Ivermectin not effective in treating Covid-19, joint Mahidol-Oxford study shows

[eisfeld]

1 hour ago, greg71 said:

My wife both had the original strain covid and were given invermectin at the hospitel here in bangkok at the time .In 3 days both were fine as gold . Those who say horse medicine etc have there heads firmly planted in the ground.

So you didn't go to a hospital but were in a hospitel which is just a hotel where they parked people for covid quarantine purposes. No idea who gave you invermectin there but it certainly wasn't a doctor.

 

That you got well relatively quickly is not evidence of anything. You most likely would have gotten well just as quickly taking nothing at all. Your immune system just did a good job. That's exactly why they do studies with many participants and have to follow methods that include control groups amongst other things in order to get any meaningful insight. Anecdata doesn't tell you anything and actually can be dangerously misleading.

 

We have 2023 and just passed a pandemic. One might lose the faith in humanity when grown up people still don't want to understand and acknowledge simple basic facts. It's like running around and claiming lucky charms work because that one time...

[xylophone]

1 minute ago, eisfeld said:

So you didn't go to a hospital but were in a hospitel which is just a hotel where they parked people for covid quarantine purposes. No idea who gave you invermectin there but it certainly wasn't a doctor.

 

That you got well relatively quickly is not evidence of anything. You most likely would have gotten well just as quickly taking nothing at all. Your immune system just did a good job. That's exactly why they do studies with many participants and have to follow methods that include control groups amongst other things in order to get any meaningful insight. Anecdata doesn't tell you anything and actually can be dangerously misleading.

 

We have 2023 and just passed a pandemic. One might lose the faith in humanity when grown up people still don't want to understand and acknowledge simple basic facts. It's like running around and claiming lucky charms work because that one time...

Agree, and trial after trial by different/various respectable organisations have proven that ivermectin is not effective against Covid, and these can be found on the Internet if one would wish to search for them.

 

I had the three vaccinations and then got Covid which was mild and only really lasted for three days, and the people who claim that ivermectin is effective against Covid are the typical anti-VAX/conspiracy theory type people, for whom I have no time.

[4MyEgo]

1 hour ago, connda said:

Neither myself or my wife have had Covid.

Good luck to you and your wife.

 

We all know one size doesn't fit all, so it's about choice and who would I be to call you an anti-vaxer, your choice not to take the vaccine.

 

Regarding Covid, both my wife and I had Pfizer (2) doses for her and (3) for me, we both had Covid, but didn't know it as it was that mild.

 

How did we know we had Covid, well I heard that a mate contracted it, he is in his 70's so has a decade on me and 3 decades on the wife. 

 

When I saw him, I said hey, I heard you had Covid, what were your symptoms and he told me of his symptoms, that said, the only one I could relate to was the headache that was at the back of my head, same with the wife, but we thought that was just the usual headache that also makes your eyes sensitive to the sun.

 

We are fairly fit, take our vitamin D, C, Zink, and other vitamins daily, eat well and exercise, so that could be why we didn't really notice that we had Covid.

 

Perhaps you have had it and didn't know, suffice to say, if we didn't take that test which showed the 2 faint lines, we wouldn't have know that we had it.

 

For the record, we won't be getting any further Covid shots due to the virus being weak, however if it became similar or worse than one of the previous strains (Delta), then I wouldn't hesitate, that would be my decision, and I am aware of all the BS that goes around on both sides of the fence, fact of the matter is, the vaccines didn't cost me anything, and I am still here breathing, till when is another matter.

 

Like you say, it's about choice, and we ALL have to respect each others choices, not bash each other about the head because of choices.

 

I don't know of anyone who has passed because of the vaccine, but I do know someone who passed because of Covid, she was 87 and unvaccinated by choice, and I respect her choice.

 

[ourmanflint]

No amount of proof will be enough for some people.

[bangon04]

1 hour ago, h90 said:

Which is very close to the pharma industry. I wouldn't call that an independent study.

so the "pharma industry" is quite happy that Invermectin will no longer be sold in large quantities to make a profit ??

[eisfeld]

8 minutes ago, xylophone said:

conspiracy theory type people, for whom I have no time.

This is a huge problem in our society that just seems to be getting worse. Unlike Covid-19, this one wont pass as easily. It's sometimes really difficult to ignore these people because they are also usually on the very "loud" spectrum by which I mean they'll talk about it constantly and religously. It gets tiring to have to counter their false claims over and over, knowing that many of them will refuse to understand. It's like a psychological virus that spreads and a shocking amount of adults have a inadequate mental immunesystem.

