Foreign 'Mafia' Harass Tourists in Pattaya, Taunt Local Police

[bubblegum]

I'm sure I do not like this at all! How the hell do I get a test for these illnesses? and what would it cost. 

 

 

Thank you for your email.

 

I would like to inform you that WRLife has recently updated its policy wording regarding degenerative diseases, adding new conditions to the coverage list.

 

Under these changes, all degenerative diseases will be covered five years after the start of your policy. To qualify for this coverage, a medical check-up is required. If no signs of degenerative diseases are detected during the waiting period, full coverage will be provided after the five-year mark. Please note that without this medical examination, WRLife will not offer coverage for degenerative diseases.

 

Additionally, WR Life has agreed to our request to implement the updated policy terms and conditions at the time of your policy renewal, rather than in the middle of your current policy year.

 

Notable Additions on Page 5: The updated wording includes several degenerative diseases such as:: Alzheimer's disease (AD), Amyotrophic lateral sclerosis (ALS, Lou Gehrig's disease), Charcot–Marie–Tooth disease (CMT), Chronic traumatic encephalopathy, Cystic fibrosis, Some cytochrome c oxidase deficiencies (often the cause of degenerative Leigh syndrome), Ehlers–Danlos syndrome, Fibrodysplasia ossificans progressive, Friedreich's ataxia, Frontotemporal dementia (FTD), Huntington's disease, Infantile neuroaxonal dystrophy, Keratoconus (KC), Keratoglobus, Leukodystrophies, Macular degeneration (AMD), Marfan's syndrome (MFS), Some mitochondrial myopathies, Mitochondrial DNA depletion syndrome, Mueller–Weiss syndrome, Multiple sclerosis (MS), Multiple system atrophy, Muscular dystrophies (MD), Neuronal ceroid lipofuscinosis, Niemann–Pick diseases, Osteoarthritis, Osteoporosis, Parkinson's disease, Pulmonary arterial hypertension, All prion diseases (Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease, fatal familial insomnia etc.)Progressive supranuclear palsy, Retinitis pigmentosa (RP), Rheumatoid arthritis, Sandhoff Disease, Spinal muscular atrophy (SMA, motor neuron disease), Subacute sclerosing panencephalitis, Substance Use Disorder, Tay–Sachs disease, Vascular dementia (might not itself be neurodegenerative, but often appears alongside other forms of degenerative dementia). Always 5 years waiting period in any case. Please take a moment to review the updated policy wording attached to this email.

 

[brewsterbudgen]

 Pulmonary arterial hypertension, - is this a degenerative disease?  

[Lorry]

That's mostly not degenerative diseases,  but just the opposite,  genetic disorders.

The common denominator: they are expensive

[brewsterbudgen]

It does indeed seem to be a new policy requirement.  They have just told me that as I have been a policy holder since 2022, I can "now do the medical checkup" and send them "your report for degenerative sicknesses coverage".   I only renewed last month and if I hadn't seen this thread, I'd have been none the wiser.

 

Hopefully they can be specific about what needs to be included in the medical report.

[simon43]

Hmm, that's not good.  I'm with WR Life and in good health, but a waiting period of 5 years for existing policy holders???

Edited Thursday at 10:20 AM by simon43

[scubascuba3]

Sounds like they've just woken up to the risk of pre-existing conditions covered sales pitch they used, wasn't it day 1 or 6 months i recall

[bubblegum]

I got the email thru AA insurance.

[jerrymahoney]

16 hours ago, brewsterbudgen said:

 Pulmonary arterial hypertension, - is this a degenerative disease?  

Pulmonary arterial hypertension (PAH) is a rare, progressive disorder characterized by high blood pressure (hypertension) in the arteries of the lungs (pulmonary artery) for no apparent reason. The pulmonary arteries are the blood vessels that carry blood from the right side of the heart through the lungs.

 

https://rarediseases.org/rare-diseases/pulmonary-arterial-hypertension/

 

These are not sudden onset conditions. Maybe they just had too many instances of persons taking out policies with no pre-existing conditions declared and and then, shortly after the prescribed waiting period, voilà there they are.

