the govt. employees at the DMV was making her life difficult. I said "well, I paid you 4,000 Baht and you gave me great service, right?" Her problem with the DMV gal got solved that very day. 

Edited January 28, 2023 by Furioso
I made a typo, therefore I had to edit this post. I deeply apologize for any convenience I may have caused.

[1happykamper]

... I should add... That I STILL needed to return for FOURTH TIME to pick up the actual 3 certificates... and guess what... Immigration staff handed me just TWO! Another 15 minute wait while they fixed that cluster f. You can't hire writers to think up stories like this. 5555 Maybe old Monty Python writers would have done a fine job. 

[scubascuba3]

That wasn't a short story

[flyingtlger]

You need a Thai local that can speak Thai and translate everything for you, the majority of your problems will be solved. Also, you might want to get up earlier to get your business done instead of going in the afternoon and expect civil servants to accommodate your needs. After lunch, all they're thinking of is going home 555!

[Olmate]

9 minutes ago, flyingtlger said:

You need a Thai local that can speak Thai and translate everything for you, the majority of your problems will be solved. Also, you might want to get up earlier to get your business done instead of going in the afternoon and expect civil servants to accommodate your needs. After lunch, all they're thinking of is going home 555!

Yep, 3pm, "overit" time.! 

[rankric]

You were in no rush you said, clearly. Who arrives at immigration at 3pm. This story would never have needed to be written if you had planned your activities properly. 

[jaywalker2]

1 hour ago, rankric said:

You were in no rush you said, clearly. Who arrives at immigration at 3pm. This story would never have needed to be written if you had planned your activities properly. 

He still would have had the same problems. He just would have had them earlier in the day. Everything he said about the bureaucratic hurdles you have to go through here is true. I don't know why anybody would even bother contesting it.

[ThailandRyan]

@1happykamper

Just wait until you move again and need to change your address on your licenses and the vehicle owners books...lol...more fun.

[kinyara]

I decided is was a good opportunity to open an additional bank account during COVID when business activity in Pattaya was at an all time low and immigration was devoid of tourists, there are ways and means of helping yourself minimise official hassles with a bit of planning. 

 

I'd always recommend anyone going to be based in Pattaya contemplating retirement to ensure their initial Non O is obtained in Sep/Oct. 

[bob smith]

I can't say I disagree with much of what you have said. Thailand is indeed a bureaucratic nightmare but that's how the Thais like it.

 

Either learn to live with it or the Emergency EXIT door is always open should you wish to use it.

Edited January 29, 2023 by bob smith

[BananaStrong]

6 hours ago, Furioso said:

I consider living here in Thailand a priviledge

I honestly consider it a privilege that I'm here!!!!  I've help hundreds of Thais, donated tons of stuff worth well over 100k, etc.....

 

They should very VERY lucky I came here.

 

Not the other way around.      Maybe the first few weeks here I was overwhelmed, but it wasn't long until I realized I offer way more value than value given to me.

 

 

[Gsxrnz]

Personally, I find the disorganized Thai bureaucratic system much less tyrannical than the organized and brutal bureaucracy of my home country, the Democratic Socialist Republic of New Zealand.

[Smokey and the Bandit]

2 hours ago, flyingtlger said:

You need a Thai local that can speak Thai and translate everything for you, the majority of your problems will be solved. Also, you might want to get up earlier to get your business done instead of going in the afternoon and expect civil servants to accommodate your needs. After lunch, all they're thinking of is going home 555!

Immigration is there for foreigners, Thais in general don't go there, unless with a a partner? Surely the guys at Immigration should speak good English, at least? Some do some don't? Why should you need a Thai person to translate?

[1happykamper]

2 hours ago, rankric said:

You were in no rush you said, clearly. Who arrives at immigration at 3pm. This story would never have needed to be written if you had planned your activities properly. 

OK Einstein... When should I have gone? Monday and Fridays.. Stay away... This is basic. .. But I was there at various hours of the day AND I occasionally walk by that place.. It was always a busy mess. 

 

41 minutes ago, kinyara said:

I decided is was a good opportunity to open an additional bank account during COVID when business activity in Pattaya was at an all time low and immigration was devoid of tourists, there are ways and means of helping yourself minimise official hassles with a bit of planning. 

 

I'd always recommend anyone going to be based in Pattaya contemplating retirement to ensure their initial Non O is obtained in Sep/Oct. 

So you telling me to plan a pandemic to get in and out faster. Gotchya. 

 

I agree on the visa timing. However these items couldn't wait... Licenses and new bank account. 

Edited January 29, 2023 by 1happykamper
I goofed

[brianthainess]

1 hour ago, ThailandRyan said:

@1happykamper

Just wait until you move again and need to change your address on your licenses and the vehicle owners books...lol...more fun.

Well it might be a lot easier away from Pattaya/Jomtien, most IO it is free, and less queues, the joys of living anywhere near Pattaya LOL,  there is NO official charge but a 3day wait is normal.

[mikeymike100]

37 minutes ago, Smokey and the Bandit said:

Immigration is there for foreigners, Thais in general don't go there, unless with a a partner? Surely the guys at Immigration should speak good English, at least? Some do some don't? Why should you need a Thai person to translate?

Got to agree, unless you don't speak pretty good English, you shouldn't need a Thai translator with you?

[kinyara]

14 minutes ago, 1happykamper said:

OK Einstein... When should I have gone? Monday and Fridays.. Stay away... This is basic. .. But I was there at various hours of the day AND I occasionally walk by that place.. It was always a busy mess. 

 

So you telling me to plan a pandemic to get in and out faster. Gotchya. 

