12 Thais may have been killed in Hamas attack in Israel

[Frankie baby]

Israel are now going to do what they always wanted, take out Hamas & bomb the s--t out of Hezbollah. The only difference this time around is that they will have UN & international backing. For the sake of the hostages we can only hope that international pressure holds the Israelis at bay why some sort of diplomacy can be established in order to get as many hostages free before they kick-off?   

[John Drake]

2 hours ago, Lemsta69 said:

From what the article says they weren't getting paid very much. 50K bath per month for driving trucks around Israel seems like a really rotten deal given all the money that lot have.

Khaosod has a story about the mother of one of the Thais Hamas murdered. Her son was paid, says the article, about 80,000 baht per month on a banana farm. He sent 58,000 per month back home to Thailand. That would indicate his own living expenses were minimal. So perhaps these workers are also receiving subsidized housing and other benefits. This does not seem like an exploitive wage to me or a "really rotten deal" by "that lot."

[Artisi]

2 minutes ago, John Drake said:

Khaosod has a story about the mother of one of the Thais Hamas murdered. Her son was paid, says the article, about 80,000 baht per month on a banana farm. He sent 58,000 per month back home to Thailand. That would indicate his own living expenses were minimal. So perhaps these workers are also receiving subsidized housing and other benefits. This does not seem like an exploitive wage to me or a "really rotten deal" by "that lot."

some people can't really help themselves when it comes to bigotry

[rudi49jr]

22 minutes ago, trainman34014 said:

My Father worked in Palestine for three years in the 50's and he told us that every Palestinian he met was hell bent on driving all the Jews into the sea and taking back their Country.

How would you feel if someone took your land and chased you away?

[Artisi]

2 minutes ago, rudi49jr said:

How would you feel if someone took your land and chased you away?

But isn't that fairly normal for nearly every nation on the planet? 

 

Maybe you could name a couple of countries where the original people are still No1. 

[koele2]

Do these captured or killed Thais have any money or high status?  If not, why would Thai authorities care about them?  

[rudi49jr]

10 minutes ago, Artisi said:

But isn't that fairly normal for nearly every nation on the planet? 

 

Maybe you could name a couple of countries where the original people are still No1. 

Fairly normal? So people should just accept it when someone wants to grab their land and make them second rate citizens? How do you feel about Russia invading Ukraine?

[JCauto]

I find it a bit sad that this is just bringing out all of the old opinions, tropes, misinformation and other BS without any context as to how and why this happened. No, this is not your same old Israel-Palestinian conflict.

 

Has anyone noticed that there are conflicts ramping up in numerous locations, and in each of these conflicts there is a clear division between the side the Russians are supporting and the other one? It doesn't require four years at West Point to understand that it was in Russia's strategic interest to do two things outside of the direct conflict and they have done so quite successfully:

1. Spread a huge amount of disinformation on social media using the same channels and techniques honed in the mess they made in the USA over the last several years to divide the Western public about the Ukraine war and spread conspiracy theories to the brain-addled.
2. Spread the conflict zones to other locations so that they stretch the supply lines of the USA and their allies and keep them having to fund other conflicts so they can't supply all the material for Ukraine.

The first strategy is already paying dividends, with Hungary, Poland and possibly the USA moving towards the Right and the Russian position of disengagement with Ukraine and stopping to provide funding for ammunition and other supplies. The GOP already eliminated Ukraine aid from the budget to maintain the funding for the US government and the ammunition supplies are starting to run low.

The second strategy is evident in Wagner stoking war in the Sahel and elsewhere in Africa, the Nagorno-Karabakh conflict, Syria and, now, Israel. It should be noted that Israel were supporting Armenia in Nagorno-Karabakh whereas the Russians were supporting the Azerbaijani. Iran has been supplying the Russians with drones, the Russians are now supporting Iran to cause trouble for Israel.

I don't think the Putin alliance has anywhere near the people, equipment, ammunition or other strength to take on NATO, but they sure can cause a lot of trouble for a world that has become much more easy to influence in your direction with propaganda and social media. They've already shown how well that works.

