Briton Killed In Motorcycle Crash Appeared Drunk

[sriracha john]

Briton killed in road accident in Chonburi

Chonburi - A British tourist, who appeared drunk, was killed here Sunday morning when his motorcycle crashed into an incoming motorcycle.

Police said Gavin Mann, 41, was killed at the scene. The strap of his helmet cut into his throat, police said.

The accident happened in Bang Lamung district at 6:50 am.

Boonruang Sakulma, who rode the other motorcycle, was severely injured and rushed to the Pattaya Memorial Hospital.

Witnesses told police that Gavin's motorcycle appeared to lose control and swerve and crashed into Boonrung's motorcycle on the opposite lane.

- The Nation / 2009-03-15

Edited March 15, 2009 by sriracha john

[geriatrickid]

Is it really necessary to post unsubstantiated garbage like this?

I appreciate that you feel you are doing the readers a service with your cut and paste effort, but does this mean that you have to throw away basic decency and fairplay? Most of us have zero tolerance for drinking and driving, but many of us also believe in the concept of innocent until proven guilty. The fact that the Nation printed it, does not justify repeating the allegation. The Nation isn't known for accuracy is it? For all we know, the deceased may have been diabetic, had a stroke and didn't realize what was happening, or had a neuromuscular condition that produced the slurring of speech and slight stagger (assuming anyone even saw that). Or, he just might not have been impaired. This is why there are autopsies, so that one can know for sure without destroying a person's reputation. This kind of statement wouldn't be made by a responsible news organization.

Briton killed in road accident in Chonburi

Chonburi - A British tourist, who appeared drunk, was killed here Sunday morning when his motorcycle crashed into an incoming motorcycle.- The Nation / 2009-03-15

If there were eye witness reports that the individual had been staggering, or gave off alcohol fumes, I wouldn't say anything. In the absence of substantiated eye witness statements and more importantly EVIDENCE such as a blood alcohol measurement, it is unfair to make such a statement.

[Thai at Heart]

Hear hear!

An absolutely ridiculous story for the Nation to print.

[bangkokrick]

Hear hear! i get tired of the Brit = drunk syndrome.

Cheers, Rick

[IraqRon]

Yes yes it is terrible. Of course if the Thai guy had swerved into the brit, then most on this post would be decrying the Thai culture that allows drunken yabba smoking somchais to ride bikes at all.

Maybe he was murdered due to a land deal or other biz with a Thai person, or perhaps his wife poisioned him, thus causing the crash.

[RusticCharm]

For all we know, the deceased may have been diabetic, had a stroke and didn't realize what was happening, or had a neuromuscular condition that produced the slurring of speech and slight stagger

Then he should not have been riding a bike in the first place.

[stumonster]

get tired of the Brit = drunk syndrome.

maybe

but what about "Brit = no soap" ?

[samuibeachcomber]

the OP is just posting a news worthy article,whats all the fuss about.!

[Maigo6]

If it had been a Thai guy that had been seen to swerve across the road killing himself and severely injuring the British guy there would have been 300 Posts slamming Thai people with no objections to SRJ's post at all.

I see nothing wrong with SRJ's post. Besides, most Farangs I know drink and drive, be it motorcycle or car, so whats new.

I know, I know, Thai Visa members never drink and drive, I'm on about the real world, not the make believe world of Farangs after they reinvent themselves on an anonymous Internet forum.

[caf]

the OP is just posting a news worthy article,whats all the fuss about.!

the point the posters are making - and making quite clearly - is that these are unsubstantiated "facts" from a usually unrelaible source. we are not the judge and jury. wait for the real facts and don't support the promulgation of rumours.

[Thai at Heart]

Statements like "appeared" are complete opinion. That is the issue. Reproducing it I have no problem with.

Appearing drunk is not relevant. He either was or he wasn't, that is the issue.

[Neeranam]

If it had been a Thai guy that had been seen to swerve across the road killing himself and severely injuring the British guy there would have been 300 Posts slamming Thai people with no objections to SRJ's post at all.

I see nothing wrong with SRJ's post. Besides, most Farangs I know drink and drive, be it motorcycle or car, so whats new.

I know, I know, Thai Visa members never drink and drive, I'm on about the real world, not the make believe world of Farangs after they reinvent themselves on an anonymous Internet forum.

I certainly never drink and drive - you should chose you friends more carefully

SJ's post is OK for a moderator.

Edited March 15, 2009 by Neeranam

[Maigo6]

If it had been a Thai guy that had been seen to swerve across the road killing himself and severely injuring the British guy there would have been 300 Posts slamming Thai people with no objections to SRJ's post at all.

I see nothing wrong with SRJ's post. Besides, most Farangs I know drink and drive, be it motorcycle or car, so whats new.

I know, I know, Thai Visa members never drink and drive, I'm on about the real world, not the make believe world of Farangs after they reinvent themselves on an anonymous Internet forum.

I certainly never drink and drive - you should chose you friends more carefully

SJ pos is OK for a moderator.

