How To Stop The Million Man March Legitimately

[rixalex]

I cant be bothered to look back and see who was in power before Thaksin.

[Mario2008]

Funny comment deleted. We sure can do with a good laugh in the current political situation, but it was totally off topic and will derail the discussion.

[jdinasia]

TonyWebster

I see again you resort to obfuscation instead of dealing with the points raised.

"the dems" have not been caught vote-buying or committing electoral fraud. I invite you to document where the leadership has been shown to participate in electoral fraud. A few dems over time HAVE been redcarded for vote buying. Your statement would be similar to painting ALL farang with the same brush by saying "the farang in Thailand ...."

Not only does Thai law differentiate between the actions of a political party's leadership and individuals, but common sense makes it obvious that they are not the same.

As for your "balanced perspective", you only suggest that the political party that is legally bound to lead the country abdicate that responsibility would not be fair to the people that voted for them (more raw votes than any other single party in the last election.)

Your speculation about future events is, while not exactly groundless, purely speculation but the fact that you ignore the questions around the issues that would be created by trying to hold new elections early AND the problems of all parties not being allowed to campaign in all areas is truly telling.

The "yellows" are not "allied" with the PAD. The PAD leads the yellows. The Democrat party has some people that also were involved in the PAD but Kasit's appointment had nothing to do with the PAD. It had everything to do with Kasit's position in the Democrat party.

As you said --- If someone posts a balanced (both sides of an argument) post then there is no need to counter it. Since you post only the Red side you will find your posts continually countered.

[MrRichard2009]

My cab driver from the airport yesterday was a red shirt, and he was ready, willing and mentally prepared to die for his cause. He seemed to think a huge number of people will come and they all know it's their last chance\stand. His goal was not to protest but to overthrow the government at any cost. I don't know about all the others but this guy, an ex army guy, was talking mostly about how many armed people would come, death, ect. The whole tone of his conversation was about what he perceived as the inevitable violence.

[rixalex]

His goal was not to protest but to overthrow the government at any cost.

Funny how they are fighting against the over-throwing of a government they supported but would be quite happy if they could manage the same feat against one they don't.

Message being, it's not coups they are against, just coups that bring down governments they support.

I don't know about all the others but this guy, an ex army guy, was talking mostly about how many armed people would come, death, ect. The whole tone of his conversation was about what he perceived as the inevitable violence.

If he is planning it, which it sounds like he is, it's hardly something he needs to perceive.

[Ulysses G.]

Message being, it's not coups they are against, just coups that bring down governments they support.

Maybe governments that they consider illegal, as they came about because of coups against governments that they supported.

[Jingthing]

It is clear red shirt violence is in the air. Which begs the question, should the Abhisit government just allow itself to be crushed by it, or do everything they can to stop it? Mob rule, someday it has got to stop. I feel the majority of people in Thailand would prefer a less than perfect Abhisit regime to a government formed by a murderous red mob.

[bendejo]

OP: the only way that would work would be to have the military running the checkpoints, as the police would use it as just another means of lining their pockets. I don't think the military brass want to see their troops used as traffic cops.

The Royal Thai Police Force is there to protect the royals and protect government officials (usually), otherwise their purpose is to collect money. Their motto should be a Thai translation of a piece of Bertoldt Brecht cynicism from Beggar's Opera: the bulging pocket makes a happy life.

Unfortunately this goes for pretty much all of the developing world.

[rixalex]

Message being, it's not coups they are against, just coups that bring down governments they support.

Maybe governments that they consider illegal, as they came about because of coups against governments that they supported.

Those who were responsible for and those who supported the over-throwing of Thaksin, like the reds, also no doubt felt they were justified in their actions and their beliefs because of what they considered illegalities in what Thaksin and his government were doing - illegalities some of which have since been corroborated by the courts. Does that make the 2006 coup acceptable?

I have heard it stated by red sympathisers that no matter what Thaksin did wrong, he should have been removed by the ballot box. The worm has indeed turned.

[jdinasia]

Message being, it's not coups they are against, just coups that bring down governments they support.

Maybe governments that they consider illegal, as they came about because of coups against governments that they supported.

That might be a valid point IF it referred to the current government, which it clearly does not. This government was elected by the MP's. The MP's were elected by the people.

[Ricardo]

Added to the fact that during the yellows crimes the dems made no attempt to condemn them and quite happliy sneaked into power on the back of their actions.

This is simply untrue.

Abhisit himself did speak out against the PAD's tactics, when they moved from peaceful protest, to occupying buildings. I remember it very clearly, and commented at the time, that this showed that the Democrats were not in direct control of the PAD.

[Moonrakers]

There is clearly no point in trying to reason with tony.

You could hit him hard over the head with a heavy fact book and he still wouldn't notice it.

[Lizard]

Why would you want to stop a march? are you against democracy? is your shirt yellow?

