13 minutes ago, redwood1 said:

20,000 dollars will come close to buying a new car...

If someone had the need to replace their whole battery pack, I'd say they got their money's worth out of that EV.

 

LFP batteries last approximately 2500 cycles, so about 500k kms & up, and that's conservative.  Still holding 70-80% capacity.

 

Already a market to repurpose EV batteries.

 

Rarely does a battery pack need to be replaces, more just the lower capacity cells in the pack.

 

How much is that ICE worth after 500k kms ?

 

Lot of 'what if' scenarios, not worth debating.

1 hour ago, sidneybear said:

Do you have one? I'm genuinely curious. 

 

And yes, that 270 HP of unabashed materialism does make me smile when I put my foot down.

Yes, I get the smile factors, as pretty confident my almost instant EV torque will match or beat that 270hp turbo off the line.

 

Search the fastest vehicles, 0-60mph/100kph

Hint; they won't be ICEs

 

And I get to pass all those petrol stations and spend my baht on things I actually want, instead of the fueling and constant maintenance of an ICE vehicle.

 

Did that for decades, so moved on from those old, inefficient low tech machines to something much better.

 

Last reply to you, and thread.

 

 

Edited April 30, 20233 yr by Jotnar

15 minutes ago, Jotnar said:

Yes, I get the smile factors, as pretty confident my almost instant EV torque will match or beat that 270hp turbo off the line.

 

Search the fastest vehicles, 0-60mph/100kph

Hint; they won't be ICEs

 

And I get to pass all those petrol stations and spend my baht on things I actually want, instead of the fueling and constant maintenance of an ICE vehicle.

 

Did that for decades, so moved on from those old, inefficient low tech machines to something much better.

 

Last reply to you, and thread.

 

 

Certainly EVs are fast until the battery goes flat. They sound a bit like a washing machine though, give me that visceral snarl of a turbo any day. 

2 hours ago, sidneybear said:

Certainly EVs are fast until the battery goes flat. They sound a bit like a washing machine though, give me that visceral snarl of a turbo any day. 

I prefer a smooth and quiet ride.

 

Certainly ICEs are fast until;

blow a rod

need a tune up

run out of oil

drop a drive shaft

pop a rear

unbalance u-joint

break a belt

need a new clutch plate

along with need to replace any of the other 2000 moving parts

 

"A fully electric car has fewer moving parts, so they come with less ongoing maintenance costs. In fact, there are about 20 moving parts in an electric engine, compared to nearly 2,000 in an ICEV!"

https://driveelectric.org.nz/consumer/what-is-an-ev/#:~:text=A fully electric car has,nearly 2%2C000 in an ICEV!

2 hours ago, sidneybear said:

Certainly EVs are fast until the battery goes flat.

And likewise, ICE vehicles are (quite) fast until they run out of petrol or diesel.

Just now, macahoom said:

And likewise, ICE vehicles are (quite) fast until they run out of petrol or diesel.

............which can be replenished incredibly easily by the vast network of filling stations.........

2 minutes ago, transam said:

............which can be replenished incredibly easily by the vast network of filling stations.........

Which takes a whole 5 minutes, and you're good for the next 500 kms.

2 minutes ago, sidneybear said:

Which takes a whole 5 minutes, and you're good for the next 500 kms.

Correct..................

38 minutes ago, Jotnar said:

Certainly ICEs are fast until;

blow a rod

need a tune up

run out of oil

drop a drive shaft

pop a rear

unbalance u-joint

break a belt

need a new clutch plate

along with need to replace any of the other 2000 moving parts

The last time I had any of those problems was with an old Morris Minor. It belonged to my mum and I used to fix it for her in exchange for driving lessons and driving it around after I passed my test. That was back in the 80's.

 

ICE cars are incredibly reliable these days. 

45 minutes ago, Jotnar said:

I prefer a smooth and quiet ride.

 

Certainly ICEs are fast until;

blow a rod

need a tune up

run out of oil

drop a drive shaft

pop a rear

unbalance u-joint

break a belt

need a new clutch plate

along with need to replace any of the other 2000 moving parts

 

"A fully electric car has fewer moving parts, so they come with less ongoing maintenance costs. In fact, there are about 20 moving parts in an electric engine, compared to nearly 2,000 in an ICEV!"

https://driveelectric.org.nz/consumer/what-is-an-ev/#:~:text=A fully electric car has,nearly 2%2C000 in an ICEV!

EV's never go wrong.......????

Did you know the blind never see..................

