Thai Red-Shirts Leaders Will Surrender To Police May 15: Nattawut

[denissr]

Is it a possibility that all sides are wrong, and there is no real Democracy or peace in sight? Seems that both sides want power, but do not have the best intentions for the people of Thailand in their agenda. As long as one is in power the other will fight, no peace. After I wrote this I see it looks a like America.

[jdinasia]

I didn't realise that you have to submit your autobiography on here in order to be able to make a comment.

Thaksin is the last democratically elected leader that Thailand had. In addition he won two elections. Three if you accept that the Reds won the post coup one too. You mention things about Thaksin but like a lot of your ilk who attack and abuse do not actually back it up with facts or quotes and context. It is easy to say things like you say but where does it take anyone.

My recollection is that the first post coup election – so one based on the constitution that the Army Government created – elected the Reds to a majority government. Then the Electoral Commission removed the first PM because he was a chef on a TV show. Then the Yellows invaded the Airport and that caused a crisis. The army didn't want to help on that one either. The Electoral Commission stepped in once more and got rid of the next Red PM. He stood aside and the Yellow's then formed a majority coalition government.

So not quite right on the facts and the constitution you put so much faith in is not exactly based on democratic values.

The big thing to watch is the Army as they make their own minds up and do not have anything to do with democracy.

Now the same electoral commission has told Abhisit that he has problems, but we don't hear anything about that from you apologists.

LOL --- I can't find a single accurate fact in your post.

BTW --- Arisman is in fact out on bail.

[ballpoint]

But when he was in power only a few years ago, I cannot recall reading such extreme views about him from Thai Visa posters. No-one was baying for his blood, or demanding his imprisonment

Now why is that? Seems to me that there are too many 'sheep' on this forum willing to accept the statements of an illegal, post-coup government.

Why is it that Thaksin's mouthpieces must hijack every thread with their "Thaksin was the best PM ever... The current government is not elected..." clap trap? These have been done to death on countless threads, and the facts are all counter to what the Thaksinistas would have us believe.

FACT: In any true democracy Thaksin would never have made it to PM. He would have failed the asset concealment case, he wouldn't have been able to buy his way to the job, and he wouldn't have been able to use his family connections to make his money in the first place.

FACT: Thaksin was responsible for the murder of over 3,000 people in his war on drugs, southern crackdowns and bird flu coverup.

FACT: Thaksin stole around 150 Billion baht from the Thai people while serving as PM.

FACT: Many people who spoke out against him either turned up dead, or never turned up at all.

FACT: Many more were sued for vast amounts of money.

FACT: Thaksin never won an election using new TRT candidates, both his victories were achieved by buying up the same old corrupt parties such as the NAP, which was the biggest single party prior to the TRT.

FACT: He couldn't even win the 2006 election, despite the TRT being the only major party involved, and despite cheating.

FACT: He resigned following the 2006 election debacle, then appointed himself as caretaker PM and resisted holding elections despite having no mandate at the time. He was not the elected PM at the time of the coup.

FACT: Thaksin appointed family members as head of the military and deputy head of the police.

FACT: In the 2007 election, more people voted for a party other than his proxy PTP than for it. The PTP was only able to form a government by forming a coalition with the minor parties, including the CTP, which itself had joined the boycot of the 2006 election and whose leader had stated that he wouldn't align with the PTP prior to the 2007 election. A vote for the CTP was not a proxy vote for the PTP. And, in terms of actual percentages, the Democrats got slightly more votes than the PTP.

FACT: Samak was kicked out for getting paid to host a cooking show, during which he spouted politics, and then lying about doing so. He could have been reinstated the next day, but Thaksin installed his own brother in law instead.

FACT: The Somchai government did not resign due to the PAD protests, but was dissolved by the courts. The EC has recommended that the Democrats also be dissolved, however no court ruling has yet been made.

FACT: The combined Samak and Somchai government was one of the most ineffectual the country has seen. It spent more time trying to change the constitution and get a pardon for Thaksin than actually ruling the country. It's most far reaching policies were to throw the Rohingya out of the country and to repatriate the Hmong, both of which were later jumped upon by the clueless anti Abhisit brigade in the mistaken belief that he had introduced them. (Along with where he was born, where he was educated, the eloquence with which he speaks and what he looks like, for some strange reason).

FACT: Neither the reds nor the PPP have ever come up with a manifesto, or even a list of what they would do if elections were held and they came out on top. Repeated rants about dissolving parliament now (every delay being an impediment to Thaksin's return) are not really credible policy of any opposition. They're not even sure who their leader is as well. Sure, we all know the man pulling the strings is the dear leader, but who would be PM? Chalerm? Chavalit? Jatuporn? Yingluk? Oak?

FACT: Every redshirt rally has been all about Thaksin. They rally to his call, avidly listen to his phone ins, openly take orders from him and take his money. Last Songkran it was all about his call for revolution. This year it was all about his asset freeze case. His own brother has stated that if the government talks to Thaksin the rally would be over immediately. Meanwhile he flies about like a cancer ridden red arsed fly, his family safely out of the country, his lieutenants sleeping in his hotel, while the poor duped out of town supporters sleep on the street, and the Bangkok based ones commute in and out for the free food and a cash payment.

