US Economy Races Ahead While UK Struggles to Keep Pace

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Ah the lazy work shy migrants, who we are told are living on benefits and being accommodated in five star hotels are driving up house prices.

I didn't suggest they were either workshy or their living quarters were driving house prices up, that was all you.

[Chomper Higgot]

28 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I didn't suggest they were either workshy or their living quarters were driving house prices up, that was all you.

It’s a frequent argument made in this forum by those keen to scapegoat migrants.

[Purdey]

On 3/4/2025 at 7:04 AM, Social Media said:

this means that a US-based manager could afford to purchase 809 Big Macs per month at local prices, compared to just 647 for a UK manager.

Big Macs should be the new currency. 

[Cameroni]

"Since the end of 2019, the statistics are quite striking. GDP in Germany has been flat over that period while the rest of the euro area has grown by 5%, and the US has grown 11%"

 

 

https://www.goldmansachs.com/insights/articles/when-will-the-german-economy-bounce-back

 

Who'd have thought that decades of redistributing the wealth of British, German, French taxpayers to Poland, Czechia etc would result in the GDP of the former going down whilst that of the East Europeans goes up? 

 

What a wholly unpredictable and unexpected turn of events, lol.

 

Fact is the political class in Britain, Germany, France etc has failed and mismanaged the countries they were supposed to look after.

 

What all these countries need is someone like Trump, who roots out the astronomical government waste. Can you imagine the waste in the EU and these European countries? 

 

The infrastructure of Britain and West Germany is crumbling. Women are not having children to maintain population growth. The writing is on the wall, in a few years these economies will disintegrate.

 

It's no consolation the problem is even worse in South Korea which is heading to halve its population in 50 years which of course implies the economic implosion of S Korea.

[Chomper Higgot]

31 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

"Since the end of 2019, the statistics are quite striking. GDP in Germany has been flat over that period while the rest of the euro area has grown by 5%, and the US has grown 11%"

 

 

https://www.goldmansachs.com/insights/articles/when-will-the-german-economy-bounce-back

 

Who'd have thought that decades of redistributing the wealth of British, German, French taxpayers to Poland, Czechia etc would result in the GDP of the former going down whilst that of the East Europeans goes up? 

 

What a wholly unpredictable and unexpected turn of events, lol.

 

Fact is the political class in Britain, Germany, France etc has failed and mismanaged the countries they were supposed to look after.

 

What all these countries need is someone like Trump, who roots out the astronomical government waste. Can you imagine the waste in the EU and these European countries? 

 

The infrastructure of Britain and West Germany is crumbling. Women are not having children to maintain population growth. The writing is on the wall, in a few years these economies will disintegrate.

 

It's no consolation the problem is even worse in South Korea which is heading to halve its population in 50 years which of course implies the economic implosion of S Korea.

The wealth of the UK has indeed been redistributed, from the working class and middle class to the rich.

 

Who’d have thought a war impact in the supply of energy to the German economy would effect economic growth?

While at the same time Biden was spending $Billions on infrastructure projects boosting the U.S. economy.

 

I look forward to seeing the actual outcome of Trump ‘rooting out waste’ the early signs aren’t looking good.

 

 

 

[candide]

On 3/4/2025 at 9:36 AM, atpeace said:

Chomper just makes up things and calls them facts.  Does he really think that GDP tells us nothing about the middle class? He probably does which is idiotic but whatever and he isn't going to stop posting rubbish.  The gap is widening between the rich and the middle class would be an accurate statement but Chomper isn't a big fan of accuracy. 

 

The median income of middle-class households in 2020 was 50% greater than in 1970 ($90,131 vs. $59,934), as measured in 2020 dollars.

Source: Pew Research Center

Why 1970?

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

It’s a frequent argument made in this forum by those keen to scapegoat migrants.

Not by me!

[candide]

4 hours ago, impulse said:

 

This coming from the same guys who said inflation isn't Biden's fault, it's happening all over the world.  Wouldn't that mean that the UK middle class is also being hollowed out, and they're not making the additional coin to compensate, like the Yanks? 

 

You can't have it both ways.  As much as the lefties try.

 

I've been hearing lately that the EU economy today is only 60% of the US economy, and when the EU was formed, they were about equal.  I don't claim to know what numbers they're referring to exactly since EU countries have come and gone since its inception.  But it sure seems to reflect that bad policy is dragging the EU down.

 

Luckily, UK left the EU! 

 

Oh wait! 😆

 

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn02784/

 

PS. Note the stellar GDP performance under Biden, compared to other G7 countries.

[BritManToo]

35 minutes ago, candide said:

Why 1970?

That's as far back as most of us can remember (as working adults in the UK).

 

Back then I could afford a house in the UK but almost no luxury items.

Now I can afford many luxury items but not a house in the UK.

