Thai Protesters Target Bangkok's Tourist Centre

[jfchandler]

Sorry to disagree.... But...it IS ultimately all about Thaksin....

I don't dispute that there may be all kinds of different interests and motivations involved on the part of the so-to-speak foot soldiers in the Red Shirt movement.

But the leaders and organizers and funding for it all come from people who are there to put Thaksin back in power, regain his lost fortune, and to try to quash the court rulings against him....

If it weren't for all that, none of this Red Shirt stuff, at least the way it is now, would be happening.

[jackr]

I am in Thailand (moderators can see that from my ISP) but I guess that most people posting here are not as the sheer massive amount of people who do not understand Thailand and Thai's as seen by lots of the posts on this thread is staggering.

...

This is Democracy.

Is it really... even when one is paid to walk the street whether one agrees with what's going on or not?

The short of it is, democracy currently won't work in developing Asian climes such as this. Like a bunch of kids, they need to be told what to do until they grow up and can accept the majority's choice. That'd probably require several generations of different thinking and the removal of silly television programs.

[JW2010]

Are you advocating Police use violence to disperse a peaceful anti-government protest?

if they are breaking the law and disrupting the freedoms of other then YES YES YES YES YES YES ... not only the police but have the military there as back up if needed and don't hesitate sending them in too.

Many of you here seem to be blinded by the very openly biased local English language press. Firstly you must appreciate that while many try to portray this as just "Thaksin supporters" it is now not.

There are some Thaksin supporters, there are many other groups now involved and they are merging into a force that scares the elite annointed government.

The old "Its Thaksin" argument and excuse is running very thin now, whilst he is "one" of the people supporting the reds he is not the only person now. Many interest groups who were hurt by an illegal military coup, by the appointing by the coup leaders of a new judiciary who subsequently found anything to do with the old system "guilty" and many directly effected by the elite system are now on the bandwagon.

When the government tried to have negotiations signaled the point at which "Puppet Abhisit" become concerned, for negotiations signalled a final acceptance that this is more than just Thakky's boys and girls, it signaled the Reds are now a group with many supporters of different interests who are not going to go away.

In the same way the Yellow shirts were paid for (by a lady and a man and say BB and CP amongst many others) various interest groups are now supporting the reds with logistics.

The ideal solution is, the military appointed judiciary dissolved the PPP and got "their" coalition into power and therefore the solution is to dissolve the "elite appointed and manipulated" coalition and give the power back to the people for a vote in an election.

Yellow force and "elite" power got rid of the PPP government, so it is only fair now for people power to get rid of the 'elite" appointed government, so the situation goes back to square one, which is a new election.

So, rather than simply say "violence and force" is needed, keep a cool head and support the instant dissolution of parliament and new elections, it the best solution.

And then whoever wins the election, all parties agree to abide by the results of the will of all the Thai people.

Blah blah blah yellow yellow yellow ... right now this is about a group of people who are clearly breaking the law and infringing on the rights of others. Who cares what has happened in the past ... it is time for the government to let this country and world know that they will not tolerate this kind of behavior.

No its not blah blah blah, everything that happened in the past leads up to today. Its one thing that educated people learn, your past will always catch up with you.

The only solution is to dissolve parliament and allow the people to have the vote to elect a governement, one that is elected by the people and not one that has been made up by the elite making a coalition behind the scenes.

Elections now, its the peaceful and really the only just solution to the problem.

Why are the "elite" scared of elections........... ? Do they know want the government to represent the will of the people ? Answering that question may help you understand the delicate state of Thailand today.

[johndpoole]

Use of force is NOT a solution.

I guess many people here do not have decades of experience in Thailand but let me remind you.

50% of the army support red, 50% support yellow (The yellow support 50% are now in the positons of power)

50% of the police support red and 50% support yellow (The yellow support 50% are now in the positions of power)

Therefore any unjust use of force could be the signal for a counter coup to occur, where the red supporting forces overthrow the yellow ones. To keep this situation under control it is very much a mandate of the present government not to use force. This is why they set a 9pm deadline and it passed. They set a 12pm deadline and it passed. They are very very weak and they know that most Thai's, while not directly supporting the reds, do not support the "elite annointed" government and any use of force could easily see "run of the mill" people put on red shirts and start fighting against the "elites forces"

Watch what happens if they continue to refuse to move. The gov't simply is giving them enough rope to hang themselves and show the people they have been beyond patient w/these folks.

