Health Insurance for the over 70’s

[Kalasin Jo]

The premiums for the over 70s are astronomic, then there are the exclusions and/or outright refusal of cover. Failure to disclose complete medical history will result in refusal to pay up and cancellation of the policy with no refund of premium. With some insurers a dormant or apparently cured condition a moratorium of months or years is applied to that condition and any related complications that may arise. Insurers will fight hard to argue an event is a related complication justifying non payment.

 

Shouting in to the wind and rain I know but as Thailand now proposes we are tax resident if here more than 179 days in their fiscal year (which is the calendar year here) it should offer access to its state healthcare system, I suggest with contributions on an annual means tested basis. This is how France approaches foreign resident retired/ not in work healthcare. The contributions I had to pay were not unreasonable, nothing if on a very low income. After the first year the system was straightforward, taking your income from your previous year's tax assessment.

 

However French state  healthcare  only covers in the region of 70%, 100% if life threatening, of the cost AND this is where it gets complicated there the state sets tariffs for medical " interventions", consultations etc but professionals, clinics and hospitals are not bound by these tariffs and can charge more, sometimes much more. Still overall it's an acceptable system for most.

So to say it would be an unreasonable burden on Thailand to include us is a very arguable point, especially if the starting point is that it is reasonable to treat us as taxable.

[newbee2022]

1 hour ago, Sheryl said:

 

But there is a 5 year moratorium on anything else.

 

A significant problem IMO.

 

I now need an operation that will cost about about 550k baht. It does not qualify as an emergency, but I am in a lot of pain and will be in even more is I don't get it, and also might eventually develop an  emergency condition (and even suffer loss of function) if it is not dealt with proactively. What I need is not available through public hospitals, either.

 

If I had taken out this insurance less than 5 years ago, it would not cover me, and this would be quite a problem/cut a serious dent in my funds.

 

I had no way of predicting this 4-5 years back, either.

 

So one is taking a chance getting a policy with such a long Moratorium. Maybe it won't matter, but maybe it will.

 

 

 

 

If you got preconditions which will cause an operation you'll probably have to pay by yourself, unless it is life threatening.

[dddave]

On 5/29/2024 at 11:09 AM, Ben Zioner said:

I was talking about about keeping the cover from your employer once you retire.

 

I think this is available to most US civil servants, many large corporation and the UN. I belong to the last group. The way is works is quite simple: the underwriter assesses the whole group of employees and retirees instead of assessing individuals. The premium (millions) is paid by the organisation and fully or  partly recovered from the employees and retirees.

 

This is not uncommon at all. Then of course the question is wether this cover works in Thailand. In my case, being from a UN organisation, obviously the cover had to be international. And very honestly, if that hadn't been the case I wouldn't have retired here. As you get older having to face massive medical expenses isn't a possibility anymore, it becomes a damn certainty.

 The OP clearly stated thar as an employee of NHS, his coverage was terminated when he retired.  Keeping it was not an option.

Edited May 30 by dddave

[Sheryl]

1 hour ago, dddave said:

 The OP clearly stated thar as an employee of NHS, his coverage was terminated when he retired.  Keeping it was not an option.

It is not that he was an NHS employee. All UK citizens are covered by the NHS which is s national healy system not an Empl9yer plan. But it does not cover health care costs abroad.

 

The sort of cover that @Ben Zioner has is unavailable to majority of people.  Including the OP. 

[Ben Zioner]

22 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

It is not that he was an NHS employee. All UK citizens are covered by the NHS which is s national healy system not an Empl9yer plan. But it does not cover health care costs abroad.

 

The sort of cover that @Ben Zioner has is unavailable to majority of people.  Including the OP. 

How about ex US civil servants or Army?

[dddave]

3 hours ago, Ben Zioner said:

How about ex US civil servants or Army?

The best healthcare plan in the United States is the plan that the US Congress voted for itself: 100% lifetime coverage for all currant and former members of Congress and their immediate families with no exclusions. They are also allowed access to any US government Hospital on demand.

[geisha]

On 5/29/2024 at 6:23 AM, scubascuba3 said:

Most people don't have that luxury of continuing employer cover

My work medical cover after retirement costs me now ( 71 yrs)  60 € euros a month. One reason why I stay a permanent resident of France as I would not get the equivalent for specialists, surgeons, my choice of hospitals/ clinics anywhere where else. This was a the major factor in my decision to be a snowbird and not a resident in Thailand. 

[Letseng]

On 5/29/2024 at 5:35 AM, Ben Zioner said:

That's not correct I pay the same as a 25 years old joining the organisation today.  

Would you let us know which insurer extends such generous offers to old folks ? 

[Ben Zioner]

2 hours ago, Letseng said:

Would you let us know which insurer extends such generous offers to old folks ? 

UN ASHI (After Service Health Insurance). Outsourced to Cigna.

[jayboy]

On 5/29/2024 at 3:02 PM, Mike Lister said:

Whilst major medical events can consume many millions of baht, I think you have to be very unlucky to end up in that situation.

 

But that is the whole point of being insured, to anticipate and protect oneself from very unlikely events.

 

As Sheryl has pointed out self-insurance is a term used too loosely on this forum.For a moderately well off expatriate here, putting aside a few million Baht isn't really self insurance.

