Thai Forces Fire Warning Shots In Standoff With Red Shirts

[humfurry]

Both CNN and BBC know that something very big is about to happen in Bangkok. They're not sending their top reporters over here for nothing, believe me.

They want something big to happen... and they are determined to skew the reporting to make it happen.

Pathetic comment

Oh, then you must be one of their top reporters?

[timekeeper]

TAN Network: Soldiers back away from further confrontation allowing reds to return to Ratchprasong

that might sound like a bad call but these boys will go back to the others and tell them just how scary that confrontation was and there will be less reds returning to the site tomorrow

they won't be quite so cocky either.....

And some may decide they have more important business elsewhere as they make their way back.

Yep. I'm quite sure that there will be no red shirts left by tomorrow morning. All gone home. Political problem solved!

if only.................

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Has anyone noticed that the soldiers were wearing pink ribbons around their neck today?

All the army on Silom have been wearing pink scarfs since they arrived last Monday.

Nice touch I reckon

Yes, definitely!

What's perhaps less nice is the reason why it's necessary for members of the same armed forces to be distinguishing themselves. Possibly the concern is that not all factions are on exactly the same side.

[brianbiegler]

I just want to applaud the soldiers and police for doing their jobs. They were tasked to stop that convoy and they did. Well done, lets see more of that.

For the last few weeks I've been doubting they could get anything right.

Cheers.

[lazurus]

TAN Network: Soldiers back away from further confrontation allowing reds to return to Ratchprasong

that might sound like a bad call but these boys will go back to the others and tell them just how scary that confrontation was and there will be less reds returning to the site tomorrow

they won't be quite so cocky either.....

Or it could have the opposite affect?? I do hope not..

They aren't the type for quiet reflection and self preservation, they've sealed their fate.

[way2muchcoffee]

I understand that the moderators need to be cautious during this time of unrest and sympathize with the difficulties they face doing a thankless job. Since we're no longer permitted to post and discuss news clippings in the General Forum, I thought I'd bring a story to your attention here. Abhisit told the BBC on Tuesday why he won't call for a new election.

Thailand crisis: Red-shirt protesters and troops clash

On Tuesday Mr Abhisit told the BBC that while he wanted a political solution to the crisis, immediate elections were not the answer.

"There is a clear threat that if we hold elections too soon, with the mood running as high in terms of divisions and in terms of tension, elections would turn violent and they would solve nothing and we could be back into this vicious cycle of demonstrations."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/8648109.stm

He's probably right about that. So what's taking him so long to (re)start this political solution?? Never mind which side (or no side) you support, Abhisit is failing miserably as a leader. (or even as the establishment's spokesperson).

Tell us Winnie -------- how could YOU do better? Abhisit has been patient and tolerant and maintained some semblance of normalcy. The reds escalate in the hopes of creating enough blood on the streets to force a change of governent. The reds have failed so far and Abhisit has maintained his cool .... I hope that they continue to play it as cool as they have.

I would have engaged Phua Thai (possibly but not necessarily including the Red leadership) and come to an agreement on elections. Abhisit has already suggested 9 months, the Reds want 1 month. Enough of this BS already and negotiate something that saves some face all around and gets to elections in half a year or so. Note that not just a timeline needs to be on the table, but also the conditions of the election, or even constitution amendments prior to the election. At the same time, any violent elements in the Red protests need to be brought to justice.

(Sadly even this statement above some people will see as Red.. that's just sad. There is a clear path forward but Abhisit is unwilling (though more likely: unable) to take it. )

There were reports of secret talks between government and red shirt leaders right after the Sala Daeng grenades. This was when the red shirts were changing to a 30 day offer and bringing in envoys from the embassies. Evidently it was the amnesty issue that caused the government to back out of those talks. I don't recall where I read that information. New Mandala, BPund, tweets, newspaper? Somewhere. Because I don't recall precisely please feel free to take it with a grain of salt.

