Is It Unlawful That Teachers Hit Students ?

[THAIPHUKET]

I posed the question in the Phuket forum, didn't get a clear legal answer. Not an answer who believes to know something.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...view=getnewpost

Any citation of the applicable law will be helpful.

[Mario2008]

Moved to teaching forum.

Hitting students is illegal, that is why I just tickle them, but as to the article in the law.....

[Scott]

Hopefully someone will be able to give the actual law.

I know it's illegal. We recently suspended a teacher (with pay), investigated the incident and then dismissed him.

We have Thai teachers who routinely give a slight smack on the hand with a ruler. Usually the student is told to put his hand out, palm up and then he is smacked. This seems to be OK, but foreign teachers don't do it.

[otherstuff1957]

About 5 years ago corporal punishment was banned in Thai schools. I remember reading that teachers could still spank students, but only if they had the parents' prior consent.

Personally, I think the corporal punishment is counter-productive and usually has more to do with the teachers current emotional state than the severity of the perceived behavioral problem. Furthermore, it teachers kids that they only have to behave well when an adult is going to hit them if they misbehave. So, when kids get into a class with a farang who 1) isn't going to hit them and 2) can't talk to their parents, they usually take it as a license to run amok!

Of course, when you remember that most teachers in government schools have classes with 50 or more students, you can understand why they resort to it!

[Scott]

I remember the 'good ol' days' here in Thailand when kids were routinely wacked. All I ever had to do was pick up a ruler and there was instant order. I felt more powerful than Merlin the Magician with a magic wand! I never used the ruler, but from the effect of just carrying one, it was pretty obvious the students knew the power it had!

Personally, I prefer mental torture, threats and intimidation.

[allane]

I don't claim that this a legally precise answer, but I doubt that there is a law specifically applicable to students. Presumably, they are protected by the same law as any one else.

[Ijustwannateach]

I believe it is against either some law or some regulation regarding Thai public schools that teachers are not now allowed to hit students. This was explained to me a number of years ago in a somewhat rural school. Nevertheless, parents at that school nearly unanimously requested that the teachers continue to use corporal punishment, and at the time I worked there, they did so.

[PeaceBlondie]

Reminder: this TV Teaching Forum has extra rules, including "3. It is inflammatory to refer to teachers in general or groups of teachers (by age, nationality, ethnicity, age, sexual preference, religion, or gender) in negative terms. It is also inflammatory to refer to the group of posters on this forum in negative terms. You may relate anecdotes about individual teachers who specifically deserve criticism in relation to some part of their identity as listed above, but such remarks should be carefully considered. The moderators reserve the right to determine if such statements about individual teachers remain on the forum."

Stop me if you've heard this: My twin girls broke some serious rule at their middle school. The vice-principal got ready to paddle them on their rumps. They said he couldn't paddle them because it was against MY religion. The Vice-Principal was found guilty of statutory rape of other girls.

[elkangorito]

If the Child Protection Act of 2003 is in force, it is illegal to hit a child.

The act can be downloaded as a PDF from the following site;

http://www.unhcr.org/refworld/type,LEGISLA...6b2f91f2,0.html

Once downloaded, do a search for the word "torture" within the document.

[hansnl]

Moved to teaching forum.

Hitting students is illegal, that is why I just tickle them, but as to the article in the law.....

I just wonder.

Since a new principal started his tenure on the school where my daughter is now in Mathyom 5, some, in my eyes, very stupid things happened.

- The hair of the girls needed to be shortened to the old "military" style, while before the school did not sport any rule about the length of the hair,

- Some teachers started to clip the hair of the girls who, in their eyes, wore the hair too long.

- Some teachers started to hit the pupils.

Also since the new principal started, the new semester started, and the pupils had to spend 3 days outside the classrooms, because the rostering was not ready.

Personally I cannot escape the idea that the quality of the teaching has markedly gone down.

Any ideas about the above?

