60 Day Extension to Non O Based on Marriage

[jonnit]

My wife and I recently arrived in Thailand on a 90 day visa based on marriage. Our visa's are valid until 25 July. My wife has Thai citizenship with lifetime Thai ID card. However, she does not have a Thai passport and has not had one since hers was stolen during a home robbery around 1978. The passport had expired in 1975. She is planning to apply for a passport this coming Tuesday. We are both traveling on US passports as US citizens. We had intended to arrive in Thailand on the 90 day visa, get a 60 day extension, then go to Suvvanakhet for me to get a 30 day entry and to use her Thai passport for reentry. Upon arrival at our home , checking in with local immigration, and asking how to get a 60 day extensions, she was told to get a Thai passport and I was given a sheet showing the requirements for a retirement visa. He did not speak any Engligh to me, so I don't know if I missed something in the translation by my wife. My question is: Do I need to go to Bangkok to obtain a 60 day extension? If so, where do I need to go in Bangkok and what documents do I need to take with me? We plan to return to the US prior to being in Thailand for 180 days, but may have to return earlier if my plans were in error. Even though I have the funds to apply for the retirement visa, I do not want to move them here. Thanks

[Lite Beer]

The extension is obtained at the Immigration Office that covers the area in which you are staying.

[DrJack54]

OP, this thread has an excellent OP Report and also a link from ubonjoe.

It concerns Bangkok but the requirements are pretty much standard.

You apply at immigration office where you are staying..

 

 

[BritTim]

Which immigration office are you trying to use?

If your wife has a Thai id card, that should be sufficient. You do not need a Thai passport either to be considered Thai nor to be considered married. More likely, the problem is that your marriage is not registered in Thailand.

Did your wife show her US passport to the official? If so, that was a big mistake. Some officials, for totally illogical reasons, are upset with Thai women who acquire other nationalities.

 

When does your current permission to stay end? You mention a 'visa' valid until July 25th. Do you mean that this is the 'admitted until' date stamped in your passport when you arrived in Thailand? If so, I am confused as to why you currently need a 60-day extension.

 

38 minutes ago, jonnit said:

then go to Suvvanakhet for me to get a 30 day entry and to use her Thai passport for reentry.

Your wife will not usually be able to switch from her US passport to her Thai passport with a border bounce by land. A change of passports is not permitted during a land crossing.

Since she will have a brand new unused Thai passport, she would probably be able to both leave and return on the Thai passport (concealing the fact that she entered on the US passport). However, this would mean that her visit on the US passport would never be terminated. The Thai authorities might be upset if they ever become aware of the facts, and this would be a risky approach if your local immigration office are already aware that she arrived on a US passport.

 

Normally, to switch passports, you need to leave Thailand by air (perhaps, to somewhere like Vientiane). You can then return by land if you prefer. Even then, it is occasionally problematic as immigration can start asking a lot of questions about how you can have an unused Thai passport issued in Thailand and yet be using it for entry into Thailand. It is tempting to think about trying to use the automatic machines at the airport to leave on the Thai passport while at the same time trying to get stamped out on the US passport. That, if successful, will ensure no further problems.

 

This is not a unique problem and needs better solutions.

[jonnit]

1 hour ago, BritTim said:

Which immigration office are you trying to use?

If your wife has a Thai id card, that should be sufficient. You do not need a Thai passport either to be considered Thai nor to be considered married. More likely, the problem is that your marriage is not registered in Thailand.

Did your wife show her US passport to the official? If so, that was a big mistake. Some officials, for totally illogical reasons, are upset with Thai women who acquire other nationalities.

 

When does your current permission to stay end? You mention a 'visa' valid until July 25th. Do you mean that this is the 'admitted until' date stamped in your passport when you arrived in Thailand? If so, I am confused as to why you currently need a 60-day extension.

 

Your wife will not usually be able to switch from her US passport to her Thai passport with a border bounce by land. A change of passports is not permitted during a land crossing.

