It's Hot (What if Global Warming is Here?)

[NorthernRyland]

13 hours ago, nigelforbes said:

After about 4:30pm it's OK where we are (30 kms North of Chiang Mai). Overnight is cool and pleasant and the morning the same,

CM is hotter than hell right now. Going 30k north of anywhere in Thailand is not going to help.

[Jonathan Swift]

14 hours ago, Crossy said:

"Global Warming" is passé, it's now "Climate Change". Same, same!

 

Climate Change is real enough, just how much of it is caused by us is debatable but it's definitely not "none".

 

Debatable by the uneducated or those in denial for various reasons, most of them crooked and political. No debate among experts. The evidence is incontrovertible, if you're educated enough to understand it. That's not meant as in insult, it's just that this is not simple science, it's quite complex on many levels. But the science has been done. Problem is a lot of people overestimate their grasp of such things. Splitting hairs over blame doesn't matter at this point anyway, if we let it continue we're headed for catastrophe after catastrophe, and a lot of loss and suffering. 

[Yellowtail]

6 minutes ago, Jonathan Swift said:

Debatable by the uneducated or those in denial for various reasons, most of them crooked and political. No debate among experts. The evidence is incontrovertible, if you're educated enough to understand it. That's not meant as in insult, it's just that this is not simple science, it's quite complex on many levels. But the science has been done. Problem is a lot of people overestimate their grasp of such things. Splitting hairs over blame doesn't matter at this point anyway, if we let it continue we're headed for catastrophe after catastrophe, and a lot of loss and suffering. 

Okay, so if it is not debatable, exactly how much of it is caused by humans and how much is not?  

[Jonathan Swift]

You're asking a Thai Visa forum "what if global warming is here" when  you won't get anything useful in response. This is not a forum of experts and scientists.  Anyone at this point in time who has doubts about this is so far out of the information loop or so deeply in denial that no amount of information will likely be of any use. I'm no expert, but my opinion would be that it is difficult to say whether unusually hot weather in Thailand right now is directly caused by climate change. Statistically, given the average global rise in temperature, it is likely. But averages are of limited use, since some areas see a higher rise than others. But if you WANT to answer your questions, go to where the answers actually exist. Search generally on climate change Southeast Asia, You might try including the year 2023, You can compare seasonal temperatures going back 10-20 years using graphs, you can research the damage from tropical storms over the last 20 years and see whether they've gotten worse, you can search on general climate disruptions and catastrophes, Tsunamis, Hurricanes, over the last 20 years, THAT is the only way you will get reliable information - to research it yourself and draw your own conclusions. One factor that confuses people and is often used to deny climate change is the disruption of normal wind and ocean currents that occurs with overall warming. This has precipitated record high snowfalls in otherwise more temperate areas of the US. So then the deniers point and say "see! it's colder, not warmer". meanwhile the polar icecaps are melting at a record rate to the extent that polar bears are in danger of dying out through loss of habitat. The overall disruption of weather patterns is likely to become a catastrophe in and of itself. Here is one specific research report. Remember that a rise of a single degree on average may not sound like much, but the impact overall is huge. This is only one source out of many. If you want your questions answered accurately you will need to do some work. Try Youtube, maybe a visual explanation will be easier for you, but be sure of who you're watching because there are a lot of tinfoil hat climate deniers with youtube channels. here's the link. https://www.dni.gov/files/documents/climate2030_southeast_asia_pacific_islands.pdf

[ozimoron]

16 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Okay, so if it is not debatable, exactly how much of it is caused by humans and how much is not?  

All of it is caused by humans. We are otherwise in a cooling period.

 

Natural archives generally show that Earth's average temperature roughly 6,000 years ago was warmer by about 0.7 °C (1.3 °F) compared with the 19th century median, and then cooled gradually until the Industrial Revolution. We found that most evidence points to this result.

 

https://www.sciencealert.com/before-human-made-climate-change-was-earth-actually-in-a-cooling-phase

 

Edited April 19, 2023 by ozimoron

[Jonathan Swift]

here's a general wikipedia link. But remember, this is only a start, if you want to know about this it will take some serious learning:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_change_in_Thailand

[bignok]

15 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

All of it is caused by humans. We are otherwise in a cooling period.