[PeaceBlondie]

In our northern Thai matayom schools, 2003-2005, girls with short hair were punished. Vice-versa for the boys, and boys in M4/5/6 could wear their hair near the collar.

[Firelily]

As far as I know, the rules leave it up to school principals to set the requirements on hair.

[makavelithedon]

I believe it is against either some law or some regulation regarding Thai public schools that teachers are not now allowed to hit students. This was explained to me a number of years ago in a somewhat rural school. Nevertheless, parents at that school nearly unanimously requested that the teachers continue to use corporal punishment, and at the time I worked there, they did so.

Yeh, and good on um!

In regard the hair cutting business, why is it that so many western parents appear to be against strict discipline? It's also not lost on me that some of the most prestigious and expensive schools (with maxed out enrollment) on the planet are also the strictest!

Perhaps if some of these useless parents did their job and held a minuscule amount of responsibility for their own children, teachers wouldn't have to resort so much to a tap on the hand which now constitutes 'torture' and western society would be in a better moral state than it is at this sorry time.

Edited August 10, 2009 by makavelithedon

[Scott]

The use of corporal punishment isn't permitted in Thailand.

Parents are by nature protective, it's what we do with our children--protect them. Sometimes overprotective, but that is a far less severe problem that parents that don't protect their children.

Corporal punishment brings the worst out in both parents and teachers and ultimately causes problems.

Students need discipline and there are a lot of alternative measures that are much less controversial and much less likely to get anyone in trouble.

[Scott]

If anyone knows the specific law that applies, please post it. However, let's not let this thread degenerate into the rights and wrongs of corporal punishment/teachers/parents or how hard can I hit them before it's against the law.

[elkangorito]

If the Child Protection Act of 2003 is in force, it is illegal to hit a child.

The act can be downloaded as a PDF from the following site;

http://www.unhcr.org/refworld/type,LEGISLA...6b2f91f2,0.html

Once downloaded, do a search for the word "torture" within the document.

If anyone knows the specific law that applies, please post it. However, let's not let this thread degenerate into the rights and wrongs of corporal punishment/teachers/parents or how hard can I hit them before it's against the law.

If the Child Protection Act is still in force, it is therefore the law.

Edited August 10, 2009 by elkangorito

[Mario2008]

If the Child Protection Act of 2003 is in force, it is illegal to hit a child.

The act can be downloaded as a PDF from the following site;

http://www.unhcr.org/refworld/type,LEGISLA...6b2f91f2,0.html

Once downloaded, do a search for the word "torture" within the document.

Hitting a child does not constitues torture. Torture requires much more.

[elkangorito]

If the Child Protection Act of 2003 is in force, it is illegal to hit a child.

The act can be downloaded as a PDF from the following site;

http://www.unhcr.org/refworld/type,LEGISLA...6b2f91f2,0.html

Once downloaded, do a search for the word "torture" within the document.

Hitting a child does not constitues torture. Torture requires much more.

According to the Act, "torture" is used as a definition...not your definition.

[Mario2008]

If the Child Protection Act of 2003 is in force, it is illegal to hit a child.

The act can be downloaded as a PDF from the following site;

http://www.unhcr.org/refworld/type,LEGISLA...6b2f91f2,0.html

Once downloaded, do a search for the word "torture" within the document.

Hitting a child does not constitues torture. Torture requires much more.

According to the Act, "torture" is used as a definition...not your definition.

In international law the term torture is used for very serious cases. I must say the definition of the child protection act is less rigid:

"Torture" means any commission or omission of acts which cause the deprivation of freedom of, or mental or physical harm to, a child; sexual abuses committed against a child; inducement of a child to act or behave in a manner which is likely to be mentally or physically harmful to the child, unlawful or immoral, regardless of the child's consent.

But it still doesn't say that hitting a child is torture. One can interpret it as to the meaning that only serious cases are deemed illegal, but a smack on the but not. That would be practise in according with a lot of other countries.

[elkangorito]

If the Child Protection Act of 2003 is in force, it is illegal to hit a child.