[eisfeld]

14 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

Like you say, it's about choice, and we ALL have to respect each others choices, not bash each other about the head because of choices.

 

I don't know of anyone who has passed because of the vaccine, but I do know someone who passed because of Covid, she was 87 and unvaccinated by choice, and I respect her choice.

I agree it is important that people are given a choice and should be able to refuse treatment BUT choices have consequences. And it gets complicated when someones choice impacts others. Same as drunk driving. I don't care if one drinks and then dies because they drive into a tree. What I do care about is that they are endangering other people while doing so.

 

I think the key word is responsibility. Be free to do something but do it responsibly.

[4MyEgo]

1 minute ago, eisfeld said:

I agree it is important that people are given a choice and should be able to refuse treatment BUT choices have consequences.

Agree, however, we have now found out that we had been lied to by ALL governments telling us to take the vaccines to stop the infection spreading.

 

There has been no evidence to support that, that said, if there is no evidence that the vaccines stop the spread of infections, then people should have the choice to decide whether they should take the vaccine or not.

 

I'm not a conspiracy theorist, as mentioned, I have been vaxed 3 times, I also would have thought twice about being vaccinated if I knew that it doesn't stop the virus from spreading.

 

Even though I have had just about every vaccine imaginable over my years on this earth, they were always by choice, e.g. Dr's explaining to me, the benefits and the downsides, however we all know Covid vaccines were rushed, and lots of lies were told, so I don't believe we all had choices in that regard.

 

Do I regret getting vaccinated, no, do I regret believing governments and big pharma, so far yes.

[AndyFoxy]

4 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

So your an antivaxxer. You are aware that any medications and vaccines can cause people to have reactions to them right? 

That’s a big jump……from someone saying ivermectin works to that person being an anti-vaxxer

[AndyFoxy]

2 hours ago, greg71 said:

My wife both had the original strain covid and were given invermectin at the hospitel here in bangkok at the time .In 3 days both were fine as gold . Those who say horse medicine etc have there heads firmly planted in the ground.

Yes. They are just repeating what they see from some clueless talking head on TV. Lazy in my opinion.

[h90]

29 minutes ago, bangon04 said:

so the "pharma industry" is quite happy that Invermectin will no longer be sold in large quantities to make a profit ??

there is no profit on Ivermectin....100 pills cost like $3
And it is sold in large quantities in Africa against parasites. (worms and similar)

[Pedrogaz]

2 hours ago, greg71 said:

My wife both had the original strain covid and were given invermectin at the hospitel here in bangkok at the time .In 3 days both were fine as gold . Those who say horse medicine etc have there heads firmly planted in the ground.

Ivermectin was developed by Merck and co for river blindness, a parasitic infection endemic to Africa. Merck gave it away free to the poor people who developed it. Merck were so proud of it that in their headquarters they had a statue commissioned showing a young black boy holding a stick and behind him, holding the other end of the stick was a blind man....a river blindness victim. The veterinary indications came later. Fauci's comments about 'horse medicine' and the like were asinine in the extreme and really got up my nose.

[eisfeld]

14 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

Agree, however, we have now found out that we had been lied to by ALL governments telling us to take the vaccines to stop the infection spreading.

I don't remember the government of my home country Germany claiming that. The overall consensus was always that vaccines help both reduce the severity of the disease as well as reducing the spread. They did not claim it would stop infection completely.

That's nothing new, that's how vaccines always worked. And hey for some minority of people they even cause serious issues. It's all a statistical game of big numbers. I have no doubt they helped a lot and are definitely a net positive. Always be sceptical of absolute claims.

[BritManToo]

7 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

I don't remember the government of my home country Germany claiming that. The overall consensus was always that vaccines help both reduce the severity of the disease as well as reducing the spread. They did not claim it would stop infection completely.

That's nothing new, that's how vaccines always worked. And hey for some minority of people they even cause serious issues. It's all a statistical game of big numbers. I have no doubt they helped a lot and are definitely a net positive. Always be sceptical of absolute claims.

I had Polio vaccine, and never caught polio, tetanus vaccine, and never caught tetanus, whooping cough vaccine and never caught whooping cough ........ that's how I expect vaccines to work.

Also had COVID vaccine x2 and caught COVID 2x.

 

So I would dispute your claim that vaccines aren't expected to stop you catching the disease.

Edited February 24, 2023 by BritManToo

[ThailandRyan]

21 minutes ago, AndyFoxy said:

That’s a big jump……from someone saying ivermectin works to that person being an anti-vaxxer

Where did I say ivermectin worked for covid. Read my posts again and your trolling with your comment.