 

• 08 January 2024 WRLife List of DEGENERATIVE DISEASES

Edited Thursday at 10:38 PM by jerrymahoney

[simon43]

But a 5-year wait is extreme.  I'm healthy now, but I could develop one of these conditions in maybe 4 years from now.  Why should I pay monthly premiums to an insurance company who will deny a claim after 4 years of good health?

 

If I were to change insurers, I can certainly do that without any additional medical exclusions, (I'm only excluded for BPH/UTIs).  But eg Cigna, who are certainly a reputable company, will charge me more than double the monthly premium   😞

Edited yesterday at 11:19 AM by simon43

[Celsius]

On 10/17/2024 at 5:19 PM, simon43 said:

Hmm, that's not good.  I'm with WR Life and in good health, but a waiting period of 5 years for existing policy holders???

 

After your last insurance refused to pay you 1 baht, you took even more useless insurance? I don't get ...

 

Why not put the insurance premiums in the bank account and use this cash to pay for tests? No stress of being approved, not feeling scammed when they deny your claim.

[jerrymahoney]

Some people have disabilities that gradually develop. These types of disabilities are often called “progressive disabilities.” Common examples of progressive disabilities include muscular dystrophy, multiple sclerosis, Alzheimer's disease, and types of vision and hearing loss that get worse over time.

https://mn.db101.org/mn/situations/newtobenefits/progressive_disability/program.htm

-- It is the nature of these degenerative or progressive illnesses that one can have symptoms of a condition, but it be years before any treatment is required.

-- And in my reviewing of the negative reports on Trustpilot or Google, they almost all involved submitting a claim shortly after the policy was started for a condition not declared as pre-exiting. Edited 14 hours ago by jerrymahoney

[bubblegum]

29 minutes ago, jerrymahoney said:

Some people have disabilities that gradually develop. These types of disabilities are often called “progressive disabilities.” Common examples of progressive disabilities include muscular dystrophy, multiple sclerosis, Alzheimer's disease, and types of vision and hearing loss that get worse over time.

https://mn.db101.org/mn/situations/newtobenefits/progressive_disability/program.htm

-- It is the nature of these degenerative or progressive illnesses that one can have symptoms of a condition, but it be years before any treatment is required.

-- And in my reviewing of the negative reports on Trustpilot or Google, they almost all involved submitting a claim shortly after the policy was started for a condition not declared as pre-exiting.

So? 

[jerrymahoney]

So the circumstance as described above as being in good health for 4 years and then having some onset of the condition in the 5th year is not generally how it would work.

[bubblegum]

Just now, jerrymahoney said:

So the circumstance as described above as being in good health for 4 years and then having some onset of the condition in the 5th year is not generally how it would work.

You get sick when you get sick. Changing existing ! policies like this is hardly trustworthy imo. 

[jerrymahoney]

I don't know the specifics of why this change as of 27 SEP 2024. I will just presume that, under the prior policy wording, there were too many persons claiming for a condition that was already pre-existing at time the policy was initiated but not so declared.

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

"Additionally, WR Life has agreed to our request to implement the updated policy terms and conditions at the time of your policy renewal, rather than in the middle of your current policy year."

 

 

Does the WRLife policy contain a clause that would allow for unilateral coverage changes during the term of the policy? 

[simon43]

13 hours ago, Celsius said:

 

After your last insurance refused to pay you 1 baht, you took even more useless insurance? I don't get ...

 

Why not put the insurance premiums in the bank account and use this cash to pay for tests? No stress of being approved, not feeling scammed when they deny your claim.

Because saving up my monthly insurance premiums (about $200) will result in a miniscule amount when/if I have to pay $10,000 - $30,000 for some hospital operation etc.  A major illness would force me to return to the UK.  It's not an ideal situation is it?

 

Yes, insurance is definitely a risk as well, but I declared absolutely everything to WR Life (such as minor accidents 50 years ago etc), and therefore my chances of having an insurance claim rejected is small.

[jerrymahoney]

1 hour ago, Etaoin Shrdlu said:

Does the WRLife policy contain a clause that would allow for unilateral coverage changes during the term of the policy? 