FACT: Despite the main targets of the current shopping centre blockade being large organisations, those most affected by it are the employees, the small stall holders and all the other "lower class" people who make their living by working in Central World, Paragon, Siam, Central Chidlom and the other shops in the area. The only real inconvenience to the "elite" is making them go to Emporium, or overseas, in order to buy their luxury goods. Have the red leadership ever stated a reasonable purpose for their choice of location? Have the red leadership ever made a reasonable statement at all? "Dissolve now! We'll only negotiate if we get what we want before hand! 15 days!" The rabid chanting of a ship of fools can in no way be described as reasonable. And once the ship of fools sinks, as it will one way or another, many innocents will drown and the rats will come out fighting. Let's hope the army is prepared to exterminate them when they do.

BULL (WENG): The red shirt leaders will surrender to police on May 15th.

[Jaggg88]

What are the yellows??

Burr,

the Yellows are/were the crowd the Bangkok Bandits wheel out when they lose an election. Unlike the Reds, the army does not shoot them when they occupy an airport, etc.

Most of the farang posters here seem to be right-wing authoritarians who have not a clue about democracy. In a real democracy, ultimate political power is the will of the majority of people, as expressed at the ballot-box. It is not some elevated elite possessing unlimited money, troops, tanks, guns, & English-language newspapers.

I see one of the latter has dubbed the Red-supporting majority of Thailand as 'terrorists'. Nice one for all authoritarian anti-democrats. It's a simple 'law 'n order' situation, so bring on more firepower! Were Adolf Hitler & Joe Stalin alive, they would be cheering behind you.

By all means let the legal attrition against Ole Squarehead continue. Meantime, howsabout a free election, dudes?

Couldn't agree more. If we were back in our home free democratic countries we would be cheering on the protesters who basically want a free democratically elected government and not the military backed current Junta. The blatantly obvious propaganda I witness on state controlled TV is laughable if it were not so serious. The Red Shirts only failing is their misguided support for Thaskin, who did more for poor people than any other Thai Leader but unfortunately he lined his own pockets at the same time.

[Skywalker69]

Didn't Arisaman already surrender on April 1st? The only way these people will 'turn themselves in' will be to Redshirt Police officers (perhaps the ones who handed their weapons over to the crowd at SC Park Hotel), who will promptly release them on 50 satang bail.

[tominbkk]

They have to be alive to surrender.

Are you suggesting that someone should or would see to it that they are not alive? Can that be said on this forum? I thought this forum was just for the whiners that can't get out to drink their beer? JMHO

They are the ones always threatening to kill people if they don't get their way, and have shown they are willing to hurt any civilians, army or police who get in their way. Gun 'em down!!!!!!!

[ballpoint]

What are the yellows??

Burr,

the Yellows are/were the crowd the Bangkok Bandits wheel out when they lose an election. Unlike the Reds, the army does not shoot them when they occupy an airport, etc.

Most of the farang posters here seem to be right-wing authoritarians who have not a clue about democracy. In a real democracy, ultimate political power is the will of the majority of people, as expressed at the ballot-box. It is not some elevated elite possessing unlimited money, troops, tanks, guns, & English-language newspapers.

I see one of the latter has dubbed the Red-supporting majority of Thailand as 'terrorists'. Nice one for all authoritarian anti-democrats. It's a simple 'law 'n order' situation, so bring on more firepower! Were Adolf Hitler & Joe Stalin alive, they would be cheering behind you.

By all means let the legal attrition against Ole Squarehead continue. Meantime, howsabout a free election, dudes?

Couldn't agree more. If we were back in our home free democratic countries we would be cheering on the protesters who basically want a free democratically elected government and not the military backed current Junta. The blatantly obvious propaganda I witness on state controlled TV is laughable if it were not so serious. The Red Shirts only failing is their misguided support for Thaskin, who did more for poor people than any other Thai Leader but unfortunately he lined his own pockets at the same time.

1. @Jaggg88: The main barrier to a free election is the reds themselves, and their refusal to allow non PPP candidates to campaign in many parts of the country. It's something they're proud about, and their mouthpieces here constantly boast about how Abhisit can't safely tavel to the North and parts of Isaan.

2. @OldgitTom: Oh dear, I seem to have left a fact off of my list above. Please post a link to Thaksin "doing more for poor people than any other Thai Leader". The facts would suggest he did no more or less than any other. Not surprising really, as he simply bought out the same politicians who have been keeping the poor in their place for decades. The TRT government spent less than a third on Isaan than it did on the Northern, Central and Southern regions. This includes education and transport. What he did for the poor, apart from kill thousands of them, was to throw a few crumbs of taxpayers money in what was arguably the most organised votebuying campaign ever seen in the country. In the long term, he had very little effect. If you actually pay attention to what the current government has done in the past year, it potentially has achieved far more long term good for the poor with its crop insurance schemes, free education to 15 years, the abolishment of the 30 baht health charge, and some major public works, including installing street lighting and upgrading of main and accident prone roads. Of course, you won't hear about these from any red shirt source. You probably won't even hear too much from their own coalition partners, but they have been done, and continue to be done, and those upcountry who really care about making some progress, rather than making a quick buck from Thaksin's protests, and previously his handouts and loans, are well aware of them.

