32 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

Your defense of Pattaya Pimps and exploiters of women does not come as a surprise.

The problem is that foreign journalists and NGOs want to fix Thailand and think they can do a better job running the country.

What do you know about running a country? Have you ever run a country before?

The finances of country have a lot to do with the existence of these types of industries.

Before passing sweeping judgment based on God knows what Biblical values, maybe try to imagine that you can sort out the economy better.

What industries would you create to keep all these women employed?

Edited May 23May 23 by save the frogs

1 hour ago, scubascuba3 said:

Your fake wife is a sex worker, just a different type, surprises no one

You are assuming that other people's social circles mirror your life, and the reality is that they do not.

I do not socialize with female sex workers. Never have and never will. No one I know does.

1 minute ago, Patong2021 said:

You are assuming that other people's social circles mirror your life, and the reality is that they do not.

I do not socialize with female sex workers. Never have and never will. No one I know does.

Same with me Darl !

3 minutes ago, georgegeorgia said:

Same with me Darl !

yeah, but maybe not for ethical or religious reasons.

if you weren't gay, you probably would i'm guessing.

1 hour ago, save the frogs said:

The problem is that foreign journalists and NGOs want to fix Thailand and think they can do a better job running the country.

What do you know about running a country? Have you ever run a country before?

The finances of country have a lot to do with the existence of these types of industries.

Before passing sweeping judgment based on God knows what Biblical values, maybe try to imagine that you can sort out the economy better.

What industries would you create to keep all these women employed?

Mr. Drummond was not obsessed with "fixing" Thailand. He reported on the foreigners who were engaged in criminal acts including financial fraud, trafficking of humans, pimping and conflicts of interests amongst other topics. The people he exposed usually had extensive criminal records in their homelands and had set up shop in Thailand where they preyed upon the vulnerable.

Thailand's finances do not rely upon the operations of sketchy beer bars in tourist destinations operated by scummy foreigners. You miss the fact that the foreigners suck the money out of the operations, pay minimal taxes and rely on corruption to continue their operations. Other countries with a robust tourist trade do not rely on cheap beer bars and prostitution for their revenues. Thailand's tourist sector would not suffer if some of the crooked foreigners were removed. On the contrary it would be improved.

26 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

You are assuming that other people's social circles mirror your life, and the reality is that they do not.

I do not socialize with female sex workers. Never have and never will. No one I know does.

I'm confident your relationship isn't real, your thai wife only went for it for money perhaps a job was involved, I couldn't be righteous like you knowing it's fake

On 5/21/2026 at 1:38 PM, Andy Harrow said:

Okay, this article does raise some genuinely interesting points in a fairly measured way. It feels quite insightful in places, while still leaving a bit of space for context, and the possibility that not everything presented By Andrew Drummond and Adam Howell is air tight. Drummond is frequently publishing with fact checking. This is careless as the disgraced journalist was convicted of fake allegations.

https://drummondhowellcampaign.com/evidence/pattaya-groups-incitement-may-2026

Drummond - He has said he is happy to be called a gutter journalist, which is just what he is. In the end picked on the wrong people and had to flee Thailand leaving the mrs behind. He has had it in for Bryan Flowers mostly of late. He only ever picked on foreigners, never Thai wrong doers. He has 'exposed' people in the past just for going to bars in Bangkok, leading to severe employment problems.

39 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

Mr. Drummond was not obsessed with "fixing" Thailand. He reported on the foreigners who were engaged in criminal acts including financial fraud, trafficking of humans, pimping and conflicts of interests amongst other topics. The people he exposed usually had extensive criminal records in their homelands and had set up shop in Thailand where they preyed upon the vulnerable.

Thailand's finances do not rely upon the operations of sketchy beer bars in tourist destinations operated by scummy foreigners. You miss the fact that the foreigners suck the money out of the operations, pay minimal taxes and rely on corruption to continue their operations. Other countries with a robust tourist trade do not rely on cheap beer bars and prostitution for their revenues. Thailand's tourist sector would not suffer if some of the crooked foreigners were removed. On the contrary it would be improved.

Not always, he once wrote an article about an American diplomat at the Embassy in Bkk, just because he was enjoying the nightlife, nothing criminal. But that did not stop Drummond smearing his name for column inches. I once saw Drummond drunk in a Bar in Suk Soi 23, that was different though I expect. He also has defamed the founder of this site.

Edited May 23May 23 by visalady

Long-timer here. WTF is this thread about, anyway?

Some links for context would be useful for the uniformed uninformed.

