Cable brands - big differences?

[OneMoreFarang]

I am working on the electrical installation in my new condominium.

I use VAF-G cable, mostly 1.5 and 2.5 sqmm.

Until now I bought cable from BBC and YAZAKI.

Are there any substantial differences between brands? Which are the best and which should be avoided?

 

And it seems all the available VAF-G cables are "flat". From long time ago I am used to round cables. Are there any disadvantages to flat cables?

 

 

[Muhendis]

  On 8/13/2023 at 3:11 AM, OneMoreFarang said:

Are there any disadvantages to flat cables?

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There are no disadvantages.

There is an advantage in the cross sectional area of flat cables being smaller than round. Also when laying a cable run in trunking with several others, the cables will not twist and tangle so easily.

[sometimewoodworker]

Also when clipping to a wall it will look much neater

  On 8/13/2023 at 3:11 AM, OneMoreFarang said:

I am used to round cables.

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it wasn’t until I came to Thailand that I came across round section mains cables 

[stubuzz]

  On 8/13/2023 at 3:11 AM, OneMoreFarang said:

Which are the best and which should be avoided?

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I seem to remember another thread saying that not all of the 1.5 and 2.5... cable sizes are actually that size, as differ slightly between brands.

[Muhendis]

  On 8/13/2023 at 3:50 PM, stubuzz said:

I seem to remember another thread saying that not all of the 1.5 and 2.5... cable sizes are actually that size, as differ slightly between brands.

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This is true.

I bought some 25mm aluminium cable in a Chinese electrical shop and, out of curiosity, measured it. 

The actual size was 22mm.

[bluejets]

  On 8/13/2023 at 11:10 PM, Muhendis said:

measured it. 

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Yes....BUT....just what did you measure..???

[Muhendis]

  On 8/14/2023 at 10:37 PM, bluejets said:

Yes....BUT....just what did you measure..???

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Using a vernier caliper I measured the diameter of each of the seven cores.

I calculated the cross sectional area of each and summed them.

[Ben Zioner]

  On 8/14/2023 at 10:43 PM, Muhendis said:

Using a vernier caliper I measured the diameter of each of the seven cores.

I calculated the cross sectional area of each and summed them.

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errrmmmm, electric wires are measured in square millimetres, not mm. 22mm would be rather short for a cable and if it was a diameter it'd be huge, enough to supply a small factory, even for aluminium. 

[Crossy]

  On 8/14/2023 at 11:48 PM, Ben Zioner said:

errrmmmm, electric wires are measured in square millimetres, not mm. 22mm would be rather short for a cable and if it was a diameter it'd be huge, enough to supply a small factory, even for aluminium. 

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Isn't that what he said?

 

Measure the diameter of each strand, calculate the area of each, multiply by the number of strands?

[Ben Zioner]

  On 8/15/2023 at 12:01 AM, Crossy said:

 

Isn't that what he said?

 

Measure the diameter of each strand, calculate the area of each, multiply by the number of strands?

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Nope, he refers to mm which is a unit of length,  Wires are measured by their cross sectional area which  is  expressed in square mm (mm² not mm), in Europe at least.

[Crossy]

  On 8/15/2023 at 12:19 AM, Ben Zioner said:

Nope, he refers to mm which is a unit of length,  Wires are measured by their cross sectional area which  is  expressed in square mm (not mm), in Europe at least.

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OK, it's incorrect, but we all most of us understood what he meant.

 

If I corrected every post where someone says they used XX Kw on their energy bill ...

 

 

[Muhendis]

  On 8/15/2023 at 12:01 AM, Crossy said:

 

Isn't that what he said?

 

Measure the diameter of each strand, calculate the area of each, multiply by the number of strands?

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Thanks.

Problem is, us regular engineering type guys automatically know what cable size refers to so if we say 25mm cable we know it means 25mm². This is useful if you are using a notepad type machine which doesn't have a way of doing the superscript ². (anyone know how to do this?)

'course it could be that Ben Zioner is fully aware of this and is simply nitpicking for the sake of it but probably not since that is so rare on this forum.............????

[Crossy]

  On 8/15/2023 at 12:27 AM, Muhendis said:

Thanks.

Problem is, us regular engineering type guys automatically know what cable size refers to so if we say 25mm cable we know it means 25mm². This is useful if you are using a notepad type machine which doesn't have a way of doing the superscript ². (anyone know how to do this?)

'course it could be that Ben Zioner is fully aware of this and is simply nitpicking for the sake of it but probably not since that is so rare on this forum.............????

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I'll just go and install some number 12 cable for that water heater, or maybe number 10 would be more appropriate ...

 

EDIT - Maybe we need a rule on "Unit Police" posts on the same lines as for "Grammar Police" ???? 

[Ben Zioner]

  On 8/15/2023 at 12:27 AM, Muhendis said:

Thanks.

Problem is, us regular engineering type guys automatically know what cable size refers to so if we say 25mm cable we know it means 25mm². This is useful if you are using a notepad type machine which doesn't have a way of doing the superscript ². (anyone know how to do this?)

