New Thai Tax On Remittances??

[Mike Lister]

3 minutes ago, Negita43 said:

A slight variation I use a debit card (UK) to pay for medical bills:

1. If I can prove the money was in the bank account before 01/24 will that be taxable?

2. Are medical bills tax deductible?

1. Theoretically those would be savings so no.

 

2. Not medical bills but health insurance premiums are, with a Thai insurer, up to 25k per year can be deducted from assessable income

[Negita43]

On 1/22/2024 at 4:02 AM, Robin said:

Will money from sale of UK property owned before 2023 be considered income?  Like most property in UK, there could be a sizeable capital gain on the sale.  Saving?  Income?  How will this be decided?

I would like to see an answer to this one too

[Mike Lister]

On 1/22/2024 at 11:02 AM, Robin said:

I am a retiree from UK, lived in Thailand with wife  for some years on Retirement visa, all very happy with life until this came along.  I do not like uncertainty.

As a precaution, before 1/1//2024, I transferred US$50,000to my Thil bank account, with no problems, so with wife's income from rice fields and beauty shop, we can go on living in Thailand.  

My questions are for the future;  I have property in UK, now rented out, and income kept in UK (taxes paid)  My intention ha always been to sell this property and live out my life on the capital, perhaps transferred to Thailand.

Will money from sale of UK property owned before 2023 be considered income?  Like most property in UK, there could be a sizeable capital gain on the sale.  Saving?  Income?  How will this be decided?

If all the proceeds of the sales are kept in a Asset management Account, does it become savings or income?

Say the money was kept in UK bank offering me a credit card, and I spend in Thailand mainly on this card. is that expenditure taxable income or not?

Do I need a reliable  Thai Tax Consultant to give me these answers?  Can someone on AN suggest such a person?

I have never had any contact with Thai RD or been given a Tax umber and I was hoping to keep it that way.  Wife has income from growing Rice but has never files a tax return.

This whole idea of Sreettha's appears to be a good way of getting Retirees out of Thailand, and possibly counterproductive, 

 

17 hours ago, persimmon said:

Would money brought in from the sale of a house be taxed ? In the UK , the sale of a domestic property attracts no CGT , so is a very good way of accumulating wealth over the long term . Not so good though if it`s taxed when transferred to Thailand .

I don't think anyone outside of a few people in the Thai RD can answer this question with 100% certainty, not at this point in time. I also have UK property that I will sell before too long so this issue applies to me also.

 

My view is that any gain earned, prior to 1 January 2024, is tax free, in Thailand, that is clear because the RD has stated as much. The question then becomes, how will apportioned gain be calculated for tax purposes, from 1 January 2024 and the answer is, I do not know. My best guess is that Thailand does not want to prevent foreigners' from bringing money into the country to spend on real estate in Thailand so there will almost certainly not be a tax to pay on those house sale proceeds, as long as the property was a primary residence. If it was not and CG was paid on the sale, that will be adequate proof that tax was paid and again, not taxable in Thailand. For a crystal clear bullet proof answer, you will have to wait I'm afraid, until the RD speaks.

[Jonpail]

On 1/20/2024 at 3:55 PM, giogio said:

I will read your mentioned guide

 

what new rules need to be announced? (Or, did u mean to say: we hope changes of current new rules?)

 

i visited a provincial inland revenue last week, spoke in depth with chief director. First he told me was: “foreigners seem to misinterpret the rule”. Provincial Inland revenues have already been instructed by govnmt that remittances will be taxed according to certain criterias. He gave me copy of govnmt instructions, the forms to apply for TIN and told me to come back by march 2025 to file tax return.

 

that s why i posted on forum

“foreigners seem to misinterpret the rule”. is this because they haven't announced the exact details yet?

[Jonpail]

Just now, Jonpail said:

“foreigners seem to misinterpret the rule”. is this because they haven't announced the exact details yet?

Do you have a government # for the government form instructions?

 

[Mike Lister]

1 hour ago, Jonpail said:

“foreigners seem to misinterpret the rule”. is this because they haven't announced the exact details yet?

No, not at all, the Revenue made their announcement last year and it was very clear:

 

https://sherrings.com/foreign-source-income-personal-tax-thailand.html#:~:text=The Foreign Source Income Law&text=A resident of Thailand* who,bringing the income into Thailand.

 

 

[JimGant]

On 1/22/2024 at 10:32 AM, Mike Lister said:

So, people who earned money last year and remitted it last year, are taxable on that income. It's a basic premise of all of these discussions on tax, in every thread.

 

Indeed (unless the applicable DTA says the home country has exclusive taxation rights on that income).

[JimGant]

9 hours ago, JimHuaHin said:

But, if the funds used to pay the credit card debt were acquired after 1 January 2024, then the purchase is classed as a taxable remittance.

 

We're forgetting that the new rule applies to remitted INCOME, not remitted cash flow. A credit card cash flow to the Thai merchant I buy from is just a loan from the bank that issued me the credit card. It's not remitted income. This is in the same category as, I borrow $100,000 from my mother, which I then remit to Thailand. Whether I gave my mom a note, or she considered it a gift, is neither here nor there. It is definitely NOT income, and therefore would not show up on my US tax return, nor would it be considered income for Thai purposes. How I pay the bank back, or how I pay Mom back, does not redefine this loan as income.

 

Do you really think the Thais are going to view all remittances into Thailand as income? Of course not. And they're not going to be able to differentiate remittances between income and capital. As said too many times on these threads, common sense dictates that what you report as assessable income on your Thai tax return will be determined only by you. Random compliance audits, like we do in the US, may be in the future. But even if hit by one of them, if you filter all your monies through an offshore or home country bank, the fungibility of such money, and some good record keeping, should shoo away the revenuers.

[Jonpail]

1 hour ago, Mike Lister said:

No, not at all, the Revenue made their announcement last year and it was very clear:

 

https://sherrings.com/foreign-source-income-personal-tax-thailand.html#:~:text=The Foreign Source Income Law&text=A resident of Thailand* who,bringing the income into Thailand.

 

 

Is there any mention of taxing Social Security or pensions? That's what a lot of people are concerned about, but I don't see any clear mention of it. Also, it says that any income earned before 2024 is protected. Does it specify how that needs to be proven? It looks like they think/say they can tax pensions, but it doesn't specify social security is that clear somewhere?

Edited January 24 by Jonpail

[Mike Lister]

4 minutes ago, Jonpail said:

Is there any mention of taxing Social Security or pensions? That's what a lot of people are concerned about, but I don't see any clear mention of it. Also, it says that any income earned before 2024 is protected. Does it specify how that needs to be proven? It looks like they think/say they can tax pensions, but it doesn't specify social security is that clear somewhere?

Please read the folloiwng and revert to us with any outstanding questions afterwards. Thanks

 

 

[topt]

5 hours ago, Mike Lister said:

as long as the property was a primary residence.

My understanding is that if you are non-resident for tax and sell property in the UK whilst being non resident you still have to pay CGT - even if it was your PPP although there are various calculations that help to reduce the overall figure.

[Mike Lister]

Just now, topt said:

My understanding is that if you are non-resident for tax and sell property in the UK whilst being non resident you still have to pay CGT - even if it was your PPP although there are various calculations that help to reduce the overall figure.

Yes, I'm in that situation, I would need to go back and live there for two years I believe, in order to escape CGT, which I'll happily pay, rather than return.