Australian Aged Pension

[Olmate]

14 hours ago, LosLobo said:

Sounds like your 'mate' may be making multiple trips per year to avoid residency and taxation issues.

I suggest Rent Assistance and the non-basic Supplement payments are generally only available to Australian residents living in Australia as these benefits are tied to long-term residency.

 

Additionally, claiming these supplements while primarily living overseas could potentially raise questions about residency status, which might impact pension portability.

It’s best to check with Services Australia for tailored advice.

 

The 'mate' has been away in Oz for 4yrs, just returned to be "home on his farm".Unexpected family affairs are the reason, not tax concerns, but nice conjecture! No idea whatyour on about re portability.Cheers.

[rhodie]

On 9/19/2024 at 1:22 PM, Peterw42 said:

The 35 year rule has nothing to do with pension being portable or being cut off if you leave. 35 years is the minimum time you are required to be working (available for work), to even qualify for a pension.

As above, if someone leaves Australia aged 40 and doesn't return until 67, then they haven't put in the required years to even get a pension, let alone making it portable. Even if they started working at 15, that 25 years working.

I'm not sure where you are getting your information from, but you may need to read @LosLobo's reply above. You can get the full pension if you have been a permanent resident for 10 years before you reach pensionable age

 

.https://www.servicesaustralia.gov.au/residence-rules-for-age-pension?context=22526

"To get Age Pension you generally need to have been an Australian resident for at least 10 years in total. For at least 5 of these years, there must be no break in your residence."

 

The link above will help you understand the rules.

 

 

[4MyEgo]

On 9/19/2024 at 2:23 AM, KhunHeineken said:

Do you know the answer?  Yes, or no? 

 

It's important because we have a member suggesting you just have to be inside Australia at the time of applying, which I found surprising. 

 

 

Too easy....

 

Generally, this means they must be residing in Australia and physically present in Australia when they lodge their claim.

 

https://guides.dss.gov.au/social-security-guide/7/1/4

 

[Artisi]

On 9/18/2024 at 11:24 PM, KhunHeineken said:

You haven't answered the question. 

 

Example:  Say one's pension age is 67.  They have been outside of Australia since their mid to late 40's, for whatever reason. 

 

How long before the day they turn 67 should they return to Australia to guarantee portability on the day they apply, and receive, the aged pension?   

You can return anytime you like, before or after you get to pension age - however, there would be no portability for  2 years after pension being granted. 

[Nemises]

7 hours ago, Artisi said:

You can return anytime you like, before or after you get to pension age - however, there would be no portability for  2 years after pension being granted. 

Are you sure? I thought that if you returned 2 years before pension age, there would be portability immediately after pension being granted. 

[scorecard]

8 minutes ago, Nemises said:

Are you sure? I thought that if you returned 2 years before pension age, there would be portability immediately after pension being granted. 

 

Suggest you call the Centrelink International Office in Hobart on 131673 for a clear / specific answer on this point. 

[Artisi]

2 hours ago, Nemises said:

Are you sure? I thought that if you returned 2 years before pension age, there would be portability immediately after pension being granted. 

I  should have been more specific and said, returning "just before applying" as this is what I thought HK was implying. So I would say 2 years prior to applying, portability should be granted. 

As scorecard said, ring Centrelink Hobart - straight from the official source. 

Edited September 20 by Artisi

[Mason45]

6 minutes ago, Artisi said:

I  should have been more specific and said, returning "just before applying" as this is what I thought HK was implying. So I would say 2 years prior to applying, portability should be granted. 

I didn't return to Australia for 2 years prior as I had commitments in Thailand. I'm now 80 years old, worked for the Department of Defense all my working life. I also did military service, I have an Australian Service medal and I still don't qualify. Need I say my thoughts about Australia, a once great country of which we were lucky to spend our childhoods in.

[Nemises]

21 minutes ago, Artisi said:

So I would say 2 years prior to applying, portability should be granted.

Agree. Thanks for the correction. 

[scorecard]

1 hour ago, Mason45 said:

I didn't return to Australia for 2 years prior as I had commitments in Thailand. I'm now 80 years old, worked for the Department of Defense all my working life. I also did military service, I have an Australian Service medal and I still don't qualify. Need I say my thoughts about Australia, a once great country of which we were lucky to spend our childhoods in.

 

Unfortunately military service / war service has no bearing on gaining the OAP.

 

On an aligned subject I have sent you a private message. 

Edited September 20 by scorecard

[georgegeorgia]

1 hour ago, Mason45 said:

I didn't return to Australia for 2 years prior as I had commitments in Thailand. I'm now 80 years old, worked for the Department of Defense all my working life. I also did military service, I have an Australian Service medal and I still don't qualify. Need I say my thoughts about Australia, a once great country of which we were lucky to spend our childhoods in.

