America has emerged....as an international laughingstock

[placeholder]

1 minute ago, Cameroni said:

 

MFN is already gone. It's no more. The MFN principle, which requires each member of the World Trade Organization to apply the same tariff rates for all its WTO trading partners (unless a free trade agreement is in force) is now no longer followed by the USA. Retaliation from many US trading partners would, in effect, mean the end of the MFN principle and mark the beginning of prolonged bilateral negotiations for country-specific tariff rates and implementation schemes. This is what we are seeing now.

 

They are violating MFN rules as retaliation. Why wouldn't they follow the rules with countries that abide by them?

[Cameroni]

22 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Why would globalism end just because the USA raises the drawbridge? Trump's program isn't even popular in the USA. What makes you think other countries would adopt it?

 

 

You see, it's not just the US. As you previously said yourself, China has reduced its share of exports from 35% to19%, in fact most developed countries are gettting more and more uneasy with having to depend on a supply chain that is controlled by China, or even other countries. After Covid, countries realise the importance of self sufficiency and manufacturing. No doubt the Covid experience has moulded Trump's thinking on the manufacturing problem.

 

So it's not just a US drive, it's a global drive towards more nationalist, self-sufficient economies.

 

24 minutes ago, placeholder said:

s the dollar weakens and people lose faith in it because of U.S.unstable economic management, other countries simply will begin to use currencies from a more stable economy. The Euro is a good candidate. But if it happens it will happen gradually over time.

 

There are no questions whatsoever about the stability of the US economy, it is still the most stable and strongest economy in the world, which is why even if the dollar weakens, trust in the Dollar will continue. No banker in their right mind will want to get Chinese, Japanese or European currency instead of US dollars.

[placeholder]

7 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

This was probably not in Trump's mind at all, however, if you think about it, if the US gets used to paying fair prices for products, rather than ludicrously low prices, that will mean that the market for these ultra-low priced products will not be as big anymore. To compete China et al may need to focus on quality rather than price. The end result could be a reduction in the merciless epxloitation of factory workers in Asia.

How do consumers behave in other countries that had high tariff walls after they came tumbling down. Do you think that they got used to paying a fair price and wouldn't pay a lower one if they had the opportunity? This is just plain nuts.

EDIT: I should edit this to note that when an another country declares economic war on them, that would provide an incentive not to always pay the cheapest price.

[Cameroni]

1 minute ago, placeholder said:

How do consumers behave in other countries that had high tariff walls after they came tumbling down. Do you think that they got used to paying a fair price and wouldn't pay a lower one if they had the opportunity? This is just plain nuts.

 

Well, consumers in the US would not get the opportunity to pay lower prices, US made products will be more expensive, and cheaper imports will be impaired with tariffs, therefore more expensive still.

 

The US consumer, whether he likes it or not, will have to pay higher prices.

 

This could have very beneficial effects for workers in Asia.

[placeholder]

4 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

You see, it's not just the US. As you previously said yourself, China has reduced its share of exports from 35% to19%, in fact most developed countries are gettting more and more uneasy with having to depend on a supply chain that is controlled by China, or even other countries. After Covid, countries realise the importance of self sufficiency and manufacturing. No doubt the Covid experience has moulded Trump's thinking on the manufacturing problem.

 

So it's not just a US drive, it's a global drive towards more nationalist, self-sufficient economies.

 

 

There are no questions whatsoever about the stability of the US economy, it is still the most stable and strongest economy in the world, which is why even if the dollar weakens, trust in the Dollar will continue. No banker in their right mind will want to get Chinese, Japanese or European currency instead of US dollars.

You just wrote about other countries forming economic alliances. These alliances are designed to reduce barriers not raise them

As for China reducing it's share of exports, this is what always happens as a nation leaves developing status and becomes more advanced. It's got nothing to do with doing it on purpose.

But it is true that supply line fragility is a factor in where manufacturers are located. Which is why the Mexican economy has flourished.

 

In fact there are plenty of questions about US economic instability. If there weren't why would bond buyers be buying less from the US and more from countries like Japan and Germany.

[placeholder]

5 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

Well, consumers in the US would not get the opportunity to pay lower prices, US made products will be more expensive, and cheaper imports will be impaired with tariffs, therefore more expensive still.

 

The US consumer, whether he likes it or not, will have to pay higher prices.

