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Thai gov. to tax (remitted) income from abroad for tax residents starting 2024 - Part I


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Posted
  On 9/24/2023 at 9:20 AM, vukovar77 said:

I have tax number as an expat here for about 8 years.Every year they ask to provide more and more documents and data.I am from EU.This year was pretty tough (for 2022)and RD check out all pension listings per month for 2022 to check out did I pay and how much taxes.They ask for yearly tax report in my home country.They ask me to show them my bank accounts in Thai banks as well.I am on retirement visa and I never had any bussiness here or rental income as well.I have Thai wife. Had to go to RD 3 times to provide all data and documents .We live simple life and abide Thai laws which demands for expats with permanent residence to have a tax number.From my experience and from my point of view it is not easy for expats do deal with this all even my income(state pension) is pretty low  comparing with most of expats live here (from my knowledge).If they do not change a new rules, next year will be very challenging for us permanents residents,from my point of view.

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Your experience with the RD sounds horrific, particularly with a relatively small amount of tax at stake. I have been in the Thai tax net for years owing to locally sourced income but they have never been difficult over personal income tax, presumably because they are familiar with the standard Thai documents they request.

 

Did they make you get translations of your home country tax documents, which I guess were not in English, if you are from the EU, unless from Ireland? Also did they need copies of the originals certified by the tax authority.

Did the RD deduct the tax you paid overseas from your Thai tax obligation or did they make you pay the Thai tax and claim a tax refund from your home country?

 

Posted
  On 9/24/2023 at 4:12 PM, K2938 said:

If you allow me to correct your typo:  The inheritance tax threshold in Thailand is actually not 1, but 100 million baht.  And if the assets are not in Thailand and you are not a Thai national and you are only on a non-immigration visa such as Elite, retirement etc., there is no inheritance tax regardless of value.

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Mea culpa. Yes 100 million not 1 million is the threshold for Thai inheritance tax but Settha has just ordered the RD come up with a plan to increase revenue from IHT and Land & Buildings tax. 

 

IHT is charged on Thai assets regardless of where the beneficiary resides. It is charged on foreign assets, if the heir is Thai or resides in Thailand according to Immigration laws, whatever that means.

 

There is obviously potential for overlapping jurisdictions on IHT with Thailand and other countries claiming global jurisdiction over inheritances by their citizens which might become more of an issue, if Thailand amends its inheritance tax with lower thresholds and higher rates. This is further complicated by different approaches to IHT, eg the UK taxes estates but Thailand and EU countries tax heirs. The UK Thai DTA specified inheritance as something that can be taxed in Thailand, even though Thailand had  no IHT at the time.

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Posted
  On 9/24/2023 at 4:06 AM, Felt 35 said:

Anyone who know if the new tax regulations also will include inheritance from a Foreigner to Thai spouse and how shall it eventually be controlled if its savings and a gift / inheritance? ????

Felt 

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Nobody knows yet.

Generally Thai laws and regulations have been geared towards and supportive of her getting her hands on all you are worth!

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Posted

To pay tax in Thailand and get the tax paid deducted from double taxation, most I know who do it, pay someone to do it. 

 

Scandinavian law take 25 000,- to do all necessary paperwork, including tax declaration in Norway.

 

 

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Posted

Christ sake, so much doom day negativity before anyone really knows how this is going to turn out. 

 

For most my best guess, it will continue as it have done, but for those who already have tax number, it will be easier to squise a few more baht from. 

 

The very same who claimed a tax number on long stay visa, have done it to save paying tax to their orign country. 

 

It is a very good reminder, that what we have today, might not continue the same way in future. 

 

 

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Posted
  On 9/25/2023 at 2:01 AM, Happy happy said:

Currently as the law stands right now, does a retiree- who is tax resident in Thailand but covered by double taxation exemption-does he need to file a tax return in Thailand?

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(Technically)... Yes if you have overseas income above 150,000 (+ allowances) THB that you bring into Thailand in the same Calendar/Tax year that it was earned. 

 

The DTA only comes into play when calculating how much Tax is due on the income. 

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Posted
  On 9/24/2023 at 3:40 PM, DudleySquat said:
  On 9/18/2023 at 3:59 AM, impulse said:

If you didn't get mugged last night walking on the sidewalk, you're enjoying for free the benefits of tax money spent on police and sidewalks.

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You can't say with a straight face that the police reduce crime here. 

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I guess a lot of guys didn't get the irony when I chose 2 of the most oft maligned uses of tax money...  Cops and sidewalks.