Thaksin was a great Prime Minister of Thailand, he wanted to get it out of it's 3rd world quagmire, and get it more like Singapore is, clean living, rode rules observed, etc. etc. etc. etc. Now this Military run country is more like a dictatorship, they can do, say and stop anything they dam_n well please. There is a lot more to it, but I might be chastised by our illustrious Thai Visa Controller, for really saying whats going on here in Thailand. You people better really get your facts right, there is going to big some huge changes made here in Thailand *deleted*

Yes for the march, no for milatary control-

You have it right I am pro RED SHIRT !!!

[Moonrakers]

Why would you want to stop a march? are you against democracy? is your shirt yellow?

Thaksin was a great Prime Minister of Thailand, he wanted to get it out of it's 3rd world quagmire, and get it more like Singapore is, clean living, rode rules observed, etc. etc. etc. etc. Now this Military run country is more like a dictatorship, they can do, say and stop anything they dam_n well please. There is a lot more to it, but I might be chastised by our illustrious Thai Visa Controller, for really saying whats going on here in Thailand. You people better really get your facts right, there is going to big some huge changes made here in Thailand when the Monarchy topples.

Yes for the march, no for milatary control-

You have it right I am pro RED SHIRT !!!

I searched your post for a single fact.

Alas, I found none.

[Ulysses G.]

Added to the fact that during the yellows crimes the dems made no attempt to condemn them and quite happliy sneaked into power on the back of their actions.

This is simply untrue.

Abhisit himself did speak out against the PAD's tactics, when they moved from peaceful protest, to occupying buildings. I remember it very clearly, and commented at the time, that this showed that the Democrats were not in direct control of the PAD.

I have a bridge for sale in Brooklyn that you might want to take a look at.

[connel707]

remember the millions that turned up to get the Berlin wall down, the velvet revolution in Czech. all wanted democracy, no matter how you look at it the guy won 3 elections, they banned his party so they set up PPP who stormed to victory again, then sacked the PM for the henous crime of making a cookery show on TV. why is Taskin a traitor becuse he works for a neighbouring country. if you had no money for hospital treatment, then some guy bring in a scheme that says for 30 baht you get all the treatment you need, saved thousands of lives including my father in law, would you note vote for him. this goverment did not get voted in democratically. if the majority want him as prime Minister then thats it end of story its democracy, Germany took away democracy from the Polish look what happened them. we went to war to give the Iraqies democracy, only after no wmd. taskin is the rightful leader of this country, so say the MAJORITY. if Mark had the most votes i would support him, but he does not simple as. ballaot box over tanks and guns anyday. taskin most farangs had never heard of Taskin until he bought in the 2 am closing then thats it hes the devil. people have the right to protest in my country why should they be stopped of marching in support of their democracy that was taken away with the barrels of tanks.

He never won his elections...he Bought them....that easy..

[connel707]

I can't think of many things more destabilizing to be honest.

There is one obvious thing............ and a properly elected government being in place before that day comes might prevent serious turmoil.

Thailand Has a properly elected government...

[Huey]

I wish they wouldn't call it a Million Man march. I went to the Million Man March, and the Million Family March, and both were peaceful demonstrations. Nothing like the barbarous savagery that jumps off when red shirt thugs get together.

[ballpoint]

I have a bridge for sale in Brooklyn that you might want to take a look at.

Really? How long have you had this illusion of owning a bridge in Brooklyn? I'd suggest you see a psychiatrist for some treatment. Or are you just trying to sell something that doesn't belong to you? I can see why you're a Thaksin supporter. A chip off the old square block.

[Ricardo]

Added to the fact that during the yellows crimes the dems made no attempt to condemn them and quite happliy sneaked into power on the back of their actions.

This is simply untrue.

Abhisit himself did speak out against the PAD's tactics, when they moved from peaceful protest, to occupying buildings. I remember it very clearly, and commented at the time, that this showed that the Democrats were not in direct control of the PAD.

I have a bridge for sale in Brooklyn that you might want to take a look at.

If we could put it into a joint-venture, with my own bridge in London, we could offer walking-tours of both great cities, and make an absolute forune !

[Jingthing]

I wish they wouldn't call it a Million Man march. I went to the Million Man March, and the Million Family March, and both were peaceful demonstrations. Nothing like the barbarous savagery that jumps off when red shirt thugs get together.

Maybe they ought to call it the Million Baht march to stoke the rumor that reds will each get a million baht gift from their dear leader should they pull off their violent revolution. That ploy may actually get them the numbers they want.

[Ulysses G.]

I have a bridge for sale in Brooklyn that you might want to take a look at.

Really? How long have you had this illusion of owning a bridge in Brooklyn? I'd suggest you see a psychiatrist for some treatment.

Something tells me that you need one more than I do.

[Huey]

I wish they wouldn't call it a Million Man march. I went to the Million Man March, and the Million Family March, and both were peaceful demonstrations. Nothing like the barbarous savagery that jumps off when red shirt thugs get together.