 

Natural archives generally show that Earth's average temperature roughly 6,000 years ago was warmer by about 0.7 °C (1.3 °F) compared with the 19th century median, and then cooled gradually until the Industrial Revolution. We found that most evidence points to this result.

 

https://www.sciencealert.com/before-human-made-climate-change-was-earth-actually-in-a-cooling-phase

 

So the current cooling is natural. Therefore all the warming by definition isnt caused by humans as warming happened pre 1900.

 

So there is no crisis, just money grab.

[bignok]

13 minutes ago, Jonathan Swift said:

here's a general wikipedia link. But remember, this is only a start, if you want to know about this it will take some serious learning:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_change_in_Thailand

Wiki isn't a science website.

[Jonathan Swift]

18 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

Okay, so if it is not debatable, exactly how much of it is caused by humans and how much is not?  

I'm not going to do your work for you. Put your own time in, go and seek out your own research and statistics. I'm not being paid to be anyone's tutor. And I don't mean just cherry pick that which supports your preconceptions, I mean a real education. You'll likely need a college course in it. No offense. It's complex stuff if you really want to understand it. I've done my studying over the last 40 years. I'm glad I did. That's the problem, you want to argue just for the sake of arguing in a wholly inappropriate news (not science) forum on a subject you have no expertise in rather than do the actual necessary work to learn and educate yourself. If you knew anything about this, you likely wouldn't be discussing or arguing about it here at Aseannow. So, no, go ahead and believe what you want. You will anyway, nobody can force education on anyone. I just happened to see the title of the article and was curious as to why anyone would ask the question that was asked. And I told the questioner that he needs to go elsewhere, he won't find anything useful in this forum. I provided him with some useful links and a summary on the science. AND, I'm done. 

[ozimoron]

5 minutes ago, bignok said:

So the current cooling is natural. Therefore all the warming by definition isnt caused by humans as warming happened pre 1900.

 

So there is no crisis, just money grab.

There is no current cooling. The natural cooling is being overwhelmed by the man made warming. Surely, that's obvious to you and you are just trolling?

[ozimoron]

6 minutes ago, bignok said:

Wiki isn't a science website.

Yes it is. It refers to scientific concepts constantly.

[Jonathan Swift]

3 minutes ago, bignok said:

So the current cooling is natural. Therefore all the warming by definition isnt caused by humans as warming happened pre 1900.

 

So there is no crisis, just money grab.

here's your natural cooling, I used a picture because it seems like big scientific words might only serve to confuse you. But if you ARE ambitious, here's a link to get you started. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_change_in_Thailand 

[Jonathan Swift]

You're asking a Thai Visa forum "what if global warming is here" when  you won't get anything useful in response. This is not a forum of experts and scientists.  Anyone at this point in time who has doubts about this is so far out of the information loop or so deeply in denial that no amount of information will likely be of any use. I'm no expert, but my opinion would be that it is difficult to say whether unusually hot weather in Thailand right now is directly caused by climate change. Statistically, given the average global rise in temperature, it is likely. But averages are of limited use, since some areas see a higher rise than others. But if you WANT to answer your questions, go to where the answers actually exist. Search generally on climate change Southeast Asia, You might try including the year 2023, You can compare seasonal temperatures going back 10-20 years using graphs, you can research the damage from tropical storms over the last 20 years and see whether they've gotten worse, you can search on general climate disruptions and catastrophes, Tsunamis, Hurricanes, over the last 20 years, THAT is the only way you will get reliable information - to research it yourself and draw your own conclusions. One factor that confuses people and is often used to deny climate change is the disruption of normal wind and ocean currents that occurs with overall warming. This has precipitated record high snowfalls in otherwise more temperate areas of the US. So then the deniers point and say "see! it's colder, not warmer". meanwhile the polar icecaps are melting at a record rate to the extent that polar bears are in danger of dying out through loss of habitat. The overall disruption of weather patterns is likely to become a catastrophe in and of itself. Here is one specific research report. Remember that a rise of a single degree on average may not sound like much, but the impact overall is huge. This is only one source out of many. If you want your questions answered accurately you will need to do some work. Try Youtube, maybe a visual explanation will be easier for you, but be sure of who you're watching because there are a lot of tinfoil hat climate deniers with youtube channels. I've attached a graph for the global trend, and the black one is southeast asia. here's the link. https://www.dni.gov/files/documents/climate2030_southeast_asia_pacific_islands.pdf

Edited April 19, 2023 by Jonathan Swift

[bignok]

1 minute ago, Jonathan Swift said:

here's your natural cooling, I used a picture because it seems like big scientific words might only serve to confuse you. But if you ARE ambitious, here's a link to get you started. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_change_in_Thailand 

UK has been warming since 1700.