 

I agree on the visa timing. However these items couldn't wait... Licenses and new bank account. 

You said you've been in Jomtien since June 2021 so you didn't have to plan a pandemic it was in full swing, so you missed taking advantage of a rather large window of opportunity. Similarly you can renew your driving licence 3 months before expiry date, I'm sure it would have been a little less time consuming queueing wise if you had gone end of October rather the wait to peak high season at immigration. The point is not leaving things until they can't wait but to schedule for less busy periods where possible.

 

 Do we take it you are no longer a happy camper.

[brianthainess]

9 hours ago, Leaver said:

No.  The whole bureaucratic system in Thailand is designed to have you seek out the services of an agent. 

Sorry but not the Whole system, I tried to get a resident Cert the same day and asked my IO can I pay an 'express fee' NO! come back in 3 days. 

[brianthainess]

5 minutes ago, mikeymike100 said:

Got to agree, unless you don't speak pretty good English, you shouldn't need a Thai translator with you?

I had to translate for a 'English' guy in the bank not long ago, the staff couldn't understand his  BRUMMY (Birmingham) accent . 'Pretty good' do you think they would understand that terminology ?

[brianthainess]

52 minutes ago, Smokey and the Bandit said:

Immigration is there for foreigners, Thais in general don't go there, unless with a a partner? Surely the guys at Immigration should speak good English, at least? Some do some don't? Why should you need a Thai person to translate?

'Are there'. There fixed your English. 

[mrbojangles]

10 hours ago, Leaver said:

 

No.  The whole bureaucratic system in Thailand is designed to have you seek out the services of an agent. 

I would say I agree with that at Jomtien office but up country it's extremely easy in my experience and no agent required. The requirements are the same but the Immigration Officers are helpful, unlike Jomtien where they pick holes in anything so you get fed up and go through an agent.

 

It took me 4 visits on my first extension at Jomtien (with my wife of 20 years present) and that desk messed us about. They wanted a longer lease for the rented house that we had, so went and got that. Then they wanted a better copy of the blue book (even though it was good enough for the other counters to file the TM30 and get residence certs), so we got that. Then they wanted a copy of the chanote, even though they hadn't asked for that in any of the other checklist visits. Then they wanted a better copy. After the 4 visits I think they realised I wasn't getting an agent and passed everything. The following year I did it up country and hassle free.

[Smokey and the Bandit]

35 minutes ago, brianthainess said:

'Are there'. There fixed your English. 

Quite, you should work in immigration?????

[crouchpeter]

1 hour ago, Gsxrnz said:

Personally, I find the disorganized Thai bureaucratic system much less tyrannical than the organized and brutal bureaucracy of my home country, the Democratic Socialist Republic of New Zealand.

Might get better once Horseface pisses off!

[Kopitiam]

1 hour ago, BananaStrong said:

Not the other way around.      Maybe the first few weeks here I was overwhelmed, but it wasn't long until I realized I offer way more value than value given to me.

And you are still here in Thailand.  Something positive must have kept you here.

[crouchpeter]

This is a "short story", compared to my driving licence renewal. New address and new passport= 3 day nightmare! And then, even though I've got cataracts (fixed soon I hope?), they did everything to pass me, tapping me on the arm when the 2 sticks were aligned, giving me 2 or 3 guesses to get the colours right. And didn't even put "glasses" on my licence! Lovely people.

[BananaStrong]

7 minutes ago, Kopitiam said:

And you are still here in Thailand.  Something positive must have kept you here.

I like helping the poor.  Giving them clothes, a little money, etc.....it makes me feel good.    Plus I'm a little lazy when it comes to packing and moving.   Especially with COVID (before), but that's changing.   

 

In America, people have given me the equivalent of 300,000 baht for work, bonuses, gifts, whatever.... plus some luck added a few extra zeros.   I didn't have a hard life, at all, even thought I thought life was hard at times.

 

It's my time to give back a little bit.   

 

I would be 100000000000000000x more productive back home, but I like to put a smile on the faces of those less fortunate.   Even once a week is better than back home...............back home you had to have the RIGHT BMW model or you were a loser.  I played that game for too long.  Driving a paddle shifting LEXUS wasn't even fun.  Living in a 2.5 million USD dollar house felt like a prison, and I hate working. lol.  But people like me and give me work that has nice perks.   I have the education and experience to back it up............

 

Impossible to tell if I made the right decision.  In some aspects, yes, but in some, definitely not.

 

Not retired yet, so I still have time to ponder life's mysteries.   

Edited January 29, 2023 by BananaStrong

[buick]

2 hours ago, kinyara said:

I decided is was a good opportunity to open an additional bank account during COVID when business activity in Pattaya was at an all time low and immigration was devoid of tourists, there are ways and means of helping yourself minimise official hassles with a bit of planning. 

 

I'd always recommend anyone going to be based in Pattaya contemplating retirement to ensure their initial Non O is obtained in Sep/Oct. 

if you get a Non O in Sep/Oct, doesn't that mean you do you the one year extension 3 months later, in the peak of high season ?  i think you want to do the one year extension in Sep/Oct which means get the Non O three months prior.  May is a bad month for extension renewals also, alot of holidays in that month (i had May for a few years, now i have October).  June is a pretty good month for renewals.

[yeahbutif]

I agree with everything the op said but it won't change nothing.. on a similar note I went to open another bank account in the same bank that I have another account in already. They said need residents cirtificate. I said why same branch same address .he said rules of of bank.. I he and tm30 and Thai driving licence. But nope still needed cirtificate.. I left saying  stick the Extra account where the sun don't shine...