5 minutes ago, sidneybear said:

The last time I had any of those problems was with an old Morris Minor. It belonged to my mum and I used to fix it for her in exchange for driving lessons and driving it around after I passed my test. That was back in the 80's.

 

ICE cars are incredibly reliable these days. 

Don't confuse the bloke, he may have bought a "British" MG.....????

1 minute ago, sidneybear said:

ICE cars are incredibly reliable these days. 

As are EVs, and with 99% less moving parts, that should be self explanatory.

 

Does explain the steady rise in sales, as most kinks have been worked out, and those, like myself, only bought in after.

Just now, Jotnar said:

As are EVs, and with 99% less moving parts, that should be self explanatory.

 

Does explain the steady rise in sales, as most kinks have been worked out, and those, like myself, only bought in after.

.........after the vast implementation of charge stations that are working....????

4 hours ago, sidneybear said:

And yes, that 270 HP of unabashed materialism does make me smile when I put my foot down.

You've obviously never driven an electric vehicle. A Volvo C40 would leave you in its wake.

I have always been a petrol head, I had a Subaru Impreza that I modified the heck out of up to almost 500bhp. I currently drive a 248 bhp turbo petrol car that is fun to drive. But I have spent time with electric cars - I had a 408 bhp electric Volvo for three days and I can tell you nothing puts a smile on your face more than flooring that - the instant acceleration is addictive and incredible. A new model coming this year will do 0-60 in four seconds or less.

Once I gave my electric one back and got back in to my petrol one it felt noisy, sluggish and very old fashioned. And you would feel the same if you tried it. 270hp is nothing special.

 

 

1 minute ago, transam said:

.........after the vast implementation of charge stations that are working....????

If you lived in Thailand, you'd know there are more than enough stations to use.

5 minutes ago, josephbloggs said:

You've obviously never driven an electric vehicle. A Volvo C40 would leave you in its wake.

I have always been a petrol head, I had a Subaru Impreza that I modified the heck out of up to almost 500bhp. I currently drive a 248 bhp turbo petrol car that is fun to drive. But I have spent time with electric cars - I had a 408 bhp electric Volvo for three days and I can tell you nothing puts a smile on your face more than flooring that - the instant acceleration is addictive and incredible. A new model coming this year will do 0-60 in four seconds or less.

Once I gave my electric one back and got back in to my petrol one it felt noisy, sluggish and very old fashioned. And you would feel the same if you tried it. 270hp is nothing special.

 

 

Well at least I've still got my licence. Anyway, I love the sound of a piston engine. Mobile washing machines that leave you stranded don't match up.

 

Oh, and don't turn the aircon up too much or you'll lose that vital percentage of range that would have got you to the next broken charging station. 

Edited April 30, 20233 yr by sidneybear

1 minute ago, Jotnar said:

If you lived in Thailand, you'd know there are more than enough stations to use.

I think I have been in LOS probably longer than you, but is way off-topic regarding charging stations in LOS and the speed of topping up a gas ride...........????

Please try again....????

1 minute ago, transam said:

I think I have been in LOS probably longer than you, but is way off-topic regarding charging stations in LOS and the speed of topping up a gas ride...........????

Please try again....????

I've been here a couple decades+, though irrelevent.

 

Not off topic, as explains the rise in new registrations, the topic.  Plenty of  charging points, so no topping up issues, unless weekend, which you should plan ahead and use  their reservation system.

 

Now, I'm topping up at home with solar, so pretty convenient.

1 minute ago, Jotnar said:

I've been here a couple decades+, though irrelevent.

 

Not off topic, as explains the rise in new registrations, the topic.  Plenty of  charging points, so no topping up issues, unless weekend, which you should plan ahead and use  their reservation system.

 

Now, I'm topping up at home with solar, so pretty convenient.

Yes, irrelevant, so don't do it again....????

 

Plenty of charging points for the rise in EV sales, you're having a laugh. ????

Folk have to think about their every driving move with an EV, not so with a gas ride....????

5 hours ago, Jotnar said:

Nothing worse than being behind a diesel vehicle on motorcycle or even a bicycle.  Or walking if some idiot left it idling while parked.  That fuel really should be banned, except for maybe the trucking industry, for now.

 

Disgusting pollution, and you couldn't give me one.  I prefer not to contribute.

 

Why would anyone want to drive 1000 kms for pleasure ?

All silly comparisons and arguments.

 

If you like your ICE, I'm happy for you, as it pays the tax base, and probably gives me a tax break.  I just prefer not to be behind you or live in a congested area with them spewing their pollution.

I would the drive distance out of necessity. 

A silly and childish response on your part.

I like ice in a gin and tonic, lovely.