By the way if your 50-50% was accurate then it really makes the Reds appear to be liars and beyond the point of lunacy in their demands and claims.

Also, you will find the police and military will do what they are told by their leaders. There is no threat of coup if they go in there and clear out a crowd who is breaking the law and have been warned many times and whose leaders are now advocating violence.

[LuckyLew]

Send in the troops and wack'em all!!!

At least the average IQ of Thailand would go up

Cheerleading violence and bigotry!

You must be proud of yourself.

Although I am sure the original post was a joke and I don't advocate whacking anybody ... I am having a hard time understanding how there is any bigotry in the post. He says a country IQ would go up if a group (not related to race) is eliminated. He is talking about some members of a political group. Also having a hard time wondering is the IQ wouldn't actually go up if these folks were not around.

Yes the original post was tongue in cheek, it is a shame

some people are so tightly would that have trouble taking

a dump.

I am a 100% not violent person, I even think violent video

games gotta go

But sooner or later this procession of paraders and porta

potty less people gotta packup and push off!! It is my belief

that the army should totally surround them and give them one

option, stay in this perimeter, if you choose to leave this

perimeter, it must be to get on a bus and go up north.

Abi getta gun !!!

Peaceful rallies are fine, but bringing Bangkok to a halt is not

I am not yellow or red ... I am Blue ... Chelsea Blue

2 - 1 to the Chelsea

There's only one .... didier Drogba

Playing in a Drogba wonderland

[johndpoole]

Are you advocating Police use violence to disperse a peaceful anti-government protest?

if they are breaking the law and disrupting the freedoms of other then YES YES YES YES YES YES ... not only the police but have the military there as back up if needed and don't hesitate sending them in too.

Many of you here seem to be blinded by the very openly biased local English language press. Firstly you must appreciate that while many try to portray this as just "Thaksin supporters" it is now not.

There are some Thaksin supporters, there are many other groups now involved and they are merging into a force that scares the elite annointed government.

The old "Its Thaksin" argument and excuse is running very thin now, whilst he is "one" of the people supporting the reds he is not the only person now. Many interest groups who were hurt by an illegal military coup, by the appointing by the coup leaders of a new judiciary who subsequently found anything to do with the old system "guilty" and many directly effected by the elite system are now on the bandwagon.

When the government tried to have negotiations signaled the point at which "Puppet Abhisit" become concerned, for negotiations signalled a final acceptance that this is more than just Thakky's boys and girls, it signaled the Reds are now a group with many supporters of different interests who are not going to go away.

In the same way the Yellow shirts were paid for (by a lady and a man and say BB and CP amongst many others) various interest groups are now supporting the reds with logistics.

The ideal solution is, the military appointed judiciary dissolved the PPP and got "their" coalition into power and therefore the solution is to dissolve the "elite appointed and manipulated" coalition and give the power back to the people for a vote in an election.

Yellow force and "elite" power got rid of the PPP government, so it is only fair now for people power to get rid of the 'elite" appointed government, so the situation goes back to square one, which is a new election.

So, rather than simply say "violence and force" is needed, keep a cool head and support the instant dissolution of parliament and new elections, it the best solution.

And then whoever wins the election, all parties agree to abide by the results of the will of all the Thai people.

Blah blah blah yellow yellow yellow ... right now this is about a group of people who are clearly breaking the law and infringing on the rights of others. Who cares what has happened in the past ... it is time for the government to let this country and world know that they will not tolerate this kind of behavior.

No its not blah blah blah, everything that happened in the past leads up to today. Its one thing that educated people learn, your past will always catch up with you.

The only solution is to dissolve parliament and allow the people to have the vote to elect a governement, one that is elected by the people and not one that has been made up by the elite making a coalition behind the scenes.

Elections now, its the peaceful and really the only just solution to the problem.

Why are the "elite" scared of elections........... ? Do they know want the government to represent the will of the people ? Answering that question may help you understand the delicate state of Thailand today.

Bizzare logic ... today the law needs to be enforced. You cannot hold elections every time a group of people are unhappy. You wait for the next elections which the current gov't has agreed to hold a year early.

[JW2010]

Sorry to disagree.... But...it IS ultimately all about Thaksin....

I don't dispute that there may be all kinds of different interests and motivations involved on the part of the so-to-speak foot soldiers in the Red Shirt movement.

