Khao San Road Feels Pinch as European Tourists Hold Off on Bookings - video

[ChipButty]

9 hours ago, hotchilli said:

So why are Phuket, Pattaya doing so well?

Who told you that? 

[ChipButty]

Only certain areas of Phuket are busy, Monday evening in Rawai at the Seafood market was not busy, Usually full of tourist this time of the year, 

If I have a drive around the area all the bike rental shops are full of bikes, 

[RayC]

10 hours ago, baansgr said:

Is there still 300 baht rooms and can you get a beer and a bird for £10  after buying your fake degree? Might be worth a visit if I can

 

Sadly,no.

 

The products you list are still available, but you will need to adjust your cost estimates upwards by a considerable amount😉

[hotchilli]

2 hours ago, ChipButty said:

Who told you that? 

TAT every day

[Nid_Noi]

Thailand does not smile anymore. The new generations have no knowledge of hospitality and they have no work ethics. 40 years ago more people spoke English, now almost none. Even with their smartphone application they can’t make a sale. Rama 9 spent so much money to educate the Thai, one wonders if this money has not been totally wasted.

[bristolgeoff]

I agree a previous comment said they changed  everything and then hoped it would be ok. Should have left it the way it was,maybe modernise  a few things,but they completely changed it  and then that was the end of it

[NativeBob]

Agree. KSR is done long time ago. And F*** those memories "I've been there in 90s!" 

So what? 

Marco Polo hostel was 120thb? many hostels were not more than 200thb. 

Pad Thai for the price of burger? 

Everything is vanished from KSR and unfortunately it is normal. 

Thai charm is gone.

[MarkyM3]

On 11/25/2024 at 11:45 AM, snoop1130 said:

 

Bangkok's celebrated Khao San Road, long a hub of backpacker activity, faces a slump in hotel reservations just ahead the festive season. Khaosan Business Association President Sanga Ruangwattanakul attributes the decline to European tourists' uncertainty amidst the persisting Russia-Ukraine conflict.

 

Coinciding with a wider downturn, reservations for the key dates of December 30 to December 31 have decreased to approximate 60%, falling from last year's 70%. European visitors, predominantly from the UK, France, Germany, and Italy, usually contribute to 80% of Khao San's tourist demographic, with a lesser proportion hailing from other Asian countries.

 

In spite of the disappointing figures, Sanga remains positive, anticipating an influx of bookings closer to the festive period. Khao San Road, staying true to its energetic character, will host a New Year’s Eve countdown that aims to attract between 50,000 to 70,000 tourists. On an average, each tourist spends around 1,000 baht thereby potentially injecting over 70 million baht into the local economy.

 

 

Christmas festivities will commence on December 24 with a splendid display of Christmas lights. Sanga is optimistic about Khao San's enduring appeal as a tourist hot-spot, although he admits that sales of alcohol, a significant contributor to revenues, haven’t been as buoyant. A lack of spending from Thai visitors, conscious of financial constraints, is a factor dimming economic vibrancy.

 

To circumvent these financial challenges, Sanga proposes government measures to stimulate consumer spending, including tax breaks through initiatives such as Easy E-Receipt or the Khon La Khreung co-payment subsidy. He also supports plans to enhance revenues by focusing on the 5F industries — food, film, festivals, Thai boxing, and fashion — to attract more global tourists to Thailand.

 

Despite current obstacles, hopes remain high for Khao San Road as the New Year’s Eve countdown closes in. The belief is that the celebrated strip will once again buzz with the vibrancy and dynamism that make it an essential stop on every traveller's itinerary.

 

 

File photo for reference only

 

-- 2024-11-25

 

 

Absolutely zilch to do with the Ukraine War. Clutching at straws there (great Marillion album btw 😄 )

 

I went down there earlier this year. 300 baht for a "jug" of beer everywhere so it ain't that cheap. A friend of mine who still likes to backpack and wanted to revisit the places we stayed in 20 years ago when we first visited Asia inc. KSR paid £70/night for a room around there and it wasn't much cop by the sounds of it. Residences in Sukhumvit/Asoke for an average £100/night (will be more now due to exchange rate dipping) are in a completely different league.

 

I also suspect people are moving on. The internet and social media/blogging has made information so much more accessible and quicker to disseminate and booking places is completely different to how it was when I did it 20 years back. Then, people were mainly still carrying Lonely Planet or Rough Guide around and being able to book online or see a website was still in its infancy. KSR was still full of internet cafes at the time!

 

Laos is obviously going to have some issues with their backpacker demand after the alcohol poisoning issues but that will probably be short lived.  

