Popular Post Social Media Posted May 29 Popular Post Share Posted May 29 Ireland’s unwavering support for Palestine is not merely a political stance but a deeply ingrained sentiment rooted in the nation’s own history of colonial struggle and quest for independence. The recent decision by Ireland to officially recognize Palestine as a state highlights the potent sense of kinship and solidarity that pervades Irish society, drawing parallels between Ireland’s past and the Palestinian plight. Taoiseach Simon Harris articulated this connection succinctly when he declared, “Recognition is an act of powerful political and symbolic value. From our history, we know what it means.” Harris’s words reflect a profound empathy for the Palestinian struggle, which resonates deeply within Ireland, a country that experienced its own battle for independence from British colonial rule. In January 1919, Irish politicians declared independence from the United Kingdom, establishing a government in Dublin and seeking recognition from “every free nation in the world.” This declaration marked the beginning of a turbulent period that culminated in the UK recognizing the Irish Free State three years later. Harris drew a direct parallel between this historical plea for recognition and Ireland’s current stance on Palestine, emphasizing “our distinct national identity, our historical struggle, and our right to self-determination and justice.” The announcement of Ireland’s recognition of Palestine, coordinated with Norway and Spain, triggered a vehement response from Israel, which recalled its ambassador to Ireland. Jerusalem media were allowed to film the Irish ambassador, Sonya McGuinness, being shown videos of female hostages taken during Hamas’s October 7 attack, a move condemned by Micheál Martin, Ireland’s deputy premier, as “totally unacceptable.” Israeli ambassador Dana Erlich accused Ireland of a “disproportionate obsession with Israel” and warned of a review of Ireland’s diplomatic, economic, and humanitarian activities in Palestine. Despite these diplomatic tensions, Harris remained unrepentant. He refuted Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s claim that recognizing Palestine was a “reward for terrorism.” Harris stated unequivocally, “We have been clear and unequivocal that we condemn Hamas, that we condemn the most horrific, barbaric massacre that Israel experienced on [October 7],” and drew another parallel to Irish history, asserting, “The IRA was never the people of Ireland and Hamas is not the people of Palestine.” Ireland’s political landscape shows rare unity on the issue of Palestine. From the centre-right Fine Gael to the left-wing Sinn Féin, which has historically been linked to the Provisional IRA, support for Palestine is widespread. This unity is particularly significant ahead of two contentious elections focused on housing and immigration. Recognizing Palestine is a popular move that resonates with Irish voters. For Fine Gael and its coalition partners, the conservative Fianna Fáil and the Greens, it is a strategic decision to prevent being outflanked by Sinn Féin, which has led the polls for the past two years. Public opinion in Ireland overwhelmingly supports the Palestinian cause. A February poll by Ireland Thinks revealed that 79 percent of Irish people believe Israel is committing genocide in Gaza. In contrast, a YouGov poll in the UK found that 59 percent of British people supported an immediate ceasefire. These sentiments are evident in the numerous protests that have taken place in Ireland, including large demonstrations at the Israeli embassy in Dublin, where protesters chanted slogans like “how many children have to die” and “Palestine will be free.” The solidarity extends beyond protests. The Bohemian Football Club’s 2023 away kit was made in partnership with Palestine Sport For Life, with sales proceeds donated to support football for children in West Bank camps. This initiative underscores the pervasive support for Palestine in Irish society. Jeremy Corbyn, former leader of the UK Labour Party, who faced accusations of anti-Semitism during his tenure, was even pictured wearing one of these shirts. Irish support for Palestine also manifests in actions targeting other entities perceived as supporting Israel. For instance, in May, Trinity College Dublin saw protests by pro-Palestinian students, which led to the university agreeing to divest from Israeli companies active in occupied territories and providing scholarships for students from Gaza. This five-day demonstration highlighted the depth of support for Palestinian rights within Irish academic institutions. Ireland’s historical and political connections to Palestine date back over a century. Both Ireland and Palestine were under British control, and figures like Arthur Balfour, who was opposed to Irish home rule, played significant roles in shaping the destinies of both nations. Balfour, known as “Bloody Balfour” in Ireland, was later responsible for the 1917 Balfour Declaration, which supported the establishment of a Jewish national home in Palestine. The notorious Black and Tans, British soldiers known for their brutality in Ireland, were also deployed in Palestine, further intertwining the histories of the two regions. Diplomatically, Ireland has been consistent in its support for Palestine. It was the first EU member state to call for Palestinian statehood in 1980 and has maintained official relations with Palestine since 2000. Ireland did not recognize Israel until 1963, and it was the last EU country to allow Israel to open a residential embassy, which only