Do I ask them to fill out a questionaire to see if they are suitable candidates ?

I'm stating a fact, and the fact that you don't drink and drive is neither here nor there.

I refer to the group as a whole, not the individual who may not drink and drive, or, as in your case, does not drink at all under any circumstances, driving, riding or walking.

[loong]

get tired of the Brit = drunk syndrome.

maybe

but what about "Brit = no soap" ?

Yes, I'm a Brit and quite often have this no soap problem. I have to leave the bathroom and get some more.

Maybe because we Brits use soap and don't think it's a bathroom decoration, unlike some other Nats.

But that's off topic,

Posters here seemed to have focused on the "appeared drunk"...

Well, unless the rider had been observed for some time driving erratically, I can't see how anybody can say he appeared drunk. Witnesses, so it seems, only saw him lose control and so have nothing to base this assumption on.

I have seen many farang lose control of their rented motorbikes, usually because they are not used to them, not because they are drunk.

The last one I saw was a farang on one of those automatics. He was waiting to pull out of a side turning and decided to rev the throttle. Of course the bike shot across the road, but luckily for him, missed the traffic and hit a post on the other side. Only his pride and his pocket hurt.

[samuibeachcomber]

the OP is just posting a news worthy article,whats all the fuss about.!

the point the posters are making - and making quite clearly - is that these are unsubstantiated "facts" from a usually unrelaible source. we are not the judge and jury. wait for the real facts and don't support the promulgation of rumours.

my point is "why choose this particular post to get all moralistic"there have been many topics where an article has been posted with unsubstantiated evidence,and not a murmer of dissent regarding proof in an article.

[Maigo6]

the OP is just posting a news worthy article,whats all the fuss about.!

the point the posters are making - and making quite clearly - is that these are unsubstantiated "facts" from a usually unrelaible source. we are not the judge and jury. wait for the real facts and don't support the promulgation of rumours.

my point is "why choose this particular post to get all moralistic"there have been many topics where an article has been posted with unsubstantiated evidence,and not a murmer of dissent regarding proof in an article.

If it was a Thai guy that had been killed and a Brit seriously injured, the Thai guy and the rest of the Thai population would have been tried, convicted and sentenced by now by the very people that now take the moralistic high ground cos it's a Farang.

[Thai at Heart]

the OP is just posting a news worthy article,whats all the fuss about.!

the point the posters are making - and making quite clearly - is that these are unsubstantiated "facts" from a usually unrelaible source. we are not the judge and jury. wait for the real facts and don't support the promulgation of rumours.

my point is "why choose this particular post to get all moralistic"there have been many topics where an article has been posted with unsubstantiated evidence,and not a murmer of dissent regarding proof in an article.

If it was a Thai guy that had been killed and a Brit seriously injured, the Thai guy and the rest of the Thai population would have been tried, convicted and sentenced by now by the very people that now take the moralistic high ground cos it's a Farang.

Writing "probably" drunk in a blog, is a completely different issue from printing "apparently" drunk in a newspaper. Or is it to be taken that all news presented in the Nation should be presumed to be an opinion piece?

I mean why should reporting facts get in the way of a story, or is the Nation apparently not a NEWSpaper?

[DeathbyDurian]

Why all the bickering?

A man died.

RIP

[samuibeachcomber]

Why all the bickering?

A man died.

RIP

true and yes may he RIP.however if i had died eating a durian would it be right to assume i was drunk at the time.......................probably!

[ballpoint]

the OP is just posting a news worthy article,whats all the fuss about.!

the point the posters are making - and making quite clearly - is that these are unsubstantiated "facts" from a usually unrelaible source. we are not the judge and jury. wait for the real facts and don't support the promulgation of rumours.

my point is "why choose this particular post to get all moralistic"there have been many topics where an article has been posted with unsubstantiated evidence,and not a murmer of dissent regarding proof in an article.

If it was a Thai guy that had been killed and a Brit seriously injured, the Thai guy and the rest of the Thai population would have been tried, convicted and sentenced by now by the very people that now take the moralistic high ground cos it's a Farang.

Precisely. The double standards on this forum are very obvious. If the article said "drunken Thai crashes into British tourist" we'd have twice the number of posts here, all either claiming that it was typical Thai behaviour, or demanding the Thai be locked up. Or both. I had to laugh at the "wait for the real facts and don't support the promulgation of rumours" though. Even though I agree, since when has that stopped a thread about someone you don't know in a case where very little facts are known from reaching over 20 pages? Not when it comes to Swede T-shirt thieves, bodyless Russian/Greek/British/Italian heads, abusive drunken Aussies and swearing Brits it hasn't.

Edited March 15, 2009 by ballpoint

[eastlight]

Briton killed in road accident in Chonburi

Chonburi - A British tourist, who appeared drunk, was killed here Sunday morning when his motorcycle crashed into an incoming motorcycle.

Police said Gavin Mann, 41, was killed at the scene. The strap of his helmet cut into his throat, police said.