Edited yesterday at 01:45 PM by MarkyM3

[sambum]

 "Khaosan Business Association President Sanga Ruangwattanakul attributes the decline to European tourists' uncertainty amidst the persisting Russia-Ukraine conflict."

 

Has nobody thought that the reason that bookings are down is because the average "Joe" in Europe is having a hard job feeding his family and keeping warm due to the  cost of food and utilities.

 

Footnote: "In 2023, Chris O'Shea, the CEO of British Gas owner Centrica, received a total remuneration package of £8.2 million. This was an increase of more than 80% from his 2022 pay of £4.5 million."

 

And so the prices of gas go up to help pay for this obscene increase - no doubt other utility companiess have a similar story to tell - B.P. for instance:-

 

" BP's 2023 profits were $13.8 billion, which was the second highest annual profit in a decade."

 

So basically, people are paying for these massive profits and salaries out of the money that they would otherwise be spending on non-essentials - like holidays!!!

 

[MarkyM3]

26 minutes ago, sambum said:

 "Khaosan Business Association President Sanga Ruangwattanakul attributes the decline to European tourists' uncertainty amidst the persisting Russia-Ukraine conflict."

 

Has nobody thought that the reason that bookings are down is because the average "Joe" in Europe is having a hard job feeding his family and keeping warm due to the  cost of food and utilities.

 

Footnote: "In 2023, Chris O'Shea, the CEO of British Gas owner Centrica, received a total remuneration package of £8.2 million. This was an increase of more than 80% from his 2022 pay of £4.5 million."

 

And so the prices of gas go up to help pay for this obscene increase - no doubt other utility companiess have a similar story to tell - B.P. for instance:-

 

" BP's 2023 profits were $13.8 billion, which was the second highest annual profit in a decade."

 

So basically, people are paying for these massive profits and salaries out of the money that they would otherwise be spending on non-essentials - like holidays!!!

 

Every EVA flight I've been on for many years is sold out without fail. Every time. And that's despite premium economy and business fares going up by >2/3 in the last 5 years. There's still plenty of money floating around in the UK tbh and I live there most of the year - for the time being at least. Unemployment is still near a record low level and I think people are still prioritising having a holiday.

 

I totally agree with you on the cost of living but most backpackers have barely started working, or are on career breaks/sabbaticals and they are the meat and potatoes of KSR's tourist trade. Also, the UK is only one component of it. So I think your points are more applicable to tourist trade elsewhere - whether in other parts of Thailand or other countries. 

 

High executive pay is hardly a new thing and I don't think has much to do with whether backpackers are coming to KSR. The price of oil also determines BP profits, executive pay is a small element in it. Oil prices have dropped right back lately, as has the BP share price.

 

Not saying I agree with excessive pay at all btw - a lot of execs are unjustifiably rewarded for poor performance - but by Western standards the UK is actually relatively moderate.  

Edited yesterday at 02:30 PM by MarkyM3

[sambum]

9 minutes ago, MarkyM3 said:

Every EVA flight I've been on for many years is sold out without fail. Every time. And that's despite premium economy and business fares going up by 2/3 in the last 5 years. There's still plenty of money floating around in the UK tbh and I live there most of the year - for the time being at least. Unemployment is still near a record low level and I think people are still prioritising having a holiday.

 

I totally agree with you on the cost of living but most backpackers have barely started working, or are on career breaks/sabbaticals and they are the meat and potatoes of KSR's tourist trade. Also, the UK is only one component of it. So I think your points are more applicable to tourist trade elsewhere - whether in other parts of Thailand or other countries. 

 

High executive pay is hardly a new thing and I don't think has much to do with whether backpackers are coming to KSR. The price of oil also determines BP profits, executive pay is a small element in it. Oil prices have dropped right back lately, as has the BP share price.

 

Not saying I agree with excessive pay at all btw - a lot of execs are unjustifiably rewarded for poor performance - but by Western standards the UK is actually relatively moderate.  

 

".........but by Western standards the UK is actually relatively moderate."

 

As are the pensions!  But without getting political, or into a long discourse about it, you may be right about there still being a bit of money to be had in the UK, but I don't think that the average back packers to KSR fall into that category, and that is the point of the thread, surely?

[MarkyM3]

19 minutes ago, sambum said:

 

".........but by Western standards the UK is actually relatively moderate."

 

As are the pensions!  But without getting political, or into a long discourse about it, you may be right about there still being a bit of money to be had in the UK, but I don't think that the average back packers to KSR fall into that category, and that is the point of the thread, surely?

