Kevin Quill Sent Back To Prison For Six Years

[breezein]

I have read several of your posts most of which seem to be posted arter the bars close maybe that is why you come accross like a loud mouthed WakNRe

No, it's just that, like many great thinkers, I get my inspired ideas late at nite (or early in the morning)

As for the Thai justice system, sure, it is corrupt to the core! Everybody knows that, especially someone who does business in Thailand. Kevin certainly knew it...likely benefited from this corruption on occasion when running his business (when paying off officials for business licenses or paying the coppers to stay open late, or a million other ways). However, this same system can just as easily be used against you by your personal or business enemies. He should have set-up a plan and salted away a couple million baht in pay-off money if/when the time came that he needed to buy his way out of a jam!

If you live/work/exist in Thailand, you implicitly accept this...that justice is often for sale to the highest bidder. If you cannot accept this or live with such uncertainty or "unfairness", they one needs to return back home.

Apparently, one poster is unawares that in some justice systems, both in the West and here in Thailand, both the defendant and the prosecution can appeal a judge or jury's verdict/sentence. They are different from the English/American system where only the defendant may appeal a criminal conviction. Therefore, the fact that a reviewing court reinstated a criminal conviction is perfectly normal.

I don't understand all the posters who say the justice system doesn't compare to those in the West. Of course it doesn't, it isn't in the West. Nobody seriously expects it too. And by the way, injustices and corruptions of justice of justice are certainly not unknown in those "civilized" countries also. Just witness the many persons who have been released from America's Death Row after years (sometimes decades) of incarceration due to DNA evidence that proved their innocence.

THAT WAS A FAIR ENOUGH REPLY.

[Jingthing]

Jing...I think your heart is getting the better of your head in this case...but your sentiments are noble.

I think not.

This is what I think: In Thailand, even more than the west, big money talks and smaller money rots in prison.

To the family and British government, please fight on to save this man's life.

While people moralize about how he is not perfect, he is now in a living hel_l.

If we as farangs are not going to stick up for a fellow farang who has shown strong evidence that he was framed, WHO is?

Edited April 12, 2008 by Jingthing

[jonniebkk]

Jing...I think your heart is getting the better of your head in this case...but your sentiments are noble.

I think not.

This is what I think: In Thailand, even more than the west, big money talks and smaller money rots in prison.

And the sun rises in the East every morning...tell us something we don't already know.

If we as farangs are not going to stick up for a fellow farang who has shown strong evidence that he was framed, WHO is?

Well then I guess we have a basic philosophical difference. Apparently, you feel that when a judgment rendered by a court or jury doesn't comport with what you or the defendant thinks is "justice" then one is obliged to continue fighting until you get a more favorable outcome. Fortunately, that is not the way things work, or else there would be no closure in any justice system.

The West, and Thailand too, have court systems for hearing criminal and civil cases. Evidence is presented and tested and a judgment by a jury or the court is rendered. This judgment may be reviewed by higher courts. At some point, a final judgment is rendered and that is the end of it. One party is going to be disappointed - this is a given. However, justice will have been served.

Now, even after the court system has rendered its verdict, most systems provide one final safety valve - the power of clemency or pardon. I only know about the US and Thailand, but both have this...in the US, the President can pardon anyone of any federal criminal offense post-conviction for any reason. In Thailand, it is my understanding the His Majesty the King has similar powers (and often uses them to commute the sentences of those convicted of capital crimes to life in prison).

[Jingthing]

In Thailand, it is my understanding the His Majesty the King has similar powers (and often uses them to commute the sentences of those convicted of capital crimes to life in prison).

I have heard royal pardons are only given to those who have admitted guilt. Is this true? If so, there is no hope for this man because he will never admit guilt.

I disagree with you on your basic premise. There are organizations in different parts of the world fighting to overturn WRONGFUL convictions. I personally think this might be one of them and I am not the only person who thinks this.

You keep talking as if this is a normal everyday case. It is not. It is one of most sensational cases (when you also consider the murder of the other business partner) of the decade in Thailand. It is very exceptional. I suspect there might be a major movie about the case, it is that special, and I hope there is a happy ending (but it ain't looking that way now).

Edited April 12, 2008 by Jingthing

[JonnieB]

This is an old case that was closed years ago. I think there was also a fire at one of his hotels where one of his dancers died. Suspicion was that was no accident either.

Edited April 12, 2008 by JonnieB

[Jingthing]

This is an old case that was closed years ago. I think there was also a fire at one of his hotels where one of his dancers died. Suspicion was that was no accident either.