Edited April 17, 2010 by ballpoint

[bangkokrick]

But when he was in power only a few years ago, I cannot recall reading such extreme views about him from Thai Visa posters. No-one was baying for his blood, or demanding his imprisonment

Now why is that? Seems to me that there are too many 'sheep' on this forum willing to accept the statements of an illegal, post-coup government.

Why is it that Thaksin's mouthpieces must hijack every thread with their "Thaksin was the best PM ever... The current government is not elected..." clap trap? These have been done to death on countless threads, and the facts are all counter to what the Thaksinistas would have us believe.

FACT: In any true democracy Thaksin would never have made it to PM. He would have failed the asset concealment case, he wouldn't have been able to buy his way to the job, and he wouldn't have been able to use his family connections to make his money in the first place.

FACT: Thaksin was responsible for the murder of over 3,000 people in his war on drugs, southern crackdowns and bird flu coverup.

FACT: Thaksin stole around 150 Billion baht from the Thai people while serving as PM.

FACT: Many people who spoke out against him either turned up dead, or never turned up at all.

FACT: Many more were sued for vast amounts of money.

FACT: Thaksin never won an election using new TRT candidates, both his victories were achieved by buying up the same old corrupt parties such as the NAP, which was the biggest single party prior to the TRT.

FACT: He couldn't even win the 2006 election, despite the TRT being the only major party involved, and despite cheating.

FACT: He resigned following the 2006 election debacle, then appointed himself as caretaker PM and resisted holding elections despite having no mandate at the time. He was not the elected PM at the time of the coup.

FACT: Thaksin appointed family members as head of the military and deputy head of the police.

FACT: In the 2007 election, more people voted for a party other than his proxy PTP than for it. The PTP was only able to form a government by forming a coalition with the minor parties, including the CTP, which itself had joined the boycot of the 2006 election and whose leader had stated that he wouldn't align with the PTP prior to the 2007 election. A vote for the CTP was not a proxy vote for the PTP. And, in terms of actual percentages, the Democrats got slightly more votes than the PTP.

FACT: Samak was kicked out for getting paid to host a cooking show, during which he spouted politics, and then lying about doing so. He could have been reinstated the next day, but Thaksin installed his own brother in law instead.

FACT: The Somchai government did not resign due to the PAD protests, but was dissolved by the courts. The EC has recommended that the Democrats also be dissolved, however no court ruling has yet been made.

FACT: The combined Samak and Somchai government was one of the most ineffectual the country has seen. It spent more time trying to change the constitution and get a pardon for Thaksin than actually ruling the country. It's most far reaching policies were to throw the Rohingya out of the country and to repatriate the Hmong, both of which were later jumped upon by the clueless anti Abhisit brigade in the mistaken belief that he had introduced them. (Along with where he was born, where he was educated, the eloquence with which he speaks and what he looks like, for some strange reason).

FACT: Neither the reds nor the PPP have ever come up with a manifesto, or even a list of what they would do if elections were held and they came out on top. Repeated rants about dissolving parliament now (every delay being an impediment to Thaksin's return) are not really credible policy of any opposition. They're not even sure who their leader is as well. Sure, we all know the man pulling the strings is the dear leader, but who would be PM? Chalerm? Chavalit? Jatuporn? Yingluk? Oak?

FACT: Every redshirt rally has been all about Thaksin. They rally to his call, avidly listen to his phone ins, openly take orders from him and take his money. Last Songkran it was all about his call for revolution. This year it was all about his asset freeze case. His own brother has stated that if the government talks to Thaksin the rally would be over immediately. Meanwhile he flies about like a cancer ridden red arsed fly, his family safely out of the country, his lieutenants sleeping in his hotel, while the poor duped out of town supporters sleep on the street, and the Bangkok based ones commute in and out for the free food and a cash payment.

FACT: Despite the main targets of the current shopping centre blockade being large organisations, those most affected by it are the employees, the small stall holders and all the other "lower class" people who make their living by working in Central World, Paragon, Siam, Central Chidlom and the other shops in the area. The only real inconvenience to the "elite" is making them go to Emporium, or overseas, in order to buy their luxury goods. Have the red leadership ever stated a reasonable purpose for their choice of location? Have the red leadership ever made a reasonable statement at all? "Dissolve now! We'll only negotiate if we get what we want before hand! 15 days!" The rabid chanting of a ship of fools can in no way be described as reasonable. And once the ship of fools sinks, as it will one way or another, many innocents will drown and the rats will come out fighting. Let's hope the army is prepared to exterminate them when they do.

BULL (WENG): The red shirt leaders will surrender to police on May 15th.

OK so he made the odd mistake. We all deserve a second chance in life. Lol

Cheers, Rick

[SanSaiExPat]

UPDATE

Thai protest leaders to surrender, but the rally goes on

The government, which imposed a state of emergency in Bangkok and surrounding areas more than a week ago, has accused Thaksin of stoking the unrest.

A legal aide announced Thaksin is to sue Thailand's Foreign Minister Kasit Piromya after the politician called him a "bloody terrorist".

"Dr Thaksin has assigned a team of lawyers to bring a libel case, both civil and criminal, against Mr. Kasit," Noppadon Pattama told AFP.

