Thai Electrical System

[sbaker8688]

Could someone tell me the difference between the Thai electrical system, and the U.S.? My thought was that they were "close enough" for most electrical devices to work normally. However, my electric toothbrush (a sonicare) has not charged a single day since I've been in Thailand (for over 2 months now). Now I find that my electric waterpick, which I only use on occasion, has a dead battery. It will not charge either, and probably has not charged since the day I arrived. I have an electric razor, however, that charges just fine.

Anyway, I'm torn between assuming that both the waterpick and the toothbrush went bad (they were both brand new, bought just before I stepped on the plane over), or that they are good but that I need to buy some sort of "converter" or whatever to adjust the electrical system.

Can anybody tell me anything?

Thanks.

[p_brownstone]

Hard to believe this is a serious Post but I will answer anyway!

The Thai electrical system is 220 / 240 VAC, the US is 110 VAC.

If you plug a US appliance into a Thai socket the thing will immediately blow a fuse, if it has one, or simply burn out if it does not. A few appliances have a built in step down system which will automatically adjust to the higher voltage but many don’t.

It's probably too late to do anything with the 2 appliances which do not work anymore - very expensive or impossible to fix them now - unless, as I say, they are fused in which case you simply need to replace the fuse (with a 110 VAC fuse by the way, NOT a 220) then buy a step down transformer from Home Pro or somewhere similar.

As I say it's very difficult to believe you have lived here 2 months without knowing this very basic fact.

Patrick

Edited June 14, 2005 by p_brownstone

[LoveDaBlues]

Thai = 220 volts......US = 110......but at my house actually measures around 120; not enouch to matter. I'm pretty sure you can buy a converter so your US electrical stuff will work; maybe someone here can tell you where to get them.

Edited June 14, 2005 by LoveDaBlues

[maerim]

The Thai electrical system is 220 / 240 VAC, the US is 110 VAC.

Yes it is, 220/240 most of the time, 0 volts some of the time, no earth any of the time.

By the way what is a water pick?

[lopburi3]

The Thai electrical system is 220 / 240 VAC, the US is 110 VAC.

Yes it is, 220/240 most of the time, 0 volts some of the time, no earth any of the time.

By the way what is a water pick?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

A low price and lower pressure version of the water cleaning system a dentist uses.

[p_brownstone]

By the way Shaker, since you apparently did little research before you came to Thailand - you do realise that we drive on the left over here??

Patrick

[bdenner]

You must be the only person I have heard of who travels to a foreign destination without doing a little research on the place before hand! Your 110 VAC appliances will indeed trip circuit protection (if it exists) or go up in smoke. Some things like NoteBook power adapters are universal but read the specifications. 220 to 110 transformers are available but make sure it is sized correctly to your power requirements and have the plugs on your appliances changed so as they can’t be connected to the local wall sockets accidentally.

The Thai power distribution system is like nothing in the western world, just look up next time you walk down the street. Absolute minimal to zero earthing, floating neutral which makes a mockery of single phase isolation, very few Residual Current Devices for personal protection etc. I could go on but I won’t!

[JimGant]

By the way what is a water pick?

It's the same thing as that hose that hangs by the toilet, only for the other orifice. Best if used with potable water (hope you know what that is, Shaker?)

[lopburi3]

You must be the only person I have heard of who travels to a foreign destination without doing a little research on the place before hand! Your 110 VAC appliances will indeed trip circuit protection (if it exists) or go up in smoke. Some things like NoteBook power adapters are universal but read the specifications. 220 to 110 transformers are available but make sure it is sized correctly to your power requirements and have the plugs on your appliances changed so as they can’t be connected to the local wall sockets accidentally.

The Thai power distribution system is like nothing in the western world, just look up next time you walk down the street. Absolute minimal to zero earthing, floating neutral which makes a mockery of single phase isolation, very few Residual Current Devices for personal protection etc. I could go on but I won’t!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It might be hard to change plug so as not to fit Thai sockets; and still use a transformer. Best bet is forget 110v equipment - but if you must use paint the plugs red or something.