 

Well, yes state pensions aren't great but if you look at Europe, people are obliged to pay a lot more in to the state system than in the UK. Private provision is supposed to be more of a feature in the UK. But yeah, I won't disagree necessarily on that point, the main issue I feel is the frozen pension which is entirely unfair.  

 

Tbh, as someone who stayed in KSR in my backpacking days (2005-8) and revisited a few times since (twice during the pandemic when it was utterly dead, my ex gf liked a restaurant nearby, and once more in Jan 2024),  most of the clientele are middle class kids on gap years before or after Uni, people on career breaks/sabbaticals (like I was) and older hippy types. You'd be surprised at how many of them do have money....most are probably financed by mum and dad, or used savings if they work. They tend to be on trips of several months (except perhaps for the older hippy types). One reason KSR is struggling is it has tried to go upmarket and it isn't good value for money, as my post higher up mentioned. Why pay £70 for a crappy room there in a "boutique hotel" which in reality is rubbish when you can stay elsewhere on a similar budget and get so much more for your money. Along with the fact people are trying out new places.

 

Last time I went to KSR in Jan this year it was doing fine. But it is still grubby as hell so again, the prices don't match the reality really. You can stay in Lamai, Koh Samui on the beach in an A-frame hut for a few hundred baht a night still - that's real backpacking, not the facsimile that KSR is. 

Edited yesterday at 02:54 PM by MarkyM3

[geisha]

A lot of EU foreigners are a bit worried over th claims made by Putin and co , 

I know a few who have said they don’t fancy «  flying in that direction at the moment ». I live and worked in one of the busiest tourist resorts in the south of France , when Iraq invaded Koweït, work suddenly  became quite a bit quieter for us, even though we are far from those areas. Politics make a huge impact on tourism. I think many families will travel less long haul when  prices have risen at home, tax hikes etc. I have never seen the European resorts so busy in all my professional life , packed to the rafters.

Trains and budget airlines are sold a year in advance, as with easyjet for example. 

[baansgr]

16 hours ago, RayC said:

 

Sadly,no.

 

The products you list are still available, but you will need to adjust your cost estimates upwards by a considerable amount😉

Thankyou 

[Woke to Sounds of Horking]

These days Khao San is frequented only because of its legacy. Think "Hey, there was this cool band from 1991 called Nirvana. Check out their video!" And sure, the video might be watched. And then... Next.

[sambum]

12 hours ago, MarkyM3 said:

 

Well, yes state pensions aren't great but if you look at Europe, people are obliged to pay a lot more in to the state system than in the UK. Private provision is supposed to be more of a feature in the UK. But yeah, I won't disagree necessarily on that point, the main issue I feel is the frozen pension which is entirely unfair.  

 

Tbh, as someone who stayed in KSR in my backpacking days (2005-8) and revisited a few times since (twice during the pandemic when it was utterly dead, my ex gf liked a restaurant nearby, and once more in Jan 2024),  most of the clientele are middle class kids on gap years before or after Uni, people on career breaks/sabbaticals (like I was) and older hippy types. You'd be surprised at how many of them do have money....most are probably financed by mum and dad, or used savings if they work. They tend to be on trips of several months (except perhaps for the older hippy types). One reason KSR is struggling is it has tried to go upmarket and it isn't good value for money, as my post higher up mentioned. Why pay £70 for a crappy room there in a "boutique hotel" which in reality is rubbish when you can stay elsewhere on a similar budget and get so much more for your money. Along with the fact people are trying out new places.

 

Last time I went to KSR in Jan this year it was doing fine. But it is still grubby as hell so again, the prices don't match the reality really. You can stay in Lamai, Koh Samui on the beach in an A-frame hut for a few hundred baht a night still - that's real backpacking, not the facsimile that KSR is. 

I've been living in Lamai for nearly 20 years and love it here - not as "in your face" as Chaweng but everything you need/want is here. I'm in a modern(ish) house (Not an A frame hut!) for which I pay a very reasonable 10k baht a month as I'm here "long time" (Discounted during Covid) 

Yes, the real downside is the frozen pensions thing, which is really unfair, when you take into account the money that is spent on Immigration and foreign aid, which is in the BILLIONS compared to the few MILLION that it woud cost to pay every pensioner the annual increments regardless of where they live - minus the savings that the Gov't are making due to the fact that expats are not using the Health Service, or other benefits that seem to be handed out willy nilly to people that have paid not a jot into the system. Unfortunately, pre election promises are soon forgotten by the incoming government of the day, and the current lot are no different - they do in fact seem to be cutting pensioners'income down to the bone with this abolition of free TV licences for the over 75's and the cutting back on the Winter Fuel  Allowance. ("New boss - same as the old boss - won't get fooled again"?)