1 hour ago, scubascuba3 said:

I'm confident your relationship isn't real, your thai wife only went for it for money perhaps a job was involved, I couldn't be righteous like you knowing it's fake

considering that I do not discuss my relationships, you are not in a position to comment. Many foreigners have spouses/partners who are professionals like physicians or lawyers or CPAs, or Judges etc. Some women have their own successful businesses. Not all of us occupy the lower tier of the socio economic hierarchy and have to prowl cheap beer bars for companionship. Many still have their teeth, have functional family units and children who love them.

50 minutes ago, visalady said:

But that did not stop Drummond smearing his name for column inches.

thanks for clarifying.

so what makes it confusing is he vacillated from reporting on real criminal activity and smearing people for sh*ts and giggles.

49 minutes ago, visalady said:

Not always, he once wrote an article about an American diplomat at the Embassy in Bkk, just because he was enjoying the nightlife, nothing criminal. But that did not stop Drummond smearing his name for column inches. I once saw Drummond drunk in a Bar in Suk Soi 23, that was different though I expect. He also has defamed the founder of this site.

This site is owned by Thaiger Media. The originators of Thaiger have not been defamed by Andrew Drummond.

I do not see any record of the claim you make about his criticism of an American diplomat enjoying nightlife. Do you have a link? Sounds to me like another fabrication.

4 minutes ago, save the frogs said:

thanks for clarifying.

so what makes it confusing is he vacillated from reporting on real criminal activity and smearing people for sh*ts and giggles.

You are making that statement based upon an unsubstantiated claim.

35 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

This site is owned by Thaiger Media. The originators of Thaiger have not been defamed by Andrew Drummond.

I do not see any record of the claim you make about his criticism of an American diplomat enjoying nightlife. Do you have a link? Sounds to me like another fabrication.

The poster did say the founder of this site, not the current owner.

38 minutes ago, Patong2021 said:

You are making that statement based upon an unsubstantiated claim.

A quick google found that Drummond did report on forum member george which may be what is being referred to.

9 hours ago, couchpotato said:

@Spider5511 Oh dear another wannabe very new member who thinks he knows it all. Another fabricated username along with @Thai-Defender ---spouting the same stuff.

OK, so I'm a very old forum member - one of the first way back in 2003. I personally know Andrew from many years ago, and he is an 'old-skool' professional journalist, with many awards to his name. I'd believe what he says over some Pattaya bar fly.

6 hours ago, Patong2021 said:

You are making that statement based upon an unsubstantiated claim.

So why was Drummond banned from this forum?
Or is that bs too?

11 minutes ago, save the frogs said:

So why was Drummond banned from this forum?
Or is that bs too?

See 2 posts above yours

8 hours ago, Patong2021 said:

This site is owned by Thaiger Media. The originators of Thaiger have not been defamed by Andrew Drummond.

I do not see any record of the claim you make about his criticism of an American diplomat enjoying nightlife. Do you have a link? Sounds to me like another fabrication.

I was referring to the founder of Thai Visa. The American was exposed in 2001, he was the number 2 at the Embassy. Knew him personally

2 hours ago, simon43 said:

OK, so I'm a very old forum member - one of the first way back in 2003. I personally know Andrew from many years ago, and he is an 'old-skool' professional journalist, with many awards to his name. I'd believe what he says over some Pattaya bar fly.

Claims he has many awards, like he claimed he went to a University, it was a Polytechnic. Drummond likes to big himself up, but the truth is, as he said, he was a gutter journalist, you could say that was 'old school'

Good journalism or a smear merchant?

https://www.andrew-drummond.news/exposed-thai-visa-dot-com/

'This story is centred around  allegations of blackmail, fraud, fear, loathing and corruption as the highly successful ThaiVisa.com revamps itself from Pattaya – And with a British ‘estuary man’ as nominal head, the Thaivisa family appears to be tearing itself apart.'

Edited May 23May 23 by visalady

9 minutes ago, visalady said:

Good journalism or a smear merchant?

https://www.andrew-drummond.news/exposed-thai-visa-dot-com/

'This story is centred around  allegations of blackmail, fraud, fear, loathing and corruption as the highly successful ThaiVisa.com revamps itself from Pattaya – And with a British ‘estuary man’ as nominal head, the Thaivisa family appears to be tearing itself apart.'

Crikey I hadn't ead that before.

33 minutes ago, visalady said:

I was referring to the founder of Thai Visa. The American was exposed in 2001, he was the number 2 at the Embassy. Knew him personally

The individual you refer to was subject to several allegations. The one I believe you refer to arose in 2015 when he was indicted on real estate fraud. Mr. Drummond reported the indictment. He did not invent the incident.