Thai power neutral is grounded just like "the western world".

Higher use of RCD than in USA by far IMHO - and they have been using them for 30 years.

Most new construction uses ground wire - just like those western countries - not all of which have been using that long themselves.

I look up and do not see much wrong with most of the electric lines - the phone wires are another story.

When you live under water and can not afford expensive buried cable there is not much you can do.

I can not recall an electric outage of more than two hours for many years. There are many western countries with worse records.

Edited June 14, 2005 by lopburi3

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Is the OP for real ?

[aviador88]

You must be the only person I have heard of who travels to a foreign destination without doing a little research on the place before hand! Your 110 VAC appliances will indeed trip circuit protection (if it exists) or go up in smoke. Some things like NoteBook power adapters are universal but read the specifications. 220 to 110 transformers are available but make sure it is sized correctly to your power requirements and have the plugs on your appliances changed so as they can’t be connected to the local wall sockets accidentally.

The Thai power distribution system is like nothing in the western world, just look up next time you walk down the street. Absolute minimal to zero earthing, floating neutral which makes a mockery of single phase isolation, very few Residual Current Devices for personal protection etc. I could go on but I won’t!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It might be hard to change plug so as not to fit Thai sockets; and still use a transformer. Best bet is forget 110v equipment - but if you must use paint the plugs red or something.

Thai power neutral is grounded just like "the western world".

Higher use of RCD than in USA by far IMHO - and they have been using them for 30 years.

Most new construction uses ground wire - just like those western countries - not all of which have been using that long themselves.

I look up and do not see much wrong with most of the electric lines - the phone wires are another story.

When you live under water and can not afford expensive buried cable there is not much you can do.

I can not recall an electric outage of more than two hours for many years. There are many western countries with worse records.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thai power neutral is grounded just like "the western world".

Not quite true, at least not here in "the boonies".

The lines should be re-grounded by the power company every couple 100 meters or so, but is never the case here. Everything electrical I own, including the note book as well as the PCs has to be approached with caution, especially with naked feet on wet tile floors. The shock is not deadly, but annoying.

I must admit, since the tsunami the outages have been minimal, (all new powerlines for over 100 km prior to it, every time the skies darkened, the lights blinked and if it did not shut down for hours, at least the computers quit, the compressor of the refrigerator had a hard time re-starting and upon re-booting the PC the admonishment came: "Your computer was not shut down properly. Alsways use the shut-down at the start menue".

[Thetyim]

When Sbaker adheres to all this advice and goes out to buy a converter he may stumble across another unexpected problem.

They don't speak English.

[lopburi3]

You must be the only person I have heard of who travels to a foreign destination without doing a little research on the place before hand! Your 110 VAC appliances will indeed trip circuit protection (if it exists) or go up in smoke. Some things like NoteBook power adapters are universal but read the specifications. 220 to 110 transformers are available but make sure it is sized correctly to your power requirements and have the plugs on your appliances changed so as they can’t be connected to the local wall sockets accidentally.

The Thai power distribution system is like nothing in the western world, just look up next time you walk down the street. Absolute minimal to zero earthing, floating neutral which makes a mockery of single phase isolation, very few Residual Current Devices for personal protection etc. I could go on but I won’t!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It might be hard to change plug so as not to fit Thai sockets; and still use a transformer. Best bet is forget 110v equipment - but if you must use paint the plugs red or something.

Thai power neutral is grounded just like "the western world".

Higher use of RCD than in USA by far IMHO - and they have been using them for 30 years.

Most new construction uses ground wire - just like those western countries - not all of which have been using that long themselves.

I look up and do not see much wrong with most of the electric lines - the phone wires are another story.

When you live under water and can not afford expensive buried cable there is not much you can do.