 

This could have very beneficial effects for workers in Asia.

"Well, consumers in the US would not get the opportunity to pay lower prices,"

"The US consumer, whether he likes it or not, will have to pay higher prices."

So Trump is planning a coup?

 

And what would the beneficial effects for workers in Asia be?

[billd766]

23 hours ago, Tug said:

You are mistaken he got 400 million+ a bunch of rentals from his dad not to mention several bailouts from his dad and when Mr trump the convicted felon sex offender stops sucking up to (I suspect your leader) putin and starts acting like an American president I might have a bit more respect I doubt it though.

The office of the president is generally respected. The occupant of that office however has to earn and deserve respect.

 

Trump does neither.

 

Also, who does Camaroni think he is. Respect is a 2 way function, and Camaroni has certainly shown NO respect at all for ex President Biden.

[Cameroni]

13 minutes ago, placeholder said:

ou just wrote about other countries forming economic alliances. These alliances are designed to reduce barriers not raise them

 

But they do raise them, the EU lowered barriers internally, but raised tariffs against China.

 

15 minutes ago, placeholder said:

If there weren't why would bond buyers be buying less from the US and more from countries like Japan and Germany.

 

They don't. The US has the biggest bond market in the world. Both private and government.

 

https://www.weforum.org/stories/2023/04/ranked-the-largest-bond-markets-in-the-world/

13 minutes ago, placeholder said:

And what would the beneficial effects for workers in Asia be?

 

As the focus fades from ultra-cheap prodcuts, but consumers in places like the US are used to paying higher prices, and quality becomes more important, the hunger wages in Asia would lose their rationale.

[placeholder]

28 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

But they do raise them, the EU lowered barriers internally, but raised tariffs against China.

 

 

They don't. The US has the biggest bond market in the world. Both private and government.

 

https://www.weforum.org/stories/2023/04/ranked-the-largest-bond-markets-in-the-world/

 

As the focus fades from ultra-cheap prodcuts, but consumers in places like the US are used to paying higher prices, and quality becomes more important, the hunger wages in Asia would lose their rationale.

They raised tariffs on specific items (cars) because they claimed China violated WTO rules. The claim will be adjudicated. So as yet to be determined whether the EU has violated the rules

 

Treasury Market’s ‘New World Order’ Brings Fear of the Long Bond

https://archive.ph/qMLmY

 

The US 10-Year Treasury Yield Has Spiked: What It All Means for Investors
Source Tradingkey
Apr 29, 2025 08:34

TradingKey - After President Trump’s “Liberation Day” trade tariffs announcement, one of the weirdest things to happen in market was that bond yields actually rose significantly.

The US 10-Year Treasury Yield briefly surged past 4.5% on April 9, 2025, marking its highest level since February—and a dramatic jump from just 3.9% on April 4, barely a week earlier and right after Liberation Day.

This isn't just market noise. It's one of the sharpest yield spikes in recent memory, and it's sending shockwaves through Wall Street.

https://www.mitrade.com/insights/news/live-news/article-6-787026-20250429

 

Treasury Market’s ‘New World Order’ Brings Fear of the Long Bond

https://archive.ph/qMLmY

 

Why do you think tariffs will bring higher quality. You're confusing higher prices with higher quality. Nations that adopt high tariff barriers usually offer goods with lower quality since they no longer have to compete. As for hunger wages losing their rationale...because wages somehow would be exempted from market forces?

[rough diamond]

41 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

To compete China et al may need to focus on quality rather than price. The end result could be a reduction in the merciless epxloitation of factory workers in Asia.

It has a lot to do with Trump's policies because if prodcuts will be made in the US they will be far more expensive and consumers will have to pay higher prices, whether they like it or not

So you want US customers to buy products that;

"will be far more expensive and consumers will have to pay higher prices, whether they like it or not!" 

Those are your words!

Sounds like a guaranteed vote winner to the MAGAmaniacs only!

[Digitalbanana]

23 hours ago, Cameroni said:

Obviously trade deals don't conclude within 3 days, lol.  It's not K-drama.

 

But negotiations are underway,.

Its been over 3 weeks since liberation day. .... haulage companies and shop shelves to empty in a similar time ahead from now.