But the leaders and organizers and funding for it all come from people who are there to put Thaksin back in power, regain his lost fortune, and to try to quash the court rulings against him....

If it weren't for all that, none of this Red Shirt stuff, at least the way it is now, would be happening.

Initially it might have been but now its not anymore.

I know this upsets many as they love the Thaksin excuse, but sorry, its now about The Reds movement for democracy.

This is why Thaksin, rightly, has been less and less involved as he needs to now fade into the background while keeping his supporters involved, but allowing the new faces to take over.

The local English press with their controllers and bias will still try to manipulate things to say its all about him, but its not, he represents a symbol of the unjust way the elite works against people who stand up to it, but he is not the sole cause now, the Reds have moved on and that was signaled by the government having negotiations.

That was the point at which the Reds moved into being a "political worry" for the elite.

[jfchandler]

Thaksin "represents a symbol of the unjust way the elite works against people who stand up to it"?????????

Friend, seriously, you gotta be high on something..... Ya right, Thaksin, Mr. Anti-Elite to the core....

[JW2010]

Bizzare logic ... today the law needs to be enforced. You cannot hold elections every time a group of people are unhappy. You wait for the next elections which the current gov't has agreed to hold a year early.

Its not bizzare at all.

So lets have a coup then. That does not wait for elections does it. LOL

Problem - elite do not wait for elections, they get the Army or Judiciary to get rid of the government.

Problem - people want elections and the power returned to them, but they have no army or judiciary.

People therefore can only demonstate and use the tactics of Ghandi, peaceful civil disobediance until they get their elections, now.

[johndpoole]

What is so sad is that the Reds could have walked away as winners after the talks with the PM. They not only should have gained credibility through these talks but also should have gone back home knowing they got the PM to agree to hold elections a year early as well as dissolving the house. Instead they now look like a bunch of crazed idiots whose leader is leading them to a slaughter.

Had they gone home and moved to intelligent rhetoric, they would be sitting so strong right now in the hearts and minds of the Thai people.

15 days has already come and gone ... they lost.

It is clear to any intelligent person this demand would NEVER be met and that Thaksin is leading these lambs to a slaughter in hopes of showing the gov't in a bad light by using military against its own people. But now, this is exactly what the people want to restore order.

[johndpoole]

Bizzare logic ... today the law needs to be enforced. You cannot hold elections every time a group of people are unhappy. You wait for the next elections which the current gov't has agreed to hold a year early.

Its not bizzare at all.

So lets have a coup then. That does not wait for elections does it. LOL

Problem - elite do not wait for elections, they get the Army or Judiciary to get rid of the government.

Problem - people want elections and the power returned to them, but they have no army or judiciary.

People therefore can only demonstate and use the tactics of Ghandi, peaceful civil disobediance until they get their elections, now.

grow up and wait 9-months

[phetaroi]

I am in Thailand (moderators can see that from my ISP) but I guess that most people posting here are not as the sheer massive amount of people who do not understand Thailand and Thai's as seen by lots of the posts on this thread is staggering.

If you are not in Thailand I think really you should keep your fingers from typing on the current situation.

The Reds have transformed into an entity which encompasses lots of pressure groups, which is they the puppet Abhisit "annointed" government is having to treat them with kid gloves, which is being exploited by the reds.

This is Democracy.

Un-Democratic events leds to an "annointed" government being put into place, one where influence outside of elected politicians put together a coalition.

The people are simply asking that this un-elected coalition government put in place by "elite" behind the scenes manouvering is dissolved and allow the people to vote again.

Thats a good thing. This is Democracy and the atttitude of some poster on here against the Reds is disturbing and disgusting IMO.

Who died and left you boss?

This is the first post I've made where I will state an opinion about the conflict. And one shouldn't take it as an all-encompassing opinion about Thai politics in general. This is JUST about the Red Shirts' claim that they are for 100% democracy.

Democracy is not about putting shit into plastic bags...shit divided up by female shit, male shit, and gay shit (just BTW).

Democracy is not about mixing human and pigs blood and pouring it around in public places and private property.

Democracy is not about being paid to vote a certain way.

Democracy is not about holding a proverbial gun to the head of the nation and threatening to pull the trigger unless you get exactly what your side wants and by your deadline of 15 days.