[Nick Carter icp]

14 minutes ago, rudi49jr said:

Fairly normal? So people should just accept it when someone wants to grab their land and make them second rate citizens? How do you feel about Russia invading Ukraine?

The American Indians accepted it 

[Time Traveller]

On the same day, there's another news story that Thai police are planning on make civilian ownership of firearms more difficult.   

This is precisely the reason civilians should have the right to legally own firearms for self defense.

[The Theory]

3 hours ago, Jingthing said:

If they were taken accidentally

my guess is perhaps they captured Thai (or other nationalities) in case if they can exchange 1 for 2 or more own POWs. 

[rudi49jr]

27 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

The American Indians accepted it 

Seriously? You should probably read up on American history. European settlers slaughtered most native Americans and then put the rest of them in reservations where no one else wanted to live anyway. 

[Nick Carter icp]

1 minute ago, rudi49jr said:

Seriously? You should probably read up on American history. European settlers slaughtered most native Americans and then put the rest of them in reservations where no one else wanted to live anyway. 

Maybe Israel should do that as well ?

[Nick Carter icp]

34 minutes ago, Time Traveller said:

On the same day, there's another news story that Thai police are planning on make civilian ownership of firearms more difficult.   

This is precisely the reason civilians should have the right to legally own firearms for self defense.

The Israelis did have firearms , they had guns, rifles , tanks and bomb shelters and they still got killed 

[rudi49jr]

6 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

Maybe Israel should do that as well ?

What? Slaughter all the native Americans? There aren’t many left.

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, Frankie baby said:

Israel are now going to do what they always wanted, take out Hamas & bomb the s--t out of Hezbollah. The only difference this time around is that they will have UN & international backing. For the sake of the hostages we can only hope that international pressure holds the Israelis at bay why some sort of diplomacy can be established in order to get as many hostages free before they kick-off?   

I doubt Israel would want to eliminate Hamas if Hamas wasn't intent on Israel not existing. 

Edited October 9, 2023 by Jingthing

[Cory1848]

2 hours ago, off road pat said:

There are so many more pictures on the net !!!...

And probably more than 90 percent of them are badly photo-shopped fakes !!!

[StayinThailand2much]

6 hours ago, Morch said:

Thailand merely goes with mainstream diplomacy.

Thailand merely goes wherever the $$$ are...

[impulse]

4 hours ago, hotchilli said:

7 hours ago, webfact said:

Thailand unequivocally condemns the violations that have occurred in this crisis, though it refrains from naming specific groups responsible.

Staying on the fence as usual

Plenty of time for condemnation, later when none of their citizens are held as hostages and there aren't tens of thousands of others in the line of fire.

 

[Morch]

6 hours ago, RichardColeman said:

Not really sure a two state solution is the key when both parties pray to books that pretty much say both are the only true religion, only they are the true people of god and kill the infidel !!! 

 

I pretty much expect Israel to go in and get some of its people back and then tactical nuke Gaza - the international community are so caught up in other wars and economic issues there would not be any comebacks. If Israel does not destroy Gaza and parts of the country I will be very surprised

 

 

 

 

Support for a two state solution is not high. Surely less than it used to be. Then again '2 state solution' can mean a whole lot of things, so each side got it's own views anyway. There's always a hardcore (not that small, though) on each side which will denounce any compromise (that usually goes hand in hand with religious fanaticism).

 

But as far as the international community goes, that's still the go to answer. Whether or not its a realistic goal can be debated. When diplomats and politicians make statements, though, it's often referred to. Maybe because the other alternatives are worse.

 

You can keep expecting, won't happen. At most, there will be mass destruction, on par and maybe surpassing previous rounds of fighting. There are about 150 hostages, including non-Israelis. Some will be hurt anyway, either by IDF attacks or Hamas retribution. But don't see Netanyahu actually ordering to ignore their presence and well-being.