Edited 19 hours ago by sambum

[georgegeorgia]

4 minutes ago, sambum said:

I've been living in Lamai for nearly 20 years and love it here - not as "in your face" as Chaweng but everything you need/want is here, but I'm in a modern(ish) house (Not an A frame hut!) for which I pay a very reasonable 10k baht a month as I'm here "long time" (Discounted during Covid) 

Yes, the real downside is the frozen pensions thing, which is really unfair, when you take into account the money that is spent on Immigration and foreign aid, which is in the BILLIONS compared to the few million that it woud cost to pay every pensioner the annual increments regardless of where they live - minus the savings that the Gov't are making due to the fact that expats are not using the Health Service, or other benefits that seem to be handed out willy nilly to people that have paid not a jot into the system.

How far is this LAMAI away from KSR ?

[daveAustin]

For the target demographic; flights, baht, hotels, beer too expensive in KSR compared with yesteryear, plus the euros have far less money in their pockets. Surprised they can't fill it with Chinese.

[sambum]

10 minutes ago, georgegeorgia said:

How far is this LAMAI away from KSR ?

 

A lifetime!

[JonnyF]

They destroyed the character/charm/vibe of the place when they "refurbished" it.

 

Now it's just a boring road in the middle of nowhere. Perfect for getting ripped off by TukTuk drivers as there is no MRT/BTS nearby. 

[Jim Blue]

Maybe the BTS and Metro made other places easier to get to and stay...

[baansgr]

On 11/26/2024 at 11:26 AM, kingstonkid said:

Thailand is still going to have a tourist boom  High Season will be great.

 

 

I agree. I never went there until the late 90s, but in those days, there were 3 places that every tourist had to go to at least once in a visit:  PANTIP plaza, PATPONG night market and Khaosan Road for the ambience, cheap beer, and fake IDs or diplomas. It was also, due to the backpackers, a great place to get cheap travel. 

 

Alas, time have changed. Pantip is no more; Patpong is a shell of what it was, and Khaosan is just a tourist trap.  Backpackers can now get better deals in other areas that are more accessible, like NANA. Cheap hotels are a dime a dozen, and you can book cheap fights online.  Just looking at the pictures I know I do not want to go there when there is anything happening.  The last time I was there, there were very few ways out. I would also not go to Patpong during Songkran. It has gotten ridiculous.

 

Why are Phuket and Pattaya going strong simply because they are not backpackers only?  They have entertainment for everyone, they have beaches. They are easy to walk around. 

 

Simple question what good things does Khaosan have that you can not find in China Town or NANA

 

 

And.pattaya has 500 baht hotels,

40 baht beers, 24 hour opening and 1k a night hookers...that's why it's busy 

[thongplay]

On 11/26/2024 at 6:08 AM, hotchilli said:

Celebrated Khao San Road

Celebrated?

[kingstonkid]

13 hours ago, geisha said:

A lot of EU foreigners are a bit worried over th claims made by Putin and co , 

I know a few who have said they don’t fancy «  flying in that direction at the moment ». I live and worked in one of the busiest tourist resorts in the south of France , when Iraq invaded Koweït, work suddenly  became quite a bit quieter for us, even though we are far from those areas. Politics make a huge impact on tourism. I think many families will travel less long haul when  prices have risen at home, tax hikes etc. I have never seen the European resorts so busy in all my professional life , packed to the rafters.

Trains and budget airlines are sold a year in advance, as with easyjet for example. 

 

Sorry but politics and Vlad has nothing to do with it. BUT you did ht the probelm on the head  FAMILIES.  KSR was never about families.  It was about backpackers, cheap beer cheep hostel or rooms and travel arrangements. It was the hub for backpackers to meet and relax for a day or 2 with cheap everything.  It was not even ther for the sex trade.

 

Hence Patpong was for the soldier Marine sailor airman on leave in beautiful Bang KOK.

 

KSR is still a place that Thai and backpackers young single people go to BUT only on special days.  NYE Songkran

 

Because the road is so small it is easier to have a big function with low numbers.

 

BUT again I remind you that tourism in Thailand and Bangkok is up just not in that area.

[NativeBob]

27 minutes ago, kingstonkid said:

Sorry but politics and Vlad has nothing to do with it

100% true. Ruskies don't mingle there.

But Bibi has a lot to do with it. 

Last weekend we went to check that elephant pants at KSR (nope, same price as at Silom) and seems like little Haifa. Brave and vigilant defenders of Holy Land some how relocated to exactly this area. Why? 

[Metapod]

On 11/26/2024 at 7:17 AM, Can samui said:

They destroyed the soul and ambiance of the area with their massive redo a couple of years ago. They killed the golden goose.

