Report Norway Halts Income Letters at Thai Embassy; Retirees Affected

[Khun Roberto]

I’ve been using the embassy letter for years, but no more.😞

I’ve also had the 800K in the bank since May 15 2024, so this extension I’ll change to the bank deposit method. (That deposit has been in the bank since two months before the last extension, but I did not use that method back then, so now it’s been there for 14 months, I hope that works.)

Question for the smart folks here:

Please tell me if I’m wrong.

I will file for another Non 0 extension around July 15^th 2025. Visa expires Aug 4^th. (CW)

This time I’ll use the deposit, not the Embassy letter.

If I extend on July 15^th 2025, after Oct 16^th I can withdraw 400K, (3 months after renewal, right?).

 

But… for July 15^th 2026 extension, I want to switch to >Combo method.<

When should I start sending the monthly 35,000?

Is starting July 1^st 2025 ok?

Then in July 15^th 2026 I’ll have one year of 35k/month plus 400k in the bank for over 2 years.

OK mai? 

[Presnock]

17 hours ago, jerrymahoney said:

As I remember things, not only did the US Embassy know that a large portion of the affidavits were sworn falsely (per conversation with a consul I had at an outreach) but Thai Immigration all of a sudden realized that the US Embassy made no effort at all to confirm as to the income being sworn.

When Thai IMM told the US embassy they would have to so corroborate, the US said: Forget about it:

Basically what the US embassy did was have a customer wanting such letter of income, the customer would have to swear that the information was accurate under penalty of a US law and of course pay upwards of $USD50.  If in the US and you have a document that a notary public would attest to, it is the same thing - they don't go out and check out that document, they make you sign an affidavit under penalty of law there and you pay for that service.  What actually happened and which is probably happening in other embassies too is that funds are being cut each year by many governments so the manning at embassies and consulates has dropped and thus services such as notary public at the US embassy and consulates.

[DrJack54]

@Khun RobertoRoberto what you outline is fine however I'm too conservative. 

Would prefer to satisfy both methods 

1. Funds in bank (stand alone)  +

2. Combo method. 

Then for next extension outline plan to move to combo only for the July 2026 extension. 

 

You can withdraw the 400k as you outlined however I would put that back in for the two months prior to next extension. 

Folk will tell you not required to go back up to the 800k. 

That's correct, however I like the idea of all bases covered. 

Currently I'm changing from money in bank to income method. 

In line with what I posted... I will satisfy funds in bank + 12 monthly deposits. 

Obviously check with your immigration office that they accept combo method. Few don't. 

 

 

[Patong2021]

On 5/25/2025 at 7:53 PM, Madgee said:

At least the Norwegian Embassy has given a reasonable transition period unlike the Canadian Embassy. 

A Canadian friend had no idea they had stopped the Embassy letter for proof of finances until I informed him the other week!

I hope his IO gives him some leeway when he next does his retirement extension. He has now switched to the 65k p.m. option but will be 3 months short of the required 12 months.

 

Over several months before the announcement, the Canadian government had been warning  people coming for the letters that a change was pending. The Facebook page for the embassy  on Feb 16. , made the announcement of the April 1 change.  it was not a sudden change. It is not a  consular affairs department's fault if people do not  stay up to date on regulations and procedures. As per the embassy;  No Embassy is required by Thai law to provide an income affidavit for its citizens to use for Thai visa applications. The former issuance of the affidavit in lieu of actual income evidence has been a matter of informal practice rather than regulation. Because the Embassy of Canada has no means of confirming a Canadian citizen’s income, a notarized affidavit from the Embassy of Canada has never met the requirement to prove a minimum income level for a non-immigrant long-term stay visa.

 

I expect that other governments will adopt the same position if they have not done so  yet, so people are forewarned to be prepared.

 

 

 

[DrJack54]

28 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

 

I expect that other governments will adopt the same position if they have not done so  yet, so people are forewarned to be prepared.

Fortunately it seems in this case (Norway) that folk have been given plenty of advice/notice for forward planning. 

