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Posted
7 hours ago, swissie said:

Will the Western Taxpayer be thrilled (after having paid for a war that the Ukraine was never able to win) to additionall pay for the "rebuilding" of the Ukraine?

As long as it's the western countries that supported the war paying that is fine- they deserve to have to pay, as they caused the damage by enabling the war to continue. The citizens also deserve to have to pay as they didn't protest about it.

 

I doubt any other countries will pay anything, as it's not of their making.

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Posted
8 hours ago, Cameroni said:

 

I suspect that is why the rockets were moved from Ukraine, to prevent tampering and sabotage.

 

This Kursk excursion is only 1000 troops. To say it is just theatre may be overstating it since 1000 armed man wreak a good havoc for a while, but given the numbers these Ukrainians face soon I would not put money on them holding on to any land.

 

All politicians by their nature lie like there is no tomorrow, however, we do not just have Putin making statements, we also have evidence of where the fighting is taking place. If Putin had intended to take all of Ukraine this campaign would have looked very different. And remember, Russia has an economy smaller than Texas, it knows it can not fight or occupy the Ukraine long term, since military might is based on economic strength. This is why these arguments that Putin wants all of Ukraine, Poland, Estonia, Latvia and Sweden, and to rebuild an Imperial Russia are so risible. They cannot, and Putin knows they cannot.

IMO the Kursk incursion has two purposes, to give Putin a propaganda black eye domestically, and divert Russian troops from the Donbas so Ukraine can push forward there again. I'm pretty sure the Ukrainians will withdraw in good order when it suits them.

 

The symbolism is undeniable, Kursk was the scene of the greatest tank battle in history. Humiliating.

 

I disagree Putin did not intend to take all of Ukraine. If that's the case, what was the 50 km long attack column heading for Kyiv all about?

 

You are correct about the size of the Russian economy. It would be a lot larger if it had not had a succession of incompetent governments since 1917.

 

IMO Putin wants everything he can get his hands on. He's a proven kleptomaniac, ask any oligarch. The ones that are still alive, that is.

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Posted
11 hours ago, Cameroni said:

Ukrainians are quite ingenious and beautiful people, no doubt about it. However, as Kenny Rogers tells us, "there'll be plenty of time for countin'..when the dealin's done".  And the way it looks now is that Ukraine will permanently retreat from the Donbass. 

 

Ukraine can not win anything by fighting Russia. Yes, Russia paid a price, but Ukraine has too, far worse.

 

And no, they could not have cracked the nuclear launch codes anymore  than Mexico could crack US nuclear codes.

 

 

It must give you cognitive dissonance that Russia can't stop Ukraine's offensive in Kursk.

 

It was 3 days ago that Russia claimed that they stopped the Ukrainians and killed them all. Do you believe them?

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Posted
4 hours ago, Lacessit said:

All Russians believe this, true. The Ukrainians don't, they have a different language, alphabet, and history.

 

During the second world war, the Germans invading Ukraine were greeted as liberators. Kyiv surrendered without firing a shot, While the Ukrainians quickly learned there was no difference between a Russian and a German jackboot, it has enabled the Russians ever since to label them as Nazis.

 

War is theft writ large. Ukraine has 25% of the world's chernozems, the richest agricultural soil on the planet. I hope you understand this.

 

Actually, you will find that the vast majority of Ukrainians have no idea how to speak Ukrainian or use their alphabet ,most speak Russian and use the Russian alphabet.

 

Yes, the Ukrainians did colloborate with the Germans to some extent, no doubt that is the fire which stokes the fascist insults from Russia.

 

As far as theft in war goes Russia has been restrained in this war. Do you remember Putin allowed a corridor for Ukraine to continue selling its resources by ships? This came to an end when the West continued to impose sanctions on Russia. It was pretty unique to have two warring parties agree to ship grain, and for one party to allow another to continue economic trade.

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Posted
1 hour ago, Lacessit said:

You have proof of your first assertion? It's hardly surprising any population where Russian is made compulsory for years in schools and officialdom should have it as another language. Why do you think French is the official language of New Caledonia?

 

I don't think you understand. Ukrainians hate Russians. Most of Eastern Europe does. In the aftermath of World War II, the Russians stole everything that was not nailed down, and some that was.

Then set up command economies that directed the lion's share of production to Moscow. Why do you think every country wanted to join NATO?

 

Russia has been restrained in this war? That is one of the most ridiculous statements I have read in a long time on ASEAN. Russia is targeting civilian buildings, hospitals, power infrastructure and agricultural infrastructure with shells, bombs, missiles and drones. It is releasing hardened criminals from jail to fight, who are looting, raping and killing in the occupied areas. Restrained my aching butt.