happened in 1994. Irish neutrality during World War Two and its aftermath have also influenced its relations with Israel. Ireland’s support for Palestinian statehood is also reflected in its stance at the United Nations, where it has consistently voted for resolutions calling for an end to the conflict and for Israel to withdraw from occupied territories. Irish UN peacekeepers stationed in Israel and the Golan Heights have further complicated relations between Ireland and Israel. Despite accusations against the United Nations Relief and Works Agency of links to Hamas, Ireland increased its funding to the agency, demonstrating its commitment to supporting Gaza’s main aid organization. The sympathy for Palestinians in Ireland is not solely based on political or historical reasons but also on a profound cultural and emotional identification. Images of Palestinian protesters under fire evoke memories of Catholic civil rights marches in Northern Ireland. Murals in places like Belfast draw direct comparisons between Palestinian hunger strikers and figures like Bobby Sands, an IRA member who died during a hunger strike in 1981. During the Troubles, the PLO supplied the IRA with arms, further cementing the bond between the two struggles. While the Good Friday Agreement, which brought peace to Northern Ireland, inspires some to hope for a similar resolution in the Middle East, divisions remain in Northern Ireland, where nationalists are generally pro-Palestine and unionists pro-Israel. This dynamic was evident during the Second Intifada when Israeli flags appeared in loyalist communities in response to Palestinian flags in nationalist areas. In 2006, Sinn Féin leader Gerry Adams laid a wreath on Yasser Arafat’s grave and met with Hamas members during a tour of the Middle East. Sinn Féin, the only all-Ireland party, has been a vocal supporter of Palestinian rights. Mary Lou McDonald, Adams’ successor, praised the recent decision to recognize Palestine, and Michelle O’Neill, Sinn Féin’s deputy leader and First Minister of Northern Ireland, stated, “The people of Ireland will continue to stand up for the rights and freedom of the Palestinian people.” Ireland’s conservative government has even been willing to risk straining relations with Joe Biden, the most Irish American president since Kennedy, by recognizing Palestine ahead of its Western allies. Biden supports a two-state solution, but his administration, like the UK and most of the international community, believes that recognition of Palestine should come during or after peace negotiations. During the last St. Patrick’s Day celebrations in Washington, then-Taoiseach Leo Varadkar urged Biden to pressure Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu for a ceasefire. Varadkar invoked Irish history, stating, “We see our history in their eyes. A story of displacement, of dispossession and national identity questioned and denied, forced emigration, discrimination, and now hunger.” However, the fervent support for Palestine in Ireland has also had darker undertones. Alan Shatter, a Jewish former cabinet minister, has expressed concerns about rising anti-Semitism in Ireland, stating, “I’m hugely concerned that no lessons have been remembered from the Holocaust. Significant things are happening in Ireland at the moment which are causing enormous concern. There’s been a substantial escalation in anti-Semitism, Jewish people are being targeted and Jewish people are suffering discrimination.” Credit: Daily Telegraph 2024-05-30 Get our Daily Newsletter - Click HERE to subscribe 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post RichardColeman Posted May 29 Popular Post Share Posted May 29 I think many of us could support a Palestinians state, BUT, unless Hamas has gone or been destroyed it will never happen. I'd also say that the hardline Irish never wanted to turn the whole world Catholic, where as the hardline muslims do ! 2 2 1 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Excogitator Posted May 30 Popular Post Share Posted May 30 (edited) Ireland is far from alone in supporting and recognising a Palestinian state. Norway and Spain recently did the same, and, in fact, 'as of May 2024, the State of Palestine is recognized as a sovereign state by 145 of the 193 member states of the United Nations' (Wikipedia) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_recognition_of_the_State_of_Palestine In other words, there is an overwhelming international support and recognition for and of a Palestinian state. Edited May 30 by Excogitator 2 2 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post DonnyS Posted May 30 Popular Post Share Posted May 30 OMG!! SAD SAD SAD THEY WILL MULTIPLE IN EUROPE .... JUST WAIT & SEE . STATE OF PALASTINE WILL BE HAMAS AND IRAN/YAMAN.... 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Tropicalevo Posted May 30 Popular Post Share Posted May 30 Of course Ireland supports Palestine. Both countries harbour terrorists. Same Same. 2 2 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newbee2022 Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 13 minutes ago, Tropicalevo said: Of course Ireland supports Palestine. Both countries harbour terrorists. Same Same. Can you explain what you mean? 😳 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john donson Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 look at the photo... hardly any red haired irish citizen, more import culture palestine / israel ... well it is the british empire that started this mess more then 100 years ago in the region 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post bendejo Posted May 30 Popular Post Share Posted May 30 Do they know that a Palestinian state would probably prohibit alcohol? 