 

Yep. It was dead before then, but now it's super gentrified and backpacking in general is out of trend due to covid + higher cost of living + social media driving flashpacking/luxury over budget.

 

You also don't need "hub" streets as much anymore with the pervasiveness of internet and phones. Now everyone has unlimited info on a country or city before they arrive. They can book a room online super easy on Agoda or with AirBnB. It's not like before where you would fly into a country/city and not know where to go or what to do and then just go to the "hub" area with the other travelers. 

 

 

Edited 13 hours ago by Metapod

[MarkyM3]

8 hours ago, sambum said:

I've been living in Lamai for nearly 20 years and love it here - not as "in your face" as Chaweng but everything you need/want is here. I'm in a modern(ish) house (Not an A frame hut!) for which I pay a very reasonable 10k baht a month as I'm here "long time" (Discounted during Covid) 

Yes, the real downside is the frozen pensions thing, which is really unfair, when you take into account the money that is spent on Immigration and foreign aid, which is in the BILLIONS compared to the few MILLION that it woud cost to pay every pensioner the annual increments regardless of where they live - minus the savings that the Gov't are making due to the fact that expats are not using the Health Service, or other benefits that seem to be handed out willy nilly to people that have paid not a jot into the system. Unfortunately, pre election promises are soon forgotten by the incoming government of the day, and the current lot are no different - they do in fact seem to be cutting pensioners'income down to the bone with this abolition of free TV licences for the over 75's and the cutting back on the Winter Fuel  Allowance. ("New boss - same as the old boss - won't get fooled again"?)

 

Glad you like Lamai, you're lucky to be living there! I first pitched up there in January 2005 in my backpacking days, having arrived via Surat Thani to NaThon on a glorified fishing boat with 2 travelling companions. This was a little bit before the time of planning things via the internet so we got picked up on the pier by touts and piled into a minivan. Everyone else was being encouraged to go to Chaweng but we'd already decided we didn't want to follow the crowd so told the driver to let us out in Lamai. They weren't too happy because no kickbacks were being paid, but very glad we took that option - I much prefer it to Chaweng which I virtually never go to. I've been back to Lamai many times in the last 20 years and while it's changed it still retains its quieter charms. 

 

The A-frames I mentioned are the New Hut, btw, as you probably guessed 😄 We didn't actually stay there but I still use the restaurant if I'm taking a walk down the beach. Good, cheap and great location. 

 

Pension uprating - agreed, you have to pay contributions to get it so I fail to see how it's fair to freeze just because the recipient isn't in the UK anymore. It. But as I read somewhere else, the last time a new country was added to the list was in 1981 so it ain't happening. I agree 100% on your points about the waste of money elsewhere. That plus the huge C19 debts and Ukraine war spend means uprating will never happen, if anything the qualification age will be delayed in future. 

[MarkyM3]

8 hours ago, georgegeorgia said:

How far is this LAMAI away from KSR ?

Get back to your floors/arm wrestling 😄

[sambum]

3 hours ago, MarkyM3 said:

 

Glad you like Lamai, you're lucky to be living there! I first pitched up there in January 2005 in my backpacking days, having arrived via Surat Thani to NaThon on a glorified fishing boat with 2 travelling companions. This was a little bit before the time of planning things via the internet so we got picked up on the pier by touts and piled into a minivan. Everyone else was being encouraged to go to Chaweng but we'd already decided we didn't want to follow the crowd so told the driver to let us out in Lamai. They weren't too happy because no kickbacks were being paid, but very glad we took that option - I much prefer it to Chaweng which I virtually never go to. I've been back to Lamai many times in the last 20 years and while it's changed it still retains its quieter charms. 

 

The A-frames I mentioned are the New Hut, btw, as you probably guessed 😄 We didn't actually stay there but I still use the restaurant if I'm taking a walk down the beach. Good, cheap and great location. 

 

Pension uprating - agreed, you have to pay contributions to get it so I fail to see how it's fair to freeze just because the recipient isn't in the UK anymore. It. But as I read somewhere else, the last time a new country was added to the list was in 1981 so it ain't happening. I agree 100% on your points about the waste of money elsewhere. That plus the huge C19 debts and Ukraine war spend means uprating will never happen, if anything the qualification age will be delayed in future. 

 

Did you ever get to a bar called The Red Fox in Walking Street? My best mate (R.I.P.) who was responsible for me being here owned it. 

[watchcat]

On 11/26/2024 at 12:17 AM, Can samui said:

They destroyed the soul and ambiance of the area with their massive redo a couple of years ago. They killed the golden goose.

 

Let them eat cake.