[3NUMBAS]

He’s simply a senile old fart ,there are many more in the years ahead to trash America 

[rough diamond]

36 minutes ago, billd766 said:

Camaroni has certainly shown NO respect at all for ex President Biden.

Or for the truth or facts!

[Hummin]

1 hour ago, Cameroni said:

 

Well, they clearly should have stayed with the father then..

 

Women initiate 75% of divorces. 

So many dry comedians on this site, unbelievable 

[Cameroni]

28 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Treasury Market’s ‘New World Order’ Brings Fear of the Long Bond

https://archive.ph/qMLmY

 

If you read that article it's just a pricing issue, nothing to do with the US economy being on shaky grounds.

 

"It’s not as if investors are fleeing Treasuries wholesale. JPMorgan Asset Management sees them as a better bet than European government bonds. And this month’s 30-year Treasury auction showed that there’s appetite for the maturity — at the right price. The result allayed fears of a buyers’ strike, and long-bond yields have eased back from their recent peak."

 

30 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Why do you think tariffs will bring higher quality

 

I've seen the US made maglite and the Chinese torch. The US maglite is more expensive, but a far higher quality product too.

[placeholder]

3 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

If you read that article it's just a pricing issue, nothing to do with the US economy being on shaky grounds.

 

"It’s not as if investors are fleeing Treasuries wholesale. JPMorgan Asset Management sees them as a better bet than European government bonds. And this month’s 30-year Treasury auction showed that there’s appetite for the maturity — at the right price. The result allayed fears of a buyers’ strike, and long-bond yields have eased back from their recent peak."

 

 

I've seen the US made maglite and the Chinese torch. The US maglite is more expensive, but a far higher quality product too.

If the Treasury Dept has to offer higher yields, that means US bonds are on shaky grounds. And I notice you don't have an answer as to why bond rates went up as investors cash out of stocks.

[bubblegum]

2 minutes ago, placeholder said:

If the Treasury Dept has to offer higher yields, that means US bonds are on shaky grounds. And I notice you don't have an answer as to why bond rates went up as investors cash out of stocks.

Better go Swiss Francs.

[jesimps]

On 4/28/2025 at 12:57 PM, Will B Good said:

Wow......The Telegraph no less!!!!

 

 

Used to be a good paper, now it just sits on the fence.

[billd766]

23 hours ago, Screaming said:

There was in interesting article today in the Bangkok Post describing how Thailand might enter a recession as early as the 2nd quarter:

https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/general/3012727/coping-with-a-sluggish-outlook

 

It was mentioned in this article that one reason for a potential recession was the new tariffs imposed on Thailand for its unfair trade policies against the United States. It was never mentioned in this article that anyone was laughing at the U.S. but hoped that Thailand would meet with U.S. officials to negotiate a fair trade agreement. The only people who are laughing at President Trump are those who have feeble minds.

Usual Trump supporter bluster.

 

Might, perhaps, maybe, but little substance.

 

A bit like the "I have done deals with over 200 countries", but I won't tell you which countries.

[Yagoda]

Do the Houthis consider the USA a laughingstock?

[Cameroni]

19 minutes ago, placeholder said:

If the Treasury Dept has to offer higher yields, that means US bonds are on shaky grounds. And I notice you don't have an answer as to why bond rates went up as investors cash out of stocks.

 

Not at all, the price is just higher because of a little nervousness due to tariffs. But the underlying strength of the US economy is sound und reliable.

[placeholder]

4 minutes ago, Yagoda said:

Do the Houthis consider the USA a laughingstock?

Actually China might be laughing since the US is withdrawing resources from the Asia Pacific in order to attack the Houthis.

[placeholder]

1 minute ago, Cameroni said:

 

Not at all, the price is just higher because of a little nervousness due to tariffs. But the underlying strength of the US economy is sound und reliable.

No. Usually when investors cash out of stocks, t bills fall because they want to park them somewhere safe.

In addition, when countries impose tariffs their currency tends to rise in value in the short term. If the currency rises in value that means the T bills become more valuable and therefore the interest rate on them falls.

 

[Cameroni]

15 minutes ago, placeholder said:

No. Usually when investors cash out of stocks, t bills fall because they want to park them somewhere safe.

In addition, when countries impose tariffs their currency tends to rise in value in the short term. If the currency rises in value that means the T bills become more valuable and therefore the interest rate on them falls.