Edited April 28, 2010 by way2muchcoffee

[phuketrichard]

Was watching Thai tv 3. Shwoing reds throwing rocks and sticks at the police and them doing nothing. They should just go in and end it

in lees than an hour Annapour's interview with Abhisit on CNN

[Jingthing]

I wish the reds had the sense to walk away. Nation is reporting that roads around the protesters are being closed. There is speculation that there will soon be an attempt to disperse them. I was at Sala Daeng today and there is a lot of firepower in the area. If the situation boils over and the army opens fire on the protesters they have no chance. To this point the army has been very reluctant to shoot protesters with live ammo. If that attitude changes the reds will be in real trouble. Just walk away reds, just walk away.

Agreed. They should walk away. Any peaceful ones left have associated themselves with a violent terrorist movement. Sadly, walking away may not be easy. There are physical barriers to them walking away. They won't get "paid" if they walk away. They lose their ID card if they walk away. Some more overzealous red war lords may harm them if they try to walk away. If they walk away and they come from a red village, they will be branded coward and traitor for life.

[OzMick]

I'm a little sick of hearing the redshirts this and the redshirts that. This is democracy in motion. If a ruling party refuses to openly compromise then the outcome can be violent. People here are passionate about their country. I admire them for that. They are willing to give their life for what they believe in. You whiners that think your opinion matters are just adding to the problem. The Thai people have a leader they believe is illegitimate and they are acting as such.

Many years ago our countries did the same thing the Thai are doing now. GIVE THEM SOME SLACK!!! Your opinion as a farang means nothing but your trivial rhetoric may create discontent that isn't needed. We are bystanders. Pay some respect and allow the process to come to it's conclusion. It is coming soon. I believe we will have a better country that we are visiting than the one that exists now.

If you don't want to read about redshirts, go to another thread - there is a great one about thai cooking!

[humfurry]

Has anyone noticed that the soldiers were wearing pink ribbons around their neck today?

All the army on Silom have been wearing pink scarfs since they arrived last Monday.

Nice touch I reckon

Yes, definitely!

What's perhaps less nice is the reason why it's necessary for members of the same armed forces to be distinguishing themselves. Possibly the concern is that not all factions are on exactly the same side.

The pink ribbons are pledges their support for the King.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

I would have engaged Phua Thai (possibly but not necessarily including the Red leadership) and come to an agreement on elections. Abhisit has already suggested 9 months, the Reds want 1 month. Enough of this BS already and negotiate something that saves some face all around and gets to elections in half a year or so. Note that not just a timeline needs to be on the table, but also the conditions of the election, or even constitution amendments prior to the election. At the same time, any violent elements in the Red protests need to be brought to justice.

(Sadly even this statement above some people will see as Red.. that's just sad. There is a clear path forward but Abhisit is unwilling (though more likely: unable) to take it. )

Incorrect. The red shirts have said that 3 months for new elections would be acceptable to them and they would disperse immediately if Abhisit agreed. He declined.

I stand corrected. Makes my point even stronger.. The leadership's inability to resolve a '9 baht' versus '3 baht' negotiation is leading to death, distruction and continues a path of civil war. Honestly, settle on '5 baht' and get on with things already. It saves face for all and is generally the Thai way. That this hasn't happened already can only point at an immense power vacuum OR conflicts of interests among the countries leaders (incl. military, etc, of course)

[misterjag]

I understand that the moderators need to be cautious during this time of unrest and sympathize with the difficulties they face doing a thankless job. Since we're no longer permitted to post and discuss news clippings in the General Forum, I thought I'd bring a story to your attention here. Abhisit told the BBC on Tuesday why he won't call for a new election.

Thailand crisis: Red-shirt protesters and troops clash

On Tuesday Mr Abhisit told the BBC that while he wanted a political solution to the crisis, immediate elections were not the answer.

"There is a clear threat that if we hold elections too soon, with the mood running as high in terms of divisions and in terms of tension, elections would turn violent and they would solve nothing and we could be back into this vicious cycle of demonstrations."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/8648109.stm

He's probably right about that. So what's taking him so long to (re)start this political solution?? Never mind which side (or no side) you support, Abhisit is failing miserably as a leader. (or even as the establishment's spokesperson).