 

 

[Cory1848]

1 hour ago, rudi49jr said:

Fairly normal? So people should just accept it when someone wants to grab their land and make them second rate citizens? How do you feel about Russia invading Ukraine?

Every situation is different, and the Russian invasion of Ukraine has no application here. In the late 1940s, about 800,000 Palestinian Arabs were displaced by the creation of Israel; at the same time, about the same number of Jews evacuated or were forced from majority Arab cities where they’d lived for centuries. The latter were absorbed and assimilated into the new Jewish state; the former, along with their children and grandchildren, mostly remain refugees to this day, to suit the political purposes of the Arab states that host them.

 

Population transfers, or ethnic cleansing, is horrendous and inhumane, but it’s better than people continuing to murder each other from generation to generation over scraps of land whose original “ownership” has long lost all relevance. European Jews were ethnically cleansed from most of Europe in the aftermath of World War II (those who survived), and you can blame the Germans for that. Millions of Germans were themselves ethnically cleansed from parts of present-day Poland and the Sudetenland; today, just a few generations later, the Germans, Poles, and Czechs are all happy allies. It’s still happening today; most people haven’t even noticed, but a week or two ago 150,000 Armenians were driven from their ancestral homeland in Nagorno-Karabakh. It is brutal and condemnable, but they will be able to start new lives in Armenia proper, and their offspring will hardly feel the pain.

 

Until humanity somehow evolves and develops tolerance for each other, this is sometimes the least unpleasant option. Unfortunately, for the Palestinian Arabs and the Israelis, it’s too late for simple solutions ...

[Morch]

5 hours ago, NorthernRyland said:

Either Israel completely destroys Palestine or the other way around.

 

The thing that gets me is that as a US citizen apparently Israel is my "greatest ally" and we owe them unlimited military support in the form of US tax dollars (yay!). I can't even think of a single thing Israel ever did to directly help America. IMO the US government is completely captured by Zionists (Jews and Christians alike) and they will continue to fund Israel (with my tax dollars) until the ultimate destruction of Palestine.

 

Israel will not 'completely destroy the Palestinians', and the Palestinians cannot destroy Israel.

 

As a US citizen you ought to know that the US gives Israel a 3$ Billion annually (give or take). That's a lot, but not unlimited. Further, this aid is in fact a sort of subsidy. These funds can be used to Buy American. So, in fact, some of the main beneficiaries are US arms producers, and workers therein. A lot of the lobbying for this comes from them Congressmen and Senators in relevant areas. Write them.

 

On the military side, Israel shares a whole lot of intel with the USA, and there are a few US bases (surveillance and depots) about. Then there's R&D, which also relates to the funds allocated - arms developed by Israel on US budget get the US special rights, or marketing concessions.

 

I totally get it that from a US citizen point of view, there are better ways to spend these tax dollars. Hence, the 'write your representative' comment. Relative to the US defense budget, it's hardly a speck of dust. But on a different take, it also represents 50% of the global USA military aid budget....

[Morch]

5 hours ago, chrischronic said:

Will the Thais likely be freed, or what is the typical outcome when dealing with Hamas and captured prisoners from non-conflict countries? If they are all executed, what will Thailand do? My other half is highly upset about this and has been focused on YouTube videos of the history of the conflict since the news dropped.

 

I think that they will be freed. Perhaps not immediately (which could be dangerous with IDF attacks), though. Kinda hard to arrange that during the fighting.

 

They are not from a Western or a otherwise rich country, so no real point. They have enough Israelis, Europeans and Americans to go around.

 

If they are executed, Thailand will mourn and protest. What else could it do?

 

[Morch]

5 hours ago, Jingthing said:

I wonder if the Hamas terrorists have intentionally captured Thais or if it was more situational.

Israel needs foreign workers the same as many countries. 

The workers that the Thais replaced were non-Israeli Arabs.

While the workers are obviously there for the salaries, attacking Thai workers is also an attack on the Israeli economy.

Who is going to make a deal if there is one to get the Thai captives back?

Israel or Thailand?

