Ireland’s Move at the ICJ Redefining The Meaning of Genocide to get a Conviction

[Social Media]

 

Deputy Premier Micheál Martin’s recent announcement has placed Ireland at the center of a growing international controversy. Martin revealed that Ireland would file an intervention with the International Court of Justice (ICJ) in the ongoing case concerning Israel’s military actions in Gaza. Member states are permitted to contribute statements during ICJ proceedings, but the purpose of Ireland’s intervention has sparked heated debate.  

 

According to Martin, the filing aims to “broaden [the ICJ’s] interpretation of what constitutes the commission of genocide by a State.” This statement, bold in its implications, has drawn criticism for suggesting a reinterpretation of international law mid-trial to potentially achieve a predetermined outcome. Critics argue that this undermines the very essence of due process. Observers have compared Martin’s stance to notorious historical abuses of legal systems, accusing him of prioritizing political outcomes over legal integrity.  

 

Martin’s position, however, does not emerge in isolation. It draws inspiration from a recent Amnesty International report on the conflict. The report controversially claimed that Israel was not guilty of genocide under traditional international law but proposed redefining the term to fit their conclusion. This shift in approach damaged Amnesty’s credibility; leaks, disavowals from its Israel chapter, and widespread criticism followed the report’s publication. Despite the backlash, the Irish government appears willing to follow Amnesty’s lead, potentially sacrificing the integrity of international law to align with the organization’s narrative.  

 

Amnesty, as a pressure group, wields influence but not legal authority. Ireland, as a sovereign state and member of the ICJ, occupies a far weightier position. Its intervention, critics warn, risks setting a precedent that could erode the foundation of international law itself. The implications of reshaping legal definitions to suit political objectives could have far-reaching consequences beyond the current case.  

 

 

This move also raises broader questions about the motivations driving such actions. Some see it as rooted in anti-Zionism or fear of anti-Zionist sentiment within Ireland and beyond. The obsession with Israel, they argue, has led to counterproductive outcomes, distracting from rational policymaking and undermining moral authority.  

 

The current geopolitical landscape adds further context. The October 7, 2023, attacks and their aftermath intensified global scrutiny of Israel. Nations and organizations across the spectrum appeared eager to capitalize on perceived vulnerabilities, whether through military, diplomatic, or symbolic means. Yet, as events unfold, many of these efforts have faltered. Iran, despite activating proxies, faced significant setbacks. Russia’s pro-Hamas positions have seen limited success, and Western diplomatic antagonism appears increasingly out of step with unfolding realities.  

 

Amid this shifting landscape, Ireland’s leadership persists in its ICJ initiative. For critics, this reflects an obsession rather than a measured response to global dynamics. They argue that Dublin’s alliance with a discredited Amnesty report and its pursuit of legally questionable strategies highlight a troubling fixation on undermining Israel, regardless of broader consequences.  

 

However, one thing remains clear: Ireland’s approach has illuminated the underlying purpose of certain campaigns against Israel. For many, the actions speak not of a commitment to international law but of a willingness to manipulate it.

 

Based on reports by Sky News | Commentary 2024-12-13

 

 

 

[Nick Carter icp]

Ireland wants to change what words mean in order to prosecute ?

Change the word "Not guilty" to mean guilty and then send them to jail 

[Thingamabob]

Martin should be ashamed of himself. It would be interesting to know how he reacted to the Palestinian/Hamas attack of  7 October 2023 during which over 1700 Israeli men, women, children and infants were brutally murdered.

[Theforgotten1]

Why are so many people pretending that hamas is not the problem , if you keep slapping me and then attack me I will come out fighting , that is what Israel has done , I stand with Israel 

[DaddyWarbucks]

Many of Ireland's elected officials have taken a principled and outspoken stand against the frightful war crimes committed during this never-ending conflict in and around Israel.

[Nick Carter icp]

6 minutes ago, DaddyWarbucks said:

Many of Ireland's elected officials have taken a principled and outspoken stand against the frightful war crimes committed during this never-ending conflict in and around Israel.

 

   Did they comment on the actual Hamas war crimes ?

Making up false claims about Israeli war crimes and ignoring the real actual war crimes by Hamas ?