I can not recall an electric outage of more than two hours for many years. There are many western countries with worse records.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thai power neutral is grounded just like "the western world".

Not quite true, at least not here in "the boonies".

The lines should be re-grounded by the power company every couple 100 meters or so, but is never the case here. Everything electrical I own, including the note book as well as the PCs has to be approached with caution, especially with naked feet on wet tile floors. The shock is not deadly, but annoying.

I must admit, since the tsunami the outages have been minimal, (all new powerlines for over 100 km prior to it, every time the skies darkened, the lights blinked and if it did not shut down for hours, at least the computers quit, the compressor of the refrigerator had a hard time re-starting and upon re-booting the PC the admonishment came: "Your computer was not shut down properly. Alsways use the shut-down at the start menue".

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The power line may not be grounded every 100 meters but here in my Soi they are and power lines date back to 1974. There is a ground on pole serving my house.

You get bit by leakage from a hot line inside your computer and the computer case itself needs to be grounded with a three wire service. This is your responsibility - not the electric company. I know what it feels like and before I installed three wire electric inside house had to run ground from all computer cases to prevent it (also reduces RF interference to modems).

Guess what I am trying to say is that the electric here is so much better than many other countries that to me it is outstanding. I have lived in capital cities where the power was off much more than on.

[aviador88]

When Sbaker adheres to all this advice and goes out to buy a converter he may stumble across another unexpected problem.

They don't speak English.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How true.

I was trying to buy a hand operated small meat grinder, (Fleischwolf in German to make chop meat for hamburgers etc.

No luck visiting several establisments until I found one fellow in Phuket who, after drawing a picture of what I wanted enthusiastically said: Yes, have!!! He disappeared for about 5 minutes and returned with a huge box, containing a meat grinder with a 10 hp motor attched to it. One could probably stick an entire cow into it. (obviously for a restaurant)

Number two. Again after drawing a picture of what I was looking for, appeared with a 1 meter diameter ship's propellor. Maybe I can't draw too well ?

[bdenner]

Thai power neutral is grounded just like "the western world".

Up here in this area the Neutral is not referenced to Earth in fact some of the Thais steal (or think their stealing it) power by opening up the Isolator and bridging a line then tying the other to an Earth stake. This gives them a floating supply of about 110 VAC --- enough to run flourecent lighting and will turn a fan. I installed Dual Pole CCT Breakers and Mains Isolation for this reason.

They are installing RCDs into some new homes up hear but no MEN (Mains Earth Neutral) link as we would normally see.

You must reside in a relatively new housing development.

Best bet is forget 110v equipment

Agreed

[Pink Mist]

Thai power neutral is grounded just like "the western world".

Up here in this area the Neutral is not referenced to Earth in fact some of the Thais steal (or think their stealing it) power by opening up the Isolator and bridging a line then tying the other to an Earth stake. This gives them a floating supply of about 110 VAC --- enough to run flourecent lighting and will turn a fan. I installed Dual Pole CCT Breakers and Mains Isolation for this reason.

They are installing RCDs into some new homes up hear but no MEN (Mains Earth Neutral) link as we would normally see.

You must reside in a relatively new housing development.

Best bet is forget 110v equipment

Agreed

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Multiple Earthed Neutral = MEN

How many of you guys are actually Electricians??

Some of the comments here are ridiculous

[lopburi3]

As I have said so many times before you do not need a ground of any way, shape or form for a RCD/ECCB/GFI to operate.

My home/Mooban was built in 1974 as I said in this thread. I installed a GFI in 1977 to provide safety. I re-wired with grounded outlets several years ago.

[Kerryd]

The lines should be re-grounded by the power company every couple 100 meters or so, but is never the case here. Everything electrical I own, including the note book as well as the PCs has to be approached with caution, especially with naked feet on wet tile floors. The shock is not deadly, but annoying. 