 

The agreement to ship grain owes its existence to the fact there are three Russian gas pipelines crossing Ukraine into Europe. With Nordstream gone, that's most of what Russia has left. The deal certainly was not out of the goodness of Putin's heart.

 

You should lay off the Kremlin Kool-Aid, comrade. It's not doing your credibility any good.

 

 

Just anecdotal, my kids went to a school where a number of Ukrainian refugees also arrived. The school tried to make them feel welcome by translating school messages in Ukrainian. Only for the Ukrainian parents to say they can't understand them and if they could write them in Russian. See this author as well, who is Ukrainian and says in private he speaks Russian. But I may have overcooked it. It would appear that about 67% to 80% of Ukrainians can speak Ukrainian, but used to speak Russian outside the home as teenagers, the other 33% to 20% speak mostly Russian. Since the invasion this has now changed dramatically for obvious reasons.

 

https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/politics/the-russian-language-is-another-victim-of-the-war/48526412

 

https://translatorswithoutborders.org/language-data-for-ukraine

 

It's a shame the Russian language has become a victim of this conflict, at my kids school they used to teach Russian, but after the war they closed the Russian department. Wholly philistine in my view.

 

Oh, I'm aware of the dislike for Russians, world wide, not just Europe wide. In terms of restraint, I specifically referred to economic exploitation if you read my message. The fact that two warring parties agree that the other can export its grain is really unheard of and quite rare.

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  • 2 weeks later...
Posted

Western "war-reporting" leaves a lot to be desired for. So, from time to time, it is helpful to comment what is ACTUALLY happening in the Ukraine.


-The Ukraine is in the process of orchestrating some kind of "Battle of the Bulge" in the Northeast. Designed to draw away Russian troops away from the Donbass. Not working.


- The Russians advance steadily in the Donbass. The Ukraine has established a line of defense, declaring several strategic cities as "fortresses". (Like pearls on a string). 2 pearls of that string are the cities of Pakowsk and Selydowe. Both are likely to "fall" soon. Civilians leaving already. With this line of defense perforated, the Russians will be able to advance much faster.


All of this not of much interest to the "western press", mesmorised by the Ukrainian "Battle of the Bulge" currently.


Surely, the Ukrainian soldiers trying to hold the Donbass defence line miss their comrades sorely that have been sent to a public-relations stunt on Russian territory.

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Posted
22 minutes ago, swissie said:

Western "war-reporting" leaves a lot to be desired for. So, from time to time, it is helpful to comment what is ACTUALLY happening in the Ukraine.


-The Ukraine is in the process of orchestrating some kind of "Battle of the Bulge" in the Northeast. Designed to draw away Russian troops away from the Donbass. Not working.


- The Russians advance steadily in the Donbass. The Ukraine has established a line of defense, declaring several strategic cities as "fortresses". (Like pearls on a string). 2 pearls of that string are the cities of Pakowsk and Selydowe. Both are likely to "fall" soon. Civilians leaving already. With this line of defense perforated, the Russians will be able to advance much faster.


All of this not of much interest to the "western press", mesmorised by the Ukrainian "Battle of the Bulge" currently.


Surely, the Ukrainian soldiers trying to hold the Donbass defence line miss their comrades sorely that have been sent to a public-relations stunt on Russian territory.

 

I agree with this post 100 per cent.

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Posted
On 8/12/2024 at 11:01 AM, Lacessit said:

You have proof of your first assertion? It's hardly surprising any population where Russian is made compulsory for years in schools and officialdom should have it as another language. Why do you think French is the official language of New Caledonia?

 

I don't think you understand. Ukrainians hate Russians. Most of Eastern Europe does. In the aftermath of World War II, the Russians stole everything that was not nailed down, and some that was.

Then set up command economies that directed the lion's share of production to Moscow. Why do you think every country wanted to join NATO?

 

Russia has been restrained in this war? That is one of the most ridiculous statements I have read in a long time on ASEAN. Russia is targeting civilian buildings, hospitals, power infrastructure and agricultural infrastructure with shells, bombs, missiles and drones. It is releasing hardened criminals from jail to fight, who are looting, raping and killing in the occupied areas. Restrained my aching butt.

 

The agreement to ship grain owes its existence to the fact there are three Russian gas pipelines crossing Ukraine into Europe. With Nordstream gone, that's most of what Russia has left. The deal certainly was not out of the goodness of Putin's heart.

 

You should lay off the Kremlin Kool-Aid, comrade. It's not doing your credibility any good.

 

At some point, we must come down to the "nitty gritty".


I can tell, you despise war as I do. Formerly involving "Armies" on the battlefield only. Since WW2 "civilians" are part of "warfare".