Sure, its an old case. As is the yaba charge. It wasn't a dancer who died, it was a business partner (same as KQ) and not an accident:

In 1990, Ian MacDonald, a 28-year-old from a wealthy Inverness family and a major investor in "Boyz, Boyz, Boyz", was found burned to death in the Ambiance Hotel in Pattaya, which is co-owned by Lumsden and May. The blaze was confined to the room MacDonald died in and the fingers of both his hands had been hacked off.

[britmaveric]

Well what goes around comes around - perhaps he's innocent of this, but just a case of getting him for his past indiscretions?

[Jingthing]

Anyway, if it is his fate to rot and likely die in jail, I suppose I hope he really is guilty.

[bangkokrick]

The whole case stinks and one has to feel sorry for this guy.

I suppose he was lucky that he wasn't murdered like the other bloke!

Doing business in Thailand is fraught with danger and the number of sad stories i have heard over the years beggars belief.

But there are always fresh guys ready to throw their money around and get ripped off and with the internet these days the lines are getting ever longer.

I think many foreigners just don't understand Thais or Thailand until they have been in Thailand for a fairly good length of time. Unfortunately for many by the time they work things ;out all their money is gone.

I remember the lady in the Kasikron Bank in Pattaya telling me rather matter of factly how many farangs came to Thailand with big money and how they opened accounts at ther branch and that the money eventually dwindled away.

She saw it on a daily basis.

You have to feel a lot of compassion for this guy because we can all make mistakes and be vulnerable but he seems to have been the victim of a deliverate attempt to strip him of all his assets and incarcerate him as well.

I have known kevin for 20 years and you will never meet a nicer guy. He is a self made very wealthy business man and he made is money from the pub trade and that alone. He has never and would never deal in drugs and he was definitely set up. I have discussed this situation with him many times and i believe that he is totally innocent.

Why would a multi millionare risk his wealth for a few yaba tablets? The police opened one packet from the case which contained yaba the rest of the packets were left unopened and all the packets were sealed.

He was cleared of everything in the last trial, so how the hel_l can they overturn that verdict. His only crime was to stop paying the bent policeman and for the 'Hang him high" crowd this can happen to anyone here in Thailand so beware. The whole case stinks and i only hope that he can at least serve the time in an English prison then he might at least survive.

[mikethevigoman]

Cigarette smuggling was obviously a crime and a stupid crime,

Taking 170 cartons of cigarettes out of Thailand is not a crime. It becomes a crime in your own country when you try to enter without declaring them. As long as all relevant taxes were paid on these cigarettes the Thai authorities would not be interested (unless of course somebody planted 100 yaba tablets inside a packet then they would become very interested as this now becomes a nice little earner)

I left bangkok airport with a friend a while back, he stopped at one of the booths and asked the girl what the allowance was for the uk,she replied 200, he then proceeded to buy 2000, no problem, they couldnt give a toss,.i feel kevin quill was set up,.why would they even bother to check inside packets of cigarettes unless they had information that led them to beleive there may be more to it, the guy i mentioned above was actually stopped at uk customs and his cigarettes were conviscated, they did not open one packet,i witnessed this, he was warned of his allowance and we were on our way in minutes, i smell a big rat and although i dont know kevin quill there is something wrong here for sure,.one of 2 things caused his downfall,he either told someone he did it,or as i suspect they were planted,either way he was grassed up or set up,.i think the latter, i wonder how many packets the police had to open before finding the bad carton,.was the packet marked,?. i suppose we will never know, more proof that greed and jealousy is alive and well in thailand,. Edited April 13, 2008 by mikethevigoman

[okay]

I have to say after reading most of the comments on this topic or should i say this mans life,, the fact that you are all forgetting is that Mr Quill has been found not guilty previously and has been allowed to invest more money in businesses in pattaya without any objections been raised by authorities in thailand.

Some of you say Mr Quill got what was coming to him as he had done things in his past and what goes aroung come around, what a load of crap. Mr Quill had never been involved or accused of drug crime in all his year in the UK owning several clubs and pubs. And in all our past we have done things wrong but it doesnt mean that we should accept been fitted up and sent to a hel_l hole prison for a crime you didnt commit and say well I accept it because of my past. Mr Quill getting cancer is a life sentence of its own.

I think the thing that sticks out the most about this is Mr Quill clearly has money, buisness ect so why smuggle less than £100 worth of anfetamine - and that fact that it was noted that the police only open 1 pack of the cigs and found the drugs and left the rest. All the stories from over the years confrim that Lumsden & May have been involed and convicted of various crimes and since in thialand they have been able to pay there way out of thing or make them disapear (people that is). If you note police advised Mr Quill if he paid £16000 this problem would go away would you be willing to do this if you were 100% not guilty i know i wouldnt and neither did Quill. The two men that instigated this whole chain of events will do anything to gain money, property and power and many people dont realise what they are capable of or what they have done to previous victims.

