Biden rules out sending Ukraine F-16 jets

[Rimmer]

A troll post discussing moderation has been removed

[Kwasaki]

  On 2/1/2023 at 11:25 AM, Chomper Higgot said:

There’s a border, and the Russians crossed I then started killing people and destroying infrastructure and property.

 

Let’s keep prioritize sympathy for the victims of Russia’s illegal invasion.

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I knew you were going to say that. ????

[still kicking]

  On 2/1/2023 at 12:51 PM, Kwasaki said:

I knew you were going to say that. ????

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So the Russian invasion of the Ukraine is legal Comrade. 

[Kwasaki]

  On 2/1/2023 at 2:09 PM, still kicking said:

So the Russian invasion of the Ukraine is legal Comrade. 

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Ignorance is bliss, I guess I knew you would say that too, I have 7 kids, 12 grandchildren and 6 great grandchildren.

 

[still kicking]

  On 2/1/2023 at 2:24 PM, Kwasaki said:

Ignorance is bliss, I guess I knew you would say that too, I have 7 kids, 12 grandchildren and 6 great grandchildren.

 

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all in the Ukraine ?

[thaibeachlovers]

  On 2/1/2023 at 8:12 AM, thaibeachlovers said:

2 billion $ being the significant words.

I wonder how long financially devastated American citizens will accept such payments for a war a long way off, that does not threaten them.

I imagine some congress people will be getting letters from their constituents about it.

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Even more relevant with the discussion today between Biden and the leader of the house concerning the debt ceiling. The GOP want to reduce military spending, and one would imagine that it would be difficult to cut spending without impacting the support to Ukraine.

[thaibeachlovers]

  On 2/1/2023 at 2:09 PM, still kicking said:

So the Russian invasion of the Ukraine is legal Comrade. 

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Ah, nothing of relevance to say so resorting to personal attacks I see.

[Longwood50]

  On 2/1/2023 at 10:03 AM, San Fran Dan said:

Call Trump he organized it , Didn’t he bring Taliban to Camp David , didn’t he have 5,000 Militants Released Also <deleted> , The art of the deal lol

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You would be one who if they found a dead body in the trunk of Hillary's car with a gun with her fingerprints on it would blame Trump saying the evidence was planted. 

He did not release 5,000 militants the Afghans did.  One way or another Biden refused to heed the advise of his military advisors that they needed to stage a withdrawal out of Afghanistan.  He just left, abandoning both military equipment and U.S. citizens.  He was the one driving the bus at that time. Not Trump. 

If anyone deserves severe blame it is George W. Bush.  He was the one who pushed the U.S.A. into Afghanistan for absolutely no reason and with Zero chance of "winning" .  There is no "winning" when you occupy a country whose citizens don't suport you.  Korea and Vietnam already proved and so did the Russian experience in Afghanistan  Unless you are willing to occupy a country indefinitely and control it with military force you can not control the will of the local population.  

[placeholder]

  On 2/3/2023 at 5:02 AM, Longwood50 said:

He did not release 5,000 militants the Afghans did.  One way or another Biden refused to heed the advise of his military advisors that they needed to stage a withdrawal out of Afghanistan.  He just left, abandoning both military equipment and U.S. citizens.  He was the one driving the bus at that time. Not Trump. 

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"The release of 5,000 prisoners was a condition, agreed between the US and the Taliban after their peace talks last year, to begin these negotiations.

The Afghan government was not involved in making the agreement, and had concerns about releasing thousands of militants. Last month, Afghan President Ashraf Ghani warned that the prisoners' release was a "danger" to the world, AFP news agency reported at the time."

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-54155768

[placeholder]

  On 2/3/2023 at 5:02 AM, Longwood50 said:

You would be one who if they found a dead body in the trunk of Hillary's car with a gun with her fingerprints on it would blame Trump saying the evidence was planted. 

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Obsessed with Clinton much?

[300sd]

  On 2/1/2023 at 8:12 AM, thaibeachlovers said:

2 billion $ being the significant words.

I wonder how long financially devastated American citizens will accept such payments for a war a long way off, that does not threaten them.

I imagine some congress people will be getting letters from their constituents about it.