Published with written approval from AFP.

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

Frickin' hilarious! A coward in hiding and stroking the flames of unrest, while continually claiming the courts are biased and are basically worthless. Yet, he has no problem wanting to use that which he now despises and detests. This "man" is a total nutcase.

Frodo, you offer nothing constructive or substantive. You don't know PM Thaksin yet you call him a "coward" and a "total nutcase". How is that helpful in a constructive dialogue? Who are you? What have you done with your life that redeems you and compels you to disparage PM Thaksin?

[jdinasia]

UPDATE

Thai protest leaders to surrender, but the rally goes on

The government, which imposed a state of emergency in Bangkok and surrounding areas more than a week ago, has accused Thaksin of stoking the unrest.

A legal aide announced Thaksin is to sue Thailand's Foreign Minister Kasit Piromya after the politician called him a "bloody terrorist".

"Dr Thaksin has assigned a team of lawyers to bring a libel case, both civil and criminal, against Mr. Kasit," Noppadon Pattama told AFP.

Published with written approval from AFP.

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

Frickin' hilarious! A coward in hiding and stroking the flames of unrest, while continually claiming the courts are biased and are basically worthless. Yet, he has no problem wanting to use that which he now despises and detests. This "man" is a total nutcase.

Frodo, you offer nothing constructive or substantive. You don't know PM Thaksin yet you call him a "coward" and a "total nutcase". How is that helpful in a constructive dialogue? Who are you? What have you done with your life that redeems you and compels you to disparage PM Thaksin?

Thaksin isn't PM, Abhisit is PM.

What Thaksin IS is a convicted felon on the run from justice while he foments unrest in a country he claims to love. He's a self proclaimed Ghandi whose schock-troops use molatov cocktails. He's a self proclaimed Mandela who runs away from his jail sentence instead of serving it. He's a man that set up a social divide and feeds the fire with his cash, strictly for his personal benefit.

[Netfan]

[

Frickin' hilarious! A coward in hiding and stroking the flames of unrest, while continually claiming the courts are biased and are basically worthless. Yet, he has no problem wanting to use that which he now despises and detests. This "man" is a total nutcase.

Frodo, you offer nothing constructive or substantive. You don't know PM Thaksin yet you call him a "coward" and a "total nutcase". How is that helpful in a constructive dialogue? Who are you? What have you done with your life that redeems you and compels you to disparage PM Thaksin?

I think its more what Thaksin has done Have you seen his recent videos? Nutcase. He tells old men, women and children to come to Bangkok, sleep in the streets and put their lives at risk, all so he can come back and get his money and run a republic, while he and his family live the life of luxury hiding out. Coward.

[jcbangkok]

FYI ... was at Victory Monument late this afternoon. The Anti-Red Shirt movement is really growing. Great atmosphere and people but am sure they all have another side that will come out if the Reds get there way.

Clearly the only resolution to the political problems in Thailand is for the Reds to go home and take up the current government's offer to hold elections in 6 or 9 months BUT more importantly ALL the people (and colors) of Thailand need to accept the way of change is through scheduled elections. Holding election by the end of the year is a fair compromise but it should NEVER be done again regardless of any circumstances. Laws and succession plans need to be followed in the event of a corrupt leaders and demanding elections every time your guy isn't in power is not democracy. If people are sick of coups and fraud in the government then maybe they will learn to elect honest leaders at some point.

[lannarebirth]

[

Frickin' hilarious! A coward in hiding and stroking the flames of unrest, while continually claiming the courts are biased and are basically worthless. Yet, he has no problem wanting to use that which he now despises and detests. This "man" is a total nutcase.

Frodo, you offer nothing constructive or substantive. You don't know PM Thaksin yet you call him a "coward" and a "total nutcase". How is that helpful in a constructive dialogue? Who are you? What have you done with your life that redeems you and compels you to disparage PM Thaksin?

I think its more what Thaksin has done Have you seen his recent videos? Nutcase. He tells old men, women and children to come to Bangkok, sleep in the streets and put their lives at risk, all so he can come back and get his money and run a republic, while he and his family live the life of luxury hiding out. Coward.

Does he tell them he's going to shoot the occasional supporter in the back of their skull for "the cause"?

[bangkokrick]

UPDATE

Thai protest leaders to surrender, but the rally goes on

The government, which imposed a state of emergency in Bangkok and surrounding areas more than a week ago, has accused Thaksin of stoking the unrest.

A legal aide announced Thaksin is to sue Thailand's Foreign Minister Kasit Piromya after the politician called him a "bloody terrorist".

"Dr Thaksin has assigned a team of lawyers to bring a libel case, both civil and criminal, against Mr. Kasit," Noppadon Pattama told AFP.

Published with written approval from AFP.

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

Frickin' hilarious! A coward in hiding and stroking the flames of unrest, while continually claiming the courts are biased and are basically worthless. Yet, he has no problem wanting to use that which he now despises and detests. This "man" is a total nutcase.

Frodo, you offer nothing constructive or substantive. You don't know PM Thaksin yet you call him a "coward" and a "total nutcase". How is that helpful in a constructive dialogue? Who are you? What have you done with your life that redeems you and compels you to disparage PM Thaksin?