[xylophone]

On 3/4/2025 at 10:29 AM, TedG said:

This is Joe Biden’s legacy.  

This is Joe Biden's legacy........

 

"Compare the US with other big Western economies. At the end of 2024, America’s economy was 12.1% bigger than it was at the end of 2019, on the eve of the pandemic. Over the same period Canada grew 7.7%, France 4% and the UK 3.2%. Germany shrank 0.1%.

 

That does not look like a country which is being ripped off. In fact, largely under Joe Biden, America thrived".

[impulse]

4 minutes ago, candide said:

PS. Note the stellar GDP performance under Biden, compared to other G7 countries.

 

How much of that stellar GDP performance came from tax money being thrown against the wall to see what sticks? 

 

You may recall that Biden also added the national debt at twice the rate that Trump did.  (Barring that one year when Covid struck)  What you're describing there is a sugar rush.  It wasn't organic growth. It was gub'ment spending.  With little or no long term benefit.  But paying it off will take a long term.

 

[Cameroni]

48 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

The wealth of the UK has indeed been redistributed, from the working class and middle class to the rich.

 

Who’d have thought a war impact in the supply of energy to the German economy would effect economic growth?

While at the same time Biden was spending $Billions on infrastructure projects boosting the U.S. economy.

 

I look forward to seeing the actual outcome of Trump ‘rooting out waste’ the early signs aren’t looking good.

 

 

 

 

The war did not impact the German supply of energy at the slightest. Even as bombs were flying Russia kept supplying Germany. It was the idiotic decisions of German politicians to cut off their own nose to spite their face which led to the gigantic rise in oil prices. A wholly self-inflicted debacle.

 

The wealth in the UK has not been redistributed from the working class to the rich, rather from the future generations, now the young Gen Z, to the middle aged and elderly, who in their day decided to live on credit - from their grandchildren. These young people are now paying the price in the UK for the generous pensions paid to their grandparents and parents.

 

The wealth was also redistributed from males to females, as there is now a wage gap with women on top and men at the lower end.

 

All thanks to the leftie politicians who ruined all our countries.

[impulse]

8 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Back then I could afford a house in the UK but almost no luxury items.

But now I can afford many luxury items but not a house in the UK.

 

I think that's the modern equivalent of Bread and Circuses.  We're watching the big screen and the little screen and that's distracting from the horrible decline of the quality of real life.  Where you can't even walk down some of what used to be the most cherished parts of many cities.  That's definitely true in the US, and seems to be the case across the pond.

 

[candide]

15 minutes ago, impulse said:

 

How much of that stellar GDP performance came from tax money being thrown against the wall to see what sticks? 

 

You may recall that Biden also added the national debt at twice the rate that Trump did.  (Barring that one year when Covid struck)  What you're describing there is a sugar rush.  It wasn't organic growth. It was gub'ment spending.  With little or no long term benefit.  But paying it off will take a long term.

 

Other countries also significantly increased debt (except Germany), and the impact of the Covid crisis did not stop in January 2021.....

[Chomper Higgot]

48 minutes ago, candide said:

Why 1970?

Because the late 1970’s is the inflection point at which neoliberalism and trickle down economics were introduced and after which wealth inequality accelerated.

[atpeace]

48 minutes ago, candide said:

Why 1970?

Good question.  Not sure but you could use 1980 and the same would apply and would been be over a shorter time period.  The 1970s with the rampant inflation was not  great period for the middle class.

[Chomper Higgot]

24 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

The war did not impact the German supply of energy at the slightest. Even as bombs were flying Russia kept supplying Germany. It was the idiotic decisions of German politicians to cut off their own nose to spite their face which led to the gigantic rise in oil prices. A wholly self-inflicted debacle.

 

The wealth in the UK has not been redistributed from the working class to the rich, rather from the future generations, now the young Gen Z, to the middle aged and elderly, who in their day decided to live on credit - from their grandchildren. These young people are now paying the price in the UK for the generous pensions paid to their grandparents and parents.

 

The wealth was also redistributed from males to females, as there is now a wage gap with women on top and men at the lower end.

 

All thanks to the leftie politicians who ruined all our countries.

“The wealth in the UK has not been redistributed from the working class to the rich, rather from the future generations, now the young Gen Z, to the middle aged and elderly, who in their day decided to live on credit - from their grandchildren.”

 

Let me give you a couple of examples:

 

Work place pensions that provided decent salaries in old age, stripped out for the benefit of shareholders profits.

 

Job security replaced with the insecure zero hour contracts, for the benefit of shareholder holder profits.

 

And a bonus one relating to those elderly:

 

Equity release, the transfer of people’s lifetime investment into the hands of financial institutions, with obvious benefits to shareholder profits.

 

The wealth is not trickling down and never has done.

