Interesting Question

[fireplay]

hello Readers, this is a nice threading spanning back 6 years, And I have seen some partial answers to my questions. I am looking for advice about my situation. I have an A.A. I am 15 units away from a B.A. I have also procured a fake diploma and TEFL certificate on khosan. I have taught for 6 months in South America and 4 months in Thailand.

I recently was awarede a contract to teach in a high school. The agency needs to submit my documents to the MOE. I see there can be some devasting problems with being caught using fake documents. Anyone have any advice on what you would Do? Are documents submitted to the MOE electronically validated in a database?

As I see it I have a few options. Recreate the University Diploma EXACTLY as it is based on my friends with the correct emblems and signatures and hope it it is just photo copied and filed. Submit my AA and see if they will hire me anyway. Submit my fake TEFL. Are the TEFL schools in a database as well? Who knows what level of scrutiny THE MOE adheres to regarding these issues?

I know it all sounds simply devious But I have attended University and JC for 10 years of my life. I have every intention of getting a real tefl certification eventually. I am a great teacher based on my students growth in ESL, my passions, energy, discipline and personal research on teaching modalities lesson plans etc. I am certainly not just backpackin through looking for a quick buck.

But honestly that is neither here nor there.

I am looking for some facts on the subjectivity protocals and processes of the MOE verifying degrees...I will take risks to a certain level, like giving over my AA instead of the BA my agency is expecting. I will hand in a fake TEFL. But the fake degree, well a simple database check will show I am a prior student but haven't graduated.

Oh I also have doctored my transcripts to show I have graduated. Remember, i am only a semester away from it.

Thanks for your advice, i don't want to end up in the bangkok hilton or be blacklisted from thailand

[Scott]

Oh, boy, you do have a problem. Without being judgmental, I would strongly suggest that you come clean if at all possible. I have had a lot of experience with verifying degrees and with people with dodgy degrees etc. As a very general rule, I don't believe the MOE verifies degrees; I do believe that they know a number of the fake degrees. We had 3 teachers who taught with fake degrees for many years (8-9 years approximately). One day, during the school inspection, they pulled them out and announced they were fakes. I will say that there being hired pre-dated my taking over the program and it also pre-dated degrees being questioned, at least very often.

A pretty devastating scenario followed and none of the are in Thailand any longer.

How does the MOE know? Well, I don't know. I don't think they actually check, but I think they have a list of schools that are commonly used. In the above example, the signature lines and signatures were identical, even though the people didn't graduate the same year or from the same school.

At this point, (and this does includes other schools), we must submit the degree, a copy of the transcript (which is a little harder to fake) and a letter of verification from the University.

The TEFL I wouldn't worry about (but others may have more experience with this).

The point is, that submitting fake documents is fraud and when caught, it is treated as a criminal offense. The above examples I gave didn't face any charges and that may have had to do with both the MOE saving face as well as the school.

I am not in your shoes and I don't know what 'investment' you have in being here. If your stay is important, as in having a wife and kids, I would shoot very straight and honestly. If I wasn't worried about being fired and possibly deported and heading to Vietnam or Cambodia, I might think different and the risk might be worth it. But it's your name, your reputation and your future on the line.

Keep us posted and the best of luck with your situation. Other posters will likely give you helpful information and food for thought.

[Scott]

Sorry, firefly, I forgot to say 'welcome to the forum.'

[twschw]

So, where would you like us to post, here or there?

[Scott]

Oh, sorry. I am being silly--old age, I guess.

Post in that thread: Questions about Qualifications!

[twschw]

Ok

[twschw]

You can start by reading this members experience with a fake degree. Just some food for thought. In my opinion, it is not worth it but in the end the choice is yours.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Fake-Degrees-t263129.html

[Ijustwannateach]

This question is answered on the many, many individual threads about 'fake diplomas,' not to mention 'life experience degrees' (as Twschw points out).

It's fraud. It's wrong. And it will ultimately punish you, the school, the students, and the entire reputation of foreign teachers in Thailand when/if you are caught.

It's not that hard to get some work without a degree, honestly- do that, wait until you get your degree, and then use that honestly to find other jobs.

The reason this issue is not discussed here is because this thread is about REAL qualifications.

[PeaceBlondie]

Why fake it? The AA is worth something, but not enough. The fake TEFL cert will only get you in trouble.

[culicine]

How old is the OP? It's well worth a few years to get a degree. Don't use fake documents - read: incarceration and then deportation with a possible black list. It's possible to work without the degree - plenty of people do it, though the WP will be more difficult to get. We have the odd teacher that do not have degrees, but can still get a WP. This is becoming rarer and more problematic, especially now with the TCT pressure to get the new teachers licence, where a formal (non-tefl) teaching qualification is needed. I'm one of the lucky few to have the licence, but I did spend 4 years part time doing an education course prior to this. I'm not saying the qualifications will make you a great teacher, but having them gives you one less headache.

[Scott]

I have now moved this to it's own topic, after asking people to post elsewhere. I am having a bad day, just can't get my act together. As Ijustwannateach mentioned, the Q about Q isn't the best place.

My apologies for the confusion and for taking this off-topic!