If wanting to continue with income method then start doing the monthly transfers. OR get funds in order for "money in bank" option. 

Welcome to the club. A growing number of countries

[jerrymahoney]

The US Embassy in Bangkok/Chiang Mai still provides notary services -- just not for immigration/extension purposes:

https://th.usembassy.gov/wp-content/uploads/sites/90/factsheet-income-affidavit.pdf

[harryviking]

On 5/27/2025 at 5:33 AM, Hummin said:

You need to put 65k every month, not 30k one and for the next 105k

 

They looking at each month transfer, and not the total. 

 

It would have been so much better if they looked at the total for me, not each month. 

In case you have to leave Thailand during a one year stay and need some of that 65K to "survive" back home, just use your Thai bank ATM card back home and get whatever cash you need from that account. It is of course not the best exchange rate, but quite convenient and you can continue to transfere 65K each month. Just mentioning it....🙄

[Hummin]

13 minutes ago, harryviking said:

In case you have to leave Thailand during a one year stay and need some of that 65K to "survive" back home, just use your Thai bank ATM card back home and get whatever cash you need from that account. It is of course not the best exchange rate, but quite convenient and you can continue to transfere 65K each month. Just mentioning it....🙄

Expensive, and since they want to see all of your transactions, how do you think that will look on paper. 
 

anyone tried it? Not to forget, it is an expensive solution. Until my wife get her dual citizenship I will just let my visa terminate. 

[bkk_mike]

On 5/26/2025 at 10:15 AM, JoePai said:

Explain .....

It used to be the case that some embassies would just sign whatever income statement their citizen gave them, with no checks that it was actually true.

Thailand asked the embassies to actually check, which is when letters from the UK, for example, stopped.

But actually checking has a cost in staff time, and it's, as Norway has stated, not really the reason they have an embassy...

[watchcat]

On 5/26/2025 at 2:07 AM, JoePai said:

They want to see it in a Thai bank in order to Tax it after transferring it into Thailand 

 

Put the mony in a Thai bank an never touch it, simple.

 

[daejung]

Were it to happen with the French embassy, I would reduce my stay in Thailand by half. I would never make an 800,000 baht deposit in any Thai bank, even if I could afford it.

[TaoNow]

2 hours ago, daejung said:

Were it to happen with the French embassy, I would reduce my stay in Thailand by half. I would never make an 800,000 baht deposit in any Thai bank, even if I could afford it.

 

 

Then it would appear that you are not a legitimate retiree in Thailand.   

 

People who choose Thailand to end their life in should be willing to post a "bond" of 21,000 euro to show the honesty of their intentions and ability to be financially independent of the state.

[Rob Browder]

On 5/27/2025 at 11:51 AM, jerrymahoney said:

NB the 65K+ baht monthly and 800K baht yearly required for retirement extensions is the same going back to at least JAN 2008.

Changes since include:

1) Not being able to show the 65K as "total income" - vs "income transferred to Thailand" - when the embassy-letters stop for your country. 

2) The change from 800K in the bank + 2 months living expenses to needing to show 800K in the bank for 5 months + early-submission time + 400K you can never use.

 

No "grandfathering" was permitted for either of these changes - a departure from their previous policy of not changing the requirements for those already established/retired here.

 

 

[Rob Browder]

On 5/27/2025 at 1:29 PM, ChicagoExpat said:

It's been interesting to watch the embassies slowly begin to push back against all the Thai bureaucratic nonsense.  The U.S. stopped income letters in 2019, and a bunch of other stupid crap that some random Thai official mandated that the Embassy should waste time on.

 

I hope they go after the marriage affidavit next and refuse to do that -- a huge waste of time and money.

I hope the USA and other embassies provide everything which can help US Expats support their stay in Thailand, and charge only what it costs to provide those services, for which we have always been required to pay.  That should be one of their top primary duties.

[BrandonJT]

6 minutes ago, Rob Browder said:

I hope the USA and other embassies provide everything which can help US Expats support their stay in Thailand, and charge only what it costs to provide those services, for which we have always been required to pay.  That should be one of their top primary duties.