 

https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/hadobs/hadcet/

 

Oldest data set in the world. So warming started over 300 years ago.

[bignok]

1730 to 1740 very warm period. How do the climate people explain this?

 

https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/hadobs/hadcet/

[bignok]

2 minutes ago, Jonathan Swift said:

You're asking a Thai Visa forum "what if global warming is here" when  you won't get anything useful in response. This is not a forum of experts and scientists.  Anyone at this point in time who has doubts about this is so far out of the information loop or so deeply in denial that no amount of information will likely be of any use. I'm no expert, but my opinion would be that it is difficult to say whether unusually hot weather in Thailand right now is directly caused by climate change. Statistically, given the average global rise in temperature, it is likely. But averages are of limited use, since some areas see a higher rise than others. But if you WANT to answer your questions, go to where the answers actually exist. Search generally on climate change Southeast Asia, You might try including the year 2023, You can compare seasonal temperatures going back 10-20 years using graphs, you can research the damage from tropical storms over the last 20 years and see whether they've gotten worse, you can search on general climate disruptions and catastrophes, Tsunamis, Hurricanes, over the last 20 years, THAT is the only way you will get reliable information - to research it yourself and draw your own conclusions. One factor that confuses people and is often used to deny climate change is the disruption of normal wind and ocean currents that occurs with overall warming. This has precipitated record high snowfalls in otherwise more temperate areas of the US. So then the deniers point and say "see! it's colder, not warmer". meanwhile the polar icecaps are melting at a record rate to the extent that polar bears are in danger of dying out through loss of habitat. The overall disruption of weather patterns is likely to become a catastrophe in and of itself. Here is one specific research report. Remember that a rise of a single degree on average may not sound like much, but the impact overall is huge. This is only one source out of many. If you want your questions answered accurately you will need to do some work. Try Youtube, maybe a visual explanation will be easier for you, but be sure of who you're watching because there are a lot of tinfoil hat climate deniers with youtube channels. here's the link. https://www.dni.gov/files/documents/climate2030_southeast_asia_pacific_islands.pdf

Explain the 1730 warming period and the 2016 to 2023 cooling period.

[Jonathan Swift]

For those of you inclined to argue, and who also find words a bit of a struggle, here are a couple pictures that might do the trick. But this is science now, and if you don't believe in science, just never mind. The first one is a global chart, the second one with the black background is for Southeast Asia. 

[Jonathan Swift]

1 minute ago, bignok said:

Explain the 1730 warming period and the 2016 to 2023 cooling period.

I'm not going to do your own work for you. Do you own research. You'll need a college course. You don't want to learn anyway, you'd rather argue. 

[ozimoron]

2 minutes ago, bignok said:

1730 to 1740 very warm period. How do the climate people explain this?

 

https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/hadobs/hadcet/

Whatever it was it had nothing to do with man made climate change which wasn't a thing then. If you were really interested you'd do some research but you're just intent on trolling.

[bignok]

1 minute ago, Jonathan Swift said:

For those of you inclined to argue, and who also find words a bit of a struggle, here are a couple pictures that might do the trick. But this is science now, and if you don't believe in science, just never mind. The first one is a global chart, the second one with the black background is for Southeast Asia. 

So you cannot explain

1 the 1730 period

2 the current 2016 to 2023 period

 

Just posting an old graph we saw before isnt science.

[bignok]

1 minute ago, Jonathan Swift said:

I'm not going to do your own work for you. Do you own research. You'll need a college course. You don't want to learn anyway, you'd rather argue. 

I know the answer, nature.

 

 

[bignok]

3 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

Whatever it was it had nothing to do with man made climate change which wasn't a thing then. If you were really interested you'd do some research but you're just intent on trolling.

Posting the facts isnt trolling. You claimed cooling. In fact the earth has been warming from a mini ice age.