Since she will have a brand new unused Thai passport, she would probably be able to both leave and return on the Thai passport (concealing the fact that she entered on the US passport). However, this would mean that her visit on the US passport would never be terminated. The Thai authorities might be upset if they ever become aware of the facts, and this would be a risky approach if your local immigration office are already aware that she arrived on a US passport.

 

Normally, to switch passports, you need to leave Thailand by air (perhaps, to somewhere like Vientiane). You can then return by land if you prefer. Even then, it is occasionally problematic as immigration can start asking a lot of questions about how you can have an unused Thai passport issued in Thailand and yet be using it for entry into Thailand. It is tempting to think about trying to use the automatic machines at the airport to leave on the Thai passport while at the same time trying to get stamped out on the US passport. That, if successful, will ensure no further problems.

 

This is not a unique problem and needs better solutions.

We are in Amnat Charoen. Yes, our permission to stay is 25 July. The wife did check into Amnat immigration with her US passport.  No, our marriage in the US is not registed locally. We attempted it a few years back and they wanted a marriage certificate certified by the

Department of State. I got that on our return to the US, but never returned to get registered. I guess the next question is, "If we are here on a 90 day Non O, can we go to Suvannakhet which is near to us, and get a tourist visit?

[bunnydrops]

Several years ago a friend and his wife flew in using their US passports. He then got an 30 day extension. When they left to return to the US his wife used her US passport. She was fined for overstay since she did not think she needed an extension  due to her being a Thai citizen. She showed her Thai ID card, but to Immigration, you come in as an foreigner, you must follow the rules as a foreigner.  

[DrJack54]

35 minutes ago, jonnit said:

If we are here on a 90 day Non O, can we go to Suvannakhet which is near to us, and get a tourist visit?

Yes. 

[BritTim]

1 hour ago, jonnit said:

We are in Amnat Charoen. Yes, our permission to stay is 25 July. The wife did check into Amnat immigration with her US passport.  No, our marriage in the US is not registed locally. We attempted it a few years back and they wanted a marriage certificate certified by the

Department of State. I got that on our return to the US, but never returned to get registered. I guess the next question is, "If we are here on a 90 day Non O, can we go to Suvannakhet which is near to us, and get a tourist visit?

There would be no issue with you both getting tourist visas (or Non O visas) in Savannakhet on your US passports. However, this would not solve your wife's problem of switching to her US passport.

[jonnit]

1 hour ago, DrJack54 said:

Yes. 

Thanks for the "Yes". That will work, but due to our ages (both 79 this year) it will be difficult for the wife if we have to remain out in the heat for a long period. At least, though possibly difficult, it gives us some more time here.

[transam]

1 minute ago, jonnit said:

Thanks for the "Yes". That will work, but due to our ages (both 79 this year) it will be difficult for the wife if we have to remain out in the heat for a long period. At least, though possibly difficult, it gives us some more time here.

Go to Sav on a Wednesday, but if you do encounter queues, you can pay to get in a bit quicker, it is NOT advertised, just ask Thai blokes that are loitering with eye contact....

[jonnit]

4 minutes ago, transam said:

Go to Sav on a Wednesday, but if you do encounter queues, you can pay to get in a bit quicker, it is NOT advertised, just ask Thai blokes that are loitering with eye contact....

WE can do that and appreciate the tip referring to a faster service. Thanks

 

6 minutes ago, transam said:

Go to Sav on a Wednesday, but if you do encounter queues, you can pay to get in a bit quicker, it is NOT advertised, just ask Thai blokes that are loitering with eye contact....

 

[NanLaew]

On 5/14/2023 at 8:37 AM, BritTim said:

Did your wife show her US passport to the official? If so, that was a big mistake. Some officials, for totally illogical reasons, are upset with Thai women who acquire other nationalities.

That's scaremongering. Some immigration officers may gurn but despite Thai people being legally required to claim only one nationality when they turn 21, I have never heard of anyone being arrested or charged with having dual nationality.