Not wanting to be a stickler for detail, but Thaksin allegedly did run away from his responsibilities in Thailand.

CNN: Thailand's Supreme Court issued arrest warrants Monday for deposed Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra and his wife after they skipped a court appearance and fled to the United Kingdom, court officials said.

The couple was to appear in court Monday in a corruption case.

Instead, Thaksin released a three-page handwritten statement saying he opted to go to England because he did not expect fair treatment in Thai courts, the Thai News Agency said.

Thaksin could not immediately be reached for comment.

Thaksin and his wife, Pojaman Shinawatra, were scheduled to testify in a Supreme Court case about the unlawful purchase of real estate. The real-estate scandal case is one of several corruption claims that Thaksin and his family face in court.

Their lawyer had said the pair would "definitely appear" in court Monday to fight the corruption charges, the News Agency (TNA) said. Watch more about the ex-Thai leader's decision to flee »

But the couple did not return to Bangkok on Sunday night from a trip to the opening ceremonies of the Summer Olympic Games in Beijing, China.

I agree that there is no need for the name calling, especially when he is in a suing mood.

Cheers, Rick

[Netfan]

[

Frickin' hilarious! A coward in hiding and stroking the flames of unrest, while continually claiming the courts are biased and are basically worthless. Yet, he has no problem wanting to use that which he now despises and detests. This "man" is a total nutcase.

Frodo, you offer nothing constructive or substantive. You don't know PM Thaksin yet you call him a "coward" and a "total nutcase". How is that helpful in a constructive dialogue? Who are you? What have you done with your life that redeems you and compels you to disparage PM Thaksin?

I think its more what Thaksin has done Have you seen his recent videos? Nutcase. He tells old men, women and children to come to Bangkok, sleep in the streets and put their lives at risk, all so he can come back and get his money and run a republic, while he and his family live the life of luxury hiding out. Coward.

Does he tell them he's going to shoot the occasional supporter in the back of their skull for "the cause"?

Collateral Damage

[BNZ]

It amazes me at the level of hatred and criticism being directed towards Thaksin on this forum. He seems to be considered guilty of just about every crime known to mankind. The only thing missing (AFAIK), are accusations of pedophilia...

But when he was in power only a few years ago, I cannot recall reading such extreme views about him from Thai Visa posters. No-one was baying for his blood, or demanding his imprisonment

Now why is that? Seems to me that there are too many 'sheep' on this forum willing to accept the statements of an illegal, post-coup government.

Thaksin was no angel. But he was definitely the best PM for Thailand, given the country's circumstances.

Simon

Ha ha ha ha h ha ha ha ha ha ha  ...oops my ass fell off 

[jayjay0]

It seems to me that a lot of the anti red shirts are talking about a country other than Thailand. This is nothing new for Thailand it is the way it has been for years. You seem to equate Thailand to wherever you came from. Wrong.

Part of the reason I have chose to retire here is I truly appreciate the difference. I try not to bring my preconceived idea's on how it should be. True some things I disprove of but I will be damned if I will say they are wrong. It is there country and I am a guest. It makes me wonder when I read some of these posters. They talk about how evil the red's are how they have snipers shooting themselves from within the crowd. How the terrorists dress in Black [haven't figured that one out] They ignore the fact that out of 23 dead only 4 are soldiers These soldiers were shooting rubber bullets. They forget to mention when the red shirts return guns and ammunition they had taken from the soldiers 1 out of six bullets were rubber the others were real. Why does the army need anti aircraft guns to peacefully disperse the crowds? Some times I would like to suggest to some to go back home if they don't like it or are unwilling to accept it but then I remember they are here because Thailand will accept them as they are.

There is enough blame to go around stop trying to put it all at the doorstep of one party. In the end if it is to truly make a difference both parties will have to come together and admit there part and talk freely about what needs doing for Thailand to come out a more peaceful country. In the mean time it will be same same with the occasional change of players. Sit back and enjoy Thailand.

[dude007]

Didn't Arisman say he was going to surrender to police a couple of weeks ago?

Those who refuse arrest should be shot. This is not the wild west here. The law is still above all and refusing arrest can lead to violence and even being shot. The Police has the right to do so.

But with half of the police being "watermelons"... Abhisit has finally seen the problem and responsibilised the Army. See now...

[Skywalker69]

Red-shirt leader Chat says he will not report to emergency command

BANGKOK: -- Pol Lt Gen Chat Kuldirok, a red-shirt leader, said Saturday that he will not report himself to the Emergency Operations Command.

Chat, a former commissioner of the Central Investigation Bureau, said he received the summon order of the EOC Saturday morning but he would not meet EOC officials at the 11th Infantry Regiment as summoned.

Chat said he feared that he would be arrested and taken to be detained at a military camp in Chon Buri.

He said he preferred to wait for the court issue an arrest warrant against him instead.

As more information comes out as to who is who in the red movement, if it wasn't so serious it would be funny.

Any idea as to why the police action failed at the SC Hotel anyone? Here we have a Pol Lt Gen as red leader with the police going to arrest other red leaders undercover. Talk about Keystone Cops.

And if he is not willing to surrender now what makes anyone think he will surrender after an arrest warrent is issued? Does the arrest warrent assure him he will not be taken to the military camp in Chon Buri? What a joke.