'course it could be that Ben Zioner is fully aware of this and is simply nitpicking for the sake of it but probably not since that is so rare on this forum.............????

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Again, no. What prompted me is the 25mm (or mm²), which is huge. Is this the main going to your  house?   General  wiring is 1.5 mm² for lightning, 2.5mm²  for plugs/appliances and 4 to 6mm² for water heaters.

Yet I am not an electrician, only an electrical engineer  who got diverted into IT from the onset.

[Muhendis]

  On 8/15/2023 at 12:30 AM, Crossy said:

I'll just go and install some number 12 cable for that water heater, or maybe number 10 would be more appropriate ...

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Would that be SWG or perhaps AWG?

[Crossy]

  On 8/15/2023 at 12:40 AM, Ben Zioner said:

for lightning,

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Lightning would blast 1.5mm² into next week

[Crossy]

I think at this point we should draw a veil over the unit things and get back to the real subject.

 

[sometimewoodworker]

  On 8/15/2023 at 12:27 AM, Muhendis said:

This is useful if you are using a notepad type machine which doesn't have a way of doing the superscript ². (anyone know how to do this?)

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H₂O and mm²

^Both of these _have been typed on my tablet, though you may need an Apple one

[sometimewoodworker]

  On 8/15/2023 at 12:49 AM, Ben Zioner said:

Sorry, I forgot the forum was only for boarding school educated english speakers...

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It isn’t, but you will be mocked (and possibly taunted) as will others who make amusing faux pas, probably because the appreciation of the humour of Monty Python and ilk is strong here

 

 

[Muhendis]

  On 8/15/2023 at 1:32 AM, sometimewoodworker said:

H₂O and mm²

^Both of these _have been typed on my tablet, though you may need an Apple one

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Brilliant.

Thanks

 No excuses from now on

[OneMoreFarang]

  On 8/15/2023 at 2:50 AM, Muhendis said:

Brilliant.

Thanks

 No excuses from now on

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I always use sqmm - not perfect, but it does the job (in any application with any keyboard). 

[Muhendis]

  On 8/15/2023 at 2:58 AM, OneMoreFarang said:

I always use sqmm - not perfect, but it does the job (in any application with any keyboard). 

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Looks too much like squirm. I think I will do it as sometime woodworker said

25mm². How about that. It works but need to cancel before continuing.

[OneMoreFarang]

  On 8/13/2023 at 3:11 AM, OneMoreFarang said:

I am working on the electrical installation in my new condominium.

I use VAF-G cable, mostly 1.5 and 2.5 sqmm.

Until now I bought cable from BBC and YAZAKI.

Are there any substantial differences between brands? Which are the best and which should be avoided?

Expand  

Is there anybody out there who wants to comment on my question?

Otherwise, I suggest we close this thread.

[Crossy]

OK. I have noted that "some" lesser-known brands seem to be slightly under-size when measured.

 

I have some "6mm²" stranded that fits comfortably in a 4mm² crimp! Brand? Think German mid-20th century dictator.

 

Bangkok Cable and Thai Yazaki are of the better kind, I would stick with them.

 

[Muhendis]

  On 8/15/2023 at 1:48 AM, sometimewoodworker said:

appreciation of the humour of Monty Python

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And the radio goon show staring the fabulous Eccles.

[bluejets]

  On 8/14/2023 at 10:43 PM, Muhendis said:

Using a vernier caliper

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Just to be difficult, verniers are not all that accurate (micrometer yes, vernier no) and could be enough to throw off your final calculations.

That plus it could be you measured what is known as "compressed " cable or " XLPE" where the conductors are not actually round.

[Muhendis]

  On 8/16/2023 at 10:42 AM, bluejets said:

Just to be difficult, verniers are not all that accurate (micrometer yes, vernier no) and could be enough to throw off your final calculations.

That plus it could be you measured what is known as "compressed " cable or " XLPE" where the conductors are not actually round.

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You are welcome to be as difficult as you want.

My vernier caliper is OK to 1/100th mm.

Not calibrated but measures accurately on known other items.

It's digital.

Roundness was tested and found to be ........... round.

[Fruit Trader]

  On 8/16/2023 at 10:42 AM, bluejets said:

Just to be difficult, verniers are not all that accurate (micrometer yes, vernier no) and could be enough to throw off your final calculations.

That plus it could be you measured what is known as "compressed " cable or " XLPE" where the conductors are not actually round.

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XLPE is an insulation type.

The average accuracy of digital  vernier calipers is around .02mm

[captainjackS]

I have never measured the conductors, but I have a preference of wire brands for other non-scientific / non-quantitative reasons related to insulation of THW and VAF-G.  I prefer Bangkok Cable and Phelps Dodge (purchased locally in Thailand). The insulation on these 2 brands appears to resist damage from bending and scratches better than some other cheaper brands.   Phelps Dodge THW is more slippery and easier to pull in conduit.  For VAF-G (not in conduit), I prefer the appearance of BCC because it is not as shiny as Phelps Dodge.

[Sigmund]

I would expect the worst in a country where once a sucessful farang developper said that in Thailand the 2-way switches (for lights)  were unavailable ? Is this BS true ?