Star Allaince Refuses To Return To Don Mueang

[george]

THAI insists it won't resume services at Don Mueang airport

BANGKOK: -- Thai Airways International, the country's national carrier, has insisted it will not resume its services at Don Mueang International Airport.

THAI president Apinan Sumanaseni on Tuesday said Star Alliance, a global airline partnership network composed of 18 member airlines, including THAI, had submitted to Transport Minister Adm. Thira

Haocharoen a written objection to keeping open two airports – Suvarnabhumi and Don Mueang – for international flight services.

He said that should Thailand really desire to be the region's centre of aviation, there must be only one international flight service connection to ensure convenience for all aviation routes.

Opening two airports for international flight services in Bangkok would cause difficulties to passengers, he said.

Mr. Apinan insisted THAI and Star Alliance would definitely not resume international flight services at Don Mueang Airport because the airline had already invested over Bt67 billion in Suvarnabhumi Airport.

He said the crowded flow of aircraft at Suvarnabhumi Airport could be solved through an improved management approach.

The airport, if compared with London's Heathrow airport, could still provide much more space for services if an improved schedule for takeoff and landing of planes was set properly, he said.

Also, as a former pilot, the Thai president said he viewed the opening of international flight services at two airports concurrently would lead to an air traffic control problem.

--TNA 2007-12-03

[Florin]

TG is a Star Alliance member and already runs services from Don Mueang...not international, but it nevertheless invalidates the silly concept of this article.

[JonnieB]

not sure what all the fuss is about re having 2 airports in bangkok. many large cities around the world have 2,3, or more airports. i know they will have higher costs for running out of more than one airport but they do it at other cities. if swampypoom is already full...then what's the alternative?

[PhilHarries]

Can't say I blame them for resisting the move. If you were the country's national carrier and had just invested 67 billion Baht in a move to the new international airport, the "aviation hub of SE Asia", would you let yourself be pushed out back to the old one? Okay, they've already moved their domestic traffic but that most certainly was not willingly. How would the other members of the alliance react to being told you have to use the old airport because the new one is over capacity a little over a year after opening?

As to operating two airports, yes many cities in the world do so but they usually have reasonable interconnecting transport services. Plus they usually plan these things in advance not open a new airport, move everyone across then decide there isn't enough capacity so some will have to move back.

He said the crowded flow of aircraft at Suvarnabhumi Airport could be solved through an improved management approach.

Thai management, an oxymoron if I ever heard one.

[Florin]

I think they should make a move for 2 full airports when the rail links will (at least partially) be available...there is a plan to continue the currently under construction Suvarnabhumi-Makkasan link with a further connection to Don Mueang.

Or they could just follow Moscow's example...3 major airports and no one gives a <deleted> about transfers in between them

[PeaceBlondie]

Yes, Moscow! London is bad enough, but it has transport between the airports (e.g., big buses between Heathrow and Stansted). Moscow, like Bangkok, has virtually nothing. I paid $100 for a one hour taxi ride between Domedovo and the other main airport, and the schedule required an overnight stay, as well.

It's not too bad now, if Thai airways still flies to a few domestic cities like Chiang Mai from Suvanaphoom. But transferring between Bangkok airports? No way.

I stink (that is, I still think) that the Thai president was just mentioning Heathrow to make a point. I stink Thai executives aren't that cosmopolitan in their outlook, even when they run the national carrier!

[Prakanong]

Yes, Moscow! London is bad enough, but it has transport between the airports (e.g., big buses between Heathrow and Stansted). Moscow, like Bangkok, has virtually nothing. I paid $100 for a one hour taxi ride between Domedovo and the other main airport, and the schedule required an overnight stay, as well.

It's not too bad now, if Thai airways still flies to a few domestic cities like Chiang Mai from Suvanaphoom. But transferring between Bangkok airports? No way.

I stink (that is, I still think) that the Thai president was just mentioning Heathrow to make a point. I stink Thai executives aren't that cosmopolitan in their outlook, even when they run the national carrier!

Yes but at Heathrow do Star Alliance fliers have to travel to other airports like Stanstead or Gatwick - I think not

If you are going to Edinburgh say and flying in on Thai, Luftwaffe or AA from their home countries you would make you connection at Heathrow.

If you we flying from say South America to Asia you would come in to Heathrow and make your connection at Heathrow

I think that is the point the Thai President is making - its part of being in the alliance - easy flying for its members.

[terryp]

Easy way around this stupid nonsense ....rename the Don to Swampy terminal 2 then they will have to use it..just more stupid Thai garbage…the Hi-So need to wake up and realize this is almost 2008 not 1940

LHR is now planning another massive enlargement with 2-3 more terminals and at least 2 more runways…makes Swampy look like a bicycle hub

[CbrLad]

Yes but at Heathrow do Star Alliance fliers have to travel to other airports like Stanstead or Gatwick - I think not

If you are going to Edinburgh say and flying in on Thai, Luftwaffe or AA from their home countries you would make you connection at Heathrow.

If you we flying from say South America to Asia you would come in to Heathrow and make your connection at Heathrow

I think that is the point the Thai President is making - its part of being in the alliance - easy flying for its members.

No, but One World members may have to change airports in London. Say you arrive on Qantas and change to one of the many flights that BA only operates from Gatwick.

In anycase I think in Bangkok it is silly, the airport is more than capable of a lot more flights, it would make sense to build the extra terminals now if things are already getting chocka, or as I suspect do things more efficently.

[Prakanong]

Yes but at Heathrow do Star Alliance fliers have to travel to other airports like Stanstead or Gatwick - I think not

If you are going to Edinburgh say and flying in on Thai, Luftwaffe or AA from their home countries you would make you connection at Heathrow.