They in total have managed to earn themselves over 1 million of other peoples money and thats only the cases that have been reported on, it starting when they first lived in scotland and it became easy for them when in thailand as police and other authorities are so corrupt you can pay your way out of situations and for backs to be turned when people turn up dead or just never at all.

I could go on all day about this topic as I as may other know that Mr Quill in an inocent man and now not a very well man who faces an uncertain future.

[mikethevigoman]

Jing...I think your heart is getting the better of your head in this case...but your sentiments are noble.

I think not.

This is what I think: In Thailand, even more than the west, big money talks and smaller money rots in prison.

To the family and British government, please fight on to save this man's life.

While people moralize about how he is not perfect, he is now in a living hel_l.

If we as farangs are not going to stick up for a fellow farang who has shown strong evidence that he was framed, WHO is?

im inclined to agree, the farang here are always getting the gallows ready for speeding motorists or whatever, say what you like about the thais they do not talk and act this way,..i have no feelings one way or another towards gay people but i get the feeling there are some closet queer bashers here,.whatever his sexual preferences and lifestyle were this guy was in my opinion set up, lets just comment on that,.he is some mothers son and a father, sound familiar ?

[mikethevigoman]

Is Kevin Quill originally from Halifax?

Bradford

[mikethevigoman]

The man has a credible argument for his innocence (true or not, who knows?) and you might look at throat cancer as a karmic punishment for cigarette smuggling.

Jing...I think your heart is getting the better of your head in this case...but your sentiments are noble.

As any "con" will be the first to tell you, there are no guilty men in jail...they are all innocent

There are innocent people in jails around the world...that is for sure. Being a system of rules made by and run by humans, human errors and prejudices are bound to be made. However, it is the best way we have yet devised to enforce the rules and norms of given societies. Most systems in the West and other developed societies are open and transparent, however, this still doesn't guarantee that the "right" verdict will reached. (Just ask the family of Nicole Simpson.) However, "justice," in a legal sense, was done in that case too. Justice is a system...not a preordained result.

What Kevin got was what the Thai justice system offers. It is not perfect but it is better than nothing. It is what the Thai people get and it's what all others who choose to live in the Kingdom will get to if and when they have a case in court. If one wants the protection of what they consider to be free and un-corrupt justice system if they are ever accused of a crime, they need to find another country in which to hang their hat.

Kevin was/is a 60-80 a day smoker, that will be what caused the throat cancer ,.i agree that "that is what the thai people get " .this is where we are all equal in thailand, we get the result we can afford,.

[bubblehead]

At some point, a final judgment is rendered and that is the end of it. One party is going to be disappointed - this is a given. However, justice will have been served.

Talk about naive

[actiondell4]

towards gay people but i get the feeling there are some closet queer bashers here,.

No im not a closet queer basher,because i am queer myself,but if he didnt smuggle the cigs he wouldnt of got caught,dont do the crime if your not prepared to do the time.

We all know not to smuggle ciggarettes,its a crime,he risked it,they found yaba in some packets,it wouldnt be the first time he smuggled ciggarettes now would it?He went thru 8 diiferent judges and numerous trials,he got found guilty,as he would do so most probaly in the U.K

You must remember he pleaded guilty to the ciigarettes charge and was fined 600k.

Is he more important than anyone else?

Are all the judges wrong,we dont know all the evidence.

We dont know if he has warnings and priors before in Thailand .

Where are the U.K Politicians ,there not speaking out.

[wongamat20]

Wasnt this guy (allegidly) involved in blackmailing some Scotish judge some years ago, who was a closet gay!!!

[bangkokrick]

Wasnt this guy (allegidly) involved in blackmailing some Scotish judge some years ago, who was a closet gay!!!

No he was not. He is a self made millionaire. Where do you get this crap from?

[wongamat20]

Know him well do you! Seem so certain! Give me 30 mins to have a search

[bangkokrick]

Know him well do you! Seem so certain! Give me 30 mins to have a search

Yes i do and you can search all you like. He is innocent and was aquited in the previous trial.

[wongamat20]

Sorry if he is innocent - but i am sure i read somewhere that he earned his miiion by the Scotish affair and thats why he left scotland and ended up in thailand.

Ok tell me he isnt from Edingurgh/Scotland

[bangkokrick]

Sorry if he is innocent - but i am sure i read somewhere that he earned his miiion by the Scotish affair and thats why he left scotland and ended up in thailand.

Ok tell me he isnt from Edingurgh/Scotland

He is from Bradford, West yorkshire.