It would literally be impossible for embassy staff to provide certification of income for Americans.  They have no way to verify that, and every potential way is easily forged and faked.  There's a reason it was stopped.  They simply don't have access to even government based income, let alone pensions and 401k etc.

[DrJack54]

53 minutes ago, BrandonJT said:

They simply don't have access to even government based income, let alone pensions and 401k etc

Exactly. 

Also the income can be just that. 

Income from shares etc. 

As an aside...years ago I had chat with senior Lady working at Oz embassy Bangkok. 

When discussing this topic she stated something along these lines... 

"We never should have been endorsing statutory declarations. (other countries= affidavit) as they are only for use within Australia"

 

The notion that embassies can/should actually verify incomes is a joke. 

[ChicagoExpat]

32 minutes ago, Rob Browder said:

I hope the USA and other embassies provide everything which can help US Expats support their stay in Thailand, and charge only what it costs to provide those services, for which we have always been required to pay.  That should be one of their top primary duties.

Sorry but I disagree.  It's not the U.S. Government's job to tailor services to whatever absurd requirements 200+ countries come up with, or whatever stupid demands expats make (as you can imagine, the demands get crazier and more rage-filled every year).

[Rob Browder]

6 hours ago, TaoNow said:

People who choose Thailand to end their life in should be willing to post a "bond" of 21,000 euro to show the honesty of their intentions and ability to be financially independent of the state.

"Honesty and Intentions" to do what?  Paying our own way, as we must without exception, to continue living here?  How would one not be "financially independent of the state" of Thailand, as a foreigner here?   What welfare programs are available for us?   None. 

 

Requiring health-care could come into this, but they had to "corrupt" that up, by rejecting high-quality options, in-lieu of scammy plans from local cronies on a list of "acceptable" options - with immigration's usual agent-workaround, of course.  A low fee-to-enter Thailand (repeatedly proposed / never implemented) could easily cover all foreigners emergency health services, in any case - the logical solution, which avoids paperwork / verification, etc.

[gamb00ler]

On 5/28/2025 at 9:46 AM, Patong2021 said:

Over several months before the announcement, the Canadian government had been warning  people coming for the letters that a change was pending.

I requested my letter from the 🇨🇦 consulate on Feb 6.... not a whisper of the upcoming change.

[ChicagoExpat]

On 5/28/2025 at 9:00 AM, Presnock said:

Basically what the US embassy did was have a customer wanting such letter of income, the customer would have to swear that the information was accurate under penalty of a US law and of course pay upwards of $USD50.  If in the US and you have a document that a notary public would attest to, it is the same thing - they don't go out and check out that document, they make you sign an affidavit under penalty of law there and you pay for that service.  What actually happened and which is probably happening in other embassies too is that funds are being cut each year by many governments so the manning at embassies and consulates has dropped and thus services such as notary public at the US embassy and consulates.

Efficient use of time and staff is definitely one of the big reasons.  I went to an Embassy town hall, and the guy said a few years ago they were doing 25000(!) notary services per year -- nearly all of them unique to the stupid demands of the Thai bureaucracy.  Income letters, passport letters, marriage affidavits, fake authentications of U.S. documents... that is nonsense!  Not only for the time it takes from doing their real work but because it's nearly all fake ("I, John Smith, promise I'm not married/my diploma is real/I really have money...") So they have told the Thais they're not going to do them anymore (I hear the marriage affidavit is next.)  Good on them!  And good for us -- no more $50 wasted along with a trip to the Embassy from all parts of Thailand.

[Rob Browder]

1 minute ago, ChicagoExpat said:

Sorry but I disagree.  It's not the U.S. Government's job to tailor services to whatever absurd requirements 200+ countries come up with, or whatever stupid demands expats make (as you can imagine, the demands get crazier and more rage-filled every year).