I think he prefer a nice hotel in Montenegro

[culicine]

What are the yellows??

Burr,

the Yellows are/were the crowd the Bangkok Bandits wheel out when they lose an election. Unlike the Reds, the army does not shoot them when they occupy an airport, etc.

Most of the farang posters here seem to be right-wing authoritarians who have not a clue about democracy. In a real democracy, ultimate political power is the will of the majority of people, as expressed at the ballot-box. It is not some elevated elite possessing unlimited money, troops, tanks, guns, & English-language newspapers.

I see one of the latter has dubbed the Red-supporting majority of Thailand as 'terrorists'. Nice one for all authoritarian anti-democrats. It's a simple 'law 'n order' situation, so bring on more firepower! Were Adolf Hitler & Joe Stalin alive, they would be cheering behind you.

By all means let the legal attrition against Ole Squarehead continue. Meantime, howsabout a free election, dudes?

Couldn't agree more. If we were back in our home free democratic countries we would be cheering on the protesters who basically want a free democratically elected government and not the military backed current Junta. The blatantly obvious propaganda I witness on state controlled TV is laughable if it were not so serious. The Red Shirts only failing is their misguided support for Thaskin, who did more for poor people than any other Thai Leader but unfortunately he lined his own pockets at the same time.

1. @Jaggg88: The main barrier to a free election is the reds themselves, and their refusal to allow non PPP candidates to campaign in many parts of the country. It's something they're proud about, and their mouthpieces here constantly boast about how Abhisit can't safely tavel to the North and parts of Isaan.

2. @OldgitTom: Oh dear, I seem to have left a fact off of my list above. Please post a link to Thaksin "doing more for poor people than any other Thai Leader". The facts would suggest he did no more or less than any other. Not surprising really, as he simply bought out the same politicians who have been keeping the poor in their place for decades. The TRT government spent less than a third on Isaan than it did on the Northern, Central and Southern regions. This includes education and transport. What he did for the poor, apart from kill thousands of them, was to throw a few crumbs of taxpayers money in what was arguably the most organised votebuying campaign ever seen in the country. In the long term, he had very little effect. If you actually pay attention to what the current government has done in the past year, it potentially has achieved far more long term good for the poor with its crop insurance schemes, free education to 15 years, the abolishment of the 30 baht health charge, and some major public works, including installing street lighting and upgrading of main and accident prone roads. Of course, you won't hear about these from any red shirt source. You probably won't even hear too much from their own coalition partners, but they have been done, and continue to be done, and those upcountry who really care about making some progress, rather than making a quick buck from Thaksin's protests, and previously his handouts and loans, are well aware of them.

It seems to me that the government should spend a bit more time actually telling the country folk just what there are doing for them! After all they do control the mainstream media. The problem I fear is that people want short term quick fixes, such as debt relief, (rather than being educated on how to avoid debt in the first place )and don't see any value in long term changes, such as in the education sector.

[anotherpeter]

It seems to me that the government should spend a bit more time actually telling the country folk just what there are doing for them! After all they do control the mainstream media. The problem I fear is that people want short term quick fixes, such as debt relief, (rather than being educated on how to avoid debt in the first place )and don't see any value in long term changes, such as in the education sector.

The problem is that the country folk only watch Red TV. And there is no way the government will get any space to tell their side on that channel.

[kimincm]

It amazes me at the level of hatred and criticism being directed towards Thaksin on this forum. He seems to be considered guilty of just about every crime known to mankind. The only thing missing (AFAIK), are accusations of pedophilia...

But when he was in power only a few years ago, I cannot recall reading such extreme views about him from Thai Visa posters. No-one was baying for his blood, or demanding his imprisonment

Now why is that? Seems to me that there are too many 'sheep' on this forum willing to accept the statements of an illegal, post-coup government.

Thaksin was no angel. But he was definitely the best PM for Thailand, given the country's circumstances.

Simon

Simon,this is the first post I've made during this whole debacle(check) but living in the outer suburbs of C Mai

and totally orange shirt (why not,anything I think doesn't count).But I have asked many Thai's I see everyday "When Thaksin was in power how did your life improve.?" And I asked "If the Red Shirt win,how will your life improve.?"Answer,"Nothing has changed we have always had to take care of ourselves and nothing will change,any body who rises to to power always forgets us." Sad but true.

[grayfield18]

What are the yellows??

Burr,

the Yellows are/were the crowd the Bangkok Bandits wheel out when they lose an election. Unlike the Reds, the army does not shoot them when they occupy an airport, etc.

Most of the farang posters here seem to be right-wing authoritarians who have not a clue about democracy. In a real democracy, ultimate political power is the will of the majority of people, as expressed at the ballot-box. It is not some elevated elite possessing unlimited money, troops, tanks, guns, & English-language newspapers.

I see one of the latter has dubbed the Red-supporting majority of Thailand as 'terrorists'. Nice one for all authoritarian anti-democrats. It's a simple 'law 'n order' situation, so bring on more firepower! Were Adolf Hitler & Joe Stalin alive, they would be cheering behind you.

By all means let the legal attrition against Ole Squarehead continue. Meantime, howsabout a free election, dudes?