Democracy is working within the government structure and taking things one step at a time. Although I'm not in favor of how often the Thais rewrite their constitution, working as a loyal opposition and working within the governmental framework to rewrite the present constitution in preparation for a new election would be a responsible step in a democracy. Simply waiting for the next election (which isn't that far away), and meanwhile campaigning responsibly for your party's view would be a responsible step in democracy. And, explaining to the people of the nation exactly how your party perfected democracy when you were in power, would be a responsible step in democracy. And abiding by the election results, even if they don't go your way, would be a responsible step in a democracy.

Do you notice anything about the way I have written the above paragraph? It doesn't matter what color shirt you wear...it works for everyone in the country...if you believe in democracy.

I believe the people who support the Red Shirts have many legitimate complaints. The gap in quality of life for those who live in Bangkok compared to those who live in small villages in Issan or the North or out in Tak or down in Yala is staggering. At the same time, the improvement in quality of life in most places in Thailand compared to life here 23 years ago (when I first began visiting) is also staggering. And, Mr. Thaksin, for whatever reason, did address some of the issues of those upcountry folks.

The UDD has a place in this country and in this government, and sometimes it may be leading the government. So does the PAD. So do the Democrats. That's a democracy.

[JW2010]

Thaksin "represents a symbol of the unjust way the elite works against people who stand up to it"?????????

Friend, seriously, you gotta be high on something..... Ya right, Thaksin, Mr. Anti-Elite to the core....

No, I did not say he was Mr Anti-Elite.

However, he stood up to them on certain aspects, ones which turned the elite reserved acceptance of him into hate of him and seeing him as a major threat to their continued control of Thailand.

Please, know more about the situation and the in depth behind the scenes events, not just read the biased and "un-named source said" Bangkok Post and Nation

[johndpoole]

Democracy has to have laws that allow for the ouster of a corrupt leaders. This government was legally put in place and the last one legally disbanded. This was decided by a court and has gone uncontested. There are legal avenues the Reds could take if they have a leg to stand on legally. If not then they need to wait for the next elections as is the democratic way. They cannot break the law and try to punish the population and country into getting their way.

The Reds have made clear their only agenda is to do what Thaksin pays them to do.

[johndpoole]

Thaksin "represents a symbol of the unjust way the elite works against people who stand up to it"?????????

Friend, seriously, you gotta be high on something..... Ya right, Thaksin, Mr. Anti-Elite to the core....

No, I did not say he was Mr Anti-Elite.

However, he stood up to them on certain aspects, ones which turned the elite reserved acceptance of him into hate of him and seeing him as a major threat to their continued control of Thailand.

Please, know more about the situation and the in depth behind the scenes events, not just read the biased and "un-named source said" Bangkok Post and Nation

OMG, this guy was a power hungry nut who did whatever he wanted. Yes, some things were good but it certainly didn't compare with the bad including the summary execution of more that 2500 people. There was no elite group under Thaksin as he was the Elite.

Edited April 4, 2010 by johndpoole

[jfchandler]

Well put...Phetaroi....

I'm just a guest here in LOS.... and I don't take sides in the Red and Yellow politics, having healthy skepticism about both...

But it makes me crazy when people start talking about Thaksin as an oppressed victim and/or leader of a democratic movement....

He's a guy out to regain both the power and money that he lost. Period. Anything else re him is just blowing smoke up your you know where....

[JW2010]

I am in Thailand (moderators can see that from my ISP) but I guess that most people posting here are not as the sheer massive amount of people who do not understand Thailand and Thai's as seen by lots of the posts on this thread is staggering.

If you are not in Thailand I think really you should keep your fingers from typing on the current situation.

The Reds have transformed into an entity which encompasses lots of pressure groups, which is they the puppet Abhisit "annointed" government is having to treat them with kid gloves, which is being exploited by the reds.

This is Democracy.

Un-Democratic events leds to an "annointed" government being put into place, one where influence outside of elected politicians put together a coalition.

The people are simply asking that this un-elected coalition government put in place by "elite" behind the scenes manouvering is dissolved and allow the people to vote again.

Thats a good thing. This is Democracy and the atttitude of some poster on here against the Reds is disturbing and disgusting IMO.

Who died and left you boss?

This is the first post I've made where I will state an opinion about the conflict. And one shouldn't take it as an all-encompassing opinion about Thai politics in general. This is JUST about the Red Shirts' claim that they are for 100% democracy.