 

Since the US passport was the ONLY thing the OP's wife had, how could she not make the local immigration officer aware as to what she needs to do to stay longer? Otherwise there was no point in asking. The immigration officer's advice to get a Thai passport is his way of gurning whereas in reality, the OP's wife has every right to seek the same extensions as her husband.

 

On 5/14/2023 at 8:37 AM, BritTim said:

Since she will have a brand new unused Thai passport, she would probably be able to both leave and return on the Thai passport (concealing the fact that she entered on the US passport). However, this would mean that her visit on the US passport would never be terminated. The Thai authorities might be upset if they ever become aware of the facts, and this would be a risky approach if your local immigration office are already aware that she arrived on a US passport.

The OP's wife's entry to Thailand on a US passport is now on the immigration database. Basic biometrics checks (name, date of birth, place of birth) will indicate she has a US passport and entered on it. Regardless of nationality, the rule of thumb is to enter and leave Thailand on the same passport. Even if she did slip out and back 'unnoticed' at a land border, re-entering on the new Thai passport, what's to stop the more diligent immigration officer catching this trick when it's time to head back to the US and charging lots and lots for overstay because technically, she has broken those rules? If the OP's wife gets a new Thai passport and there is still a need for it to be used to enable a longer stay in Thailand, then a short round-trip (possibly same-day) flight to Phnom Penh, Ho Chi Minh City or Kuala Lumpur where the re-entry to Thailand can legally be done on the new Thai passport. Then she could stay as long as she likes and only the OP needs to pursue his visa/extension.

 

Good luck.

[jonnit]

5 hours ago, NanLaew said:

That's scaremongering. Some immigration officers may gurn but despite Thai people being legally required to claim only one nationality when they turn 21, I have never heard of anyone being arrested or charged with having dual nationality.

 

Since the US passport was the ONLY thing the OP's wife had, how could she not make the local immigration officer aware as to what she needs to do to stay longer? Otherwise there was no point in asking. The immigration officer's advice to get a Thai passport is his way of gurning whereas in reality, the OP's wife has every right to seek the same extensions as her husband.

 

The OP's wife's entry to Thailand on a US passport is now on the immigration database. Basic biometrics checks (name, date of birth, place of birth) will indicate she has a US passport and entered on it. Regardless of nationality, the rule of thumb is to enter and leave Thailand on the same passport. Even if she did slip out and back 'unnoticed' at a land border, re-entering on the new Thai passport, what's to stop the more diligent immigration officer catching this trick when it's time to head back to the US and charging lots and lots for overstay because technically, she has broken those rules? If the OP's wife gets a new Thai passport and there is still a need for it to be used to enable a longer stay in Thailand, then a short round-trip (possibly same-day) flight to Phnom Penh, Ho Chi Minh City or Kuala Lumpur where the re-entry to Thailand can legally be done on the new Thai passport. Then she could stay as long as she likes and only the OP needs to pursue his visa/extension.

 

Good luck.

Thank you. Appreciate your comments.

[Maestro]

5 hours ago, NanLaew said:

That's scaremongering. Some immigration officers may gurn but despite Thai people being legally required to claim only one nationality when they turn 21, I have never heard of anyone being arrested or charged with having dual nationality...

It is not true that Thai people with dual nationality in general and — in the the context of this topic — in particular female Thai nationals who acquire another nationality by marriage under the laws of the country of which the husband is a national are legally required to claim only one nationality.

 

Aside from that, the excerpt of the post I am quoting is off topic but I am not removing the post because the rest of it is acceptable.

 

Anyone wishing to discuss an alleged legal requirement of the type mentioned above should feel free to start a new topic on this subject, citing the relative legal clause and giving a link to the text of the apposite law.

[AgMech Cowboy]

On 5/14/2023 at 7:43 AM, jonnit said:

Even though I have the funds to apply for the retirement visa, I do not want to move them here.

