Is the new tax on money transferred into Thailand being implemented?

[Liverpool Lou]

3 hours ago, Neeranam said:

I've lived here(and worked) for 30 years and never known anyone to go to jail for tax evasion.

Jail is not the only penalty for tax evasion.

 

https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/2216335/importer-fleeing-tax-evasion-prison-sentence-caught-on-train

 

https://www.voanews.com/a/a-13-2008-07-31-voa6/345973.html

(But slipped out of it on appeal)

 

https://apnews.com/article/c2a5c82f47cd49ceac713c4cac9b0256

[Ben Zioner]

1 hour ago, Liverpool Lou said:

"ศูนย์บริการศุลกากร - Customs Care Center".

Your link's only seven years out of date...
"Last updated date: 31 March 2017 12:05:30" .

 

"Foreign Currency 

       Individuals or tourists may bring foreign currency in the form of banknotes or coins out of or into the Kingdom without limits.  But if the total value exceeds USD 20,000 or its equivalent, a declaration must be made to the customs officer at the time of passing through Customs".

https://www.thailand.go.th/issue-focus-detail/009-010

Well, this is going to change.

[Ben Zioner]

2 hours ago, Neeranam said:

I would change that to 'tax evasion'

Absolutely not, tax evasion implies illegal acts such as hiding assessable income. Since it was a loophole deliberately inserted in the rules, using it was avoidance. In the strict legal sense. The simple fact that they have to change the rules demonstrate that it was fully compliant with those in force until December 31, 2023.

Edited January 7 by Ben Zioner

[Neeranam]

7 minutes ago, Ben Zioner said:

Absolutely not, tax evasion implies illegal acts such as hiding assessable income. Since it was a loophole deliberately inserted in the rules, using it was avoidance. In the strict legal sense. The simple fact that they have to change the rules demonstrate that it was fully compliant with those in force until December 31, 2023.

I disagree, I know many who withheld their income before sending to Thailand to evade tax. 

You don't know the meaning of loophole 

[rabas]

6 hours ago, Mike Lister said:

 

18. YOU are responsible for determining if you have the minimum assessable income in Thailand each year which means you must file a tax return. That assessable income might comprise, pension payments, investment income, rental income or any of the other types of income listed in the link above. If you have assessable income of over 120,000 baht per year, you must file a tax return (60,000 baht if your sole source of assessable income is bank interest paid in Thailand).

...YOU are responsible for determining if you have the minimum assessable income in Thailand each year - YES

...which means you must file a tax return. - NO

 

This was not a general rule before the loophole change so should still be not true.

 

I would be interested to know if you know of of new rules.

[Ben Zioner]

4 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

I disagree, I know many who withheld their income before sending to Thailand to evade tax. 

You don't know the meaning of loophole 

You may disagree if you wish, but you should look up the definitions of "tax evasion" and "tax avoidance", it is clear cut.

[Mike Lister]

23 minutes ago, rabas said:

...YOU are responsible for determining if you have the minimum assessable income in Thailand each year - YES

...which means you must file a tax return. - NO

 

This was not a general rule before the loophole change so should still be not true.

 

I would be interested to know if you know of of new rules.

The English usage is poor, I'll reword it. It intends to say that the tax filer is responsible for determining if the threshold has been reached.

[Neeranam]

44 minutes ago, Ben Zioner said:

You may disagree if you wish, but you should look up the definitions of "tax evasion" and "tax avoidance", it is clear cut.

Taking advantage of a tax loophole, such as this one, where funds from abroad are not taxed if brought in a year after they were earned, may be considered illegal in certain contexts. While tax laws vary globally, exploiting such loopholes may be deemed illegal if the intention behind the action is to evade taxes willfully and manipulate the system for personal gain. Legal systems typically frown upon actions that go against the spirit of the law, even if they technically adhere to the letter. In some jurisdictions, tax authorities may view attempts to exploit such gaps in legislation as tax evasion, subject to penalties and legal consequences. The legality of taking advantage of tax loopholes often depends on the specific language of the law, the intent of the taxpayer, and the overall ethical considerations surrounding the practice.

[Liverpool Lou]

1 hour ago, Ben Zioner said:

2 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

"ศูนย์บริการศุลกากร - Customs Care Center".

Your link's only seven years out of date...
"Last updated date: 31 March 2017 12:05:30" .

