Denied entry. The conclusion with a twist.

[paulikens]

So, I got my passport back and there wasn't even a denied entry stamp and the airport official at Penang airport who gave me my passport back said i can go back to Phuket.   And Ok he isn't an immigration officer but it all seems very strange.   Can anyone tell me what it means or has anyone else ever had that happen?      Also before anyone says what did Immigration say at Phuket.  I was met by the airline officials at the detention room and escorted by them to my flight. So, never got the chance to speak with any of them.   

[Caldera]

What did immigration in Malaysia do, did they give you a new entry permit?

 

Interesting that you didn't get a Thai denial of entry stamp. Did you sign and/or get an expulsion form from Thai immigration?

[paulikens]

Just now, Caldera said:

What did immigration in Malaysia do, did they give you a new entry permit?

 

Interesting that you didn't get a Thai denial of entry stamp. Did you sign and/or get an expulsion form from Thai immigration?

Immigration at Malaysia just stamped me as per usual for 90 days.  I not sure what i signed to be honest but i thought it was a denied entry form.  Is there a difference?  Does a expulsion form mean you don't get a denied entry stamp then?

[bignok]

12 minutes ago, paulikens said:

not sure what i signed to be honest but i tho

Is this even real?

[paulikens]

Just now, bignok said:

Is this even real?

I didn't know what was going on.  Until you've been in that position you can't comment. It's fairly scary being sat in an immigration office not knowing what's going on.  I defy anyone not to be <deleted>ting themselves in that situation unless you got balls of steel.   

[Caldera]

13 minutes ago, paulikens said:

I not sure what i signed to be honest but i thought it was a denied entry form.  Is there a difference?  Does a expulsion form mean you don't get a denied entry stamp then?

It's been a while since reading the last denied entry report, but from memory, people are usually asked to sign a form titled "Notice of Expulsion" or similar and get a copy of this form as well as a denial of entry stamp in their passport.

 

As always with Thai officials who are notoriously sloppy and inconsistent, nothing surprises me. Hard to tell if they "forgot" to stamp your passport or if they deliberately didn't do that for whatever reason. You may even see that as them doing you a favor; at least immigration in other countries won't get to see anything that would otherwise have been visible in your passport  

[BritTim]

At one time, this was a common practice at some land borders. It saved the officials work, and meant that there was no record of an attempted entry in immigration's system. I have also heard a very rare case of this happening at an airport, but a long time ago. It was a different situation to yours. Someone was told they would be denied entry if they did not depart voluntarily with no blemish on the immigration history. They never went to a detention room.

 

It is very strange. Two possibilities occur to me. First, that the officials screwed up and forgot to stamp your passport. The second is that the official who would have stamped your passport was different from the original official who denied you entry, and disagreed with your denial in the first place. He kindly omitted the passport stamp so it cannot potentially cause problems at embassies and other countries' borders in the future. Unfortunately, I think the denial was still recorded in immigration's system.

[paulikens]

Just now, Caldera said:

It's been a while since reading the last denied entry report, but from memory, people are usually asked to sign a form titled "Notice of Expulsion" or similar and get a copy of this form as well as a denial of entry stamp in their passport.

 

As always with Thai officials who are notoriously sloppy and inconsistent, nothing surprises me. Hard to tell if they "forgot" to stamp your passport or if they deliberately didn't do that for whatever reason. You may even see that as them doing you a favor; at least immigration in other countries won't get to see anything that would otherwise have been visible in your passport  

Yes I totally agree sloppy and inconsistent.   Good point they probably have just forgot to stamp it.  I expect it will still be on my passport when they scan it though.  

[paulikens]

Just now, BritTim said:

At one time, this was a common practice at some land borders. It saved the officials work, and meant that there was no record of an attempted entry in immigration's system. I have also heard a very rare case of this happening at an airport, but a long time ago. It was a different situation to yours. Someone was told they would be denied entry if they did not depart voluntarily with no blemish on the immigration history. They never went to a detention room.

 

It is very strange. Two possibilities occur to me. First, that the officials screwed up and forgot to stamp your passport. The second is that the official who would have stamped your passport was different from the original official who denied you entry, and disagreed with your denial in the first place. He kindly omitted the passport stamp so it cannot potentially cause problems at embassies and other countries' borders in the future. Unfortunately, I think the denial was still recorded in immigration's system.