The Red Shirts are protesting because the rural and urban poor--most Thai citizens--have little influence over how the nation is governed. They want a Parliament that fairly reflects their majority interests.

The authoritarian Yellow Shirts, on the other hand, would take to the streets because they don't want to give up the disproportionate power they wield. Anti-democratic forces are going to try to disrupt free elections because they know they'll lose.

[cdnmatt]

I'm a little sick of hearing the redshirts this and the redshirts that. This is democracy in motion. If a ruling party refuses to openly compromise then the outcome can be violent. People here are passionate about their country. I admire them for that. They are willing to give their life for what they believe in. You whiners that think your opinion matters are just adding to the problem. The Thai people have a leader they believe is illegitimate and they are acting as such.

Many years ago our countries did the same thing the Thai are doing now. GIVE THEM SOME SLACK!!! Your opinion as a farang means nothing but your trivial rhetoric may create discontent that isn't needed. We are bystanders. Pay some respect and allow the process to come to it's conclusion. It is coming soon. I believe we will have a better country that we are visiting than the one that exists now.

You're an idiot. This is hardly "democracy in motion". This is a mob of pissed off people overthrowing a government. That's not democracy. You know, at first I felt somewhat supportive of the red-shirts, but not anymore. Due to their actions, do you seriously believe these are people who are going to be content with nothing more than free & fair elections? I very highly doubt that, and their actions have very much proven otherwise.

I think this is actually starting to get pretty serious though. You have to remember, it was only a simple 35 years ago that Pol Pot was in charge of Cambodia, and killing millions of his fellow country men. Up to this date, the red shirts have given pretty strong indications that they're capable of doing the same type of thing. Some of them seem to have become quite demented, and at the point where they despise anyone who has more money than them.

No matter how you cut it, or what side you support, this isn't good. Let's hope it resolves itself with as little bloodshed as possible, and things don't turn into total anarchy. Don't be fooled into thinking that anarchy and a 100% reversal of power & governance can't happen though.

[way2muchcoffee]

I understand that the moderators need to be cautious during this time of unrest and sympathize with the difficulties they face doing a thankless job. Since we're no longer permitted to post and discuss news clippings in the General Forum, I thought I'd bring a story to your attention here. Abhisit told the BBC on Tuesday why he won't call for a new election.

Thailand crisis: Red-shirt protesters and troops clash

On Tuesday Mr Abhisit told the BBC that while he wanted a political solution to the crisis, immediate elections were not the answer.

"There is a clear threat that if we hold elections too soon, with the mood running as high in terms of divisions and in terms of tension, elections would turn violent and they would solve nothing and we could be back into this vicious cycle of demonstrations."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/8648109.stm

He's probably right about that. So what's taking him so long to (re)start this political solution?? Never mind which side (or no side) you support, Abhisit is failing miserably as a leader. (or even as the establishment's spokesperson).

They want a Parliament that fairly reflects their majority interests. The Red Shirts are protesting because the rural and urban poor--most Thai citizens--have little influence over how the nation is governed. The authoritarian Yellow Shirts would take to the streets because they don't want to give up the disproportionate power they wield. Anti-democratic forces are going to try to disrupt free elections because they know they'll lose.

No. They want a government made up of their minority interests. More people voted Democrat than PPP in the last election. Add in the coalition parties and you have approximately 61% of the voters represented by the current coalition.

[FarangCravings]

Was watching Thai tv 3. Shwoing reds throwing rocks and sticks at the police and them doing nothing. They should just go in and end it

in lees than an hour Annapour's interview with Abhisit on CNN

Lets see if he chokes on the questions again

wont be tough like Hardtalk though it is CNN

Edited April 28, 2010 by FarangCravings

[deadsnoopy]

I just want to applaud the soldiers and police for doing their jobs. They were tasked to stop that convoy and they did. Well done, lets see more of that.

For the last few weeks I've been doubting they could get anything right.

Cheers.

Me too. Especially the guy that shot one of his own. They must be really proud.