But looking back 2000 years, most "victories" were won by armies that were able to "outgun" the opponent. A repetiton of ths constellation will happen in the case of the Ukraine. Borders to western countries are now strictly guarded. Too many Ukrainians between the age of 18 to 40 do not want to join the Ukrainian army anymore.

 

Spartakus, the American Indians, even Napoleon and Hitler were finally "outgunned". Of course the capability to "outgun" an opponent will change over time, but the chances that Russia will "outgun" the Ukraine today are frightenly high.
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But more of importance: As I have raised the question before, "Who will pay for the rebuilding of the Ukraine, or what's left of it after the war"?


Unfortunately, I have not received any "remedies" concerning this matter by contributors of this forum, nor by the "western political elite". That's the "hot potato" that nobody wants to touch in the west. But Vladimir will, at a discount price.

Posted
4 hours ago, swissie said:

But more of importance: As I have raised the question before, "Who will pay for the rebuilding of the Ukraine, or what's left of it after the war"?

I'm sure some American company will be able to "pursuade" the US government to throw a few billion at them to do so. The only question will be how much will be actually used for reconstruction.

 

If the US government won't come to the party, Ukraine has loads of resources they can take in compensation.

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Posted
1 hour ago, MicroB said:

Japan's contributed is set aside for non-defence purchases only.

That is a surprise. I'd have thought they'd be only for defence purposes, though that depends on your definition of defence.

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Posted
2 hours ago, MicroB said:

 

 

Ahem, its not "the Ukraine" but Ukraine. "The Ukraine" was a term used to delegitimise Ukraine as a sovereign state, reducing it to nothing more than a region to be carved up by Russia, Poland and Hungary.

Does anyone on here, other than yourself, care?

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Posted
4 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

That is a surprise. I'd have thought they'd be only for defence purposes, though that depends on your definition of defence.


Defence=  Military expenditure.

 

Japan since WW2 has extremely strict export controls on defence equipment. Everyone knows this.

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Posted
12 minutes ago, MicroB said:

You said by private message that you appreciated that I did not attack your posts like other forum members,

To be clear I said that you hadn't insulted me, nothing about attacking me.

 

Re the Ukraine, it could be taken over by Russia or Poland or Santa Clause and I would lose no sleep over it. My only concern is that the fighting stops and the pawns in the Great Game can stop dying for the foolishness of old men and the greed of the 1%.

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Posted
On 8/25/2024 at 7:41 AM, thaibeachlovers said:

To be clear I said that you hadn't insulted me, nothing about attacking me.

 

Re the Ukraine, it could be taken over by Russia or Poland or Santa Clause and I would lose no sleep over it. My only concern is that the fighting stops and the pawns in the Great Game can stop dying for the foolishness of old men and the greed of the 1%.

1 divided by 140 million is much less than 1% 😀

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Posted
On 8/11/2024 at 9:09 AM, swissie said:

Will the Western Taxpayer be thrilled (after having paid for a war that the Ukraine was never able to win) to additionall pay for the "rebuilding" of the Ukraine?

The west will keep up and increase the support for Ukraine for as long as it is needed, you see the European Union has Solidarity as a core value, this means to help those who are in need. now Ukraine needs them more then ever. How would you feel if you were jumped by some a neighbour and your other neighbour would just stand there watching you being beat up.

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Posted
2 hours ago, Zenyu kanari said:

The west will keep up and increase the support for Ukraine for as long as it is needed, you see the European Union has Solidarity as a core value, this means to help those who are in need. now Ukraine needs them more then ever. How would you feel if you were jumped by some a neighbour and your other neighbour would just stand there watching you being beat up.

and just where are they going to get the money from to do so?

Perhaps you know where the money tree grows, but the rest of us don't.

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Posted
On 8/29/2024 at 3:19 AM, thaibeachlovers said:

and just where are they going to get the money from to do so?

Perhaps you know where the money tree grows, but the rest of us don't.

 

Please don't assume that you speak for me.

 

I suggest that you search the internet. There are numerous sites which provide instruction in basic Economic theory and, in particular, how governments finance their expenditure.

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  • 2 months later...
Posted
On 7/31/2024 at 6:08 PM, swissie said:

From day 1 it was clear that the Ukraine could not win this war. Period!


The only question remains is, will the Russians stop at the western Ukrainian border or will they travel unopposed thru Hungary straigtht to Austria. Straight into the "heart of Europe". Unopposed by Hungaria as the Hungarians will not shoot at Russians.


That is the only question that remains.

 

Everything seems to fall into place as I predicted.


Best case: The Ukraine will "give" the eastern Ukraine to the Russians, cementing it by a "demarcation" line like we have it in Korea. That would be the best case for the Ukraine.


But why would Putin agree to such an agreement, especially as he is winning this war. Donald is not going to make any difference.

 

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