[Donga]

What I find galling is the same people who lament IDF forcing residents away from nominated target areas, with media pictures of their distress from having to move again, can then turn around and broadcast the G word. Want it both ways.

These folk either have no shame or just don't see how inane their claim is. 

And blithely ignore Hamas deliberately placing weapons and military infrastructure in those civilian areas, requiring IDF to get the residents to move to safety.

The Irish have an axe to grind over their history of oppression but unable to see the differences between Ireland and Gaza.

[Nick Carter icp]

1 hour ago, DaddyWarbucks said:

Many of Ireland's elected officials have taken a principled and outspoken stand against the frightful war crimes committed during this never-ending conflict in and around Israel.

 

   Ireland has a long history of Anti-Semitism which stems from their Roman Catholic heritage 

[Bkk Brian]

1 hour ago, DaddyWarbucks said:

Many of Ireland's elected officials have taken a principled and outspoken stand against the frightful war crimes committed during this never-ending conflict in and around Israel.

Is that why Ireland had to redefine the definition of Genocide? ICJ never found it plausible as was  widely miss reported, that was false, so to try and get a conviction Ireland changes the meaning to something that they hope will have at least a slim chance to stick. 

[loong]

The meaning of genocide cannot be re-defined, that would be totally ridiculous.
They cannot pin any war crimes on Israel, so want to stoop to actually invent a new set of actions and call that a war crime instead!
How about calling the wearing of the Star of David a war crime? That'll sort out those frikkin Jews!

[Purdey]

13 hours ago, Social Media said:

what constitutes the commission of genocide

Um, so what IS their reinterpretation?

[Donga]

1 hour ago, Purdey said:

Um, so what IS their reinterpretation?

Deliberate and sustained mass killing of innocents, what's yours?

How do you reconcile IDF repeatedly directing residents to move out of harms way, after Hamas have deliberately placed them there?

[Bkk Brian]

This is from the wife whose husbands relatives were murdered and taken hostage by Hamas

 

Ireland wants to change the definition of genocide in order to prosecute Israel. This shifting the goalposts of established law is exactly how obsessive hatred of the Jewish State looks like antisemitism. It undermines and poisons everything.

[pacovl46]

Definitions can be changed! Usually they're not retroactive, though, which means, if they implement the new definition, Israel can't be held responsible for past actions that violate the new definition, but Israel will have to change the way it goes about it or it can be prosecuted for future actions. I don't see a problem with that at all! Shall the world wait until that conflict is over to be able to change the definition?!

[Bkk Brian]

4 minutes ago, pacovl46 said:

Definitions can be changed! Usually they're not retroactive, though, which means, if they implement the new definition, Israel can't be held responsible for past actions that violate the new definition, but Israel will have to change the way it goes about it or it can be prosecuted for future actions. I don't see a problem with that at all! Shall the world wait until that conflict is over to be able to change the definition?!

Can they? Isn't that for the ICJ to decide if it will change the goal posts midway through the trial?

 

Considering ICJ “didn't decide claim of genocide was plausible” nor “that there's a plausible case of genocide” I bet South Africa and Ireland are scratching round for straws to clutch

[loong]

11 hours ago, pacovl46 said:

Definitions can be changed! Usually they're not retroactive, though, which means, if they implement the new definition, Israel can't be held responsible for past actions that violate the new definition, but Israel will have to change the way it goes about it or it can be prosecuted for future actions. I don't see a problem with that at all! Shall the world wait until that conflict is over to be able to change the definition?!

I don't see how they could possibly change the definition without it resulting in genocide in every future conflict!

These people have remained completely silent throughout atrocities caused by Islamists!

Syria 600,000 murdered

Yemen 300,000 murdered

Nigeria Boko Harem murdering Christians

Yazidi Genocide

Many other acts of mass murder including

Rohingya Genocide by Myanma Junta.

 

What do all of these have in common?
There is no possible way that they can be blamed on Jews!

[paddypower]

1 hour ago, loong said:

I don't see how they could possibly change the definition without it resulting in genocide in every future conflict!

These people have remained completely silent throughout atrocities caused by Islamists!

Syria 600,000 murdered

Yemen 300,000 murdered

Nigeria Boko Harem murdering Christians

Yazidi Genocide

Many other acts of mass murder including

Rohingya Genocide by Myanma Junta.