 

I think nevertheless if I was single here I might be tempted to "self insure" but I'm aware of several cases over the years where catastrophic medical emergencies put an intolerable strain on families.

 

As to being covered by employer's insurance, my own case was that I was allowed to continue with cover (a well known UK based health insurance company) after retirement but at my expense.This might not seem a big deal but it did allow all medical history to be disregarded for claims.It is expensive though.

[Doctor Tom]

On 5/29/2024 at 2:52 PM, newbee2022 said:

3.150 pounds.

a year?  That would financial idiocy  

[Sheryl]

9 hours ago, Letseng said:

Would you let us know which insurer extends such generous offers to old folks ? 

He is referring to a group insurance plan for UN employees.

 

Not available to general public. 

 

Health plans of large instutions can afford to continue to cover retirees (on an optional basis and  at their expense) since they have a large base of mandatorily included working age people.  

 

A major problem for private insurers --- and most especially  for private insurer expatriate plans --  is that they tend to attract an older demographic and to have comparatively few healthy younger people enrolled. Opposite situation to that of UN and governmental health plans.

 

[newbee2022]

4 minutes ago, Doctor Tom said:

a year?  That would financial idiocy  

Is it so?

[Sheryl]

14 hours ago, dddave said:

The best healthcare plan in the United States is the plan that the US Congress voted for itself: 100% lifetime coverage for all currant and former members of Congress and their immediate families with no exclusions. They are also allowed access to any US government Hospital on demand.

Not sure what you mean by "US government hospitals"?  The US does not have a system of these.

 

A few  cities and counties have public hospitals, and there are federally run military and veteran hospitals. That's about it. Overwhelming majority of hospitals in US are privately owned and operated. 

 

AFAIK the health plans for US government officials let them use any hospital. 

[Sheryl]

18 hours ago, Ben Zioner said:

How about ex US civil servants or Army?

Every state has different systems and the federal government yet another. There is no single unified government plan.

 

Typically government employees have a choice of several group plans, all of them contracted with private insurers.   These plans vary in whether they will cover someone living abroad.

 

The situation for ex-military is complex  depending on how long they served, whether in war zone or not and other factors. Only some ex-military have coverage abroad. 

[Sheryl]

23 minutes ago, Doctor Tom said:

a year?  That would financial idiocy  

The amount mentioned is quite reasonable for health insurance at that age. In fact lower than any other I know of.  The plan has some serious limitations and there are concerns about the long term financial  viability of the company, and the transpatency of its operations ,  but the premium cost is definitely low. 

[The Fugitive]

40 minutes ago, Doctor Tom said:

a year?  That would financial idiocy  

3,150 GBP per annum for over 70 years of age is miraculous. Plans I've looked at for myself are more than twice that and I'm under 70. 

[Doctor Tom]

1 hour ago, newbee2022 said:

Is it so?

Okay, maybe not for some individuals 

[Doctor Tom]

1 hour ago, The Fugitive said:

3,150 GBP per annum for over 70 years of age is miraculous. Plans I've looked at for myself are more than twice that and I'm under 70. 

Okay, but there must be quite serious restrictions and exclusions for that premium 

[newbee2022]

9 minutes ago, Doctor Tom said:

Okay, but there must be quite serious restrictions and exclusions for that premium 

No

[newbee2022]

1 hour ago, The Fugitive said:

3,150 GBP per annum for over 70 years of age is miraculous. Plans I've looked at for myself are more than twice that and I'm under 70. 

Get a quotation from Wrlife and compare 🙏

[Doctor Tom]

3 minutes ago, newbee2022 said:

No

Now that I don't believe, sorry.  

[newbee2022]

7 minutes ago, Doctor Tom said:

Now that I don't believe, sorry.  

For non believers: get a quotation!

[scubascuba3]

16 minutes ago, newbee2022 said:

For non believers: get a quotation!

yes it's cheap relatively, do let us know if you make a large claim. Any pre-existing conditions?

[noobexpat]

1 hour ago, newbee2022 said:

Get a quotation from Wrlife and compare 🙏

 

This company still registered in the island of nevis in the caribbean?

 

[newbee2022]

39 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

yes it's cheap relatively, do let us know if you make a large claim. Any pre-existing conditions?

God sake I'm quite healthy. And my intention to have a claim some day is not very distinctive.

But I know from a friend with a hip replacement in Chiangmai RAM Hospital. It was fully paid.

The best is: go for a quotation, then ask for the papers and then decide.

[scubascuba3]

1 hour ago, newbee2022 said:

For non believers: get a quotation!

You've probably done the due diligence already, who are wrlife regulated by? who underwrites their policies? in the event of needing to go to court, what country?

[newbee2022]

12 minutes ago, noobexpat said:

 

This company still registered in the island of nevis in the caribbean?

 

...and in Thailand, and in London, and in Belgium or France.

[newbee2022]

4 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

You've probably done the due diligence already, who are wrlife regulated by? who underwrites their policies? in the event of needing to go to court, what country?

 

WRLIFE POLICY ENGLISH (1)(1).pdf

[scubascuba3]

5 minutes ago, newbee2022 said:

 

WRLIFE POLICY ENGLISH (1)(1).pdf 1.4 MB · 1 download

so you don't know