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What the Iran war means for Ukraine

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Just now, Alan Zweibel said:

Maybe you're confusing the EU with Middle Earth and you believe that wizards roam there and can with a weight of their ones make the most complicated and sophisticated weapons. The reality is quite different.

The implementation of EDIP introduces specific benchmarks for the European defense sector. According to a report by the École Militaire, the programme aims to shift the procurement patterns of member states, targeting a minimum of 50% of military equipment purchases from within the Union by 2030. This objective follows data indicating that between 2022 and 2023, 68% of EU defense acquisitions were sourced from the United States, while joint investments among the 27 member states accounted for 18%. [14]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Defence_Industry_Programme?utm_source=chatgpt.com

Do you spend your week reading Wiki for info?

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Just now, Alan Zweibel said:

Maybe you're confusing the EU with Middle Earth and you believe that wizards roam there and can with a weight of their ones make the most complicated and sophisticated weapons. The reality is quite different.

The implementation of EDIP introduces specific benchmarks for the European defense sector. According to a report by the École Militaire, the programme aims to shift the procurement patterns of member states, targeting a minimum of 50% of military equipment purchases from within the Union by 2030. This objective follows data indicating that between 2022 and 2023, 68% of EU defense acquisitions were sourced from the United States, while joint investments among the 27 member states accounted for 18%. [14]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Defence_Industry_Programme?utm_source=chatgpt.com

So the EU depends on the USA for all things defense.

  • Author
6 minutes ago, khaosokman said:

What are you talking about?

You make a claim and instead of backing it up with argument or evidence you say people don't care. That's a retreat.

Just now, Alan Zweibel said:

You make a claim and instead of backing it up with argument or evidence that you save people don't care. That's retreat.

I have no idea what you are talking about and neither do you.

1 minute ago, Alan Zweibel said:

You offer a comment on backed by reasoning or evidence and you say I have nothing?

I think the evidence points to the Europe's lack of defense capabilities. Or maybe it's pure laziness.

1 minute ago, TedG said:

So the EU depends on the USA for all things defense.

According to his googling and Wiki lol

World expert on wars lol

26 minutes ago, TedG said:

Are the people of Europe really not increasing production due to the dangers posed by Putin's Russia?

Demand already exceeds capacity. For example, it should take around 2 years to deliver the equivalent of a Patriot.

The most advanced weapons and jets are produced in small quantities, in a workshop mode, rather than by mass production. There is therefore also a HR issue. They may simply not have enough skilled manpower to significantly expand production, and training takes time.

  • Author
Just now, TedG said:

So the EU depends on the USA for all things defense.

Apparently, in your world, it's either All or nothing.

1 minute ago, TedG said:

I think the evidence points to the Europe's lack of defense capabilities. Or maybe it's pure laziness.

Decades of sluggish economic growth, laziness and hoping the USA help them.

  • Author
Just now, khaosokman said:

According to his googling and Wiki lol

World expert on wars lol

It beats taking on faith andassertion from an anonymous person on this forum. But if you have a problem with links in general or the links on using, take it up with the mods.

Just now, khaosokman said:

Decades of sluggish economic growth, laziness and hoping the USA help them.

But, they can brag about their holidays and free stuff.

  • Author
2 minutes ago, TedG said:

I think the evidence points to the Europe's lack of defense capabilities. Or maybe it's pure laziness.

I can offer you evidence but I can't make you read it.

  • Author
1 minute ago, TedG said:

But, they can brag about their holidays and free stuff.

Deflecting much?

Just now, Alan Zweibel said:

It beats taking on faith andassertion from an anonymous person on this forum. But if you have a problem with links in general or the links on using, take it up with the mods.

I don't care who wins. Both run by morons and it is commies vs fascists. It is karma.

Just now, Alan Zweibel said:

I can offer you evidence but I can't make you read it.

Come one man, Europe is lame. They can't defend themselves without big daddy the USA.

17 minutes ago, Alan Zweibel said:

You made an assertion, and instead of defending it, now you claim you don't care.

assertion about what lol? You bored with life evidently

Just now, Alan Zweibel said:

Deflecting much?