The act can be downloaded as a PDF from the following site;

http://www.unhcr.org/refworld/type,LEGISLA...6b2f91f2,0.html

Once downloaded, do a search for the word "torture" within the document.

Hitting a child does not constitues torture. Torture requires much more.

According to the Act, "torture" is used as a definition...not your definition.

In international law the term torture is used for very serious cases. I must say the definition of the child protection act is less rigid:

"Torture" means any commission or omission of acts which cause the deprivation of freedom of, or mental or physical harm to, a child; sexual abuses committed against a child; inducement of a child to act or behave in a manner which is likely to be mentally or physically harmful to the child, unlawful or immoral, regardless of the child's consent.

But it still doesn't say that hitting a child is torture. One can interpret it as to the meaning that only serious cases are deemed illegal, but a smack on the but not. That would be practise in according with a lot of other countries.

I don't know about you Mario but the bolded & underlined part above says it all for me.

Edited August 10, 2009 by elkangorito

[Scott]

I'll leave this thread open for a while, but we have moved away from the law pertaining to hitting students, into some more general rules from the UN. If someone has the law, please post it, otherwise, the thread will be closed.

5.....4.....3....

[elkangorito]

I'll leave this thread open for a while, but we have moved away from the law pertaining to hitting students, into some more general rules from the UN. If someone has the law, please post it, otherwise, the thread will be closed.

5.....4.....3....

Scott. The Child Protection Act may be on a UN site but it has the King's endorsement. I do acknowledge that this may not constitute the reality as of today (10/8/09) but it does appear to be the only availble information regarding children in Thailand (via internet).

[elkangorito]

I've just found another interesting link.

From The Ministry of Foreign Affairs - Kingdom of Thailand.

http://www.mfa.go.th/web/24.php

Another important achievement is the enactment of the Child Protection Act which came into effect on 30 March 2004 which is intended to provide protection for children from all forms of abuses, exploitation, violence and gross negligence by clearly stipulating that any child below the age of 18 is protected by the State.

[Mario2008]

The Child Protection act is indeed a Thai law and into force.

Having been very active in the child rights movement I don't disagree witht he fact that children should not receive corporal punishment, but as to the interpretation of the law I beg to differ with you.

[elkangorito]

To me, it's quite simple...belting a child with a stick is "physically harmful".

[lectito]

A couple of websites mention a "Ministry of Education Regulation on Student Punishment (2005)" which bans corporal punishment.

I can't find the actual regulation - perhaps someone fluent in reading Thai might be able to find it and confirm whether it does ban corporal punishment, or whether it allows it in some circumstances?

[Rhys]

You're just going to have to bite the bullet on this one.. it is such a hassle, and this is a no win situation..because it comes down to dealing with the parents, and in their eyes... you did wrong.. So leave it..alone.. my 2 cents..

[elkangorito]

To me, it's quite simple...belting a child with a stick is "physically harmful".

...and therefore illegal.

[THAIPHUKET]

Gentlemen, I am very happy that the discussion led to a constructive result=

substantive information about a child's right, not a clear cut legal opinion, that is never to be expected but at least something one can work with.

One point I like to add= hits can be forgotten------------- fear, however is much stronger in its affect, may cause life long insecurities , phobia in a child.

Thank you for your contributions, thank you Elkangorito for digging out some important quotations

[elkangorito]

Gentlemen, I am very happy that the discussion led to a constructive result=

substantive information about a child's right, not a clear cut legal opinion, that is never to be expected but at least something one can work with.

One point I like to add= hits can be forgotten------------- fear, however is much stronger in its affect, may cause life long insecurities , phobia in a child.

Thank you for your contributions, thank you Elkangorito for digging out some important quotations

A pleasure TP.

I also agree with your comments about "fear".

Far too many people seem to think that belting children will "do them good". In my opinion, it does nothing but waste energy & can make the person being belted, learn to dislike (fear) others.