@jonnit  Interesting comments for you to consider.  One that was not suggested; get a one year multi-entry Non-O based on marriage at Savannakeht.  The requirements are basically the same as those for the 90 day (also not financial information is required).  Your US marriage certificate is accepted without the problems that you will encounter at an immigration office.  You will only need to leave the country every 90 days, which can be extended by 60 (with no financials) at Immigration.  Considering that you are still travelling out of the country regularly this might be a better option.  Also at those times when you do need to make a run to the border for a refreshing of your permit to stay, you don't have to worry about going to the consulate to get another tourist visa.  One other caveat: if you'll make a border bounce near the end of the visa period, it's possible to use the 1 yr Non-O for 15 months stay using the 1 one year visa.

 

By doing the above you can set up 'your' (and only your name) bank account here in Thailand.  Make arrangements with WISE or your US bank to transfer baht 65,000 or more every month into that account for a year.  Then, when you do decide that you want to settle down in Thailand and stay long term, then you can go apply for you Permit to Stay extension based on Retirement at your local Immigration office without having to transfer Baht800,000 and leaving it there for long periods of time. 

 

About your wife... I read some discussions that made a little sense above and some that did not.  She needs to get her Thai passport before the end of her permit to stay (the Visa means little now, assuming it's a single entry). You are in Thailand and are able to stay here based only on the Permit to Stay stamp, which as you said was 90 days. You both can get extension to those stays at the Immigration office near you in Amnat Charoen. When (if) you go to Savannakhet to apply for another Visa, she will use the US passport to leave the country, but should come back using the Thai passport. Problem solved.

[DrJack54]

13 minutes ago, AgMech Cowboy said:

she will use the US passport to leave the country, but should come back using the Thai passport. Problem solved.

First up good post.

 

Regarding this part I quoted.

Yes indeed exit Thailand on USA pp since she entered Thailand on that visa.

 

However next step is to straight away enter Laos.

She would need to do that with Thai pp to reenter Thailand with her Thai pp.

 

Perhaps that's possible.

Might be problematic at land border. 

 

I posted earlier suggestion of flight out to Saigon and back after short stay.

More bullet proof imo. 

Edited May 15, 2023 by DrJack54

[BritTim]

28 minutes ago, AgMech Cowboy said:

When (if) you go to Savannakhet to apply for another Visa, she will use the US passport to leave the country, but should come back using the Thai passport. Problem solved.

You cannot change passports when crossing a land border from Thailand to a neighbouring country.

 

If the situation is explained to Immigration at the bridge prior to leaving Thailand, maybe they will agree both to stamp her out of Thailand as a US citizen and allow her to leave on the Thai passport. Odds against, I think.

[jonnit]

I think we have decided to go to Suvannaket and get a tourist visa and then extend it for 30 days. That will give us the time we were intending to stay in Thailand. I have another question about the Visa Application form for Suvannakhet and that refers to question 5. They want a Name, Address and Telephone No. of a Guarantor in Laos. I'm not sure what to enter for this question. I don't know anyone in Laos. What is normally entered for this question? I feel really awkward asking the questions since I have been a member of this forum and read the news letter almost daily for years. I have been to Thailand 9 times since my retirement. One for 30 days on arrival, one non-o retirement, and 7 non-o's based on marriage. I have never had a problem applying for a receiving these visa's before, but it seems much has changed since covid started. Thanks.Visa_Application_Form.pdf

[transam]

2 hours ago, jonnit said:

I think we have decided to go to Suvannaket and get a tourist visa and then extend it for 30 days. That will give us the time we were intending to stay in Thailand. I have another question about the Visa Application form for Suvannakhet and that refers to question 5. They want a Name, Address and Telephone No. of a Guarantor in Laos. I'm not sure what to enter for this question. I don't know anyone in Laos. What is normally entered for this question? I feel really awkward asking the questions since I have been a member of this forum and read the news letter almost daily for years. I have been to Thailand 9 times since my retirement. One for 30 days on arrival, one non-o retirement, and 7 non-o's based on marriage. I have never had a problem applying for a receiving these visa's before, but it seems much has changed since covid started. Thanks.Visa_Application_Form.pdf

Leave it blank...

[jonnit]

Thanks again.