Maybe they ought to call it the Million Baht march to stoke the rumor that reds will each get a million baht gift from their dear leader should they pull off their violent revolution. That ploy may actually get them the numbers they want.

LOL! Awesome, my sentiments exactly, but if they did name it that they wouldn't have enough road space let alone jail space in Bangkok for the seething throngs of illiterate savages that would come pouring out of the woodwork.

[ballpoint]

I wish they wouldn't call it a Million Man march. I went to the Million Man March, and the Million Family March, and both were peaceful demonstrations. Nothing like the barbarous savagery that jumps off when red shirt thugs get together.

Maybe they ought to call it the Million Baht march to stoke the rumor that reds will each get a million baht gift from their dear leader should they pull off their violent revolution. That ploy may actually get them the numbers they want.

LOL! Awesome, my sentiments exactly, but if they did name it that they wouldn't have enough road space let alone jail space in Bangkok for the seething throngs of illiterate savages that would come pouring out of the woodwork.

Why not just name it for the numbers likely to turn up, the type of people it will attract, and what the locals will do to them if they step out of line? The thousand thug thrash.

[Colonel_Mustard]

I feel the majority of people in Thailand would prefer a less than perfect Abhisit regime to a government formed by a murderous red mob.

There's one fairly obvious way to find that out for sure.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

^ Hear hear.

[Spee]

We could do without the bickering and personal attacks.

I think the question is legitimate, why should a demonstration be prevented? It is a democratic right to voice ones opinion.

WELL POSTED MARIO WHAT EVER COLOUR YOUR SHIRT YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO VOICE YOUR OPINIONS

Agreed although it's important to keep the perspective. Respecting the rights of colors on shirts goes both ways.

Interesting anecdote perhaps, but I happened to have been working in Washington DC when the original "million man march" was held. When going to work very early in the morning before things got started, I recall being yelled at by street corner organizers, asking me "what the eff was I doing there."

I would just let the march go on as I believe in the right to peaceful assembly and the right to free speech. It's up to the civil authorities to keep the peace in a manner that they see fit. At the same time, I wouldn't want to be anywhere near it if at all possible because of the possibility of all heck breaking loose.

At the end of it, if Thailand has peace and democracy, then it's all worth it. These undertones of a quasi-democracy propped up by a controlling junta are more than a little scary. I hope for the best.

[tonywebster]

I feel the majority of people in Thailand would prefer a less than perfect Abhisit regime to a government formed by a murderous red mob.

There's one fairly obvious way to find that out for sure.

yes put it to the vote, let us see the dems win these 240 seats they are so confident of winning, let them become a real government of the people rather than the back door merchants that they are.

if anyone wants to see a fine example of people promoted beyond their abilities, look no further than the dems.

[rixalex]

I feel the majority of people in Thailand would prefer a less than perfect Abhisit regime to a government formed by a murderous red mob.

There's one fairly obvious way to find that out for sure.

yes put it to the vote

If and when the reds win power, they can decide and determine the date of elections. Now they can't.

The Democrats have that luxury. They will set a date that suits them and suits the country. Suiting the reds i would imagine isn't a major concern.

[tonywebster]

I feel the majority of people in Thailand would prefer a less than perfect Abhisit regime to a government formed by a murderous red mob.

There's one fairly obvious way to find that out for sure.

yes put it to the vote

If and when the reds win power, they can decide and determine the date of elections. Now they can't.

The Democrats have that luxury. They will set a date that suits them and suits the country. Suiting the reds i would imagine isn't a major concern.

ah so the reds are not part of the country now? that is yellow thinking if ever I heard it.

They should call an election because that is the best thing for the country, the whole country. Clearly they have no control, it is true they do not have the mandate of the voting public, like I have said before if they were wanted they would have won the last election, they didn't win the last election because they are not fit to govern, they are proving they are not fit to govern now so it is not just speculation anymore about their abilities.

Can you explain the opinion polls and rhetoric from academics that points out their many failures to do the right thing? Can you explain their poor human rights record since abhisit came to power or do you agree with their actions in relation to the hmongs etc? Are they right to refuse a visa to the dalai lamas sister? Is it right that the alleged master of all thing treason is still walking around? Can you explain their failures with the economy? Can you explain their childish spat with cambodia? can you explain having a foreign minister who's sole aim seems to be to alienate people and was part of the PAD protests?

but hey if you say they are good for the country what the hel_l do I know, let them serve their term, lets be honest here this is the only way they will get to serve one as the populace don't want them in power. (yes the elites do, but you seem to forget with your comments above that the poor are also the populace.)

The country will benefit from having an elected government, if that is the dems then so be it, but let the public decide who they want to run the country, the public have spoken in the last 3 elections and they never said democrats, as much as that pains you.

Edited March 5, 2010 by tonywebster