Yes as i said in response to caldera's comment no doubt it shows up when they scan it.  

[BritTim]

2 minutes ago, paulikens said:

Yes as i said in response to caldera's comment no doubt it shows up when they scan it.  

I think it will. I guess there is an extremely small chance that they decided later that your denied entry was an error, and decided to scrub it. As you were willing to pay for the return flight to Penang, they could pretend nothing happened, and avoid losing face by telling you.

 

Did they charge you money for your stay in the detention room?

[freedomnow]

1 hour ago, paulikens said:

I didn't know what was going on.  Until you've been in that position you can't comment. It's fairly scary being sat in an immigration office not knowing what's going on.  I defy anyone not to be <deleted>ting themselves in that situation unless you got balls of steel.   

Go overland and check which north-west border with Thailand to avoid coming overland...one with train connection maybe is a bit more hardline.

Someone will tell you which land border to go over. You can fly domestic to your destination after that from within Thailand...at worst you get bounced back to Malaysia again overland...doubtful...this has happened for years..

 

I think there are maybe 3 on the north-west on Malaysia to choose from ?

 

 

Rejected at airport back in overland next day.

 

No sweat !

 

[ChaiyaTH]

Get a tourist visa and return via land border. Now you back in, forget about it.

[bigt3116]

7 hours ago, paulikens said:

I not sure what i signed to be honest but i thought it was a denied entry form.

The notice of expulsion form is in Thai and English

[paulikens]

4 hours ago, paulikens said:

So, I got my passport back and there wasn't even a denied entry stamp and the airport official at Penang airport who gave me my passport back said i can go back to Phuket IN A MONTH.   And Ok he isn't an immigration officer but it all seems very strange.   Can anyone tell me what it means or has anyone else ever had that happen?      Also before anyone says what did Immigration say at Phuket.  I was met by the airline officials at the detention room and escorted by them to my flight. So, never got the chance to speak with any of them.   

Just to say I didn't realize in my original post that I left out that the airport official said to me i can go back to phuket in a month.   in the original post i just said he said i could go back to Phuket.

[paulikens]

3 hours ago, BritTim said:

I think it will. I guess there is an extremely small chance that they decided later that your denied entry was an error, and decided to scrub it. As you were willing to pay for the return flight to Penang, they could pretend nothing happened, and avoid losing face by telling you.

 

Did they charge you money for your stay in the detention room?

No they didn't.  

[DrJack54]

@paulikens so what's the plan now?

 

You still have a tourist visa.

What's the "enter before date" on the visa.

Do you plan to try again via land border? 

(just nosey curiosity) 

BTW: What did they sting you for flight back to Penang. 

[BritTim]

3 minutes ago, paulikens said:

No they didn't.  

Interesting. That suggests that they really might be trying to hide the whole incident. It is normal for the stay in the detention room to be billed. It is aggravating that there is no easy way to check what has been entered in immigration's system.

[circa02]

Yep I didnt think you'd get a denied entry stamp. Give it a day or two so your stay in Malaysia looks legitimate and then off to Sadao with the minibus and you'll likely get in, hopefully they don't notice back to back exit and entry from Malaysia. I would as a precaution get 20k from the money changer on Chulia, and print off a reservation for hotel in Hat Yai,  as certainly at PB in the height of knocking people back this has been asked before. Try to choose a bloke, preferably older and sluggish, at Sadao too, just to increase your odds.

[DrJack54]

17 minutes ago, circa02 said:

Yep I didnt think you'd get a denied entry stamp. Give it a day or two so your stay in Malaysia looks legitimate and then off to Sadao with the minibus and you'll likely get in, hopefully they don't notice back to back exit and entry from Malaysia. I would as a precaution get 20k from the money changer on Chulia, and print off a reservation for hotel in Hat Yai,  as certainly at PB in the height of knocking people back this has been asked before. Try to choose a bloke, preferably older and sluggish, at Sadao too, just to increase your odds.

Good advice.

 

Here is thread for anyone interested in Malaysia to Thailand via land border.

One of the most comprehensive posts  by the OP. Excellent report

 

[StayinThailand2much]

10 hours ago, BritTim said:

It was a different situation to yours. Someone was told they would be denied entry if they did not depart voluntarily with no blemish on the immigration history. They never went to a detention room.