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On the contrary. This is the first war America is sponsoring that may threaten them directly. I would bet Russia has a nuclear sub sitting off the US coast right now! 

[placeholder]

  On 2/3/2023 at 9:52 AM, 300sd said:

On the contrary. This is the first war America is sponsoring that may threaten them directly. I would bet Russia has a nuclear sub sitting off the US coast right now! 

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Lucky for them they have that sub. Because without it, they would only have thousands of land-based ICBMs to commit suicide with.

[300sd]

  On 2/3/2023 at 10:01 AM, placeholder said:

Lucky for them they have that sub. Because without it, they would only have thousands of land-based ICBMs to commit suicide with.

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Not sure who may be committing suicide, and I really don't want to find out. Again, this is one time that the US could be threatened at home. If only they didn't have that sub huh.

[placeholder]

  On 2/3/2023 at 10:14 AM, 300sd said:

Not sure who may be committing suicide, and I really don't want to find out. Again, this is one time that the US could be threatened at home. If only they didn't have that sub huh.

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If you think Russia would survive as a nation after launching a nuclear war you're part of a very small minority. Are you familiar with the concept of mutually assured destruction?

[Salerno]

  On 2/3/2023 at 9:52 AM, 300sd said:

On the contrary. This is the first war America is sponsoring that may threaten them directly. I would bet Russia has a nuclear sub sitting off the US coast right now! 

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Russia only has a total of 11 SSBNs (only doesn't seem like a good word given how devastating one can be really) guarantee not all of them at sea or even seaworthy. The US alone has 53 attack submarines (again, not all will be at sea) plus add others from NATO. What would be the odds on there being a US sub just behind a Russian sub sitting off the coast watching for any hatches opening.

[heybruce]

  On 2/1/2023 at 10:44 PM, thaibeachlovers said:

Even more relevant with the discussion today between Biden and the leader of the house concerning the debt ceiling. The GOP want to reduce military spending, and one would imagine that it would be difficult to cut spending without impacting the support to Ukraine.

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"The GOP want to reduce military spending..."

 

Got a source for that claim?

[placeholder]

Fred Kaplan at Slate.com offers a very good explanation of the drawbacks and benefits of giving Ukraine F-16s

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2023/02/biden-ukraine-f16-fighter-planes.html

[thaibeachlovers]

  On 2/3/2023 at 9:52 AM, 300sd said:

On the contrary. This is the first war America is sponsoring that may threaten them directly. I would bet Russia has a nuclear sub sitting off the US coast right now! 

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Those subs have been threatening the US for MAD since they existed.

[VocalNeal]

  On 2/1/2023 at 10:23 AM, Jingthing said:

Ukraine has chosen to be independent from Russia. 

Russia can't accept that.

It's looking like the key to this war is probably Crimea.

Ukraine remakes Crimea which monster Putin stole in 2014 and its full circle. 

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Russia didn't want to lose its Mediterranean (southern) naval base in Sevastopol. 

The whole thing could have been avoided if Russia had asked for a Hongkong type 99 year lease on the area where most people speak Russian.

[Jingthing]

  On 2/6/2023 at 4:11 AM, VocalNeal said:

Russia didn't want to lose its Mediterranean (southern) naval base in Sevastopol. 

The whole thing could have been avoided if Russia had asked for a Hongkong type 99 year lease on the area where most people speak Russian.

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Naive analysis. Putin doesn't recognize Ukraine's existence. 

[VocalNeal]

^ Most layman's analysis is naïve. But that doesn't stop us theorizing.

[Jingthing]

  On 2/6/2023 at 4:38 AM, VocalNeal said:

^ Most layman's analysis is naïve. But that doesn't stop us theorizing.

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Much better to seek sources that are not naive that actually know a lot about the Russia Ukraine situation. 

 

 

[thaibeachlovers]

  On 2/6/2023 at 4:11 AM, VocalNeal said:

Russia didn't want to lose its Mediterranean (southern) naval base in Sevastopol. 

The whole thing could have been avoided if Russia had asked for a Hongkong type 99 year lease on the area where most people speak Russian.

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Just to be pedantic. Britain far as I know owned Hong Kong, but they depended on the New Territories to survive and the 99 year lease was on them.

Good point though.