Democracy is not about putting shit into plastic bags...shit divided up by female shit, male shit, and gay shit (just BTW).

Democracy is not about mixing human and pigs blood and pouring it around in public places and private property.

Democracy is not about being paid to vote a certain way.

Democracy is not about holding a proverbial gun to the head of the nation and threatening to pull the trigger unless you get exactly what your side wants and by your deadline of 15 days.

Democracy is working within the government structure and taking things one step at a time. Although I'm not in favor of how often the Thais rewrite their constitution, working as a loyal opposition and working within the governmental framework to rewrite the present constitution in preparation for a new election would be a responsible step in a democracy. Simply waiting for the next election (which isn't that far away), and meanwhile campaigning responsibly for your party's view would be a responsible step in democracy. And, explaining to the people of the nation exactly how your party perfected democracy when you were in power, would be a responsible step in democracy. And abiding by the election results, even if they don't go your way, would be a responsible step in a democracy.

Do you notice anything about the way I have written the above paragraph? It doesn't matter what color shirt you wear...it works for everyone in the country...if you believe in democracy.

I believe the people who support the Red Shirts have many legitimate complaints. The gap in quality of life for those who live in Bangkok compared to those who live in small villages in Issan or the North or out in Tak or down in Yala is staggering. At the same time, the improvement in quality of life in most places in Thailand compared to life here 23 years ago (when I first began visiting) is also staggering. And, Mr. Thaksin, for whatever reason, did address some of the issues of those upcountry folks.

The UDD has a place in this country and in this government, and sometimes it may be leading the government. So does the PAD. So do the Democrats. That's a democracy.

Yes and you fail to appreciate that the people did spend a long time to write a new constitution, the 1997 one.

And the Army held a coup, ripped it up and threw it in the bin.

So whats the point in revising and re-writing consitutions while the Army (under control of the elite) can, and do, hold coups and throw it in the bin.

You must be mad if you think re-writing the consitition is a solution. Simply invoke the 1997 one back in and get on with elections, or stick with what is in place at the moment.

[LuckyLew]

I am in Thailand (moderators can see that from my ISP) but I guess that most people posting here are not as the sheer massive amount of people who do not understand Thailand and Thai's as seen by lots of the posts on this thread is staggering.

If you are not in Thailand I think really you should keep your fingers from typing on the current situation.

The Reds have transformed into an entity which encompasses lots of pressure groups, which is they the puppet Abhisit "annointed" government is having to treat them with kid gloves, which is being exploited by the reds.

This is Democracy.

Un-Democratic events leds to an "annointed" government being put into place, one where influence outside of elected politicians put together a coalition.

The people are simply asking that this un-elected coalition government put in place by "elite" behind the scenes manouvering is dissolved and allow the people to vote again.

Thats a good thing. This is Democracy and the atttitude of some poster on here against the Reds is disturbing and disgusting IMO.

Please get your head out of your ARSE-nal won 1-0 last night

Where do you get off telling people not to type and that their

opinions are wrong and they do not know what they are talking about

Where was this post when Taksins brother in law was "annointed"

and not elected? what a double standard you type ... perhaps you

should get out of internet cafe and join your friends at central

world ..

what was I saying early about wack'em all and IQ's?

[phetaroi]

Yes and you fail to appreciate that the people did spend a long time to write a new constitution, the 1997 one.

And the Army held a coup, ripped it up and threw it in the bin.

So whats the point in revising and re-writing consitutions while the Army (under control of the elite) can, and do, hold coups and throw it in the bin.

You must be mad if you think re-writing the consitition is a solution. Simply invoke the 1997 one back in and get on with elections, or stick with what is in place at the moment.

You want it all "fixed" NOW.

Real democracy is evolutionary...not revolutionary.

[JW2010]

I am in Thailand (moderators can see that from my ISP) but I guess that most people posting here are not as the sheer massive amount of people who do not understand Thailand and Thai's as seen by lots of the posts on this thread is staggering.

If you are not in Thailand I think really you should keep your fingers from typing on the current situation.

The Reds have transformed into an entity which encompasses lots of pressure groups, which is they the puppet Abhisit "annointed" government is having to treat them with kid gloves, which is being exploited by the reds.

This is Democracy.

Un-Democratic events leds to an "annointed" government being put into place, one where influence outside of elected politicians put together a coalition.