Is the hard truth a deflection?

  • Author
Just now, khaosokman said:

I don't care who wins. Both run by morons and it is commies vs fascists. It is karma.

Fascists who elected a Jewish person as their president. Fascist political parties in Ukraine have fared miserably in the 21st century.

  • Author
1 minute ago, TedG said:

Come one man, Europe is lame. They can't defend themselves without big daddy the USA.

Once again, I can offer you links to material to read, but I can't make you read it.

2 minutes ago, TedG said:

So the EU depends on the USA for all things defense.

It should take at least 10 years to change that.

BTW, the EU has no defense prerogative, according to the treaties signed, it can only provide some help. Most of it will happen outside the scope of the EU, unless a new treaty is signed, which is very unlikely.

1 minute ago, Alan Zweibel said:

Fascists who elected a Jewish person as their president. Fascist political parties in Ukraine have fared miserably in the 21st century.

I still don't care who wins. None of my business.

Just now, Alan Zweibel said:

Once again, I can offer you links to material to read, but I can't make you read it.

Seriously, Europe cannot defend themselves against Russia. End of story.

  • Author
1 minute ago, TedG said:

Is the hard truth a deflection?

Just now, TedG said:

Seriously, Europe cannot defend themselves against Russia. End of story.

That's what was said about Ukraine too. Russia's economy is already straining under the burden of the Ukraine war.

  • Author
1 minute ago, khaosokman said:

I still don't care who wins. None of my business.

Another retreat.

Just now, candide said:

It should take around 10 years to change that.

BTW, the EU has no defense prerogative, according to the treaties signed, it can only provide some help. Most of it will happen outside the scope of the EU, unless a new treaty is signed, which is very unlikely.

Europe is irrelevant. Stick a fork in them. I wish the USA would close all the bases in Europe and leave.

Just now, Alan Zweibel said:

Another retreat.

I never cared. You don't either. You just got nothing better to worry about.

3 minutes ago, Alan Zweibel said:

That's what was said about Ukraine too. Russia's economy is already straining under the burden of the Ukraine war.

BRUSSELS (AP) — NATO Secretary-General Mark Rutte insisted Monday that Europe is incapable of defending itself without U.S. military support and would have to more than double current military spending targets to be able to do so.

“If anyone thinks here … that the European Union or Europe as a whole can defend itself without the U.S., keep on dreaming. You can’t,” Rutte told EU lawmakers in Brussels. Europe and the United States “need each other,” he said.

https://apnews.com/article/nato-europe-us-nuclear-trump-defense-security-c1575be708cbd813f1c7d97c87628ff6

  • Author
3 minutes ago, TedG said:

Europe is irrelevant. Stick a fork on them. I wish the USA would close all the bases in Europe and leave.

On a nominal basis the EU is the second largest economic entity in the world.

On a PPP basis it's third. That's your idea of irrelevant?

1 minute ago, Alan Zweibel said:

On a nominal basis the EU is the second largest economic entity in the world.

On a PPP basis it's third. That's your idea of irrelevant?

Sorry....Europe is dying continent. You brag about the awesome GDP and PPP, yet they can't defend themselves without big daddy helping. The GDP growth is low, and they don't innovate.

https://ecaef.org/europes-innovation-problem/

  • Author
2 minutes ago, TedG said:

BRUSSELS (AP) — NATO Secretary-General Mark Rutte insisted Monday that Europe is incapable of defending itself without U.S. military support and would have to more than double current military spending targets to be able to do so.

“If anyone thinks here … that the European Union or Europe as a whole can defend itself without the U.S., keep on dreaming. You can’t,” Rutte told EU lawmakers in Brussels. Europe and the United States “need each other,” he said.

https://apnews.com/article/nato-europe-us-nuclear-trump-defense-security-c1575be708cbd813f1c7d97c87628ff6

First off, you'll note he said the US and the EU need each other. On top of that, he included nuclear weapons in expenses. France already has them. And the UK, while not an EU member, also has a nuclear force.

In fact, the EU provides a lot of high tech components used by the US defense industry.

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