[wongamat20]

Didnt ever live or work in Edinbrugh

[bangkokrick]

Didnt ever live or work in Edinbrugh

Nope

[wongamat20]

Ok, sorry you if i am wrong and i genuinely wish him some good eventual outcome. Must be a truly hard thing to go through

[mikethevigoman]

towards gay people but i get the feeling there are some closet queer bashers here,.

No im not a closet queer basher,because i am queer myself,but if he didnt smuggle the cigs he wouldnt of got caught,dont do the crime if your not prepared to do the time.

We all know not to smuggle ciggarettes,its a crime,he risked it,they found yaba in some packets,it wouldnt be the first time he smuggled ciggarettes now would it?He went thru 8 diiferent judges and numerous trials,he got found guilty,as he would do so most probaly in the U.K

You must remember he pleaded guilty to the ciigarettes charge and was fined 600k.

Is he more important than anyone else?

Are all the judges wrong,we dont know all the evidence.

We dont know if he has warnings and priors before in Thailand .

Where are the U.K Politicians ,there not speaking out.

my comments werent directed at any individual, however to say he deserves what he got for smuggling cigarettes i agree, a 600.000 baht fine, end of story,.however there is more to this, ( i cant name one person that has never taken over his allowance through customs, i know i have,),but do you really feel this conviction is safe and that his story is 100 per cent fabrication ?..

[bubblehead]

towards gay people but i get the feeling there are some closet queer bashers here,.

No im not a closet queer basher,because i am queer myself,but if he didnt smuggle the cigs he wouldnt of got caught,dont do the crime if your not prepared to do the time.

He didn't smuggle any cigarettes

[Kerryd]

towards gay people but i get the feeling there are some closet queer bashers here,.

No im not a closet queer basher,because i am queer myself,but if he didnt smuggle the cigs he wouldnt of got caught,dont do the crime if your not prepared to do the time.

He didn't smuggle any cigarettes

"Quill remained locked up in Chonburi prison for a number of months, during which time he had plenty of time to think. Maintaining his relative innocence (he admitted to the cigarettes but denied knowledge of the drugs)"

Of course, the obvious explanation is that a 2 pack a day man just felt the need to keep just over 2 1/3 years supply of smokes on hand (the article mentions 170 cartons, which normally have 10 packs per carton, but also mentions 3,400 packages, which would equal 20 packs per carton, or enough to last just over 4 1/2 years ?)

Both sides apparently have slung accusations against the other, and no doubt there are some back-room shenanigans. But as I mentioned before, this wouldn't be the first, and won't be the last time that someone has gotten themselves into trouble and tried to lay the blame on someone else.

Maybe he is innocent (of the drug charges). Maybe he was in a cash-crunch and was looking for a quick fix (not like that's never happened before, especially in Pattaya). Maybe he tried to make a deal with the wrong people (i.e. undercover cops), and got busted (not like that's never happened before either, and would certainly explain how they knew exactly where to find the yaba).

And gees. Maybe he is ACTUALLY GUILTY ! Wow. That's never happened before, has it ? Where someone who actually did a crime got caught and sentenced ? Someone that everyone thought was such a nice guy ?

And maybe he'll be lucky, and the UK will be able to arrange a prisoner transfer. He'll get back to the UK, get treatment and probably an early release based on time served.

[thaiflyer1]

He didn't smuggle any cigarettes

He didnt need to............trust me if he was caught with cigs that had no duty paid on them i.e they had been smuggled in to Thailand then he would get done.

(I know because i was caught last August with 100 cartons of Lambert and Butlers which had been brought in from Hong Kong...........i got offered them by one of the watch sellers who then proceeded to set me up...........took me 2 days and 583k baht to get out of Lam Chabang customs offices and get the paper work torn up........fairly obvious where the "fine" money was going.................and yes i know som nom na, i/m merely posting this as a warning to others)

also.........they never managed to catch the guy who sold me them even though they were waiting at the meeting point, so that will of been another 38k i used to buy the cigs with to split between themselves

[Jingthing]

Yeah, maybe he is guilty. But maybe he is not. Just look at the behavior and motivation of the people he has accused of framing him, and at the money and power they have which as we all know buys alot here, and tell me any reasonable person wouldn't have some serious doubts. I admit my American bias, if there is doubt of guilt, you don't convict.

One detail perhaps somebody knows. In this last trial, which was bizarrely an overturn of an acquittal, I would venture to guess that charges of being framed were likely not allowed (as there was a previous successful libel case about this $$$$). It seems to me that was the only defense KQ had. This is just speculation as I have read no reports about the details of this final conviction.

Edited April 14, 2008 by Jingthing