 

But to answer your question, if there were no cops, no justice system, no courts and no prisons, Thailand would be a quagmire and unlivable.  All of those require tax money.  And we live under their benefit, Thai or foreigner, whether we pay taxes or not.  And I'm not talking about VAT.

 

Even if we "don't get anything for free" (the claim I was responding to), we still get the benefits of a lot of tax spending, just in tolerable living conditions.

 

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Posted

I don't think we get any more detailed information from Rd, until we pay tax for 2024 otherwise that should be on their webpage by now. Hmm....part of the plan???? Below is googles translation of the new regulation.

Felt

 

Revenue Department orders
No. P.161/2023
Subject: Payment of income tax according to Section 41, paragraph two of the Revenue Code.
In order for revenue officials to consider this as a practice guideline for inspecting and giving advice to those residing in Thailand.
which has assessable income according to Section 40 of the Revenue Code In the past tax year Due to work duties
or business conducted abroad or because of assets located abroad according to Section 41, paragraph two
of the Revenue Code The Revenue Department has ordered the following:
Clause 1: Persons who are residing in Thailand according to Section 41, paragraph three, of the Revenue Code.
who have assessable income due to work duties or activities conducted abroad or because the property is in
Foreign countries according to Section 41, paragraph two of the Revenue Code In the said tax year and brought the assessable income
Entering Thailand in any tax year That person has a duty to include that assessable income in the calculation.
To pay income tax according to Section 48 of the Revenue Code In the tax year in which the assessable income was brought in
in Thailand
Article 2: All rules, regulations, orders, letters of response to consultations. or any practice that is contrary to or inconsistent with
This order shall be cancelled.
Article 3 This order shall come into force for assessable income imported into Thailand from the date
1 January 2024 onwards
Ordered on 15 September 2023
  Lawan Saengsanit
(Mr. Lawan Saengsanit)
Director General of the Revenue Department

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Posted
  On 9/25/2023 at 4:36 AM, Felt 35 said:

Clause 1: Persons who are residing in Thailand according to Section 41, paragraph three, of the Revenue Code.

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Just for clarity does a non O visa extension mean I am a resident (I thought it meant just the opposite) - I think the concept of residency is (as in most countries) blurred and confusing.

Finally, there is an old saying "two things you can't escape - death and taxes" For me it's a matter of which comes first????!

Posted
  On 9/25/2023 at 4:43 AM, Negita43 said:

Just for clarity does a non O visa extension mean I am a resident (I thought it meant just the opposite) - I think the concept of residency is (as in most countries) blurred and confusing.

Finally, there is an old saying "two things you can't escape - death and taxes" For me it's a matter of which comes first????!

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I maybe wrong but......????

 

An extension is just that, an extension of your visa. Very few of us are actual "resident's", we are non-immigrants being allowed to stay provided certain things to get over the hurdles, but they are saying if you have your feet in the country for 180+ days, you may be taxed on the cash you bring into the country and/or earnings whilst being in the country. 

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Posted
  On 9/25/2023 at 2:38 AM, vukovar77 said:

They just concluded that after all that I do not need to pay additional tax in Thailand.I had electronic -documents signiture from my bank and my RD.They accepted that(we translated in Thai).No need to certified by the tax authority.They check my bank accounts here (take a copy).The procedure was longer and more complex for me and in Thai language mostly.Procedure was not "horrific ",only demanding and new for me.Next time I am prepared and I know what to do.

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Thanks for the response. People from some countries may have trouble getting those documents with electronic signature from tax authorities.  I have an accountant prepare my UK tax return but I don't recall receiving any kind of hard copy or electronic document that would be of use from HMRC.  I just have my own tax returns and some tax invoices but no receipts from HMRC. 

 

I think Vukovar's experience in filing tax returns and getting double tax treaty relief from the RD on foreign source pension indicates that they feel they are capable of implementing this without any further ado.  So there might not be any more information or guidelines forthcoming at all. Just do your tax return in 2025 and figure it out for yourself.  Online filing seems out of the question as there is no way to apply for tax credits. 

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Posted
  On 9/25/2023 at 5:16 AM, bob smith said:

That's a pretty big problem if you ask me!

 

do you enjoy the flooding, the corruption, the bureaucracy, the traffic et al?

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Flooding happens in my country, corruption happens in my country, bureaucracy happens in my country, and it also has traffic problems.

 

Now if you say your country doesn't, you would probably be fibbing, or have other problems you haven't mentioned, perhaps the reason you purport to be in LOS...............:whistling:...............????

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