Where do foreigners fit in the Thai hierarchy?

[2baht]

3 minutes ago, bob smith said:

how about half thais born here?

 

are they also khon thai?

 

bob.

My 2 kids grew up here, they receive the same benefits as Khon Thai, many more benefits than I'll ever receive here! 

[bob smith]

1 minute ago, NorthernRyland said:

Thai nationality means having Thai parents,

..so let's do a quick tabletop exercise.

 

Say a british man married a thai woman. That british man, after spending many years in Thailand naturalized to become a Thai.

 

They then had a child together.

Would that child be considered fully Thai?

 

Also, if you look far enough back at Thai history you would see what you have just said makes no sense regarding multiculturalism.

Thailand is actually a melting pot of cultures and traditions.

 

Where do you think buddhism came from?

 

bob.

[bob smith]

1 minute ago, 2baht said:

My 2 kids grew up here, they receive the same benefits as Khon Thai, many more benefits than I'll ever receive here! 

....why didn't you naturalize?

 

bob.

[NorthernRyland]

6 minutes ago, bob smith said:

Thai culture and face.

 

For any self respecting European person the idea of "face" should be a deal breaker. I'll live here speak the language and get along but I keep it shallow so I don't get too deep in their system.

 

Doing any actual work or integrating socially with these people is totally off the table because of this face thing. It's basically like a society built around protecting man-babies ego. It's pathetic honestly. Don't try to fit it, I repeat, do not fit in. Just keep on the outside, make smalltalk and be friendly and generous. That's the best you can hope for.

[bob smith]

1 minute ago, NorthernRyland said:

Just keep on the outside, make smalltalk and be friendly and generous. That's the best you can hope for.

I'll do the first two.

 

The second two I am making no promises.

 

bob.

[2baht]

Just now, bob smith said:

....why didn't you naturalize?

 

bob.

For what? I've done ok here without a change in citizenship. Still go through the visa BS but hey, it's once a year! A lot of the time I was on company work permits.

[NorthernRyland]

1 minute ago, bob smith said:

Say a british man married a thai woman. That british man, after spending many years in Thailand naturalized to become a Thai.

 

They then had a child together.

Would that child be considered fully Thai?

 

Also, if you look far enough back at Thai history you would see what you have just said makes no sense regarding multiculturalism.

Thailand is actually a melting pot of cultures and traditions.

 

Where do you think buddhism came from?

I get your point but this is being too precise. If you can pass for Thai I think that's good enough. How much farang blood can a Thai have before they start looking different? 50/50 sticks out to me. I think you need two generations of Thai parents to blend back in.

 

Having said that a Thai who never lived in the country would probably be less Thai then a mixed race Thai who grew up in the country. Not sure you need to ask them though.

[In Full Agreement]

1 hour ago, ChaiyaTH said:

Anyone with brains and enough years here can confirm that.

 

 

 

Now you may be complicating the matter for the lad.    

 

 

 

[bob smith]

3 minutes ago, 2baht said:

For what? I've done ok here without a change in citizenship.

it's my understanding that if you are a Brit then you don't have to change your citizenship.

 

You can hold dual citizenship.

 

You only have to get a letter confirming your intention to renounce your citizenship, you don't actually have to go through with the act.

 

Just be Thai when you are here and not a Brit.

If you know what I mean.

 

bob.

[2baht]

7 minutes ago, bob smith said:

Would that child be considered fully Thai?

Regardless of nationality, if a foreign child is born in Thailand, they will be issued a Thai birth certificate!

[Denim]

Which one represents the average falang ?

 

 

[ChumpChange]

1 hour ago, bob smith said:

Where do foreigners fit in the Thai hierarchy?

 

Right in between the rats and the roaches running around in the streets of your Soi. 

[Chris Daley]

Slum dwellers (lowest)

foreigners

myanmar workforce

cleaners / maids

 

Maids are told to spy on foreigners.  They are always sticking a camera phone in my face at work.  I go out to get lunch and when I return they follow me, arms out with the phone pointed at me. 

 

The Myanmar workforce has a strong place in Thailand with professionals helping them.  So they are above foreigners.

 

Foreigners can report a slum dweller.  We have more money than slum scum so its easy to assert authority.

Edited May 26 by Chris Daley

[bob smith]

6 minutes ago, Chris Daley said:

They are always sticking a camera phone in my face at work.

...sounds like a wonderful place to work!

 

bob.

[bob smith]

11 minutes ago, 2baht said:

Regardless of nationality, if a foreign child is born in Thailand, they will be issued a Thai birth certificate!

That just isn't true.

 

If a british man and a british woman get pregnant in Thailand and have the baby in Thailand, then that baby will not be issued with a Thai brith certificate.

 

They do not have right of the soil here.

 

bob.

[bob smith]

11 minutes ago, ChumpChange said:

Right in between the rats and the roaches running around in the streets of your Soi. 

Thais must therefore be very conflicted when it comes to foreigners.