Wouldn't you get Veterans Pension?

[georgegeorgia]

There is no requirement to work 35 years ,you don't even have to work a day in your life to get the old age pension 

 

As you know there are certain Country towns in Australia that many haven't worked a day in their life and they will still get full old age pension when they are 67

 

 

Edited September 20 by georgegeorgia

[giddyup]

2 hours ago, georgegeorgia said:

Wouldn't you get Veterans Pension?

Only if you served in a combat zone like Vietnam.

[LosLobo]

4 hours ago, Mason45 said:

I didn't return to Australia for 2 years prior as I had commitments in Thailand. I'm now 80 years old, worked for the Department of Defense all my working life. I also did military service, I have an Australian Service medal and I still don't qualify. Need I say my thoughts about Australia, a once great country of which we were lucky to spend our childhoods in.

As a Commonwealth employee aren't you now not on a Defined Benefits Scheme making you ineligible for Aged Pension? Or possibly you have too many assets to qualify?

[SAFETY FIRST]

3 hours ago, georgegeorgia said:

There is no requirement to work 35 years ,you don't even have to work a day in your life to get the old age pension 

 

As you know there are certain Country towns in Australia that many haven't worked a day in their life and they will still get full old age pension when they are 67

 

 

I often wonder how that works. 

 

When I was young I had a girlfriend from Dharruk, Mt Druit. 

 

Her grandparents, her mother and father, and at the time, her sisters were having children and not having worked a day in their life. 

 

So these housing commission people are still entitled to an aged pension, never having worked?

 

Generations of unemployed families. 

 

Edited September 21 by SAFETY FIRST

[georgegeorgia]

8 minutes ago, SAFETY FIRST said:

I often wonder how that works. 

 

When I was young I had a girlfriend from Dharruk, Mt Druit. 

 

Her grandparents, her mother and father, and now her sisters were having children and not having worked a day in their life. 

 

So these housing commission people are still entitled to an aged pension, never having worked?

 

Generations of unemployed families. 

 

Lol..Dharruk..Emerton..Bidwell

I have a brother who lives there ,never worked a day in his life ,managed to pay off his house which he bought in the 90's for 75k 

He had 6 kids 

Probably worth 800k now maybe more 

Of course cost him a lot for window bars ,guard dogs etc 

 

Edited September 21 by georgegeorgia

[SAFETY FIRST]

19 minutes ago, georgegeorgia said:

Lol..Dharruk..Emerton..Bidwell

 

Yes, I had a few girlfriends from these suburbs. 

 

When I was young, I had a girlfriend who going to Plumpton high school, her parents were not bothered that I would stay over on weekends and sleep in her bed, they always made me very welcome, we even spent holidays together, travelling with mum and dad around NSW visiting her relatives. 

 

Edited September 21 by SAFETY FIRST

[Artisi]

46 minutes ago, SAFETY FIRST said:

I often wonder how that works. 

 

When I was young I had a girlfriend from Dharruk, Mt Druit. 

 

Her grandparents, her mother and father, and at the time, her sisters were having children and not having worked a day in their life. 

 

So these housing commission people are still entitled to an aged pension, never having worked?

 

Generations of unemployed families. 

 

Nothing has changed and it's not right for those of use who worked all their lives, paid off our house, educated our kids and saved a bit of cash for retirement and now get screwed for our pension because we have too many assets and still support all the bludging ar$eholes.

[Will27]

7 minutes ago, Artisi said:

Nothing has changed and it's not right for those of use who worked all their lives, paid off our house, educated our kids and saved a bit of cash for retirement and now get screwed for our pension because we have too many assets and still support all the bludging ar$eholes.

My biggest bugbear is the 2 year qualifying period for portability. 

 

If you are eligible, it shouldn't matter where you live.

[SAFETY FIRST]

23 minutes ago, Will27 said:

My biggest bugbear is the 2 year qualifying period for portability. 

 

If you are eligible, it shouldn't matter where you live.

I reckon the government had no choice or could have done things a lot better regarding qualifying period, they were forced to change the procedures to quality. 

 

I read that some illegal immigrants came to Australia, hadn't worked a day in Australia but claimed the pension then moved back to the middle east enjoying a good income, it allowed them to live a very comfortable life in their craphole countries or region they came from. 

 

 

Edited September 21 by SAFETY FIRST

[Will27]

6 minutes ago, SAFETY FIRST said:

I reckon the government had no choice or could have done things a lot better.

 

I read that the illegal immigrants were coming to Australia, hadn't worked a day in Australia but claimed the pension then moved back to the middle east enjoying a good income, it allowed them to live a very comfortable life in their craphole countries or region they came from. 