If you we flying from say South America to Asia you would come in to Heathrow and make your connection at Heathrow

I think that is the point the Thai President is making - its part of being in the alliance - easy flying for its members.

No, but One World members may have to change airports in London. Say you arrive on Qantas and change to one of the many flights that BA only operates from Gatwick.

In anycase I think in Bangkok it is silly, the airport is more than capable of a lot more flights, it would make sense to build the extra terminals now if things are already getting chocka, or as I suspect do things more efficently.

Thanks for pointing out the Oneworld situation - I am with Star Alliance anddid not know about the Oneworld situation.

[ballbreaker]

Another example of business trying to dictate to governments what they will and will not do. DM is a perfectly good airport so why should AOT be forced to upgrade SUV.

I don't know where all the rail lines go but they must be able to route trains from the station across from DM to Makhasan station which happens to be where SUV sky train will terminate. Easy connection and fix for transport between airports.

[Prakanong]

Another example of business trying to dictate to governments what they will and will not do. DM is a perfectly good airport so why should AOT be forced to upgrade SUV.

I don't know where all the rail lines go but they must be able to route trains from the station across from DM to Makhasan station which happens to be where SUV sky train will terminate. Easy connection and fix for transport between airports.

Good one - you had me there till i saw you were joking.

Singapore and other hubs must be laughing up their sleeves at the antics in Thailand.

[tartempion]

not sure what all the fuss is about re having 2 airports in bangkok. many large cities around the world have 2,3, or more airports. i know they will have higher costs for running out of more than one airport but they do it at other cities. if swampypoom is already full...then what's the alternative?

"If swampypoom is already full" is the key.

They planned the space to make it bigger, no?

Overloaded 6 months after opening?

An airport built for the convenience of travellers, you must be joking, no?

I need and want to transfer to Udon ASAP in both directions and the transfer is a pain in the +ss, but you're no sure what all the fuss is?

Brilliant.

[Florin]

I don't know where all the rail lines go but they must be able to route trains from the station across from DM to Makhasan station which happens to be where SUV sky train will terminate. Easy connection and fix for transport between airports.

I love trains and this would be good in principle, but pretty much useless in practice. Trains using the line from the city stations to DM are not very frequent and very, VERY slow...also non-aircon except for the few express ones. Even rerouting and increasing frequencies wouldn't solve much because of the highly crappy SRT infrastructure. A taxi would get you from Suvarnabhumi to DM in 10% of the time it would take with this option.

[t.s]

Yes, Moscow! London is bad enough, but it has transport between the airports (e.g., big buses between Heathrow and Stansted). Moscow, like Bangkok, has virtually nothing. I paid $100 for a one hour taxi ride between Domedovo and the other main airport, and the schedule required an overnight stay, as well.

It's not too bad now, if Thai airways still flies to a few domestic cities like Chiang Mai from Suvanaphoom. But transferring between Bangkok airports? No way.

I stink (that is, I still think) that the Thai president was just mentioning Heathrow to make a point. I stink Thai executives aren't that cosmopolitan in their outlook, even when they run the national carrier!

thats pretty patronizing.

actually, you may be right, no thai ex airline pilot president of a national carrier is going to have a clue about an international airport abroad. thats about as likely as a thai bllionaire buying a football team -- never happen.

Edited December 7, 2007 by t.s

[PhilHarries]

Yes, Moscow! London is bad enough, but it has transport between the airports (e.g., big buses between Heathrow and Stansted). Moscow, like Bangkok, has virtually nothing. I paid $100 for a one hour taxi ride between Domedovo and the other main airport, and the schedule required an overnight stay, as well.

It's not too bad now, if Thai airways still flies to a few domestic cities like Chiang Mai from Suvanaphoom. But transferring between Bangkok airports? No way.

I stink (that is, I still think) that the Thai president was just mentioning Heathrow to make a point. I stink Thai executives aren't that cosmopolitan in their outlook, even when they run the national carrier!

thats pretty patronizing.

actually, you may be right, no thai ex airline pilot president of a national carrier is going to have a clue about an international airport abroad. thats about as likely as a thai bllionaire buying a football team -- never happen.

There is a massive difference between flying into and out of an airport and running one. To continue your football analogy how many ex players have made top managers?

That's what the airport needs is qualified, experienced management. If the thought of a farang running Suvarnabhumi and training Thais is too much to bear why not send some Thai managers overseas to see how it should be done.

btw Thaksin may be owner of Man City but you can bet youe ar5e he doesn't get involved in day to day running and team selection. Or if he does expect relegation.

<edit to ad the btw>

Edited December 7, 2007 by PhilHarries

[bkk_mike]

There is a massive difference between flying into and out of an airport and running one. To continue your football analogy how many ex players have made top managers?

Alex Ferguson springs to mind.

And I think what the Thai Airways president is hinting (as Thai doesn't run the airport - that's the AOT), that maybe Suvannabhumi could be better managed, as Heathrow handles more passengers with the same number of runways, and has the same 45m passenger design limit. (just happens to handle quite a bit more which partly explains why the queues at security at Heathrow are ridiculous).

Edited December 10, 2007 by bkk_mike

[lomatopo]

In theory BKK has the runway capacity (arrivals and departures on both runways, 19L and 19R: Mode 6, mixed operations) and gates (fixed: 51 and remote: ~60+) to handle much higher capacities. But this requires fully useful taxiways/aprons, and really good management/logistics/aircraft movement. Not sure if they have the ground transport, for remote gates, and baggage handling systems to support increased capacities. My guess is that they have not even attempted to push the limits because there is no need.

I was under the impression that a third runway was under construction?

I think everyone, other than some small group of Thai government/military power brokers with an interest in keeping DMK afloat along with the associated revenue, would like to be able to utilize a single airport.