It is the US Govt's job to serve it's citizens - not run espionage under embassy-cover, operating for the interests crony deep-pockets.  The cronies' budget is never cut, as we get subjected to various forms of "austerity," allegedly to "save money" - an infinitesimal amount by comparison, in any case, for which I suggested simply charging us at-cost.

 

Notarizing documents showing our income should have been the workaround / solution.  Its a federal-felony to lie / use forged documents for such.  If Thailand believed such was occurring, they could refer it to the local US-FBI office for prosecution.

[BrandonJT]

2 minutes ago, Rob Browder said:

It is the US Govt's job to serve it's citizens - not run espionage under embassy-cover, operating for the interests crony deep-pockets.  The cronies' budget is never cut, as we get subjected to various forms of "austerity," allegedly to "save money" - an infinitesimal amount by comparison, in any case, for which I suggested simply charging us at-cost.

 

Notarizing documents showing our income should have been the workaround / solution.  Its a federal-felony to lie / use forged documents for such.  If Thailand believed such was occurring, they could refer it to the local US-FBI office for prosecution.

It's also against US Federal law to offer bribes anywhere in the world.  But I don't see Americans concerned with using agents or paying off police for speeding tickets in Thailand, which would be illegal. There's a reason they stopped accepting documents on the honor system.

[Rob Browder]

11 minutes ago, ChicagoExpat said:

Efficient use of time and staff is definitely one of the big reasons.  I went to an Embassy town hall, and the guy said a few years ago they were doing 25000(!) notary services per year -- nearly all of them unique to the stupid demands of the Thai bureaucracy.  Income letters, passport letters, marriage affidavits, fake authentications of U.S. documents... that is nonsense!  Not only for the time it takes from doing their real work but because it's nearly all fake ("I, John Smith, promise I'm not married/my diploma is real/I really have money...") So they have told the Thais they're not going to do them anymore (I hear the marriage affidavit is next.)  Good on them!  And good for us -- no more $50 wasted along with a trip to the Embassy from all parts of Thailand.

Ah, yes - so much better if we have to get married to our Thai wives in Singapore or similar, then go through the rigamarole of "authenticating" that "foreign marriage."   So, save $50, and spend 10x+ that, plus additional bureaucratic-hell, instead?

 

That 25,000 x $50 = $1,250,000 in revenue.  Not enough to pay for the staff to do it?  Ok, make it $75.  Folks like you don't have to use the service, if you don't want.  I am sure many Americans would love to get the job working at the embassy doing that; fed-jobs have great $$ + benefits, after all.

[gamb00ler]

18 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

The notion that embassies can actually verify incomes is a joke. 

I don't think you're familiar with every embassy/consulate, especially not the Canadian versions.  They checked my benefit letters from the governmental agencies closely.  It was not a forensic investigation but I think it is reasonable that TH Immigration accept it.

[DrJack54]

1 minute ago, gamb00ler said:

  They checked my benefit letters from the governmental agencies closely.

Many folk don't have a "benefit letter" or pension etc. 

In any event Canadian embassy no longer will issue income letter. 

Start depositing 65/40k per month like many others are doing. 

 

[Rob Browder]

5 minutes ago, BrandonJT said:

It's also against US Federal law to offer bribes anywhere in the world.  But I don't see Americans concerned with using agents or paying off police for speeding tickets in Thailand, which would be illegal. There's a reason they stopped accepting documents on the honor system.

Yes, and that is the primary reason I throw-away the ROI I could be making from my 800K baht, by paying an agent for a fraction of the incurred-losses.   That said, they would have to show in-court an expat's knowledge that their agent-money was "paying a bribe," vs merely "sponsoring" their extension. 

 

Also note, the Trump admin just "loosened" enforcement of this policy/law, because it was making "doing business" in places like Thailand, Africa, etc near-impossible, as their economic/govt systems are built upon corruption.  Granted, such "leniency" will likely be reserved for billionaires, while the book could be thrown at us "peon" sucker-taxpayer citizens at any time - if only to keep some bureaucrat busy, who could otherwise be doing something useful for us (like providing sworn-affidavits of our income-statements).

