Frozen in time: British expats losing out on pensions in Thailand

[BritManToo]

3 minutes ago, G_Money said:

All near 20% paid by you for your entire working career.  No employer match?  
In USA employees pay about 7.5 % and employer pays another 7.5 %.  15 % into the coffers.  
At retirement age and withdrawing it is taxed by the federal government (80%).

Medicare payments are also deducted from SS payments.

Payments are subject to COLA (cost of living adjustment) when given.

UK nearly the same as USA, BUT employers aren't that charitable, assume their 10% comes from you getting a lower salary.

[Black arab]

1 hour ago, Expat68 said:

Final Salary exempt from Thai Tax. Is that everyone who was on Final Salary regardless whether it was government or not?

Unfortunately not, it is just for government pensions.

[jori123]

1 minute ago, bradiston said:

And no rise! I read the whole thread. If you leave again, your pension reverts to the very first payment amount, ie pre frozen, with no increases.

 

And you have somewhere in the UK to stay for 6 months? Is the UK affordable? And the cost of the return flight? That alone will hardly be covered by any rise you'll see while back in the UK. Is it really worth it?

 

Return flight to Philippines about 6,000 THB. Ring the DWP. Tell them you've moved there. Pay pension into Wise account. YMMV and I would expect you to spend at least 6 months there...I'm not advising breaking any laws. It's only a suggestion which probably won't be useful to many. Like tax avoidance for the rich. It's not tax evasion. There's a huge difference.

Only if you inform,

 

2 minutes ago, bradiston said:

And no rise! I read the whole thread. If you leave again, your pension reverts to the very first payment amount, ie pre frozen, with no increases.

 

And you have somewhere in the UK to stay for 6 months? Is the UK affordable? And the cost of the return flight? That alone will hardly be covered by any rise you'll see while back in the UK. Is it really worth it?

 

Return flight to Philippines about 6,000 THB. Ring the DWP. Tell them you've moved there. Pay pension into Wise account. YMMV and I would expect you to spend at least 6 months there...I'm not advising breaking any laws. It's only a suggestion which probably won't be useful to many. Like tax avoidance for the rich. It's not tax evasion. There's a huge difference.

Only if you inform, do not inform?  no nothing, no checking, unlike means tested benefits

[Mike Teavee]

Just now, jori123 said:

No State Pension

Sorry I should have been clearer, whilst your State Pension cannot be reduced, if you are receiving other Benefits (E.g. Pension Credits) these can so they can get the money back from you. 

 

[bradiston]

15 minutes ago, jori123 said:

This is State Pension

It is black and white,   State  Pension, no punishment, be specific tho,do not quote other benefits

I meant by "warnings", the warnings HM government gives in general about moving abroad, not warnings about possible illegalities. For instance, proper planning, health care, emergency funds, return trips, loved ones etc etc.

[Andycoops]

2 hours ago, Gknrd said:

That is been going on for ever, why retire there if you loose?  Best to make it seem like you live in the UK I would think. Surely there are ways around it.

There are ways around it but that involves fraud, also the loopholes are being closed down in a recently announced purge on benefits fraud which includes pensions.

[Kinok Farang]

2 hours ago, theblether said:

 

Better illegal immigrants that contribute  than sour faced pensioners that want to live abroad and slate the UK every day. 

 

Plenty of them. Just come home. 

This has got to be a troll.

Congratulations sir you had me for a minute there.

[jori123]

Just now, Mike Teavee said:

Sorry I should have been clearer, whilst your State Pension cannot be reduced, if you are receiving other Benefits (E.g. Pension Credits) these can so they can get the money back from you. 

 

Well I guess if you eventually receive housing benefit, but  That's improbable, states "maybe"

[jori123]

Just now, Andycoops said:

There are ways around it but that involves fraud, also the loopholes are being closed down in a recently announced purge on benefits fraud which includes pensions.

Not State Pension,if u can show please do

[bradiston]

1 minute ago, jori123 said:

Only if you inform,

 

Only if you inform, do not inform?  no nothing, no checking, unlike means tested benefits

Hold on. You've moved abroad. Somehow, the DWP has found this out. Your pension gets frozen. You moved back to the UK, or tell them you have? You have an address there that can forward their communications to you?

 

I don't get your plan. Move out then pretend you haven't, or move out and pretend to move back? Or move out, move back, and quietly out again, leaving you back where you started.

[EVENKEEL]

I'm just curious on how the gov. knows where each person in the country is staying. Why would you volunteer info on your whereabouts. I consider myself on an extended vacation. Nobody's business but mine. 

[jori123]

3 minutes ago, bradiston said:

Hold on. You've moved abroad. Somehow, the DWP has found this out. Your pension gets frozen. You moved back to the UK, or tell them you have? You have an address there that can forward their communications to you?

 

I don't get your plan. Move out then pretend you haven't, or move out and pretend to move back? Or move out, move back, and quietly out again, leaving you back where you started.

DWP not interested, use UK address,not sanctionable.  Can change address using Skype

[scotsdude]

As long as it keeps getting paid into a UK bank account and you still have a UK address I don't see an issue or am I missing something here? 

[MarkBR]

2 hours ago, theblether said:

 

Also, I'm not saying lengthy waits don't exist. The one thing that has already kicked in for the UK, and Thailand will be worse, is that there just aren't enough youngsters available. 

 

The birth rate has more than halved in Thailand. Crisis stages soon worldwide. 