 

"Foreign Currency 

       Individuals or tourists may bring foreign currency in the form of banknotes or coins out of or into the Kingdom without limits.  But if the total value exceeds USD 20,000 or its equivalent, a declaration must be made to the customs officer at the time of passing through Customs".

https://www.thailand.go.th/issue-focus-detail/009-010

Expand  

Well, this is going to change.

What is?  And who said that "it" is?

[rabas]

44 minutes ago, Mike Lister said:

The English usage is poor, I'll reword it. It intends to say that the tax filer is responsible for determining if the threshold has been reached.

 

I thought that's probably what you meant, but good to fix.

 

Overall, your summary of tax issues is very useful, I saved a copy.  Thank you for your work.

 

[proton]

3 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

That's for Thai baht banknotes not foreign currencies.

 

No its not 20k baht is the amount tourists need, in theory. The Thai customs site says $20k undeclared, but forms says $15k TIT

 

https://wise.com/gb/blog/taking-cash-in-or-out-of-thailand

Details of the customs regulations in Thailand can be found on the Thai Customs Board website.

According to the details available online, you can bring up to $20,000 - or the equivalent - into Thailand, without needing to take any specific action. Carry in excess of that, and you have to complete a declaration when you arrive - more on that later.

However, it’s worth noting that the actual declaration form you're required to complete states that amounts worth over $15,000 should be declared.

 

Edited January 7 by proton

[Ben Zioner]

1 hour ago, Neeranam said:

Taking advantage of a tax loophole, such as this one, where funds from abroad are not taxed if brought in a year after they were earned, may be considered illegal in certain contexts. While tax laws vary globally, exploiting such loopholes may be deemed illegal if the intention behind the action is to evade taxes willfully and manipulate the system for personal gain. Legal systems typically frown upon actions that go against the spirit of the law, even if they technically adhere to the letter. In some jurisdictions, tax authorities may view attempts to exploit such gaps in legislation as tax evasion, subject to penalties and legal consequences. The legality of taking advantage of tax loopholes often depends on the specific language of the law, the intent of the taxpayer, and the overall ethical considerations surrounding the practice.

Laughing emoticon is mine...

[rabas]

1 hour ago, Neeranam said:

Taking advantage of a tax loophole, such as this one, where funds from abroad are not taxed if brought in a year after they were earned, may be considered illegal in certain contexts. While tax laws vary globally, exploiting such loopholes may be deemed illegal if the intention behind the action is to evade taxes willfully and manipulate the system for personal gain. Legal systems typically frown upon actions that go against the spirit of the law, even if they technically adhere to the letter. In some jurisdictions, tax authorities may view attempts to exploit such gaps in legislation as tax evasion, subject to penalties and legal consequences. The legality of taking advantage of tax loopholes often depends on the specific language of the law, the intent of the taxpayer, and the overall ethical considerations surrounding the practice.

Taking advantage of a tax loophole, such as this one,

 

I doubt the Thai wait till next year rule is was illegal or even frowned  on.

 

I once asked the Revenue Dept about tax on a significant amount earned income from China and they said "Oh, no need, wait till next year and there will be no tax."

 

Edited January 7 by rabas

[Ben Zioner]

5 minutes ago, rabas said:

Taking advantage of a tax loophole, such as this one,

Yes, what amazes me is that someone who claims Thai nationality doesn't see that the "loophole" was there by design. IMHO they can remove it now simply because the younger generation of "rich Thais" tends to spend less than 179 in country. And that includes those at the very top.

[Ben Zioner]

1 hour ago, rabas said:

Overall, your summary of tax issues is very useful, I saved a copy.  Thank you for your work.

 

I agree, but it is "avoidance" not "evasion".

[UKresonant]

9 hours ago, Mike Lister said:

I did not suggest that anyone had to prove where the money came from, other than in a different thread where I wrote that people who deposit foreign cash currency into a foreign currency account, must produce a signed Customs declaration.

 

There perhaps is a threshold, that triggers a custom declaration, as at the Airport?  Paid in to a non-resident  FCD in July 23 no problem, but not a large amount.

Edited January 7 by UKresonant

[JackGats]

4 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

That's for Thai baht banknotes not foreign currencies.

Ok. So no ceiling for currencies to have to be declared?

[Neeranam]

26 minutes ago, Ben Zioner said:

Yes, what amazes me is that someone who claims Thai nationality doesn't see that the "loophole" was there by design. IMHO they can remove it now simply because the younger generation of "rich Thais" tends to spend less than 179 in country. And that includes those at the very top.