[ChicagoExpat]

48 minutes ago, Rob Browder said:

It is the US Govt's job to serve it's citizens - not run espionage under embassy-cover, operating for the interests crony deep-pockets.  The cronies' budget is never cut, as we get subjected to various forms of "austerity," allegedly to "save money" - an infinitesimal amount by comparison, in any case, for which I suggested simply charging us at-cost.

 

Notarizing documents showing our income should have been the workaround / solution.  Its a federal-felony to lie / use forged documents for such.  If Thailand believed such was occurring, they could refer it to the local US-FBI office for prosecution.

No, notarizing documents is a terrible workaround.  It's not a felony and there is no scenario in which U.S. law enforcement and the judiciary system is going to prosecute chuckleheads telling a foreign government they had "X" amount in the bank when they didn't.

 

It's 100% NOT The US Govt's job to jump through whatever stupid hoops some corrupt Thai immigration officer decides.  And yes it IS the Embassy's job to conduct intelligence.

 

You have it all backwards, amigo.  The Embassy isn't here to wipe your arse and meet the ever-increasing demands of it's often mentally ill, entitled citizens.

[harryviking]

10 hours ago, daejung said:

Were it to happen with the French embassy, I would reduce my stay in Thailand by half. I would never make an 800,000 baht deposit in any Thai bank, even if I could afford it.

I find it kind of funny that Thailand want you to "lock up" 800K when what they really want is people to come and SPEND MONEY!! Not save them for ages!! There is no logic here! I guess that is "Thai Style"....

[ChicagoExpat]

49 minutes ago, Rob Browder said:

Ah, yes - so much better if we have to get married to our Thai wives in Singapore or similar, then go through the rigamarole of "authenticating" that "foreign marriage."   So, save $50, and spend 10x+ that, plus additional bureaucratic-hell, instead?

 

That 25,000 x $50 = $1,250,000 in revenue.  Not enough to pay for the staff to do it?  Ok, make it $75.  Folks like you don't have to use the service, if you don't want.  I am sure many Americans would love to get the job working at the embassy doing that; fed-jobs have great $$ + benefits, after all.

You're missing the point.  You repeatedly accuse the Embassy of corruption and ignoring the little guy, and yet here they are saying they DON'T want your money -- and you're the epitome of the little guy.  What a mystery!

 

The bottom line is -- more bureaucracy is you enemy, not your friend.  The fact that you WANT to pay $50/travel to the Embassy several times per year at the whim of a Thai bureaucrat is just bizarre.  Now you don't have to get a fake authentication of your state documents at $50 each -- thanks to the Embassy.  Now you don't have to pay $50 to get a fake authentication of your bank accounts -- thanks to the Embassy.  And soon you won't have to pay $50 to do a fake affirmation that you are single so you can marry your local call girl -- thanks to the Embassy.

[Khun Roberto]

On 5/28/2025 at 9:17 AM, DrJack54 said:

@Khun RobertoRoberto what you outline is fine however I'm too conservative. 

Would prefer to satisfy both methods 

1. Funds in bank (stand alone)  +

2. Combo method. 

Then for next extension outline plan to move to combo only for the July 2026 extension. 

 

You can withdraw the 400k as you outlined however I would put that back in for the two months prior to next extension. 

Folk will tell you not required to go back up to the 800k. 

That's correct, however I like the idea of all bases covered. 

Currently I'm changing from money in bank to income method. 

In line with what I posted... I will satisfy funds in bank + 12 monthly deposits. 

Obviously check with your immigration office that they accept combo method. Few don't. 

 

 

Kh. Moh Jack, yes, great minds think alike. Always have a plan B.

This time I was planning on using the embassy affidavit even though I’ve had the 800k deposit for 14 months. The sudden change by the embassy policy means I go to plan B.

Yes, as you suggest, for next year I’ll do the monthly but also try to comply with the 800/400/800 system.

If I dip in too much, or too long, I’ll still have the combo method as backup.

And we all have plan C - getting an agency to do it for 15K.

 

Cheers