 

There was an unusual shock to the bond market when Germany announced it would embark on a massive debt programme to finance rearmament. That set off the higher yields for Bonds. The tariffs added uncertainty in global trade. It has nothing to do with problem with the  US economy itself. The US economy is the strongest and richest in the world. Safe as houses.

[Yagoda]

14 minutes ago, placeholder said:

Actually China might be laughing since the US is withdrawing resources from the Asia Pacific in order to attack the Houthis.

Well thats similar to the anti American China shilling I see, but one could look at it as we are practicing.

[BLMFem]

25 minutes ago, Yagoda said:

Do the Houthis consider the USA a laughingstock?

Don't know. Let me open the Signal app and see what "OPSEC" says about it.

[Mavideol]

oh man, he didn't like the polls results, he's having a kids tantrum again and runt & name calling to anyone that conducts polls, what an egoistic senile old man

Trump Melts Down Over Plummeting Popularity, Says Pollsters Are ‘Criminals’

 

https://au.news.yahoo.com/trump-melts-down-over-plummeting-140111338.html

[rough diamond]

1 hour ago, 3NUMBAS said:

He’s simply a senile old fart ,there are many more in the years ahead to trash America 

Unfortunately!

I am not anti USA.

I am however anti TRUMP wrt his actions around the world.

[RayC]

1 hour ago, Cameroni said:

 

MFN is already gone. It's no more. The MFN principle, which requires each member of the World Trade Organization to apply the same tariff rates for all its WTO trading partners (unless a free trade agreement is in force) is now no longer followed by the USA. Retaliation from many US trading partners would, in effect, mean the end of the MFN principle and mark the beginning of prolonged bilateral negotiations for country-specific tariff rates and implementation schemes. This is what we are seeing now.

 

Another example of misplaced arrogance. The US may have decided to opt-out from the MFN, the remainder of the world has not and need not.

 

1 hour ago, Cameroni said:

 

This was probably not in Trump's mind at all, however, if you think about it, if the US gets used to paying fair prices for products, rather than ludicrously low prices, that will mean that the market for these ultra-low priced products will not be as big anymore. To compete China et al may need to focus on quality rather than price. The end result could be a reduction in the merciless epxloitation of factory workers in Asia.

 

If the manufacturing of consumer goods returns to the US en masse, it will undoubtedly lead to inflation (or wage deflation). Whether - and how much of this - the US consumer will put up with is another matter. 

 

Chinese companies may decide to focus on quality rather than price in the future, but that will have nothing to do with Trump's tariff policies.

 

1 hour ago, Cameroni said:

It has a lot to do with Trump's policies because if prodcuts will be made in the US they will be far more expensive and consumers will have to pay higher prices, whether they like it or not.

 

Unless the demand for the good is inelastic - and that is not the case for most consumer goods - all that will happen is that there will be fewer goods sold and, in all probability, a recession will occur.

 

1 hour ago, Cameroni said:

I would suspect that the US will tie keeping the Dollar as reserve currency and permission to devalue the dollar to trade negotiations.

Other nations would get better access to the US market if they agree to these terms,

 

A threat that I suspect that China, the EU and, perhaps, the rest of the G7 would find unacceptable and refuse to agree to.

 

1 hour ago, Cameroni said:

 

and after all the US is still the richest and strongest economy in the world, so the dollar would be inherently more trustworthy than the decrepit Euro Zone Euro, the even more decrepit Yen or the Chinese fraud currency.

 

 

Trump's actions undermine the US economy and the dollar's status as a stable, trustworthy currency. I'm not sure that the ECB would welcome the Euro becoming the reserve currency but maybe it would have little choice but to accept the role. Who knows, maybe things will edge back towards the Gold Standard or maybe, crypto really is the way forwards?

[placeholder]

25 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

There was an unusual shock to the bond market when Germany announced it would embark on a massive debt programme to finance rearmament. That set off the higher yields for Bonds. The tariffs added uncertainty in global trade. It has nothing to do with problem with the  US economy itself. The US economy is the strongest and richest in the world. Safe as houses.

 German bunds offer lower interest rates than do US bonds. A lot lower. Tariffs usually lower the rate of the currency of the country imposing them This time not. You can repeat your mantra over and over again about the US economy but that doesn't mean it isn't on the decline.