You are claiming that Mr, Drummond wrote an article on the "night time activities" of a US embassy staff member 25 years ago, and yet you offer no evidence of the article or its negative implications other than your unsubstantiated claim. Try again. If a member of any foreign consulate is involved in activities that are contrary to their employment code of conduct and standing orders and is exposed, it is not the journalist's responsibility for the subsequent disciplinary action.

8 hours ago, treetops said:

A quick google found that Drummond did report on forum member george which may be what is being referred to.

There are several articles on the individual. Drummond's articles were factually correct. If they are not flattering, it is because of the stated established facts.

Edited May 23May 23 by Patong2021

1 hour ago, Patong2021 said:

The individual you refer to was subject to several allegations. The one I believe you refer to arose in 2015 when he was indicted on real estate fraud. Mr. Drummond reported the indictment. He did not invent the incident.

I read the article she posted and it's absolutely without doubt trash / gutter journalism.

Andrew whatever his name is an untalented writer, for one thing. It's Grade 2 English. He seems like an uneducated person and he's not a good writer at all for someone whose profession is journalism.

He mixes facts with personal low-life insults one might find on a forum like this full of anonymous trolls. It's troll journalism. I'm surprised he didn't throw in some yo momma so fat jokes in his article. Actually, he did make fun of the bar manager for being overweight in the Soi 6 bar owner article. Proof that he's mostly trolling. In a serious article about an underage sex worker, a person's waist circumference has no importance. It's crap journalism. Pick the biggest troll on this forum. That's what he sounds like.

It doesn't mean he is inventing incidents. He is basing it on some reality. Otherwise, no one would read anything he has to say. But he is the last person I would trust for a factual explanation of anything. I'm pretty sure a lot of the alleged facts in his articles are unchecked and false.

He seems like a miserable troll who is attacking people because he's not too accomplished in his own life.

Some of you guys are cheering him on probably because he tried to take down a Soi 6 bar owner and you guys would love to see the entire bar scene shut down.

Yeah, good luck with that.

Edited May 23May 23 by save the frogs

Andrew Drummond is a British independent journalist and occasional television documentary maker.

He is a former Fleet Street, London journalist, having worked at the Evening Standard, Daily Mail, Mail on Sunday, News of the World, Observer, and The Times.

Specialising in investigations, he has also worked on assignments throughout Europe, and in the United States, South America, Africa, China, Indonesia, Korea, Malaysia, Vietnam, Cambodia, Australia, the South Pacific, and Central Asia.

In television, he has worked on documentaries for a variety of broadcasters, including BBC Panorama, BBC2, Channel 4 Dispatches, and World Monitor (Boston).

With Kimis Zabhiyan, he was the joint founder of the Observer Film Company, the film arm of the Observer newspaper. His film Lord of the Golden Triangle, filmed with opium warlord Khun Sa, which he researched as a foreign correspondent for the Observer in the Shan States of Burma, was the launch film of the company.

From Thailand, from 1986 until his departure in 2015, he covered most of the major breaking stories in Southeast Asia, from the Asian tsunami and bird flu to the Bali bombings, military coups, and crime.

His investigations in Asia have led directly to the prosecution of people including a policeman for murder, and to the release of scapegoats set up on murder charges. He has been successful against “boiler room” fraud operations, which he continues to monitor, and, working with the Foundation to Fight Against Child Exploitation, has tracked and identified a variety of child sexual abusers. The most famous of these was rock star Garry Glitter (real name Paul Gadd), whom he tracked down to a house in Vung Tau, Vietnam, leading to his prosecution by the authorities.

Andrew is a holder of the Maurice Ludmer Memorial Award for investigations into racism and fascism, after he went undercover for two years in an extreme right-wing group with links to bombings across Europe.

He left Thailand in 2015, and his departure was reported by many newspapers, including the Guardian, Bangkok Post, and the Sydney Morning Herald. He currently lives in UK

This thread is a perfect example of a proverb that goes back 2,500 years to ancient China:

“Those who know do not speak. Those who speak do not know.”

― Lao Tzu, Tao Te Ching

The individuals who know the full story of this very confused string of events won't be posting on AN. Those who do post are speculating based on half-truths, rumors and incomplete information.

This type of "scandal" involving well-known farang players in Thailand isn't a good topic for AN because it draws the wrong sort of attention to the board since it involves allegations of trafficking of an under*ged pr*stitute.