The people are simply asking that this un-elected coalition government put in place by "elite" behind the scenes manouvering is dissolved and allow the people to vote again.

Thats a good thing. This is Democracy and the atttitude of some poster on here against the Reds is disturbing and disgusting IMO.

Please get your head out of your ARSE-nal won 1-0 last night

Where do you get off telling people not to type and that their

opinions are wrong and they do not know what they are talking about

Where was this post when Taksins brother in law was "annointed"

and not elected? what a double standard you type ... perhaps you

should get out of internet cafe and join your friends at central

world ..

what was I saying early about wack'em all and IQ's?

Yes, you are abusive.

Yes, you appear to like violence.

Carry on showing everyone just how "un-educated" and violent you Yellow/Pink shirts are.

[johndpoole]

When do the Reds stop demanding 15 Days? Seems kind of strange that this time has come and gone and they are still saying 15 days. Makes you wonder why they were not willing to compromise as the PM was.

15 days is the perfect unrealistic number that Thaksin hopes will ultimately lead to violence and kaos in hopes for his benefit.

What Thaksin doesn't understand is he reacts emotionally and doesn't have the intelligence of the current government that has shown great restraint in their handling of this and now are in a position where the people are demanding they act with a heavy hand to restore peace.

[johndpoole]

Yes and you fail to appreciate that the people did spend a long time to write a new constitution, the 1997 one.

And the Army held a coup, ripped it up and threw it in the bin.

So whats the point in revising and re-writing consitutions while the Army (under control of the elite) can, and do, hold coups and throw it in the bin.

You must be mad if you think re-writing the consitition is a solution. Simply invoke the 1997 one back in and get on with elections, or stick with what is in place at the moment.

You want it all "fixed" NOW.

Real democracy is evolutionary...not revolutionary.

If you know Thailand then you know that this problem over constitutions and coups is not going to go away until one man dies and whatever happens, happens.

So really, between educated people who know Thailand there is no point discussing democracy as we both know its non-existant.

Thailand is much more democratic in many ways than even the USA ... but not sure that means much.

Edited April 4, 2010 by johndpoole

[animatic]

Ladies and Gentlemen, it's save to say that the army will pull the strings for the years to come. It will be a sad ending for the unfortunate red sheep who honestly believed in a democratic movement, and it will be those unfortunate ones that will foot the bills.

The red leaders are a disgrace as much as the PADards.

The only route for the Reds to retireve a long lasting say in government,

and diminish the power of the army if to elect REAL politicians who intend to do their legislative jobs.

There in lies the problem, the N, NE has continued to install the most abusive and obtuse political class imaginable.

And when, as logically can be expected, it goes of the tracks in graft acquisition mode, or on the Thaksin power grab mode,

then the current power structure will notice and back them off again. It's not because they are encroaching on army power,

but because they are acting with a free hand as graft driven entities, not working in any sense for the people...

If the PTP and step sisters political class can be changed to a real working functioning entity, then they might be able to

hold the country together, increase the functionality of the governance system and eventually

supplant the army as final controller of the publics safety... Right now the actions of the opposition do not in any way

indicate the posibillity of this happening, just the opposite, if anything Thaksin and PTP have done an increadible job

of re cementing the army into it's hold on power behind the scenes.

Case in point last week during the opposition boycot of parliament 3 bills were vooted on,

surpassing the PPP parliaments full YEARS aggregate by well 3 bills... The PPP was monomanaical

and never functioned, and PTP is less than the sum of the PPP parts, and proves that daily in session.

Most decisions Abhisit makes on a daily basis, you can see and feel his moderqate infgluence on many issues,

but some decisions are no doubt reserved for discussion within the national security apparatus, which includes Abhisit,

and Thaksin/PTP/Reds seems to have forged this structure even more strongly, though unintentionally.

And that is part of the point;

The reds seem to make moves, historically, that HARM THEIR MOVEMENT

with greater regularity than ones that HELP it.

[JW2010]

When do the Reds stop demanding 15 Days? Seems kind of strange that this time has come and gone and they are still saying 15 days. Makes you wonder why they were not willing to compromise as the PM was.

15 days is the perfect unrealistic number that Thaksin hopes will ultimately lead to violence and kaos in hopes for his benefit.

What Thaksin doesn't understand is he reacts emotionally and doesn't have the intelligence of the current government that has shown great restraint in their handling of this and now are in a position where the people are demanding they act with a heavy hand to restore peace.