Need immigrants in UK to help pay taxes which are used for the pensions

[bradiston]

13 minutes ago, jori123 said:

Not State Pension,if u can show please do

Agreed. The most massive benefit fraud is Universal Credit. I believe the figure was, a few years back, in the region of £17 billion. Not to encourage "fraud", but a few pensioners being economical with the truth as to their geographical whereabouts is hardly likely to cost HM gov more than a few 000 quid. One of the arguments they use to shoot down protests regarding the unfreezing of pensions is the potential cost to the exchequer, which they estimate would be way into the £ billions. So turning a blind eye to the odd oldie claiming a little bit more than the widow(er)'s mite would seem a much cheaper option.

 

All this gets discussed endlessly on threads popping up every year on AN. One more for the archive!

Edited October 2 by bradiston

[jori123]

2 minutes ago, scotsdude said:

As long as it keeps getting paid into a UK bank account and you still have a UK address I don't see an issue or am I missing something here? 

No others are missing something...money

[bradiston]

5 minutes ago, jori123 said:

DWP not interested, use UK address,not sanctionable.  Can change address using Skype

Ah, ok. Now I'm with you. Use a UK address. Next!

[jori123]

off to bed

[chiang mai]

34 minutes ago, Celsius said:

 

Inflation always existed. Three decades ago I was 21 and would not move to another country where I have zero rights just because I was 😺 hungry.

Inflation has always existed but from time to time we see spikes that derail most peoples plans.

 

[hotandsticky]

2 hours ago, Nemises said:

They knew their pensions would freeze if they left the UK.

Next.

 

 

I didn't.

 

 

When I came here at age 50 the state pension was a distant thought. Knowing that my state pension would be frozen would not have changed my decision. It is an unfair situation and as laudable as all these Change petitions are, they are p1ssing in the wind  -  no government has the incentive to change it.

 

As Maya Angelou said "If you don't like something, change it. If you can't change it, change your attitude."  

 

 

[MarkBR]

2 hours ago, chiang mai said:

It may depend where you live I suppose. A friend in Lancaster had a ten month wait to have his heart effectively rebuilt and then two years later, a one year wait to fix an aorta aneurysm, hardly trivial problems.....this was at Blackpool regional hospital. 

Yes, a post code lottery.  But my mother had an ambulance twice within 30 minutes in south of Glasgow.  So, it can be fairly fast if the condition is serious.  The wait occurred at the Queen Elizabeth hospital, the second time to get a bed.  She had excellent treatment.

Edited October 2 by MarkBR
typographic error

[MarkBR]

8 minutes ago, bradiston said:

Agreed. The most massive benefit fraud is Universal Credit. I believe the figure was, a few years back, in the region of £17 billion. Not to encourage "fraud", but a few pensioners being economical with the truth as to their geographical whereabouts is hardly likely to cost HM gov more than a few 000 quid. One of the arguments they use to shoot down protests regarding the unfreezing of pensions is the potential cost to the exchequer, which they estimate would be way into the £ billions. So turning a blind eye to the odd oldie claiming a little bit more than the widow(er)'s mite would seem a much cheaper option.

 

All this gets discussed endlessly on threads popping up every year on AN. One more for the archive!

Benefit fraud does not begin to equal the amount avoided & evaded by the rich

[Nemises]

50 minutes ago, AhFarangJa said:

NO, WRONG, I for one was not aware of this blatant discrimination, like thousands of others, so crawl back under the stone you squirmed from.

You’ve only yourself to blame for not being aware of this, regardless of how many others were also. No sympathy for you. 

[Bday Prang]

2 hours ago, theblether said:

 

My dad is just out of hospital today. Picked up by ambulance within twenty minutes and a seven day stay. 

 

The NHS is not the basketcase people are making out. 

My grandfather smoked 60 a day and lived till he was 90   does that mean smoking is not bad for people ?  One's experience of the nhs can vary dramatically and in general it pretty much is a basket case 

[bradiston]

3 minutes ago, MarkBR said:

Benefit fraud does not begin to equal the amount avoided & evaded by the rich

Avoiding is not a crime. Evading is. Ask Capone!

[MarkBR]

34 minutes ago, charliebadenhop said:

This is a really poorly written article in many ways.

 

I thought people had lost access to their pensions.

 

And how does not getting a yearly increase leave people living "hand to mouth".

 

Geez!

They could eat Thai food, most quite delicious (avoid chicken feet & fresh buffalo blood larb), and very inexpensive.

[BE88]

2 hours ago, SmokeandIce said:

Plus you avoid the constant Thai attack of taxes.

 

And it will increase tourists in Thailand

[Dene16]

2 hours ago, prakhonchai nick said:

 

Edited October 2 by Dene16
Deleted

[Bday Prang]

The first guy has pretty much just arrived here, and wouldn't be due an increase until next April anyway. Yet he is already whinging,  Talk about crying before you get hit.

[MarkBR]

Just now, bradiston said:

Avoiding is not a crime. Evading is. Ask Capone!

The evasion is enormous especially coupled to being hidden in tax havens (~36billion Pounds per anuum; ~570 billion Pounds held in tax havens).  This was/is facilitated by government policies over the last party's many years of government.  London has much of the world's dirty money flowing through it (~88 billion Pounds per annuum).  If this was investigated by Inland Revenue more thoroughly then all these other things would be forgotten about.  The country would be swimming in money.  All pensions could be triple-locked.