2 hours ago, save the frogs said:

I read the article she posted and it's absolutely without doubt trash / gutter journalism.

Andrew whatever his name is an untalented writer, for one thing. It's Grade 2 English. He seems like an uneducated person and he's not a good writer at all for someone whose profession is journalism.

He mixes facts with personal low-life insults one might find on a forum like this full of anonymous trolls. It's troll journalism. I'm surprised he didn't throw in some yo momma so fat jokes in his article. Actually, he did make fun of the bar manager for being overweight in the Soi 6 bar owner article. Proof that he's mostly trolling. In a serious article about an underage sex worker, a person's waist circumference has no importance. It's crap journalism. Pick the biggest troll on this forum. That's what he sounds like.

It doesn't mean he is inventing incidents. He is basing it on some reality. Otherwise, no one would read anything he has to say. But he is the last person I would trust for a factual explanation of anything. I'm pretty sure a lot of the alleged facts in his articles are unchecked and false.

He seems like a miserable troll who is attacking people because he's not too accomplished in his own life.

Some of you guys are cheering him on probably because he tried to take down a Soi 6 bar owner and you guys would love to see the entire bar scene shut down.

Yeah, good luck with that.

I think he made a refernce to the bar owner's weight because the British bar manager was charged with working at the Soi 6 bar against Thai labour laws on an education visa for attending Muay Thai lessons at the Rage Fight Academy in Pattaya owned by his boss. It was not a joke. As far as Drummond could tell few of the bar managers employed on education visas at 'Rage Fight Academy' ever went there more than once or twice. However, he feels that the bar owner was unjustly jailed for 21 years. What were the other 'yo momma' jokes, or are you making it up? If you wish to challenge a fact I will be happy to get the answer from Andrew Drummond. In the meantime he apologises for his lack of education, and says he realises he must have fooled the editors of the Observer, Times, Economist, Guartdian etc and is grateful you were not his editor. However, for stories on his website he does not stick to the more rigid newspaper format. He does fact check - which together with 'public interest' is why he won his libel cases. PS What's Grade 2 English? Is that a GCSE certificate in the UK. I don't think he'll understand. He is Scots. I don't think GCSE's were around when he went to school. Lucky for him I guess.

Edited May 23May 23 by Thai-Defender

2 hours ago, save the frogs said:

Andrew whatever his name is an untalented writer, for one thing. It's Grade 2 English. He seems like an uneducated person and he's not a good writer at all for someone whose profession is journalism.

He mixes facts with personal low-life insults one might find on a forum like this full of anonymous trolls. It's troll journalism. I'm surprised he didn't throw in some yo momma so fat jokes in his article. Actually, he did make fun of the bar manager for being overweight in the Soi 6 bar owner article. Proof that he's mostly trolling. In a serious article about an underage sex worker, a person's waist circumference has no importance. It's crap journalism. Pick the biggest troll on this forum. That's what he sounds like.

Wait a minute. Aren't you the one who said he has no horse in the race, isn't exactly interested in the story, and don't understand what it's all about?

Yet your post count in this thread is the second most, with only posts slagging off Drummond.

Please go play your baiting agenda elsewhere, because you are infamous for doing that in every thread you enter.

Don't bother replying either, because I will not see your baiting troll posts any more.

7 hours ago, visalady said:

I was referring to the founder of Thai Visa. The American was exposed in 2001, he was the number 2 at the Embassy. Knew him personally

Andrew Drummond has since got back to me. He wishes you to point to his story about the No 2 at the U.S. Embassy going to a bar, any bar for that matter. He says he has never reported on any official at the U.S. Embassy let alone the Deputy Head of Mission. He has however reported on a United States DEA agent who fired off a gun in a bar in Chiang Mai mamny years ago, could that be what you are referriing to. Your posts indicate that you are trawling to find something negative about Mr. Drummond. You have said for instance that Drummond claimed he went to Portsmouth University - when he did not. Drummond skipped Uni entirely and entered journalism through the National Council for the Training of Journalists and did their diploma in journalism (courses on journalism and media studiies at university did not exist at UNIS) This involved attending college for a couple of months or so only every year for three years at Highbury College, Portsmouth-while he working on a real newspaper, which is the only real experience you can get. This story was put out by none other than Drew Noyes, the American owner of the now defunct Pattaya Times, who took legal action against Andrew Drummond, only to find himself under arrest for extortion. Noyes was sentenced to jail to imprisonment but while on bail on appeal he applied to the court to go back to the United States on an urgent family matter. The court took the extra 'bail' offered and, of course, he never returned.