Why do you repeatedly bring up my nationality? 

What do you mean 'claims'? 

[norbra]

23 hours ago, novacova said:

If living here 180 days or longer during the year and generating untaxed income from abroad then taxes will be owed. No taxes will be owed on pensions, ssi or money that has already been taxed from abroad

Here is some supporting clarification of what they are chasing.

 https://www.mazars.co.th/Home/Insights/Doing-Business-in-Thailand/Tax/Q-A-published-on-foreign-sourced-income

[Mike Lister]

12 minutes ago, UKresonant said:

There perhaps is a threshold, that triggers a custom declaration, as at the Airport?  Paid in to a non-resident  FCD in July 23 no problem, but not a large amount.

Yes, over $20k.

[Hellfire]

Just keep sending your hard earned, already taxed savings to the Thai bank accounts. Everything together will be double taxed as a lump sum somewhere in the January 2025. 

[Mike Lister]

3 minutes ago, Hellfire said:

Just keep sending your hard earned, already taxed savings to the Thai bank accounts. Everything together will be double taxed as a lump sum somewhere in the January 2025. 

You appear not to even understand how tax systems work, why even bother adding more drivel to an already drivel rich thread!

[sungod]

Just now, Mike Lister said:

You appear not to even understand how tax systems work, why even bother adding more drivel to an already drivel rich thread!

A drivel rich thread on which you are the main poster........

 

Cant make it up

[Liverpool Lou]

31 minutes ago, JackGats said:

5 hours ago, Liverpool Lou said:

That's for Thai baht banknotes not foreign currencies.

Ok. So no ceiling for currencies to have to be declared?

No limits on the amount of currency that can be brought in but over $20k equivalent has to be declared.

[Mike Lister]

Just now, Liverpool Lou said:

No limits on the amount of currency that can be brought in but over $20k equivalent has to be declared.

Yes.

[Liverpool Lou]

2 minutes ago, Mike Lister said:

3 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

No limits on the amount of currency that can be brought in but over $20k equivalent has to be declared.

Yes.

I know, that's why I posted that comment, it wasn't a question.

[ChaiyaTH]

On 1/6/2024 at 3:14 PM, LukKrueng said:

Has anyone here transferred money into Thailand since January 1st? Are taxes really being charged?

Everyone I know including myself have stopped transfer directly to Thailand until things are cleared up. I use Thai banks minimal as of this year. Opened some bank accounts in other SE asian countries to use for Grab, Visa pay and ATM withdrawals instead. Problem solved.

 

Even they are always slow and might not be able to do it right away, legally speaking they could still go back in time for many years, from this year start. So I am not playing with fire until it is 100% clear to not happen anymore.

Edited January 7 by ChaiyaTH

[Mike Lister]

1 minute ago, Liverpool Lou said:

I know, that's why I posted that comment, it wasn't a question.

And the same rules apply for the export of foreign currency, USD15k or more, or other currencies in excess of THB 450k in value. 

[Mike Lister]

10 minutes ago, Mike Lister said:

And the same rules apply for the export of foreign currency, USD15k or more, or other currencies in excess of THB 450k in value. 

Somebody's confused, how sad:

 

Clause 1. Any person who exports or takes out from Thailand of the following currency or foreign currencies, such person shall declare details of such currency, foreign currencies or negotiable monetary instruments to Customs Officer while passing the customs as prescribed in the annex of this notification; (1) Currency which is currency notes or coins which their aggregate value exceeding 450,000 Baht (2) Foreign currencies which are foreign currency notes or coins which their aggregate value exceeding US$15,000 or its equivalent at market rate

 

https://www.bot.or.th/content/dam/bot/documents/en/our-roles/financial-markets/foreign-exchange-regulations/laws-and-regulations/E_MOFControl6.pdf

 

https://www.bot.or.th/en/our-roles/financial-markets/foreign-exchange-regulations/exchange-control-regulation.html

 

[xtrnuno41]

My guess would be, they save it up, until tax has to be paid in the specific time of tax paying.

In the meantime, they will give you even a tax ID and then you need to pay.

All banks are in it and shift over registration of the amounts from abroad from everybody.

Wait for the envelope, which will surprise you then.

You know how governments work, they always try to surprise with negative outcome for you.

No one knows now how they would do it, secret surprise.

Just the same as changing the elite visa. They let you know, you can anticipate in time and then changed.

Making it extreme expensive.