I must admit, since the tsunami the outages have been minimal, (all new powerlines for over 100 km    prior to it, every time the skies darkened, the lights blinked and if it did not shut  down for hours, at least the computers quit, the compressor of the refrigerator had a hard time re-starting and upon re-booting the PC the admonishment came: "Your computer was not shut down properly. Alsways use the shut-down at the start menue". 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Try buying a UPS (Uninteruptable Power Supply). I read on another thread about how some UPS's will provide surge protection and limited "grounding".

I used to get those annoying little shocks and "prickles" when I touched my computer. Bought a UPS for 3,000 baht, problem solved.

Plus, the main reason for a UPS is to allow you time to save your work and shut down your computer in the event of a power failure.

[SeaVisionBurma]

Given the amount of MEN's and VAC's and other TLA's regarding electrics (which I know SFA about) I may be shot down but I might as well offer OP Matey another suggestion.

As he has already cooked 2 of his 110V appliances, lets not assume he doesnt have a few more to fry.

(I love it when you try something, and it doesnt work, and so you try it again, or try something else with the same result - almost like, ah! it broke appliance X, lets try exactly the same thing with appliance Y. ah! it broke that too, now where is appliance Z and lets have another go, etc)

Would it be fair to say, for these low use 110V gadgets, get an inverter/battery charger and run those from the 110V socket? This is what I do on the pearl farm. We're wired up for 240V 50Hz, but I have a few Japanese gadgets around the place so I run them off the inverter/charger's 110V socket.

[Jai Dee]

Some of the comments here are ridiculous  

See below...

By the way what is a water pick?

It's the same thing as that hose that hangs by the toilet, only for the other orifice. Best if used with potable water (hope you know what that is, Shaker?)

:D

[lopburi3]

Given the amount of MEN's and VAC's and other TLA's regarding electrics (which I know SFA about) I may be shot down but I might as well offer OP Matey another suggestion.

As he has already cooked 2 of his 110V appliances, lets not assume he doesnt have a few more to fry. 

(I love it when you try something, and it doesnt work, and so you try it again, or try something else with the same result - almost like, ah! it broke appliance X, lets try exactly the same thing with appliance Y.  ah! it broke that too, now where is appliance Z and lets have another go, etc)

Would it be fair to say, for these low use 110V gadgets, get an inverter/battery charger and run those from the 110V socket?  This is what I do on the pearl farm.  We're wired up for 240V 50Hz, but I have a few Japanese gadgets around the place so I run them off the inverter/charger's 110V socket.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I assume you have inverter for back up power supply so it is available it can be used but would be overkill for home use here where all he should need is a step down transformer available at any hardware or department store at a low price.

[Khutan]

  I re-wired with grounded outlets several years ago.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Good idea, an un-grounded microwave can be rather dangerous, as the Faraday shield may not work properly

[PeaceBlondie]

In addition to the voltage being twice as high here as in the US, and the pins being different, what about the cycles being different? US is 60 cycles per second; thailand is 50hz

[lopburi3]

In addition to the voltage being twice as high here as in the US, and the pins being different, what about the cycles being different?  US is 60 cycles per second; thailand is 50hz

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

They use the same pins as US - almost all Thai electric outlets will accept flat US/Japan or German round type plugs.

The Hz is not that important for most applications as the only time it comes into play is AC motors (run slow/overheat). Most small type equipment use DC motors now.

[aviador88]

Given the amount of MEN's and VAC's and other TLA's regarding electrics (which I know SFA about) I may be shot down but I might as well offer OP Matey another suggestion.

As he has already cooked 2 of his 110V appliances, lets not assume he doesnt have a few more to fry. 

(I love it when you try something, and it doesnt work, and so you try it again, or try something else with the same result - almost like, ah! it broke appliance X, lets try exactly the same thing with appliance Y.  ah! it broke that too, now where is appliance Z and lets have another go, etc)

Would it be fair to say, for these low use 110V gadgets, get an inverter/battery charger and run those from the 110V socket?  This is what I do on the pearl farm.  We're wired up for 240V 50Hz, but I have a few Japanese gadgets around the place so I run them off the inverter/charger's 110V socket.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

(I love it when you try something, and it doesnt work, and so you try it again,

This brought a smile to my face.