 

[atpeace]

2 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Because the late 1970’s is the inflection point at which neoliberalism and trickle down economics were introduced and after which wealth inequality accelerated.

We weren't discussing income disparity as I addressed with you in an earlier post.  The post was in to regards to middle class income growth. 

 

Think we all get that the gap is growing between the rich and basically everyone else but you keep using this argument repeatedly out of context.  Is it that important to you to be right that you create arguments that never existed?

 

Darn, forgot you got me again 🙂 I replied to your silly post.  Another win for the Chomper 😞

[Chomper Higgot]

8 minutes ago, atpeace said:

Good question.  Not sure but you could use 1980 and the same would apply and would been be over a shorter time period.  The 1970s with the rampant inflation was not  great period for the middle class.

It was great time for those who had mortgages, as wages rises deflated the debt.

[atpeace]

1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said:

It was great time for those who had mortgages, as wages rises deflated the debt.

I agree 🙂

[candide]

14 minutes ago, atpeace said:

Good question.  Not sure but you could use 1980 and the same would apply and would been be over a shorter time period.  The 1970s with the rampant inflation was not  great period for the middle class.

The ultraliberal economic policies have been introduced during the 80's under Raegan. Not sure it had no impact.

[Chomper Higgot]

12 minutes ago, atpeace said:

We weren't discussing income disparity as I addressed with you in an earlier post.  The post was in to regards to middle class income growth. 

 

Think we all get that the gap is growing between the rich and basically everyone else but you keep using this argument repeatedly out of context.  Is it that important to you to be right that you create arguments that never existed?

 

Darn, forgot you got me again 🙂 I replied to your silly post.  Another win for the Chomper 😞

I’m not using it out of context.

 

Perhaps you don’t understand the impact wealth distribution (not income disparity) is having on both UK and US society.

Here’s an example:

 

Millions of people on low incomes spend only on essentials, this low economic activity restricts economic growth.

 

A small number of hugely wealthy individuals are buying assets, forcing up asset prices - farm land being a recently topical example.

High asset prices are not producing wealth, they are removing money from actively being used on the economy, thereby restricting growth.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[atpeace]

2 minutes ago, candide said:

The ultraliberal economic policies have been introduced during the 80's under Raegan. Not sure it had no impact.

Not sure but they seemed to work during the 1980s.  So many variables and that was a good decade for me 🙂

[BritManToo]

24 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

“The wealth in the UK has not been redistributed from the working class to the rich, rather from the future generations, now the young Gen Z, to the middle aged and elderly, who in their day decided to live on credit - from their grandchildren.”

 

Let me give you a couple of examples:

 

Work place pensions that provided decent salaries in old age, stripped out for the benefit of shareholders profits.

 

Job security replaced with the insecure zero hour contracts, for the benefit of shareholder holder profits.

 

And a bonus one relating to those elderly:

 

Equity release, the transfer of people’s lifetime investment into the hands of financial institutions, with obvious benefits to shareholder profits.

 

The wealth is not trickling down and never has done.

 

You forgot,

Divorce laws stripping assets from the nuclear family, and awarding it to women who only  spend.

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

You forgot,

Divorce laws stripping assets from the nuclear family, and awarding it to women who only  spend.

I feel your pain Bro, but I doubt it hit the national GDP numbers.

 

[BritManToo]

6 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

I feel your pain Bro, but I doubt it hit the national GDP numbers.

 

Didn't affect me, but my Brit kids will inherit nothing.

[Chomper Higgot]

3 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Didn't affect me, but my Brit kids will inherit nothing.

I’m not at all convinced inheriting does anyone any good.

 

 

[nauseus]

On 3/4/2025 at 7:04 AM, Social Media said:

 

New analysis has revealed the stark contrast in economic performance between the United States and the United Kingdom since the 2007 financial crisis, highlighting a widening wealth gap driven by investment levels, tax policies, and economic strategy. While the US economy has flourished under successive administrations, the UK has faltered, weighed down by infrastructure failures, a heavy tax burden, and the fallout from Brexit.

 

Since 2007, income per capita in the US has surged by 72%, while in the UK, it has actually declined by 2% in dollar terms. According to data from New World Wealth, GDP per capita in America now stands at $82,800 (£65,767), compared to $49,500 in Britain. This marks a dramatic reversal from 2007 when the UK’s income per capita was higher than that of the US.

 

 

Though GDP per capita is not a flawless measure of individual prosperity, wage disparities between the two nations further illustrate the economic gap. For instance, a McDonald’s manager in the UK earns an average of £32,649 ($41,074), while their American counterpart makes $55,300. In practical terms, this means that a US-based manager could afford to purchase 809 Big Macs per month at local prices, compared to just 647 for a UK manager.