[way2muchcoffee]

I would have engaged Phua Thai (possibly but not necessarily including the Red leadership) and come to an agreement on elections. Abhisit has already suggested 9 months, the Reds want 1 month. Enough of this BS already and negotiate something that saves some face all around and gets to elections in half a year or so. Note that not just a timeline needs to be on the table, but also the conditions of the election, or even constitution amendments prior to the election. At the same time, any violent elements in the Red protests need to be brought to justice.

(Sadly even this statement above some people will see as Red.. that's just sad. There is a clear path forward but Abhisit is unwilling (though more likely: unable) to take it. )

Incorrect. The red shirts have said that 3 months for new elections would be acceptable to them and they would disperse immediately if Abhisit agreed. He declined.

They said dissolution in 30 days.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Has anyone noticed that the soldiers were wearing pink ribbons around their neck today?

All the army on Silom have been wearing pink scarfs since they arrived last Monday.

Nice touch I reckon

Yes, definitely!

What's perhaps less nice is the reason why it's necessary for members of the same armed forces to be distinguishing themselves. Possibly the concern is that not all factions are on exactly the same side.

The pink ribbons are pledges their support for the King.

That's why I agreed it's a nice touch.

However we've also seen other colors being used, and it's been widely recognized that this is to distinguish particular regiments from each other.

[humfurry]

I just want to applaud the soldiers and police for doing their jobs. They were tasked to stop that convoy and they did. Well done, lets see more of that.

For the last few weeks I've been doubting they could get anything right.

Cheers.

Me too. Especially the guy that shot one of his own. They must be really proud.

You know they shot their own.... how?

[FarangCravings]

I just want to applaud the soldiers and police for doing their jobs. They were tasked to stop that convoy and they did. Well done, lets see more of that.

For the last few weeks I've been doubting they could get anything right.

Cheers.

Me too. Especially the guy that shot one of his own. They must be really proud.

You know they shot their own.... how?

LOL come on now it cant be that hard for you to follow the thread

[WinnieTheKhwai]

I just want to applaud the soldiers and police for doing their jobs. They were tasked to stop that convoy and they did. Well done, lets see more of that.

For the last few weeks I've been doubting they could get anything right.

Cheers.

Me too. Especially the guy that shot one of his own. They must be really proud.

You know they shot their own.... how?

Sigh.. he knows because he takes in news sources other than The Nation/ThaiVisa. youknow, those big international ones with reporters actually there and reporting 24/7. Multiple ones.

Edited April 28, 2010 by WinnieTheKhwai

[deadsnoopy]

Did anyone notice during the interview with BBC, when Abhisit said that martial law wasn't his decision to implement but the army's? Clearly he's not in control, but the army is.

[phuketrichard]

The goverment admitted the policeman was killed by friendly fire.

CNN Annapour interview with Abhsist at 7pm local time.

Edited April 28, 2010 by phuketrichard

[WinnieTheKhwai]

See if Abhisit can actually come up with something constructive. Probably not, but we'll see in 35 minutes.

Edited April 28, 2010 by WinnieTheKhwai

[FarangCravings]

Did anyone notice during the interview with BBC, when Abhisit said that martial law wasn't his decision to implement but the army's? Clearly he's not in control, but the army is.

Good point

raised my eyebrows when he said that shows really who is actually in charge.

[tigerboy]

Red shirt people i understand you might want to ask for political changes or democracy...

You actually have the right to ask for whaever you want...but please do it from home and stop coming to bkk and annoy thousand of people who tries to do their work, this not good for you, this not good for us, this not good for thailand.

SO ask for whatever you want but please stay home and start doing some work or the country is heading to an economic crash...

Best idea so far in this topic!

Red shirts, F*&% OFF, go home, wait for your chance at the next election...

For F&% s sake, I really, really think that the "parliamentary system" was invented by morons for the sake of children.

Thai people, grow up, or be forever labeled as an immature culture that probably *should* have been colonized... BWE - Burma With Electricity...

Live long *or* prosper (hopefully). (What! U want both!! 5555)

I feel better now....

[humfurry]

I just want to applaud the soldiers and police for doing their jobs. They were tasked to stop that convoy and they did. Well done, lets see more of that.

For the last few weeks I've been doubting they could get anything right.