I get really angry when I read ignorant comments like this.

Oldgit - you have absolutely no idea, do you? Were you around when Thaksin was in power? Were you paying attention? Thaksin was more of an authoritarian than Abhisit will ever be. Do you honestly think Thailand was ruled democratically when the red hero was in power? Did you completely miss the intimidation of the press and the opposition, the manipulation of the courts, the use of goverment powers for private profit, the extra-judicial killings? Have you ever read Thaksin's words about democracy while he was ruling the roost? Not exactly a hero of democracy back then and hardly one now ... more like a hero of hypocrisy. I am hardly a right wing authoritarian, but I despise the red shirt leaders who are nothing but a bunch of thugs and wouldn't know democracy if they were choking on it. They are in it for themselves - period! The rural poor have legitimate beefs, but it is sad that their cause has fallen prey to the likes of Thaksin and all the other scumbag red leadership.

By the way, dude ... the current parliament consists of people who were elected in the last election in which the red shirt party (Pheua Thai) won more seats than any other party but not a majority, so a democrat-led coalition was formed when the Pheua Thai lost the support of the minority parties. That's how a parliamentary democracy works - look it up! But no! You and the reds would have the PM dissolve a constitutionally elected government just because a bunch of demagogues have convinced a bunch of gullible people to roam around the city blocking roads, defacing public property, launching grenades, and performing barbaric blood rituals. You call that democracy - seriously?

I submit that it is you, oldgit, that don't have a clue about democracy, not those of us who are attempting to call attention to the hypocrisy of the UDD leaders.

Well said, Kudo's. It is just unfortunate that this type of fact based reason will again and again fall on deaf brainwashed ears. Sad and embbarrassing days for Thailand.

There is not a single fact in this diatribe. The comments on the elections that brought Abhisit to power are not even true. Throw around a load of allegations and suggest that maybe because someone was or wasn't in Thailand at the time - which we don't even know for sure and then some other berk comes on and says they are facts. There is not ONE fact in this attack on oldgit.

[tonglen]

This escape was like a cross between a Cirque D' Sole and a Barnum Brothers Circus act.

Arisiman looks like the big red Kool-Aid guy coming down the building. Im surprised theres a big enough rope to carry him safely. If he were wearing purple he would look like Barney or Grimace. Too much Pad Thai, not enough shrimp.

The govt should be ashamed. Next time carry a pair of scizzors guys.....

By the way, is Arisman really a caucasian or did he lose the capllaries that carry blood to his head in the escape attempt?

[anotherpeter]

There is not a single fact in this diatribe. The comments on the elections that brought Abhisit to power are not even true. Throw around a load of allegations and suggest that maybe because someone was or wasn't in Thailand at the time - which we don't even know for sure and then some other berk comes on and says they are facts. There is not ONE fact in this attack on oldgit.

Maybe rather that stating there are no facts, can you please provide some corrections to the statements?

How did Abhisit come to power if it wasn't by the change of the support of the smaller parties?

[Skywalker69]

But when he was in power only a few years ago, I cannot recall reading such extreme views about him from Thai Visa posters. No-one was baying for his blood, or demanding his imprisonment

Now why is that? Seems to me that there are too many 'sheep' on this forum willing to accept the statements of an illegal, post-coup government.

Why is it that Thaksin's mouthpieces must hijack every thread with their "Thaksin was the best PM ever... The current government is not elected..." clap trap? These have been done to death on countless threads, and the facts are all counter to what the Thaksinistas would have us believe.

FACT: In any true democracy Thaksin would never have made it to PM. He would have failed the asset concealment case, he wouldn't have been able to buy his way to the job, and he wouldn't have been able to use his family connections to make his money in the first place.

FACT: Thaksin was responsible for the murder of over 3,000 people in his war on drugs, southern crackdowns and bird flu coverup.

FACT: Thaksin stole around 150 Billion baht from the Thai people while serving as PM.

FACT: Many people who spoke out against him either turned up dead, or never turned up at all.

FACT: Many more were sued for vast amounts of money.

FACT: Thaksin never won an election using new TRT candidates, both his victories were achieved by buying up the same old corrupt parties such as the NAP, which was the biggest single party prior to the TRT.

FACT: He couldn't even win the 2006 election, despite the TRT being the only major party involved, and despite cheating.

FACT: He resigned following the 2006 election debacle, then appointed himself as caretaker PM and resisted holding elections despite having no mandate at the time. He was not the elected PM at the time of the coup.

FACT: Thaksin appointed family members as head of the military and deputy head of the police.

FACT: In the 2007 election, more people voted for a party other than his proxy PTP than for it. The PTP was only able to form a government by forming a coalition with the minor parties, including the CTP, which itself had joined the boycot of the 2006 election and whose leader had stated that he wouldn't align with the PTP prior to the 2007 election. A vote for the CTP was not a proxy vote for the PTP. And, in terms of actual percentages, the Democrats got slightly more votes than the PTP.

FACT: Samak was kicked out for getting paid to host a cooking show, during which he spouted politics, and then lying about doing so. He could have been reinstated the next day, but Thaksin installed his own brother in law instead.

FACT: The Somchai government did not resign due to the PAD protests, but was dissolved by the courts. The EC has recommended that the Democrats also be dissolved, however no court ruling has yet been made.