 

The financial divergence is also evident in the stock markets. The S&P 500, the main US stock index, has soared by 306% since 2007, reflecting the dominance of American tech giants such as Apple and Google. Meanwhile, London’s FTSE 100 has declined by over 20% in dollar terms. The UK has also underperformed on a global scale, with average worldwide income increasing by more than 50% since 2007, while Britain's relative standing has weakened considerably.

 

Part of the explanation lies in the sharp decline of the British pound, which has lost more than a third of its value against the dollar over the past 17 years. However, economists argue that deeper structural issues are to blame.

 

Maxwell Marlow, director of research and education at the Adam Smith Institute, attributes the UK’s economic stagnation to three main factors: a lack of capital investment, planning and infrastructure failures, and high taxation. He explains that scaling up businesses from medium to large size is particularly difficult in the UK due to restrictive capital programmes. “The annual investment allowance is capped at £1 million, while enterprise investment schemes cut off just before a company reaches medium size,” he noted.

 

Marlow also criticized Britain’s complex and restrictive planning system, which he argues stifles development and innovation. “Our sclerotic planning regime makes it incredibly difficult to build without navigating through dozens, if not hundreds, of bureaucratic hoops,” he said. The consequences of this, he added, are evident in rising industrial energy prices as the UK pushes toward sustainability without adequate grid upgrades.

 

Taxation is another key issue. Corporation tax was raised to 25% in 2021, a move Marlow claims was driven by political appeal rather than economic logic. “We rank 30th out of 38 countries globally for tax competitiveness, with high property taxes, complex business levies, and high consumption taxes all lowering the standard of living,” he added.

 

Britain’s sluggish productivity growth has further compounded the problem. Before 2008, productivity doubled over a 35-year span. However, in the 15 years since, it has increased by just 5%.

 

Nick Ridpath, a research economist at the Institute for Fiscal Studies, emphasized the importance of investment in driving economic growth. “Investment can boost productivity—when a car factory buys a new machine, the same workforce can produce more cars in the same amount of time,” he explained. But the UK has persistently lagged behind comparable nations such as France and Germany in investment levels, and the financial crisis further curbed both private and public sector spending.

 

Ridpath also pointed to Brexit as a significant drag on the UK economy. “One key component of GDP is exports,” he said. “By increasing trade barriers between Britain and the EU, Brexit raised the costs of selling goods to the UK’s largest trading partner. This, in turn, has reduced exports and overall economic output.”

 

While the US continues to forge ahead, leveraging its investment in technology, business-friendly policies, and economic resilience, Britain faces the challenge of reversing its relative decline. Without addressing its deep-seated economic weaknesses, the UK risks falling further behind on the global stage.

 

Based on a report by The Sunday Times  2025-03-04

 

 

 

The USA has also been leader with historically low interest rates and high amounts of money printing. Forging ahead into an abyss.

[Cameroni]

36 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

“The wealth in the UK has not been redistributed from the working class to the rich, rather from the future generations, now the young Gen Z, to the middle aged and elderly, who in their day decided to live on credit - from their grandchildren.”

 

Let me give you a couple of examples:

 

Work place pensions that provided decent salaries in old age, stripped out for the benefit of shareholders profits.

 

Job security replaced with the insecure zero hour contracts, for the benefit of shareholder holder profits.

 

And a bonus one relating to those elderly:

 

Equity release, the transfer of people’s lifetime investment into the hands of financial institutions, with obvious benefits to shareholder profits.

 

The wealth is not trickling down and never has done.

 

 

We've gone from jobs for life with generous company pensions to the gig economy where today's generation has to juggle 2 or 3 jobs and get new ones every year, due to systemic changes, let me give you some examples:

 

1. Massive competition from China

 

2. Massive oversupply of university educated workers

 

3.Inflation

 

However, when it came to government policy and the provision of generous pensions it was decided by politicians to live at the expense of the younger generations for the benefit of the current middle aged and elderly population. Now the young have to pay for the big buffet of pensions their parents pocketed.

 

Wealth DOES trickle down, people have become increasingly well off in the working class. However, not if it is redistributed at will by politicians to old age pensioners and Eastern Europe.

 

Who do you think is the biggest shareholder? Pension funds for the elderly.

 

[atpeace]

34 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

I’m not using it out of context.

 

Perhaps you don’t understand the impact wealth distribution (not income disparity) is having on both UK and US society.

Here’s an example:

 

Millions of people on low incomes spend only on essentials, this low economic activity restricts economic growth.

 

A small number of hugely wealthy individuals are buying assets, forcing up asset prices - farm land being a recently topical example.

High asset prices are not producing wealth, they are removing money from actively being used on the economy, thereby restricting growth.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Duh, your point? I never said the above isn't true.  Do you actually read posts or just reply to stories in your own head.

 

Why are you stating that wealth disparity isn't an issue?  Get where I'm going with that? 555