Eons ago I worked in a TV and electronis repair shop. A customer came in and bought a box of 5 amp fuses for his disabled TV. Halve an hour later he came back and screamed. "What junk did you sell me. I put the fuses in and they all blew out again".

[Crossy]

Back to assisting our OP.

Your equipment that is not working is most definately fried

The toothbrush is probably BER (Beyond Economical Repair) chuck it and get a new one.

Does the pick have a 'wall wart' power supply?? If so you should be able to get a replacement (220V) locally from any decent hardware store, take the old one with you to get the correct rating of course.

On the frequency point, 50Hz kit tends to work ok on 60Hz, unfortunately the other way round is often untrue as the transformers and motors have too little iron in their cores causing them to saturate at the lower frequency and overheat.

[mpdkorat]

The lines should be re-grounded by the power company every couple 100 meters or so, but is never the case here. Everything electrical I own, including the note book as well as the PCs has to be approached with caution, especially with naked feet on wet tile floors. The shock is not deadly, but annoying. 

I must admit, since the tsunami the outages have been minimal, (all new powerlines for over 100 km    prior to it, every time the skies darkened, the lights blinked and if it did not shut  down for hours, at least the computers quit, the compressor of the refrigerator had a hard time re-starting and upon re-booting the PC the admonishment came: "Your computer was not shut down properly. Alsways use the shut-down at the start menue". 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Try buying a UPS (Uninteruptable Power Supply). I read on another thread about how some UPS's will provide surge protection and limited "grounding".

I used to get those annoying little shocks and "prickles" when I touched my computer. Bought a UPS for 3,000 baht, problem solved.

Plus, the main reason for a UPS is to allow you time to save your work and shut down your computer in the event of a power failure.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I bought a UPS, came home one night after a storm and found that all my computer equipment including the UPS had blown up. I have alway been lucky like that. I now just unplug everthing and put a rubber mat on the floor. Call me a cheap charlie if you wish.

[SeaVisionBurma]

Call me a cheap charlie if you wish.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Okay then.....

....you're a Cheap Charlie!

[JimGant]

The toothbrush is probably BER (Beyond Economical Repair) chuck it and get a new one.

Haven't seen these yet in Thailand, but in the States the battery powered toothbrushes (Crest seems to be the biggest) are huge sellers, and they're only about 1/10th the cost of a plug-in electric toothbrush. And my dentist (Stateside) swears electric toothbrushes will do wonders in curbing gum disease.

So having said that, if you buy one of these in the States, make sure you buy extra AA batteries, as the Thai AA batteries have twice the voltage.....

[bkk_mike]

The toothbrush is probably BER (Beyond Economical Repair) chuck it and get a new one.

Haven't seen these yet in Thailand, but in the States the battery powered toothbrushes (Crest seems to be the biggest) are huge sellers, and they're only about 1/10th the cost of a plug-in electric toothbrush. And my dentist (Stateside) swears electric toothbrushes will do wonders in curbing gum disease.

OP said Sonicare - Those aren't cheap...far from it...

However, they usually have a pretty good warranty - I had one in the UK that went about a year and a half after I got it, and was shocked to get it replaced with a new one under warranty. (2 year warranty in the UK anyway).

If you're going back to the US at any point in the next year - don't throw it out - just take it back with you and try and get a replacement. (Avoid saying what you actually did though - stupidity probably isn't covered by the warranty)

As for battery powered toothbrushes - if you haven't seen those in Thailand yet, you haven't really been looking very hard...

So having said that, if you buy one of these in the States, make sure you buy extra AA batteries, as the Thai AA batteries have twice the voltage.....

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Edited June 14, 2005 by bkk_mike