The accident happened in Bang Lamung district at 6:50 am.

Boonruang Sakulma, who rode the other motorcycle, was severely injured and rushed to the Pattaya Memorial Hospital.

Witnesses told police that Gavin's motorcycle appeared to lose control and swerve and crashed into Boonrung's motorcycle on the opposite lane.

- The Nation / 2009-03-15

'Apparently drunk' at 6.50 AM?

[zaphodbeeblebrox]

The strap of his helmet cut into his throat, police said.

To me, this was the interesting part of the story. Of course, the exact cause of death won't be known without an autopsy.

If they are going to require compliance with a helmet law, don't allow those spit buckets frequently worn by cyclists satisfy the law. Require motorcyclists to wear proper DOT-certified full-faced helmets. Condolences to the friends and families of the victim.

[loong]

Precisely. The double standards on this forum are very obvious. If the article said "drunken Thai crashes into British tourist" we'd have twice the number of posts here, all either claiming that it was typical Thai behaviour, or demanding the Thai be locked up. Or both. I had to laugh at the "wait for the real facts and don't support the promulgation of rumours" though. Even though I agree, since when has that stopped a thread about someone you don't know in a case where very little facts are known from reaching over 20 pages? Not when it comes to Swede T-shirt thieves, bodyless Russian/Greek/British/Italian heads, abusive drunken Aussies and swearing Brits it hasn't.

If the article said "drunken Thai crashes into British tourist" it would be reporting the FACT that the Driver was drunk.

If the article said "drunken British tourist crashes into Thai " then there would be the Brit brashers all clamouring for him to be locked up and the key thrown away.

[Texpat]

Couldn't they merely allow his nationality to make the obvious references?

Redundancy is a poor literary device.

[johnyb]

Gentleman and lady,s

I am a newby on the forum,but read thai-visa news more than 8 years.

Sometimes i am wondering the comments from the members.I didnd see a toppic without crittics .

Why are you a member,to spit out your anger or are you all bored and now better.

the moderators dooing a good job and hope they go on with bringing the news.

[Scott]

My deepest sympathies to the family and friends of both the deceased and the other victim.

[ballpoint]

Precisely. The double standards on this forum are very obvious. If the article said "drunken Thai crashes into British tourist" we'd have twice the number of posts here, all either claiming that it was typical Thai behaviour, or demanding the Thai be locked up. Or both. I had to laugh at the "wait for the real facts and don't support the promulgation of rumours" though. Even though I agree, since when has that stopped a thread about someone you don't know in a case where very little facts are known from reaching over 20 pages? Not when it comes to Swede T-shirt thieves, bodyless Russian/Greek/British/Italian heads, abusive drunken Aussies and swearing Brits it hasn't.

If the article said "drunken Thai crashes into British tourist" it would be reporting the FACT that the Driver was drunk.

If the article said "drunken British tourist crashes into Thai " then there would be the Brit brashers all clamouring for him to be locked up and the key thrown away.

You missed the point of my post. If the Thai had have been seen as at fault, there would be no difference if the post read "drunk" or "apparently drunk", he would have already been sentenced by many of the posters here, and would not be receiving the benefit of doubt that many are giving to this British guy.

[loong]

Precisely. The double standards on this forum are very obvious. If the article said "drunken Thai crashes into British tourist" we'd have twice the number of posts here, all either claiming that it was typical Thai behaviour, or demanding the Thai be locked up. Or both. I had to laugh at the "wait for the real facts and don't support the promulgation of rumours" though. Even though I agree, since when has that stopped a thread about someone you don't know in a case where very little facts are known from reaching over 20 pages? Not when it comes to Swede T-shirt thieves, bodyless Russian/Greek/British/Italian heads, abusive drunken Aussies and swearing Brits it hasn't.

If the article said "drunken Thai crashes into British tourist" it would be reporting the FACT that the Driver was drunk.

If the article said "drunken British tourist crashes into Thai " then there would be the Brit brashers all clamouring for him to be locked up and the key thrown away.

You missed the point of my post. If the Thai had have been seen as at fault, there would be no difference if the post read "drunk" or "apparently drunk", he would have already been sentenced by many of the posters here, and would not be receiving the benefit of doubt that many are giving to this British guy.

Then you should have phrased it "Thai crashes into British tourist - the Thai driver appeared drunk " and not "drunken Thai crashes into British tourist"

Actually, I do agree with you that in this situation, the Thai would probably not be given the benefit of the doubt.

[BSJ]

It's sad to hear of one dying so young... whatever the circumstances.

[Chaimai]

RIP to the deceased.

I see nothing wrong with the post - I see hundreds like it where the news report has (quite rightly) been posted verbatim. If there is any issue it should be with the 'quality' of the Nation's reporting. Here, and in several other publications, there is a case for better factual reporting.

The fact also remains that readers are attracted by sensationalist headlines - evidence the UK soap culture and the sales figures for The Sun newspaper.

"Briton killed in road accident, not all facts yet established" does not have the same 'selling power'.