Seems accidental, as they apparently also captured their boss (not clear if he's alive, though). They were targeting settlements, towns, concentrations of people (like that festival) - rather than specific individuals or groups. Just grabbed whomever they didn't shoot.

 

A deal, if there is one, will most likely be handled by Egyptian representatives. or Qatari ones. Whether they deal with Israel of Thailand is dependent on Hamas's conditions.

 

Either way, families of Thais killed in Israel will receive a full compensation package (as happens with Israeli casualties). It won't bring people back but would carry a long way in Thailand. Injured and kidnapped get a similar, but smaller deal.

[Morch]

5 hours ago, Marco51 said:

Denying a 2state solution from the start or a peaceful together of palestinians and jews as a united country, stealing other peoples' land and life has given rise to hamas and similar organisations (they did not exist before Israel started the Stern Group terror and did not either until it was obvious the 2state solution was a scam), maybe shooting and arresting stone throwing children against tanks and trigger happy brooklyn jews has slightly increased the anger of people that had lived there for thousands of years before the zionists, just as the cia coup against an elected governement support for a murderous shah has given rise to equally murderous mullahs that now support eejits like hamas against eejits like N. . Maybe history is just another alternative fact, right? And maybe killling their own 2state solution politicians was not the greatest idea ........at least Netanyoohoo can now follow through easily on his fascist agenda and turn Israel from democracy to a jewliban state. My alternative fact would be : Netanthingummie knew this would happen and let it, so he could cling on to power and not go to jail for corruption. As good as any explanation, ey?!

There were Arab (before they called themselves Palestinians, which is a relatively late title ) violence and terrorism directed at Jews and Brits well before 'the stern gang'. The rest of your vehement post is similarly peppered with nonsense. Conspiracy theories is just another form of the same.

[Morch]

4 hours ago, ujayujay said:

You are completely wrong! Hamas extremists want this! The majority of Palestinians, especially in the West Bank, like much of Israeli society, want a two-state solution! Israel's extremist government does not want a two-state solution. So we have a situation that shows what happens when extremists subjugate a country!

This is not true. Hamas won the last general Palestinian Elections. And while that was years ago, any poll conducted since shows they have the support of (at minimum) almost half of the voter base. While Hamas rules in the Gaza Strip, there are numerous supporters in the West Bank as well.

 

Just yesterday, following the news there were mass support protests, clashes with Israeli security forces and the usual sickening offering of sweets in celebration.

 

Support for the two-state solution is, generally, waning. Both on the Israeli and the Palestinian side. This is bad news, certainly, but it does no good to pretend otherwise. Attacks such as this just set it back a bunch.

[Morch]

4 hours ago, Lemsta69 said:

Isaan is not Israel. Pretty sad state of affairs if the rich you-know-who's can't pay a proper wage for what turns out to be a very hazardous job. 

 

As for being "antisemitic", no I'm not anti I just don't believe the propoganda anymore. Both sides in this conflict are hard-headed, full of themselves, unlikeable people and neither side has the moral high ground.

Foreign workers at basic jobs often get low salaries relative to the country they are working in. That's how it works. If you don't get it, talks to some Myanmar or Cambodian workers here.

[Morch]

5 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

If Israel does that, it would be tantamount to declaring war on the entire Arab world, and could be the beginning of the end of Israel as a nation. The extremists Netanyahu has allied himself with are destroying the country. 

Sure. The United Arab World fantasy. Didn't happen when there was war in Syria. Didn't hold vs. Egypt after signing peace agreement with Israel. Took the US and a whole lot of pressure to forge an Arab 'coalition' vs. Iraq. No such Arab coalition vs. Iran...Shall I go on?

[Hockeybik]

6 hours ago, ChipButty said:

I didn't realize there was that many Thai's in Israel need a few planes to get that lot home,  

30,000? Even on A380's that's more than 50 trips and you know it won't happen.

[Nick Carter icp]

4 hours ago, chilli42 said:

, the radar system supporting the “iron dome” shut down prior to the attack.

 

Do you have a link to that claim ?