The thing I love about all this is that "Tourists" are getting served by Red Shirts.

Those not in Thailand have no idea whats going on, but for example go down Sukhumvit, most of the food vendors in the evening are all wearing red shirts. Lots of stall holders are red shirts.

All the tourists are being served by red shirts, smiling and being happy.

This helps the world know the red shirts are peaceful, and just "oridinary men and women" of Thailand.

If the elite wishes to use violence against "normal civilians" then it will look very bad. Which is why they have not.

The solution is simple and peaceful, dissolve parliament and hold elections now.

[way2muchcoffee]

I am in Thailand (moderators can see that from my ISP) but I guess that most people posting here are not as the sheer massive amount of people who do not understand Thailand and Thai's as seen by lots of the posts on this thread is staggering.

If you are not in Thailand I think really you should keep your fingers from typing on the current situation.

The Reds have transformed into an entity which encompasses lots of pressure groups, which is they the puppet Abhisit "annointed" government is having to treat them with kid gloves, which is being exploited by the reds.

This is Democracy.

Un-Democratic events leds to an "annointed" government being put into place, one where influence outside of elected politicians put together a coalition.

The people are simply asking that this un-elected coalition government put in place by "elite" behind the scenes manouvering is dissolved and allow the people to vote again.

Thats a good thing. This is Democracy and the atttitude of some poster on here against the Reds is disturbing and disgusting IMO.

I think it is you who really don't understand. This is about Thaksin. He and his leaders are using the Democracy and Class War argument as a front. Here is the evidence and it isn't hard to connect the dots.

1) Thaksin lost billions in a court decision.

2) The demonstrations started about a week after this decision was handed down.

3) The demonstrations are funded primarily by Thaksin

4) The demonstrators are being paid to attend.

5) The redshirt leaders have already declared that Thaksin's situation would be rectified if they win this war.

6) The reds are calling for elections, but have no platform that supports democratic principles.

7) Their previous (now banned) political leaders engaged in some of the largest violations of democratic principles in recent Thai history.

8) The redshirts won't allow opposition parties to campaign in their region.

9) The redshirt footsoldiers come from regions where vote buying is the most rampant.

10) The reds are calling for elections, but have no platform with specific policies to help the poor, except free cash handouts and debt forgiveness.

11) Thaksin makes almost nightly phone-ins to his followers.

So this isn't about democracy. It isn't about fair policies for to help the poor. So what is it really all about? The answer is painfully obvious.

Edited April 4, 2010 by way2muchcoffee

[JW2010]

When do the Reds stop demanding 15 Days? Seems kind of strange that this time has come and gone and they are still saying 15 days. Makes you wonder why they were not willing to compromise as the PM was.

15 days is the perfect unrealistic number that Thaksin hopes will ultimately lead to violence and kaos in hopes for his benefit.

What Thaksin doesn't understand is he reacts emotionally and doesn't have the intelligence of the current government that has shown great restraint in their handling of this and now are in a position where the people are demanding they act with a heavy hand to restore peace.

The thing I love about all this is that "Tourists" are getting served by Red Shirts.

Those not in Thailand have no idea whats going on, but for example go down Sukhumvit, most of the food vendors in the evening are all wearing red shirts. Lots of stall holders are red shirts.

All the tourists are being served by red shirts, smiling and being happy.

This helps the world know the red shirts are peaceful, and just "oridinary men and women" of Thailand.

If the elite wishes to use violence against "normal civilians" then it will look very bad. Which is why they have not.

The solution is simple and peaceful, dissolve parliament and hold elections now.

I suppose I should put a "shock" disclaimer on that post to warn people not in Bangkok who rely on reading the Bangkok Post and The Nation for their news that, contrary to their "un-named sources" who report all sorts of outrageous claims, and contrary to their reporting, lots of people support the reds, as can be seen on the streets of Bangkok.

So please, unless you are in Bangkok and see with your own eyes whats going on, be very wary of what you read in the BP and TN, as its extremely "biased" due to their "yellow" support and "yellow" owners.

[losworld]

H

I am in Thailand (moderators can see that from my ISP) but I guess that most people posting here are not as the sheer massive amount of people who do not understand Thailand and Thai's as seen by lots of the posts on this thread is staggering.

If you are not in Thailand I think really you should keep your fingers from typing on the current situation.