 

They see us that way and yet millions depend on farang money to feed their kids!

 

what an existence.

 

bob.

Edited May 26 by bob smith

[2baht]

Just now, bob smith said:

That just isn't true.

 

If a british man and a british woman get pregnant in Thailand and have the baby in Thailand, then that baby will not be issued with a Thai brith certificate.

 

They do not have right of the soil here.

 

bob.

It's issued by the hospital in Thailand at which the baby was born! How did you do it for your kids, Bob???

[bob smith]

4 minutes ago, 2baht said:

It's issued by the hospital in Thailand at which the baby was born! How did you do it for your kids, Bob???

A Thai birth certificate is NOT automatically issued when both parents are foreign and are not legally resident, i,e have PR status in Thailand.

 

Jus Soli is not an inherent right here.

 

 Thailand operated a system of pure jus soli prior to 1972. Due to illegal immigration from Burma, the Nationality Act was amended to require that both parents be legally resident and domiciled in Thailand for at least five years for their child to be granted Thai citizenship at birth.^[83][84] Furthermore, someone who has Thai citizenship by sole virtue of jus soli may be stripped of Thai citizenship under various conditions (such as living abroad), which does not apply to people who have Thai citizenship by virtue of jus sanguinis.

 

bob.

Edited May 26 by bob smith

[Gecko123]

I think you're overstating the hierarchical nature of Thai society. Most people interact with people in their same social milieu. It's not like Thai people are a big army and everyone has a name, rank and serial number. With that said, the two things which limit foreigners' social status potential are the inability to own land and the inability to vote and hold political office. Trying to climb the rungs of a mythical social status ladder is probably futile. What I would advise striving towards instead is building your respectability over time by displaying good character and being as likable a person as you can manage to be.

 

Edited May 26 by Gecko123

[2baht]

A birth certificate is issued at ............................................AT BIRTH!

[bob smith]

4 minutes ago, 2baht said:

A birth certificate is issued at ............................................AT BIRTH!

But the child will be without Thai citizenship.

 

That was my initial point when I asked will the child be fully Thai.

They may have a piece of paper with their name on it, but they wont be issued a Thai ID number and/or citizenship status by right of the soil unless both foreign parents have been legally resident (PR) in Thailand for 5 years. And even then there are restrictions.

 

bob.

Edited May 26 by bob smith

[ravip]

You are not Thai, you never will be, simple as that. 

 

Is this not the same as in any other country? Sometimes, it 'seems' there is no difference, but do foreigners and natives integrate 100%?

Maybe, after a couple of generations...???

[connda]

Where do foreigners fit in the Thai hierarchy?

 

Below Thai dogs.
Above street beggars.

[2baht]

1 minute ago, bob smith said:

But the child will be without Thai citizenship.

 

That was my initial point.

 

bob.

Fair point. I got the Thai birth certs for my kids and immediately got them citizenship to my home country. They are dual nationals.

[OneMoreFarang]

1 hour ago, ChaiyaTH said:

No that is simply the truth, you can complicate it as much you want, it doesn't change the facts. Anyone with brains and enough years here can confirm that. We are seen as a different group: foreigners.

 

I agree. And I have to admit I am happy that we frangs are a different group. We are out of the hierarchy and that means we can mix with anybody in Thailand. I knew a farang who lived at times in a slum and then he had a HiSo friend from the royal family. I don't think Thai can do that.

 

I don't think I would want to live in Thailand if I would have been born in Thailand. Maybe if I would have been born in the HiSo. But also they have a long list what they can't do if they want to continue to be part of the HiSo.

 

It's nice to be independent and in part seen as that crazy farang. It frees up the life. 

 

P.S.: This must be the only interesting question Bob ever asked.

[2baht]

1 minute ago, connda said:

Where do foreigners fit in the Thai hierarchy?

 

Below Thai dogs.
Above street beggars.

Well you can't have much to offer if that's how they treat you!

[HappyExpat57]

One more time:

 

On the Thai social ladder, you are one rung below the soi dog that comes by occasionally to pee on your tires.

[2baht]

Just now, OneMoreFarang said:

P.S.: This must be the only interesting question Bob ever asked.

Bob carries this forum!

[NorthernRyland]

14 minutes ago, Chris Daley said:

Slum dwellers (lowest)

foreigners

myanmar workforce

cleaners / maids

 

You said this before but surely you're joking right? How come foreigners can date women 30 years younger than them if they're so low on the scale? Can a Burmese construction worker marry a 30 year old when they're 60? I don't see those people can date ANY Thai women. 

 

Thai people are money obsessed and guess who has money? that's right, foreigners. Women aside, how do we do against Thai men? More money, taller, lighter skin is generally true. Are we really viewed that poorly here? 

 

[2baht]

1 minute ago, HappyExpat57 said:

One more time:

 

On the Thai social ladder, you are one rung below the soi dog that comes by occasionally to pee on your tires.

How many pants a day do you go through???