Modification of cover
The Insurer reserves the option to modify the cover in one or more specific territories subject to notifying the Subscriber 15 days in advance.

Edited 9 hours ago by jerrymahoney

[KannikaP]

52 minutes ago, simon43 said:

A major illness would force me to return to the UK

Where, depending on how long you have been out of UK, you could be asked to pay 150% for your treatment on NHS, and a long wait.

Edited 8 hours ago by KannikaP

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

I think both contract law and insurance regulations would normally work against allowing an insurer to reduce coverage during the term of a policy or to insert wording into their policy attempting to allow such modification. Yes, there are exceptions with certain lines of commercial insurance, usually involving material change in risk, but I don't think I've seen this with respect to personal lines insurance before.

 

Perhaps this is a feature of having insurance from a company overseen by the insurance regulator on Nevis.

 

[bubblegum]

Well 1 thing for sure is that they pissed me off and I'll be going elsewhere.

[jerrymahoney]

Just to note I have an undated copy of the WrL policy that I downloaded November 2021.

It does not contain the word 'degenerative'.

[simon43]

I will post my edited comment that is still awaiting mod approval -I've removed the company name so this should be posted OK 🙂

(Mods, you can delete my post that's waiting approval)

 

Well, I copied the letter from the insurance company that the OP posted at the start of this thread, and sent this to my company agent, expressing my 'concern' and asking for more clarification.

 

I received a 4-word reply email from them  "You are not concerned"  (sic)

 

Hmm........ Now I am even more concerned!

Edited 4 hours ago by simon43
Remove company name

[jerrymahoney]

As I read the 27 SEP 2024 policy revisions, the ones who should be most concerned are those persons who realize they have early symptoms of some of these degenerative or progressive illnesses. They then felt they could not declare as pre-existing and that they could wait out the (then) 2 years restriction before submitting a claim for treatment.

[bubblegum]

11 minutes ago, simon43 said:

I will post my edited comment that is still awaiting mod approval -I've removed the company name so this should be posted OK 🙂

(Mods, you can delete my post that's waiting approval)

 

Well, I copied the letter from the insurance company that the OP posted at the start of this thread, and sent this to my company agent, expressing my 'concern' and asking for more clarification.

 

I received a 4-word reply email from them  "You are not concerned"  (sic)

 

Hmm........ Now I am even more concerned!

So you did NOT get an email from Wrlive? Now I'm even more concerned.

[simon43]

3 minutes ago, bubblegum said:

So you did NOT get an email from Wrlive? Now I'm even more concerned.

nope!!

 

The agent's short reply was very concerning.  It has shaken my confidence in this company, should I need to make a claim.  I've started to contact other insurance companies, especially C....igna from the UK who have a very good reputation, but would cost me twice as much in monthly premiums.

Edited 4 hours ago by simon43

[bubblegum]

12 minutes ago, jerrymahoney said:

As I read the 27 SEP 2024 policy revisions, the ones who should be most concerned are those persons who realize they have early symptoms of some of these degenerative or progressive illnesses. They then felt they could not declare as pre-existing and that they could wait out the (then) 2 years restriction before submitting a claim for treatment.

I'm in my third year with them, never had a claim not do I have any symptoms of a disease I never heard of. The only thing on the list I have heard of is Alzheimer. 

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

The list of degenerative diseases looks as if it was copied and pasted from Wikipedia:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Degenerative_disease

 

I note that Wikipedia also lists cancer as a degenerative disease. If the policy wording states that all degenerative diseases are subject to this exam requirement and waiting period, then cancer is presumably also subject.  Otherwise the policy wording would have stated "the following degenerative diseases are subject to exam and waiting period", or would have a carve-back for cancer.  But that's not what the wording in the OP says. What other diseases might fall under the "all degenerative diseases" category but aren't specifically listed?

 

 

 

 

[Henk Langeweg]

I think everyone has the right NOT to know what's in the sickness future so surely I will not go for check up as 'ordered'.

[jerrymahoney]

14 minutes ago, Etaoin Shrdlu said:

If the policy wording states that all degenerative diseases are subject to this exam requirement and waiting period

It doesn't.