The Reds have transformed into an entity which encompasses lots of pressure groups, which is they the puppet Abhisit "annointed" government is having to treat them with kid gloves, which is being exploited by the reds.

This is Democracy.

Un-Democratic events leds to an "annointed" government being put into place, one where influence outside of elected politicians put together a coalition.

The people are simply asking that this un-elected coalition government put in place by "elite" behind the scenes manouvering is dissolved and allow the people to vote again.

Thats a good thing. This is Democracy and the atttitude of some poster on here against the Reds is disturbing and disgusting IMO.

I think it is you who really don't understand. This is about Thaksin. He and his leaders are using the Democracy and Class War argument as a front. Here is the evidence and it isn't hard to connect the dots.

1) Thaksin lost billions in a court decision.

2) The demonstrations started about a week after this decision was handed down.

3) The demonstrations are funded primarily by Thaksin

4) The demonstrators are being paid to attend.

5) The redshirt leaders have already declared that Thaksin's situation would be rectified if they win this war.

6) The reds are calling for elections, but have no platform that supports democratic principles.

7) Their previous (now banned) political leaders engaged in some of the largest violations of democratic principles in recent Thai history.

8) The redshirts won't allow opposition parties to campaign in their region.

9) The redshirt footsoldiers come from regions where vote buying is the most rampant.

10) The reds are calling for elections, but have no platform with specific policies to help the poor, except free cash handouts and debt forgiveness.

11) Thaksin makes almost nightly phone-ins to his followers.

So this isn't about democracy. It isn't about fair policies for to help the poor. So what is it really all about? The answer is painfully obvious.

Precisely.

[johndpoole]

When do the Reds stop demanding 15 Days? Seems kind of strange that this time has come and gone and they are still saying 15 days. Makes you wonder why they were not willing to compromise as the PM was.

15 days is the perfect unrealistic number that Thaksin hopes will ultimately lead to violence and kaos in hopes for his benefit.

What Thaksin doesn't understand is he reacts emotionally and doesn't have the intelligence of the current government that has shown great restraint in their handling of this and now are in a position where the people are demanding they act with a heavy hand to restore peace.

The thing I love about all this is that "Tourists" are getting served by Red Shirts.

Those not in Thailand have no idea whats going on, but for example go down Sukhumvit, most of the food vendors in the evening are all wearing red shirts. Lots of stall holders are red shirts.

All the tourists are being served by red shirts, smiling and being happy.

This helps the world know the red shirts are peaceful, and just "oridinary men and women" of Thailand.

If the elite wishes to use violence against "normal civilians" then it will look very bad. Which is why they have not.

The solution is simple and peaceful, dissolve parliament and hold elections now.

hmmm, you must be in a different Thailand than the rest of us who live in BKK

[OzMick]

Given the amount of material she has I can see why they gave her the 2.30 slot...

She's a spy. She's been hired by the government to send the red shirts to sleep, then the mopping up crew will move in and carry the red shirts out.

Blimey ... this woman goes on. But fair enough ... she's 66 years old. She's spent much of her time in L.A. but claims to have come back to support democracy.

If she's been in L.A. for the period of time she claims, she could have lost the terrible accent she's speaking in.

Yeahhhhhhhhhhh .... she's finished!!! Bloody hel_l ... now she's speaking Thai too!! This could go on all night .... might drive the crowd away on her own.

She's doing a Weng ... but in slow motion!!

I thought everyone from LA had a spanish accent

[dobadoy]

Latest phone-in from Thaksin, being reportec now on Nation website

Former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra made a phone-in to address the protesters who seized control of the Rajprasong commercial area and said he was proud of what they have done.

Thaksin said the red-shirt people had it "for Thailand's future".

He said the "ammart" or elites-back government would be unable to suppress the people.

He said the red-shirt protesters did not damage the business in the area but helped foods vendors and restaurant owners have better business.

The Nation

:D

You couldn't make it up...

It is quite funny when Siam Paragon doesn't sell a couple of Gucci or Louis Vuitton bags, but instead the poor food vendors make a bit more money, isn't it?

Did you think of all the cleaners, car park attendants, tuk-tuk drivers, motorcycle taxi drivers, taxis drivers,small stall vendors (MBK), food court vendors, cooks, kitchen hand, toilet attendants, security guards, and the many 1000s of sales assistants who will lose out from those few gucci-bag-selling malls being closed?