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excogitator Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 5 minutes ago, john donson said: look at the photo... hardly any red haired irish citizen, more import culture palestine / israel ... well it is the british empire that started this mess more then 100 years ago in the region Rather pointless trying to argue anything as complex as this, based on a single photograph, don't you think? (Although, only from a quick look, I saw at least 5 redheads..) There is overwhelming support in the world, including in most Western countries, for a Palestinian state, as well as sympathy for the plight of the Palestinian people. True, the British (and other empires) braindead actions and decisions, created enormous problems and suffering, then and later, in the world, not only in the Middle East, but also in most of the Global South. Just take a look at Africa, for instance, how they simply took a pen a ruler, and 'divided it up' into 'countries', irrespective of thousands of years old local history, traditions, tribal cultures etc.. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post ChicagoExpat Posted May 30 Popular Post Share Posted May 30 2 hours ago, Excogitator said: In other words, there is an overwhelming international support and recognition for and of a Palestinian state. This really needs to be qualified. I too think that someday there should be a Palestinian state but also believe that now is 100% NOT the time to do it. It DOES reward Hamas -- saying anything else is an obvious untruth, and practically speaking... there's nothing to recognize. Who would run this "state", where the controllers of half the territory are corrupt, incompetent and ineffectual and controllers of the other half are quite literally bloodthirsty murderers (who wiped out representatives of Fatah in a brutal purge)? It's sadly hilarious that pretty much EVERYTHING Hamas stands for, and SO MUCH Palestinians would choose to make the law of their land, would be anathema to Irish and EU values. 1 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post ChicagoExpat Posted May 30 Popular Post Share Posted May 30 1 hour ago, Tropicalevo said: Of course Ireland supports Palestine. Both countries harbour terrorists. Same Same. But not even the IRA carried out something like October 7. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanaguma Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 I guess they don't see the sad irony that their previous Taoseach (sp) would have been killed the second he set foot in Gaza or the west bank... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuamRudy Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 31 minutes ago, Hanaguma said: I guess they don't see the sad irony that their previous Taoseach (sp) would have been killed the second he set foot in Gaza or the west bank... Or maybe they recognise that the first step to becoming an inclusive society is to become a free society? It is barely 30 years since same-sex activity was decriminalised in Ireland - the west might be leading the way in that respect but this is a relatively new phenomenon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excogitator Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 44 minutes ago, ChicagoExpat said: This really needs to be qualified. I too think that someday there should be a Palestinian state but also believe that now is 100% NOT the time to do it. It DOES reward Hamas -- saying anything else is an obvious untruth, and practically speaking... there's nothing to recognize. Who would run this "state", where the controllers of half the territory are corrupt, incompetent and ineffectual and controllers of the other half are quite literally bloodthirsty murderers (who wiped out representatives of Fatah in a brutal purge)? It's sadly hilarious that pretty much EVERYTHING Hamas stands for, and SO MUCH Palestinians would choose to make the law of their land, would be anathema to Irish and EU values. You are looking at this the wrong way. Hamas raison d'etre is based on Israel's decades long oppression of the Palestinian people, denying them their own state, and a life in dignity, peace and prosperity. If the Palestinian people had all this, there would be no reason for Hamas to even exist. Anyone who cares enough about the peoples of Israel, Palestine and peace in the Middle East, knows that a two state solution is the only way forwards. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hanaguma Posted May 30 Popular Post Share Posted May 30 42 minutes ago, RuamRudy said: Or maybe they recognise that the first step to becoming an inclusive society is to become a free society? It is barely 30 years since same-sex activity was decriminalised in Ireland - the west might be leading the way in that respect but this is a relatively new phenomenon. Current polling in Gaza is in the 90% "Throw them off a roof" range. Somehow I don't think Ireland was quite the same. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chomper Higgot Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 Just now, Hanaguma said: Current polling in Gaza is in the 90% "Throw them off a roof" range. Somehow I don't think Ireland was quite the same. Any recent election results to refer to? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hanaguma Posted May 30 Popular Post Share Posted May 30 38 minutes ago, Excogitator said: You are looking at this the wrong way. Hamas raison d'etre is based on Israel's decades long oppression of the Palestinian people, denying them their own state, and a life in dignity, peace and prosperity. If the Palestinian people had all this, there would be no reason for Hamas to even exist. Anyone who cares enough about the peoples of Israel, Palestine and peace in the Middle East, knows that a two state solution is the only way forwards. Nope. Hamas' raison d'etre is to kill every Jew in the world and convert the planet to Islam. Killing anyone along the way who disagrees. They don't give a rat's a55 about oppression or dignity or peace. 2 1 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Hanaguma Posted May 30 Popular Post Share Posted May 30 9 minutes ago, Hanaguma said: Current polling in Gaza is in the 90% "Throw them off a roof" range. Somehow I don't think Ireland was quite the same. Also one of the worst places in the world to be a woman. Currently ranked 160 out of 170. Below Somalia and Niger and Congo. https://giwps.georgetown.edu/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/WPS-Index-2021-Summary.pdf?ref=quillette.com 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post FruitPudding Posted May 30 Popular Post Share Posted May 30 The West supporting Islamic extremists is just about the dumbest thing I've seen in my lifetime. Darwin's theory is going strong. 3 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChicagoExpat Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 46 minutes ago, Excogitator said: You are looking at this the wrong way. Hamas raison d'etre is based on Israel's decades long oppression of the Palestinian people, denying them their own state, and a life in dignity, peace and prosperity. If the Palestinian people had all this, there would be no reason for Hamas to even exist. Anyone who cares enough about the peoples of Israel, Palestine and peace in the Middle East, knows that a two state solution is the only way forwards. 1) The terror problem/Palestinian propensity for terrorism long predated Hamas. It existed even when things were very hopeful, when there was literally no border or restrictions on Palestinians from both Gaza and the West Bank to enter Israel, and when Israelis made multiple offers to create a state. 2) You can't move forward to create an ideal world when a huge cancer prevents that dream from becoming reality -- and that cancer is not just hardened Israeli attitudes. Far worse, or at a minimum equally worse, are Palestinian attitudes, Hamas, and Hamas' patron, Iran. So I would suggest you're looking at it this the wrong way, and from a way so imbalanced it prevents you from seeing the situation clearly. There are many, many factors in this -- and the best thing an educated person could say about characterizing this solely as "Israel's decades long oppression of the Palestinian people, denying them their own state, and a life in dignity, peace and prosperity" is, it's wildly inaccurate and incomplete. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chomper Higgot Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 15 minutes ago, FruitPudding said: The West supporting Islamic extremists is just about the dumbest thing I've seen in my lifetime. Darwin's theory is going strong. Well it’s an assertion that is about the dumbest departure from reality. 2 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChicagoExpat Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 I hope Israel recognizes a Catalan or Basque state. Not quite apples to apples, but also not a bad way for payback. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excogitator Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 1 hour ago, Hanaguma said: Nope. Hamas' raison d'etre is to kill every Jew in the world and convert the planet to Islam. Killing anyone along the way who disagrees. They don't give a rat's a55 about oppression or dignity or peace. An extremely simple-minded view and outlook, completely of touch.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excogitator Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 1 hour ago, ChicagoExpat said: 1) The terror problem/Palestinian propensity for terrorism long predated Hamas. It existed even when things were very hopeful, when there was literally no border or restrictions on Palestinians from both Gaza and the West Bank to enter Israel, and when Israelis made multiple offers to create a state. 2) You can't move forward to create an ideal world when a huge cancer prevents that dream from becoming reality -- and that cancer is not just hardened Israeli attitudes. Far worse, or at a minimum equally worse, are Palestinian attitudes, Hamas, and Hamas' patron, Iran. So I would suggest you're looking at it this the wrong way, and from a way so imbalanced it prevents you from seeing the situation clearly. There are many, many factors in this -- and the best thing an educated person could say about characterizing this solely as "Israel's decades long oppression of the Palestinian people, denying them their own state, and a life in dignity, peace and prosperity" is, it's wildly inaccurate and incomplete. Imbalanced is pointing your finger in only one direction, which is what you, and some other posters in here do; Palestinians/Muslims = bad, Israel = good.. There are extremists on both sides, ruining it for the vast majority, who only want to live their lives in peace In 1993 there was a real chance of lasting peace, the Oslo-agreement, which netanyahoo and his ilk successfully sabotaged, leading all the way up till todays war.. I maintain that if the Palestinians were allowed to live lives in peace, dignity and prosperity, Hamas would have no reason to exist.. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post ChicagoExpat Posted May 30 Popular Post Share Posted May 30 15 minutes ago, Excogitator said: Imbalanced is pointing your finger in only one direction, which is what you, and some other posters in here do; Palestinians/Muslims = bad, Israel = good.. Ah, that's literally NOT what I did and I LITERALLY SAID, several times, that the situation is complex and many factors -- INCLUDING Israelis and their attitudes -- were the issue. Look, man, if you're going to argue with me, please don't flat out lie. Which is really dumb because anyone can read what I wrote. >>I too think that someday there should be a Palestinian state...and that cancer is not just hardened Israeli attitudes. Far worse, or at a minimum equally worse, are Palestinian attitudes, Hamas, and Hamas' patron, Iran. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post ChicagoExpat Posted May 30 Popular Post Share Posted May 30 42 minutes ago, Excogitator said: An extremely simple-minded view and outlook, completely of touch.. It is literally in Hamas' charter. Here are a few relevant quotes and I stop at Article 11. Check them out yourself if you think I took them out of context: Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it The Islamic Resistance Movement is a distinguished Palestinian movement, whose allegiance is to Allah, and whose way of life is Islam. It strives to raise the banner of Allah over every inch of Palestine The Islamic Resistance Movement is one of the links in the chain of the struggle against the Zionist invaders. It goes back to 1939, to the emergence of the martyr Izz al-Din al Kissam and his brethren the fighters, members of Moslem Brotherhood. (For the simple among us -- @Excogitator – this was before the creation of Israel.) "The Day of Judgement will not come about until Moslems fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him.” This is the law governing the land of Palestine in the Islamic Sharia (law) and the same goes for any land the Moslems have conquered by force, because during the times of (Islamic) conquests, the Moslems consecrated these lands to Moslem generations till the Day of Judgement. (For the simple among us -- @Excogitator – this means any land once conquered by Islam, belongs to Islam in perpetuity.) 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excogitator Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 (edited) 31 minutes ago, ChicagoExpat said: Ah, that's literally NOT what I did and I LITERALLY SAID, several times, that the situation is complex and many factors -- INCLUDING Israelis and their attitudes -- were the issue. Look, man, if you're going to argue with me, please don't flat out lie. Which is really dumb because anyone can read what I wrote. >>I too think that someday there should be a Palestinian state...and that cancer is not just hardened Israeli attitudes. Far worse, or at a minimum equally worse, are Palestinian attitudes, Hamas, and Hamas' patron, Iran. You are the only one arguing here.. and I don't waste my time on brainwashed fanatics. Either you get it, or you don't. You don't. And that's your loss.. Edited May 30 by Excogitator 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post ChicagoExpat Posted May 30 Popular Post Share Posted May 30 23 minutes ago, Excogitator said: You are the only one arguing here (he said while arguing) 🤣.. and I don't waste my time on brainwashed fanatics. Either you get it, or you don't. You don't. And that's your loss.. I'm both refuting your arguments and not fitting the mold you want me to fit, so you run. I'm the one with the nuanced view of the conflict, seeing fault on many sides, and I'M the "brainwashed fanatic." You see things only from a pro-Palestinian point of view, and are totally ignorant of the actual history of this conflict and the region, and YOU "get it." If you can't handle it when someone politely challenges something you said, as I initially did, and you make up lies about what I said and after several posts it's clear you haven't the least idea what you're talking about... JUST SHUT UP. 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post jayboy Posted May 30 Popular Post Share Posted May 30 1 hour ago, Excogitator said: Imbalanced is pointing your finger in only one direction, which is what you, and some other posters in here do; Palestinians/Muslims = bad, Israel = good.. But that is what you appear to be doing - only Palestinians/Muslims good and Israel/Jews bad. Ireland has always been a country with many Jew haters.Perhaps that's why President de Valera trotted off to the Germany Embassy in Dublin to express his commiserations on the death of Hitler in his Berlin bunker.The new Taoiseach of Ireland is effectively rewarding Hamas for the worst slaughter of Jews since the Nazi Holocaust. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChicagoExpat Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 3 hours ago, RuamRudy said: Or maybe they recognise that the first step to becoming an inclusive society is to become a free society? It is barely 30 years since same-sex activity was decriminalised in Ireland - the west might be leading the way in that respect but this is a relatively new phenomenon. If they believe installing Hamas as an internationally recognized government will lead to such things as liberal Western social values... well, it's hard to know what to say about that. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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