 

You're right.

They could've done things a lot better.

 

Could've implemented a few things to try and avoid that type of thing happening.

[LosLobo]

I thought only Poms whinged about Australia.

[TroubleandGrumpy]

17 hours ago, Artisi said:

You can return anytime you like, before or after you get to pension age - however, there would be no portability for  2 years after pension being granted. 

WRONG.  If you return to Australia before getting the pension and establish residency (2 years is seen as a reasonable time) then once you do get the Pension (if qualified) you will also get portability approved - but best to check first before leaving. I know that and I did it.  Example - eligible for Pension in 2028 and return now - get Pension in 2028 and portability is approved.

 

However - once you have been overseas for a while and then return to get the Pension (if qualified) then you do have to wait 2 years before portability will be approved.  Example - eligible for Pension now/next week/month and return now - you will get the Pension now, but you must wait 2 years before portability will be approved. Fact.

[TroubleandGrumpy]

6 hours ago, Artisi said:

I  should have been more specific and said, returning "just before applying" as this is what I thought HK was implying. So I would say 2 years prior to applying, portability should be granted. 

As scorecard said, ring Centrelink Hobart - straight from the official source. 

Just replied to your earlier post - and now read this one - my bad.

 

For further clarification - although portability is basically automatic if you return 3-4 years before, or wait the 2 years period out - it is a fact that CLink can deny portability if you clearly never intended to stay in Australia once the Pension was granted. That is not easy for them to do and that decision has been over-turned several times after appeals, but several appeals have been denied by AAT because the person clearly never intended to stay (told everyone, rented room in hotel, etc etc.).

  

So anyone thinking of going back early, or when they qualify, you need to 'pretend' that you want to stay living in Australia forever. In my case the family of my Thai Wife (also an Aust Citizen) had a medical situation (genuine - her Mother had a serious operation and a Brother is still sick), so we moved here for a while/years.  

[TroubleandGrumpy]

1 hour ago, Will27 said:

My biggest bugbear is the 2 year qualifying period for portability. 

If you are eligible, it shouldn't matter where you live.

I agree - the Aust system is one where you must be a resident to be able to apply for the Pension. In order to keep the Pension while living overseas temporarily or permanent (portability)  you must be a 'Resident' and approved for Portability. Which means a Citizen or a Permanent Resident. You cannot lose Citizenship, but if you are away a long time, then Permanent Residency can be withdrawn - and you would therefore lose the Pension (and it has happened and will probably happen more). 

 

There is also a 'benefit' in regards to Thailand taxation of the Pension - the Australian Pension is only paid to residents of Australia - wherever they are living - that is why Portability (of Residence) was created.  And as per the Aust-Thai DTA, taxation of a Pension paid by one State to residents of that State, can only be taxed by that State (the State that pays the Pension). There is an exemption, and that is where the person receiving the Pension from one State is a Citizen of the other State and is living in that other State and is a tax resident.  What that means is that an Aussie living in Thailand's Pension is not taxable by Thailand, but a Thai Citizen/Resident (that part means permanent Resident) living in Thailand who is receiving an Aust Pension, can be taxed by Thailand under the DTA.  Yes I know there are some saying it is taxable, and some saying it is not - but IMO the meaning and intention is clear - the Pension is not taxable.

 

 

Edited September 21 by TroubleandGrumpy

[scorecard]

20 hours ago, Nemises said:

Are you sure? I thought that if you returned 2 years before pension age, there would be portability immediately after pension being granted. 

Do you have any reference for that?

[Nemises]

3 hours ago, scorecard said:

Do you have any reference for that?

 

Suggest you call the Centrelink International Office in Hobart on 131673 for a clear / specific answer on this point. 

[georgegeorgia]

8 minutes ago, Nemises said:

 

Suggest you call the Centrelink International Office in Hobart on 131673 for a clear / specific answer on this point. 

Do they speak english?

[georgegeorgia]

14 hours ago, TroubleandGrumpy said:

So anyone thinking of going back early, or when they qualify, you need to 'pretend' that you want to stay living in Australia forever.

Please show me a case where it's being denied because you didn't pretend to "stay" 

All the cases of appeals are public on the AAT website if you want to read all of them just type in Thailand or Philippines as a search in the website 

Once you hit 67 and got the OAP  you can go overseas no need to pretend 

Anyone who wants to read the appeals head to the AAT federal tribunal website there's a stack of them 

Edited September 21 by georgegeorgia

[rhodie]

6 hours ago, scorecard said:

Do you have any reference for that?

 

It's 10 years ago now, but I have a friend who was in the Philippines for 15 years and returned at age 63. Was on Newstart for 2 years until he got the pension at 65 and left to return to the Philippines with portability.