Cheers.

Me too. Especially the guy that shot one of his own. They must be really proud.

You know they shot their own.... how?

LOL come on now it cant be that hard for you to follow the thread

No one knows who shot that boy at this point... but then again I forgot, your a top reporter... you know everything.

[Neurath]

I understand that the moderators need to be cautious during this time of unrest and sympathize with the difficulties they face doing a thankless job. Since we're no longer permitted to post and discuss news clippings in the General Forum, I thought I'd bring a story to your attention here. Abhisit told the BBC on Tuesday why he won't call for a new election.

Thailand crisis: Red-shirt protesters and troops clash

On Tuesday Mr Abhisit told the BBC that while he wanted a political solution to the crisis, immediate elections were not the answer.

"There is a clear threat that if we hold elections too soon, with the mood running as high in terms of divisions and in terms of tension, elections would turn violent and they would solve nothing and we could be back into this vicious cycle of demonstrations."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/8648109.stm

He's probably right about that. So what's taking him so long to (re)start this political solution?? Never mind which side (or no side) you support, Abhisit is failing miserably as a leader. (or even as the establishment's spokesperson).

Tell us Winnie -------- how could YOU do better? Abhisit has been patient and tolerant and maintained some semblance of normalcy. The reds escalate in the hopes of creating enough blood on the streets to force a change of governent. The reds have failed so far and Abhisit has maintained his cool .... I hope that they continue to play it as cool as they have.

I would have engaged Phua Thai (possibly but not necessarily including the Red leadership) and come to an agreement on elections. Abhisit has already suggested 9 months, the Reds want 1 month. Enough of this BS already and negotiate something that saves some face all around and gets to elections in half a year or so. Note that not just a timeline needs to be on the table, but also the conditions of the election, or even constitution amendments prior to the election. At the same time, any violent elements in the Red protests need to be brought to justice.

(Sadly even this statement above some people will see as Red.. that's just sad. There is a clear path forward but Abhisit is unwilling (though more likely: unable) to take it. )

Very sensible indeed. But the key for both sides is September. Reds will not agree to an election after that and the coalition won't agree to one before. This is most assuredly not a fight over democratic rights, it is a fight for advantage in whatever political system is extant.

I once compared the Red Shirts to Naxalites and was rightly reprimanded by, I believe Axiomatic. Suitably chastened, I now believe that in tactics at least the red shirt leadership is increasingly coming to resemble the Taiping and their ardent supporters those C20th Chinese who lionized the Taiping as revolutionary precursors fighting against a corrupt feudal system. Didn't turn out to well in the end though.

[zorm999]

... This is a mob of pissed off people overthrowing a government. That's not democracy. You know, at first I felt somewhat supportive of the red-shirts, but not anymore. Due to their actions, do you seriously believe these are people who are going to be content with nothing more than free & fair elections? I very highly doubt that, and their actions have very much proven otherwise.

I think this is actually starting to get pretty serious though. You have to remember, it was only a simple 35 years ago that Pol Pot was in charge of Cambodia, and killing millions of his fellow country men. Up to this date, the red shirts have given pretty strong indications that they're capable of doing the same type of thing. Some of them seem to have become quite demented, and at the point where they despise anyone who has more money than them.

No matter how you cut it, or what side you support, this isn't good. Let's hope it resolves itself with as little bloodshed as possible, and things don't turn into total anarchy. Don't be fooled into thinking that anarchy and a 100% reversal of power & governance can't happen though.

I believe the reds have only been demanding elections, not "free and fair" elections. An important difference!!

Have to agree about how this is looking though - the longer it goes and the more militant the red shirts become and the less confidence the army and police have, the more likely it's going to escalate before it subsides. A peaceful resolution is still possible but it seems desperately remote, sadly.

[kevkev1888]

I just want to applaud the soldiers and police for doing their jobs. They were tasked to stop that convoy and they did. Well done, lets see more of that.

For the last few weeks I've been doubting they could get anything right.

Cheers.

Me too. Especially the guy that shot one of his own. They must be really proud.

Created a new account today to spout shit!!!