 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.theguardian.com/media/2021/nov/03/how-anti-vaxxers-and-ivermectin-advocates-have-co-opted-local-news&ved=2ahUKEwjpysz22a39AhX0SmwGHYDIBF8QFnoECBoQAQ&usg=AOvVaw3IzMJTkeBtGG-l5Wailcf_

Edited February 24, 2023 by ThailandRyan

[BritManToo]

47 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

This is a huge problem in our society that just seems to be getting worse. Unlike Covid-19, this one wont pass as easily. It's sometimes really difficult to ignore these people because they are also usually on the very "loud" spectrum by which I mean they'll talk about it constantly and religously. It gets tiring to have to counter their false claims over and over, knowing that many of them will refuse to understand. It's like a psychological virus that spreads and a shocking amount of adults have a inadequate mental immunesystem.

IMHO the 'you must take the vaccine and wear face masks' claimants have been far more vociferous than the anti-vaxxers ever were. Not to mention Google/Facebook/Twitter et al censoring the anti-vaxxers and promoting the vaxxers.

 

Anti-vaxxers appear to have no wish in imposing their wills on pro-vaxxers.

They just want to be left alone, their bodies, their choice.

Edited February 24, 2023 by BritManToo

[hotandsticky]

2 hours ago, connda said:

"You’re not going to get COVID if you have these vaccinations."
"If you’re vaccinated, you’re not going to be hospitalized, you’re not going to be in the ICU unit, and you’re not going to die."
- US President Joe Biden, CNN Townhall, June 2021

“Our data from the CDC today suggests that vaccinated people do not carry the virus, don’t get sick.”
CDC Director Rochelle Walensky in CNN interview, April 2021

 

 

He didn't tell me.

 

I was fully aware that the main purpose of the vaccine was to limit the most serious possible effects of the virus.At no point did I think that they would protect me from getting the virus  -  a mask was probably more effective!

[BritManToo]

1 minute ago, hotandsticky said:

 

 

He didn't tell me.

 

I was fully aware that the main purpose of the vaccine was to limit the most serious possible effects of the virus.At no point did I think that they would protect me from getting the virus  -  a mask was probably more effective!

I followed all the rules and still caught COVID 2x, masks and vaccine totally ineffective IMHO.

[hotchilli]

5 hours ago, webfact said:

The study that was published on the peer-reviewed eLife medical journal found that high doses of the drug ivermectin, controversially recommended by some high-profile political and media figures during the pandemic, is ineffective at treating the virus.

Well who'd have thought that, high-profile political figures and media figures not knowing what they're talking about.

[AndyFoxy]

33 minutes ago, ThailandRyan said:

Where did I say ivermectin worked for covid. Read my posts again and your trolling with your comment.

 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.theguardian.com/media/2021/nov/03/how-anti-vaxxers-and-ivermectin-advocates-have-co-opted-local-news&ved=2ahUKEwjpysz22a39AhX0SmwGHYDIBF8QFnoECBoQAQ&usg=AOvVaw3IzMJTkeBtGG-l5Wailcf_

Where did I say that you said that Ivermectin worked.? Stop making stuff up. Labelling people as trolls and antivaxxers is the route for …..well I will leave it there.

 

Samuttodd said IVM worked for him and you jumped to the conclusion he was an antivaxxer. Try to slow down and stop being offended by something that was never said. You’ll be happier and probably live longer too.

Edited February 24, 2023 by AndyFoxy

[Rimmer]

Misleading unattributed post removed

[h90]

55 minutes ago, eisfeld said:

I don't remember the government of my home country Germany claiming that. The overall consensus was always that vaccines help both reduce the severity of the disease as well as reducing the spread. They did not claim it would stop infection completely.

That's nothing new, that's how vaccines always worked. And hey for some minority of people they even cause serious issues. It's all a statistical game of big numbers. I have no doubt they helped a lot and are definitely a net positive. Always be sceptical of absolute claims.

on the very beginning, just before the release they discussed that this vaccine is 90% that vaccine 95% effective for protecting you from getting the virus. Later for a long time they claimed that it helps to reduce the spread and that was the reason for the vaccine mandates.

[transam]

56 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I followed all the rules and still caught COVID 2x, masks and vaccine totally ineffective IMHO.

Even washing your hands regularly  ?.......................................

[transam]

16 minutes ago, h90 said:

on the very beginning, just before the release they discussed that this vaccine is 90% that vaccine 95% effective for protecting you from getting the virus. Later for a long time they claimed that it helps to reduce the spread and that was the reason for the vaccine mandates.