 

What do all of these have in common?
There is no possible way that they can be blamed on Jews!

impressive research. but your logic is flawed and worse - you do not propose a solution - just attack the Irish led attempt to deal with ALL attrocities. Muslims have been killing Muslims, like for ever, due to the major division in Islam, between Shiite and Sunni followers. Assad is a Shiite. so they killed 600,000 'non-believers' nothing to do with Ireland or 'these other people' you want to target. Roghingya are Muslim and were massacred  by the junta representing extremest Buddhists 

[Purdey]

18 hours ago, Donga said:

Deliberate and sustained mass killing of innocents, what's yours?

How do you reconcile IDF repeatedly directing residents to move out of harms way, after Hamas have deliberately placed them there?

I asked how they interpreted as in what did they say 

[Donga]

7 hours ago, Purdey said:

I asked how they interpreted as in what did they say 

Apologies, as I clearly misread your post.

[JonnyF]

The Irish are great people.

 

They deserve much better. 

[Bkk Brian]

19 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

The Irish are great people.

 

They deserve much better. 

Agree, unfortunately they've just been taken on the wrong side of history.

 

When Hamas welcomes something you do, you know you are on the WRONG side of history!

[pacovl46]

On 12/13/2024 at 1:25 PM, Bkk Brian said:

Can they? Isn't that for the ICJ to decide if it will change the goal posts midway through the trial?

 

Considering ICJ “didn't decide claim of genocide was plausible” nor “that there's a plausible case of genocide” I bet South Africa and Ireland are scratching round for straws to clutch

The keywords in my previous post are "not retroactive"....

[pacovl46]

14 hours ago, loong said:

I don't see how they could possibly change the definition without it resulting in genocide in every future conflict!

These people have remained completely silent throughout atrocities caused by Islamists!

Syria 600,000 murdered

Yemen 300,000 murdered

Nigeria Boko Harem murdering Christians

Yazidi Genocide

Many other acts of mass murder including

Rohingya Genocide by Myanma Junta.

 

What do all of these have in common?
There is no possible way that they can be blamed on Jews!

Well, I guess the difference between the genocides you have listed and what's going on in Gaza is that your list were all pretty much one-time events, while the one in Gaza has been continuously ongoing for at least a decade. So what were "these people" supposed to do about them after the fact? 

[Bkk Brian]

20 minutes ago, pacovl46 said:

Well, I guess the difference between the genocides you have listed and what's going on in Gaza is that your list were all pretty much one-time events, while the one in Gaza has been continuously ongoing for at least a decade. So what were "these people" supposed to do about them after the fact? 

What one in Gaza? Can you provide a link to this Genocide in Gaza going on for the last 10 years? 

[MalcolmB]

On 12/13/2024 at 3:02 PM, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   Ireland has a long history of Anti-Semitism which stems from their Roman Catholic heritage 

Just about any place that has Jews has a history of antisemitism

They just don’t get along with others, many of them don’t even like each other.

[Nick Carter icp]

21 minutes ago, MalcolmB said:

Just about any place that has Jews has a history of antisemitism

They just don’t get along with others, many of them don’t even like each other.

 

   Its to do with Ireland's religious persuasion 

[Bkk Brian]

22 minutes ago, MalcolmB said:

Just about any place that has Jews has a history of antisemitism

They just don’t get along with others, many of them don’t even like each other.

Do other religions like each other such as Muslims? Do yourself a little research.

 

How about Christians? You are in an Ireland topic, what Christian problems have there been in Ireland between themselves?

 

What wars have Jews fought among themselves the same as Muslims and Christians?

 

For your opening gambit you claim where ever they go there is antisemitism. Really? Quite a few in Phuket actually, never witnessed any antisemitism. 

[MalcolmB]

1 minute ago, Bkk Brian said:

Quite a few in Phuket actually, never witnessed any antisemitism. 

I have.

[Bkk Brian]

2 minutes ago, MalcolmB said:

I have.

Can you describe the incidents and where they were in Phuket, I have lived here for 18 years and know a few Jews. How many do you know?

[MalcolmB]

Quite common for hotels and businesses around Thailand to openly refuse Israelis in the past.

Phuket is about 30% Muslim. They see what the Jews are doing in Gaza and are horrified by it.