Pretty low wrt taxes here in Thailand, so I am unlikely to be contributing to your tax break.... you most certainly would be behind me if in an all electric vehicle... miles behind sitting around for hours waiting on a charge up!

 

29 minutes ago, josephbloggs said:

A new model coming this year will do 0-60 in four seconds or less.

I did have an Honda Blackbird CBR 1100 XX bike a few years ago that would leave that behind. The roar of its engine. Ahhhh, bliss. It could do walking pace to 200 kmh in the same gear and topped put at close to 300 kmh.

 

People I know with EVs like them, but only as a second car to their ICE one. That kind of tells me something. 

Edited April 30, 20233 yr by sidneybear

22 minutes ago, Jotnar said:

Now, I'm topping up at home with solar, so pretty convenient.

Solar? Doesn't the sun's energy only amount to 1200 Watts per square metre of the earth's surface, in clear skies, when it's directly overhead? Solar panels aren't 100% efficient, and the sun is seldom overhead because trigonometry comes into play.

 

How many years do your batteries take to charge?

11 minutes ago, sidneybear said:

People I know with EVs like them, but only as a second car to their ICE one. That kind of tells me something. 

There's a few, inclusive, on AN that have multiple EVs, and tells me something also.

5 hours ago, redwood1 said:

How Much Does an EV Battery Cost to Replace? 

EV battery replacements range from $5,000 to $20,000 based on the pack, size and manufacturer.

 

https://www.recurrentauto.com/research/costs-ev-battery-replacement

 

Also 55% depreciation within 3 years......

The batteries' technologies are improving quickly, BYD just launched $11k car..

 

https://www.businessinsider.com/byd-seagull-cheap-ev-electric-car-tesla-china-2023-4

 

The battery replacement for this one won't be more than 5k, and the buyer would be well ahead with money due to the lower initial cost and less opportunity cost. If one has a solar panels to charge at home it would be pretty low cost of ownership.

in the uk sales of ecars are in the dumps due to high prices and falling prices on 2nd hand cars ,dealers are reluctantt to trade em or hold em in stock 

On 4/29/2023 at 11:35 AM, h90 said:

more electric cars but we are not investing in more electric power plants? Put solar on the roof or build nuclear power plants or both

There is already a 36% surplus of power generation available.

 

What IS necessary is an upgrade of the entire PEA network including new transformers, cabling, gangs going around clearing the trees away from the power lines and upgraded home meters and power lines.

 

The phasing out of old coal fired generators, more use of renewable energy sources and far more efficient contracts for small power producers.

 

https://www.krungsri.com/en/research/industry/industry-outlook/Energy-Utilities/Power-Generation/IO/io-power-generation-21/#:~:text=This includes plants that are,and oil (Figure 5).

 

The ability for household using solr to sell the surplus back to EGAT.

11 minutes ago, 3NUMBAS said:

in the uk sales of ecars are in the dumps due to high prices and falling prices on 2nd hand cars ,dealers are reluctantt to trade em or hold em in stock 

Don't let the facts get in your way.

"New plug-in car registrations year-to-date:

• BEVs: 76,230 (up 19% year-over-year) at a market share of 15.4%
• PHEVs: 31,765 (up 7% year-over-year) at a market share of 6.4%
• Total: 107,995 (up 15% year-over-year) at a market share of 21.8%

 

For reference, in 12 months of 2022, more than 368,000 new passenger plug-in cars were registered in the UK, reaching an average market share of 22.8%."

 

https://insideevs.com/news/661371/uk-plugin-car-sales-march2023/#:~:text=Plug-in electric car registrations in the UK – March 2023&text=New plug-in car registrations,a market share of 21.8%

Edited April 30, 20233 yr by Jotnar

https://basic-tutorials.com/news/electric-cars-worldwide-sales-figures-slump/

People aren't buying into the con. Come back in 20 years, once battery technology has caught up with practicality. Those damn laws of physics (electrochemistry department) might get in the way though:

 

https://thebulletin.org/2009/01/the-limits-of-energy-storage-technology/

 

Meanwhile, there's always petrol, packed with 46 Megajoules of energy per kilogram. Lithium batteries? A measly 2MJ/kg, even the best ones, which is why EVs are soo heavy and dangerous in an accident. 

 

Edited April 30, 20233 yr by sidneybear

https://www.politico.eu/article/germany-berlin-electric-cars-ev-sales-target-is-a-pipe-dream-electric-cars-batteries/

 

German e-car sales target called a ‘pipe dream’
The government’s optimistic target of having 15 million electric vehicles on the road by the