Link....

[eisfeld]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

I had Polio vaccine, and never caught polio, tetanus vaccine, and never caught tetanus, whooping cough vaccine and never caught whooping cough ........ that's how I expect vaccines to work.

Also had COVID vaccine x2 and caught COVID 2x.

 

So I would dispute your claim that vaccines aren't expected to stop you catching the disease.

You didn't understand what I said. I said there are no absolute guarantees that they stop it 100%. Of course they reduce it. And the amount of reduction depends on the virus, the vaccine and the person amongst numerous other factors.

 

You fell into the exact trap I mentioned: jumping from anecdata to absolute expectation or claim.

 

56 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I followed all the rules and still caught COVID 2x, masks and vaccine totally ineffective IMHO.

Here another example of what I outlined above. "I got vaccinated and wore a mask but still got covid and so vaccines and masks are useless.". No, that's not how it works. And I'm not going to explain it again.

 

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

IMHO the 'you must take the vaccine and wear face masks' claimants have been far more vociferous than the anti-vaxxers ever were. Not to mention Google/Facebook/Twitter et al censoring the anti-vaxxers and promoting the vaxxers.

 

Anti-vaxxers appear to have no wish in imposing their wills on pro-vaxxers.

They just want to be left alone, their bodies, their choice.

The difference between the two factions is who has the facts on their side. Of course anti-vaxxers wish to impose their point of view on others. Otherwise they wouldn't spew their wild claims over and over. For example claiming that ivermectin can help treat covid-19. They have their own agenda and want to advance that.

 

People were not forced to get an injection and as explained earlier, choices have consequences for others too. You don't live in an isolated bubble without effect on others.

[zzaa09]

4 hours ago, ozimoron said:

There was anecdotal evidence that vaccinations saved all their lives or at least didn't let them get very ill and hospitalised. Why do you reject that anecdotal evidence?

So much for basic fact checking.....

[BritScot]

5 hours ago, ThailandRyan said:

So your an antivaxxer. You are aware that any medications and vaccines can cause people to have reactions to them right? 

Here we go again with the "anti vax" rubbish! Maybe try and take a look out of your echo box. Things have changed, try looking up this figure 1/800 injured/killed (really shocking figure now emerging from government agencies). It is and always has been accepted that it helps fight viral infections for many years (well up until 2021). Vitimin D3 is now proven in several peer reviewed papers greatly improves immune defense. One can now go on and on. Masks that were known (with many peer reviewed papers written) pre 2021 not to stop a virus due to its size, masks have other purposes. Maybe it's time to stop the slurs or change from anti vaxer to informed and vax fans to the uninformed. It is upto the individual not the collective "We are not Borg".

[eisfeld]

26 minutes ago, h90 said:

on the very beginning, just before the release they discussed that this vaccine is 90% that vaccine 95% effective for protecting you from getting the virus. Later for a long time they claimed that it helps to reduce the spread and that was the reason for the vaccine mandates.

This is a misunderstanding on your part. I marked bold the part that you added. The real claim stops at "90% effective". It does not mean that it protects you with a 90% chance from getting the virus. The percentage is the vaccine efficacy which defines the relative rate of contracting the disease and NOT the rate of getting infected with the virus nor the rate of spreading it to others.

 

See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaccine_efficacy

[hotandsticky]

2 hours ago, BritManToo said:

I followed all the rules and still caught COVID 2x, masks and vaccine totally ineffective IMHO.

 

 

Masks have limited use IMO but are better than nothing at the height of a pandemic - they are not the suit of armour that the Thais think they are. I am happy to believe that the vaccine may have limited the effects of the virus when I caught Covid.

[ozimoron]

58 minutes ago, zzaa09 said:

So much for basic fact checking.....

The OP is facts.

 

53 minutes ago, BritScot said:

Here we go again with the "anti vax" rubbish! Maybe try and take a look out of your echo box. Things have changed, try looking up this figure 1/800 injured/killed (really shocking figure now emerging from government agencies). It is and always has been accepted that it helps fight viral infections for many years (well up until 2021). Vitimin D3 is now proven in several peer reviewed papers greatly improves immune defense. One can now go on and on. Masks that were known (with many peer reviewed papers written) pre 2021 not to stop a virus due to its size, masks have other purposes. Maybe it's time to stop the slurs or change from anti vaxer to informed and vax fans to the uninformed. It is upto the individual not the collective "We are not Borg".

Perhaps try producing a link so we can fact check your anti vax claims? It's mandatory if you want to comment here.