A Society At War With Itself: Yes, That Is Thailand

[webfact]

EDITORIAL

A society at war with itself: Yes, that's Thailand

By The Nation

We thought we lived in a tolerant and peaceful country, but apparently that is no longer the case

Thailand ranks 124th in the recently released Global Peace Index (GPI) of 149 nations, way down in the lower half of the survey. The figure reflects the country's unsatisfactory performance and political violence. Overall, the GPI report suggests that the world has become less peaceful over the last year, despite a drop in the number of armed conflicts. But uneven economic development is also a source of conflict, as evidenced in Thailand.

For Thais, the ranking should not come as a surprise, as we have seen so much instability in recent years. Thailand was once a peaceful nation. However, the political conflict and general confrontational atmosphere, as well as the insurgent violence in the deep South have changed that perception. It is unfortunate, as we have long prided ourselves on being tolerant advocates of peace.

The release of the report is timely. However, peace cannot be brought about by any one party alone; it requires cooperation and effort from all in society.

The GPI report says that societies that are peaceful also perform exceptionally well in many other ways. They have higher per capita income, high levels of personal well-being, more freedom, they perform better in terms of economic sustainability, and appear to have a more equitable distribution of social spending.

For the second year running, New Zealand is rated the most peaceful country in the world, with Iceland climbing back up to second place, after dropping from the top slot in 2008 to fourth place last year. Japan ranks third. Fifteen of the top 20 countries are western or central European states, and all Scandinavian countries are listed in the top 10, suggesting that small, stable, democratic countries are the most successful models for development. At the same time, Iraq was found to be the least peaceful country for the fourth year running, followed by Somalia, Afghanistan and Sudan. Russia ranked 143rd.

The GPI report added that what is important is not whether peace creates economic success, rather the realisation that what creates a peaceful society also allows for a fuller expression of human potential, and in many diverse forms.

The challenges are global. They include economic management, environmental sustainability, and measures to tackle a wide variety of social ills. Conflict often arises from the failure to adequately address the cause of discontent and create remedies. The GPI report says that this can be seen in the breakdown of the Copenhagen climate-change talks, burgeoning government and private-sector debt, the lack of regulation of the speculative aspects of the financial system, and our inability to even articulate good capitalist models that aren't totally based on consumption.

Meanwhile, the conflict in Thailand can be attributed to the country's ineffective economic management, which has led to a disparity of income distribution and opportunity. As a result a significant number of people feel they have been unfairly treated or even victimised. The red-shirt movement thus arose as people in rural areas have been unfairly deprived of economic opportunities. It is not simply a question of economic failure or disadvantage, but a feeling of being unjustly treated over a long period of time. In comparison, during the financial crisis of 1997, when a large number of Thais were left unemployed, there was no social unrest because those affected didn't feel that they had been systematically treated unfairly; the crisis was the result of financial mismanagement that affected people across all social classes.

Another challenging issue for Thais is that of limited resources. The issues of sustainability and the irresponsible consumption of resources have increasingly become issues of conflict in Thailand. Increasingly, communities will require industries and individuals to be more accountable for their consumption.

Peace requires an understanding of the problems and the sustainable solutions. As the GPI reports says, peace "is a proxy for many other things that create the optimum environment for humanity to flourish. These can be defined as the structures that create peace and the social attitudes that support it".

Peace is a key to co-existence. But peace will not come from passive action; it requires everyone's contribution. One cannot ask for peace without contributing to the process and playing a meaningful part in enriching society. We can start the process at the individual level by trying to understand ourselves and others, trying to seek and apply wisdom, and trying to use our potential to the full.

-- The Nation 2010-06-10

[tigerbalm]

Is'nt the five point national reconciliation road map going to deal with this problem of increased society unrest ie in the North and South, which will be kicking of on Saturday encouraging the unity of Thai society.

Edited June 10, 2010 by webfact
no need to quote OP in first reply

[Rucharee]

Color war is always colorful.

[MikeyIdea]

We thought we lived in a tolerant and peaceful country, but apparently that is no longer the case

I was pretty new in Thailand when Sujinda did the military coup in 1992 and I thought: He will never be able to come back to Thaland after that, not after killing thousands of people. Yet, only a few years later, there he was and he even had his own police force attending to his needs

Just wait a while and people will forget... unless money talks again

[lannarebirth]

Judging from the leading peaceful countries, New Zealand and Iceland, it would seem the key to peacefullness is to be situated in a remote location with no bordering countries.

[neverdie]

Judging from the leading peaceful countries, New Zealand and Iceland, it would seem the key to peacefullness is to be situated in a remote location with no bordering countries.

Indeed. Theres no disputing that.