FACT: The combined Samak and Somchai government was one of the most ineffectual the country has seen. It spent more time trying to change the constitution and get a pardon for Thaksin than actually ruling the country. It's most far reaching policies were to throw the Rohingya out of the country and to repatriate the Hmong, both of which were later jumped upon by the clueless anti Abhisit brigade in the mistaken belief that he had introduced them. (Along with where he was born, where he was educated, the eloquence with which he speaks and what he looks like, for some strange reason).

FACT: Neither the reds nor the PPP have ever come up with a manifesto, or even a list of what they would do if elections were held and they came out on top. Repeated rants about dissolving parliament now (every delay being an impediment to Thaksin's return) are not really credible policy of any opposition. They're not even sure who their leader is as well. Sure, we all know the man pulling the strings is the dear leader, but who would be PM? Chalerm? Chavalit? Jatuporn? Yingluk? Oak?

FACT: Every redshirt rally has been all about Thaksin. They rally to his call, avidly listen to his phone ins, openly take orders from him and take his money. Last Songkran it was all about his call for revolution. This year it was all about his asset freeze case. His own brother has stated that if the government talks to Thaksin the rally would be over immediately. Meanwhile he flies about like a cancer ridden red arsed fly, his family safely out of the country, his lieutenants sleeping in his hotel, while the poor duped out of town supporters sleep on the street, and the Bangkok based ones commute in and out for the free food and a cash payment.

FACT: Despite the main targets of the current shopping centre blockade being large organisations, those most affected by it are the employees, the small stall holders and all the other "lower class" people who make their living by working in Central World, Paragon, Siam, Central Chidlom and the other shops in the area. The only real inconvenience to the "elite" is making them go to Emporium, or overseas, in order to buy their luxury goods. Have the red leadership ever stated a reasonable purpose for their choice of location? Have the red leadership ever made a reasonable statement at all? "Dissolve now! We'll only negotiate if we get what we want before hand! 15 days!" The rabid chanting of a ship of fools can in no way be described as reasonable. And once the ship of fools sinks, as it will one way or another, many innocents will drown and the rats will come out fighting. Let's hope the army is prepared to exterminate them when they do.

BULL (WENG): The red shirt leaders will surrender to police on May 15th.

Very informative post, thank you

[yoshiwara]

What are the yellows??

As a witness, i could say that a yellow is a thai person issued from medium/high to high class who support a group of old (very old) elites witch are part of famous very high class famillies witch are owning almost all country large buisenesses, for example: they are rulling the rice buisness and also deciding for it's price.

Very influent people who are staying in the background, never appears on any medias but rule the country and it's economy. They do not want to share power or anything else...

Sounds like a description of Thaksin and his northern landowner supporters.

One thing for sure is that Thaksin does not want to share power with anyone.

The overreacher's downfall.

[Skywalker69]

[

Frickin' hilarious! A coward in hiding and stroking the flames of unrest, while continually claiming the courts are biased and are basically worthless. Yet, he has no problem wanting to use that which he now despises and detests. This "man" is a total nutcase.

Frodo, you offer nothing constructive or substantive. You don't know PM Thaksin yet you call him a "coward" and a "total nutcase". How is that helpful in a constructive dialogue? Who are you? What have you done with your life that redeems you and compels you to disparage PM Thaksin?

I think its more what Thaksin has done Have you seen his recent videos? Nutcase. He tells old men, women and children to come to Bangkok, sleep in the streets and put their lives at risk, all so he can come back and get his money and run a republic, while he and his family live the life of luxury hiding out. Coward.

You got it spot on

[jdinasia]

There is not a single fact in this diatribe. The comments on the elections that brought Abhisit to power are not even true. Throw around a load of allegations and suggest that maybe because someone was or wasn't in Thailand at the time - which we don't even know for sure and then some other berk comes on and says they are facts. There is not ONE fact in this attack on oldgit.

Maybe rather that stating there are no facts, can you please provide some corrections to the statements?

How did Abhisit come to power if it wasn't by the change of the support of the smaller parties?

I could find no factual errors in the post that grayfield was referring to .... That cannot be said about grayfield's post that had no facts that were correct.

but hey .......

[animatic]

[

Frickin' hilarious! A coward in hiding and stroking the flames of unrest, while continually claiming the courts are biased and are basically worthless. Yet, he has no problem wanting to use that which he now despises and detests. This "man" is a total nutcase.

Frodo, you offer nothing constructive or substantive. You don't know PM Thaksin yet you call him a "coward" and a "total nutcase". How is that helpful in a constructive dialogue? Who are you? What have you done with your life that redeems you and compels you to disparage PM Thaksin?

I think its more what Thaksin has done Have you seen his recent videos? Nutcase. He tells old men, women and children to come to Bangkok, sleep in the streets and put their lives at risk, all so he can come back and get his money and run a republic, while he and his family live the life of luxury hiding out. Coward.

Does he tell them he's going to shoot the occasional supporter in the back of their skull for "the cause"?

I think that part was let out of the contract negotiations for the 500 baht.

Now the offer is 100k insurance if you die for the cause.

Go on boyo set your old widowed mother up for life and help Thailand!