 

https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/hadobs/hadcet/

 

Facts are above.

[ozimoron]

3 minutes ago, bignok said:

So you cannot explain

1 the 1730 period

2 the current 2016 to 2023 period

 

Just posting an old graph we saw before isnt science.

Not can't - won't

[bignok]

6 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

Not can't - won't

Which means it's nature. No crisis.

 

https://tradingeconomics.com/thailand/temperature

 

3 month averages show Thailand hotter 36 years ago.

 

https://www.worlddata.info/asia/thailand/climate.php

 

 

Edited April 19, 2023 by bignok

[kwilco]

3 hours ago, bignok said:

Totally irrevelant. Have the last 7 years shown any warming? No it's cooled off according to your graph.

 

That means the "crisis" is over. So Greta was totally wrong.

 

So it's been a big scare campaign and totally over the top.

 

 

I have to cut and paste your answers to my computer - no-one is going to believe that a fossil like you still exisits - I expect you don't know wat a fossil this though.do you?

[bignok]

7 minutes ago, bignok said:

Which means it's nature. No crisis.

 

https://tradingeconomics.com/thailand/temperature

 

3 month averages show Thailand hotter 36 years ago.

 

https://www.worlddata.info/asia/thailand/climate.php

 

 

"The average annual temperature was about 27.6 °C in the years after 1979 and about 27.7 °C in the last years before 2022. So it has hardly changed at all in the past 44 years"

 

https://www.worlddata.info/asia/thailand/climate.php

 

From world data.

 

 

[bignok]

1 minute ago, kwilco said:

I have to cut and paste your answers to my computer - no-one is going to believe that a fossil like you still exisits - I expect you don't know wat a fossil this though.do you?

Maybe actually read the science.

 

https://www.worlddata.info/asia/thailand/climate.php

 

 

Thailand has warmed 0.1c degrees in 44 years.

[kwilco]

23 minutes ago, bignok said:

UK has been warming since 1700.

 

https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/hadobs/hadcet/

 

Oldest data set in the world. So warming started over 300 years ago.

you don't appear to be able to interpret a graph and then contradict your self.

MMCC is largely due to chemical processes.

These processes started in UK with the industrial revolution. You don't seem to understand that Global warming is GLOBAL and not national - you also don't seem to have any concept of how incredibly complicated the effects are around the world - just spouting off dates and temperatures shows little understanding of the reality of the situation.\

 

The actual chemistry of MMCC was first identified towards the end of the 19th century. A long term study of this has proved the theory right in scientific terms (I'm expecting you to illustrate you don't know the difference between a scientific theory and that word in everyday use).

I find it hard to believe that someone in this day and age can be so obtuse and uninformed - unless they are trolling?

[bignok]

2 minutes ago, kwilco said:

you don't appear to be able to interpret a graph and then contradict your self.

MMCC is largely due to chemical processes.

These processes started in UK with the industrial revolution. You don't seem to understand that Global warming is GLOBAL and not national - you also don't seem to have any concept of how incredibly complicated the effects are around the world - just spouting off dates and temperatures shows little understanding of the reality of the situation.\

 

The actual chemistry of MMCC was first identified towards the end of the 19th century. A long term study of this has proved the theory right in scientific terms (I'm expecting you to illustrate you don't know the difference between a scientific theory and that word in everyday use).

I find it hard to believe that someone in this day and age can be so obtuse and uninformed - unless they are trolling?

I posted the facts and figures with links. Your post contains no figures or links which means you a trolling. 

 

Given you didn't know the UK warmed in 1730 and that Thailand has hardly warmed in 44 years I can only conclude you haven't researched the numbers.

 

The world has also cooled since 2016.

 

 

[Yellowtail]

1 hour ago, ozimoron said:

All of it is caused by humans. We are otherwise in a cooling period.

 

Natural archives generally show that Earth's average temperature roughly 6,000 years ago was warmer by about 0.7 °C (1.3 °F) compared with the 19th century median, and then cooled gradually until the Industrial Revolution. We found that most evidence points to this result.

 

https://www.sciencealert.com/before-human-made-climate-change-was-earth-actually-in-a-cooling-phase

 

How do these links show that the experts all agree that all climate change is caused by humans?