How do you 'depart voluntarily', I wonder. You're at arrival, but can't enter the arrival hall, or get to check-in or departure...

[paulikens]

Just now, DrJack54 said:

@paulikens so what's the plan now?

 

You still have a tourist visa.

What's the "enter before date" on the visa.

Do you plan to try again via land border? 

(just nosey curiosity) 

BTW: What did they sting you for flight back to Penang. 

I'm debating what to do actually.  and wondering what are the best land borders to go through?          the date is the end of october.    I think I'll sit it out in Penang for a bit though even if i decide to go back via land border.           Yes i had to pay for the flight back to Penang.  not too much but still something i could have done without.

[paulikens]

Just now, BritTim said:

Interesting. That suggests that they really might be trying to hide the whole incident. It is normal for the stay in the detention room to be billed. It is aggravating that there is no easy way to check what has been entered in immigration's system.

Really!   What a liberty

[BritTim]

1 hour ago, StayinThailand2much said:

How do you 'depart voluntarily', I wonder. You're at arrival, but can't enter the arrival hall, or get to check-in or departure...

All airlines have the ability to issue or modify reservations airside. Generally, they have transfer desks that can arrange it. If not, there are airline representatives that can be contacted. You will note that the OP received a boarding card for his flight back to Penang, which he also paid for. That is not only possible from the detention room, but anywhere airside.

[StayinThailand2much]

44 minutes ago, BritTim said:

All airlines have the ability to issue or modify reservations airside. Generally, they have transfer desks that can arrange it. If not, there are airline representatives that can be contacted. You will note that the OP received a boarding card for his flight back to Penang, which he also paid for. That is not only possible from the detention room, but anywhere airside.

Good to know, thanks.

 

So, if I were denied, instead of being detained, could I just ask Immigration to let me go back airside to make my own arrangements for a flight out?

[Caldera]

17 minutes ago, StayinThailand2much said:

Good to know, thanks.

 

So, if I were denied, instead of being detained, could I just ask Immigration to let me go back airside to make my own arrangements for a flight out?

It doesn't hurt to ask. No guarantees, but if they're feeling lazy and you present it well, it could work. 

[StayinThailand2much]

10 minutes ago, Caldera said:

It doesn't hurt to ask. No guarantees, but if they're feeling lazy and you present it well, it could work. 

Thanks.

[circa02]

44 minutes ago, StayinThailand2much said:

Good to know, thanks.

 

So, if I were denied, instead of being detained, could I just ask Immigration to let me go back airside to make my own arrangements for a flight out?

Yes, but I don't think it's a solid policy, so your mileage may vary.

My experience is that they will let you through the transfer security check - how you get from arrivals to departures - with just proof of purchase, even just receipt on your phone, they grumbled a bit but I think it's pretty common, but you'll then have to convince the transfer desk to issue you a boarding pass which might be problematic depending on the airline, their policies, and if they are even manned at the time. That ticket you purchased 30 minutes earlier in arrivals is then a dud. Your best bet is to choose an airline and destination that doesn't have a document-check so you can generate the boarding pass right there and then, thus no worries about detention, you'd have to check what airlines are doing that now. For example AirAsia will do document check  (which means no eboarding pass) for Vietnam but not for Malaysia for non Thai passport holders in my experience, there is no indication prior to purchase though.

[StayinThailand2much]

11 minutes ago, circa02 said:

For example AirAsia will do document check for Vietnam but not for Malaysia for non Thai passport holders in my experience, there is no indication prior to purchase though.

Good to know. I'd imagine that the difference in procedure is because of Vietnam's and Malaysia's different visa policies.

[BritTim]

51 minutes ago, StayinThailand2much said:

Good to know, thanks.

 

So, if I were denied, instead of being detained, could I just ask Immigration to let me go back airside to make my own arrangements for a flight out?

They can agree to that, but they will probably refuse your request.

[BritTim]

3 hours ago, paulikens said:

No they didn't.  

@paulikens Is it just possible that the original immigration official missed that you had a tourist visa, and believed you were seeking a visa exemption? That would make the original denial correct, and a desire to quietly bury it (with no passport stamp, no charge for the detention room and, hopefully, no record of the denied entry in immigration's system) logical.