[Samuian]

....Meanwhile, the conflict in Thailand can be attributed to the country's ineffective economic management, which has led to a disparity of income distribution and opportunity. As a result a significant number of people feel they have been unfairly treated or even victimised. The red-shirt movement thus arose as people in rural areas have been unfairly deprived of economic opportunities....

Easy way out? Regarding this theory half he planets nations should have "red shirts" burning down the house!

I live on Ko Samui here is no "social strife".... but everyone can feel waht all this rioting for "genuine democracy" did... many gone out of business already and they are the "have not's", the seasonal workers, the soup stall owners, those who seell fruits and other goodies at the beach - those who should have "benefited" from all this, have been hit worst, through the action of their feinted "friends" buy the lies and empty promises of the con-men they put their trust into.....it's nut's, absolutely nut's!

It had the absolute reverse effects, it didn't help anyone, only a few swollen ego's... feel maybe "good" about the havoc they created!

I hope for the sake of this nation that this will never, ever be allowed to be repeated!

...

during the financial crisis of 1997, when a large number of Thais were left unemployed, there was no social unrest because those affected didn't feel that they had been systematically treated unfairly;

Exactly, because nobody told them, everybody knew, even there would have been people, a system that could haveeasely been targeted!

There is no "divide", this "divide" is a construction of evil minded people, who want to utelize this "split" of a nation for their very OWN benefit!

In every nation on this planet there are "Underprivileged" people, there re "poor", there are people who have and thos who don't, it jsutpart of life... not everyone can be a Warren Beatty!

Some of them feel "poor"...

Listen to H.M. be self efficient, help yourself, work, do your duties and don't fight against each pother, for nothing it will only bring mischief, and more mischief!

The one who is stoking the fire, is himself a multi billionaire - how much more sarcastic one can be?

Only this fact - tells volumes!

BEWARE!

[somtampet]

Judging from the leading peaceful countries, New Zealand and Iceland, it would seem the key to peacefullness is to be situated in a remote location with no bordering countries.

Indeed. Theres no disputing that.

What about the uk then

[rkidlad]

Judging from the leading peaceful countries, New Zealand and Iceland, it would seem the key to peacefullness is to be situated in a remote location with no bordering countries.

Indeed. Theres no disputing that.

What about the uk then

What about it?

We now have our first hung parliament for the first time in a long time. The transition of powers went smoothly with no problems. That's democracy.

I can't remember seeing any Labour or Gordon Brown fanatics burning down parts of London.

[chainarong]

Peace ,what is peace, Thailand has a long way to go before peace will come a callin, too many factions and underlying hatred, some of this hatred go's back far longer than the time Australia or N.Z was invaded by the english.He He He

[Arjay]

Is'nt the five point national reconciliation road map going to deal with this problem of increased society unrest ie in the North and South, which will be kicking of on Saturday encouraging the unity of Thai society.

The solution to Thailands problems are to stop money politics. Political parties are owned by wealthy influentials. Politicians and police are for sell. All agendas and issues are self serving by these influential people.

[TPI]

Peace only comes when there is prosperity, money makes the world go 'round, so the song goes!

Do you think that Thailand will change in our lifetime? A hundred years ago Thailand was entertaining the Tzar of Russia, there were unreleased slaves and many poor people, all this 4 years before WWI...What's the problem? The poor will always be with us, as will the dis-affected! If you don't like it, get out amongst it and be an instrument of change instead of just bleating about the "poor".

[Valentine]

We thought we lived in a tolerant and peaceful country, but apparently that is no longer the case

I was pretty new in Thailand when Sujinda did the military coup in 1992 and I thought: He will never be able to come back to Thaland after that, not after killing thousands of people. Yet, only a few years later, there he was and he even had his own police force attending to his needs

Just wait a while and people will forget... unless money talks again

I seriously doubt he killed thousands. Between 40 & 50 official deaths on the streets when the army fired on protesters & some others missing after that. Intervention by HM prevented what could easily have been 1,000s of deaths or civil war.

[SpoliaOpima]

Judging from the leading peaceful countries, New Zealand and Iceland, it would seem the key to peacefullness is to be situated in a remote location with no bordering countries.

Indeed. Theres no disputing that.

What about the uk then

What about it?

We now have our first hung parliament for the first time in a long time. The transition of powers went smoothly with no problems. That's democracy.

I can't remember seeing any Labour or Gordon Brown fanatics burning down parts of London.

Not to mention Northern Ireland ....

[tigerbalm]

Is'nt the five point national reconciliation road map going to deal with this problem of increased society unrest ie in the North and South, which will be kicking of on Saturday encouraging the unity of Thai society.

The solution to Thailands problems are to stop money politics. Political parties are owned by wealthy influentials. Politicians and police are for sell. All agendas and issues are self serving by these influential people.

Probably some truth in what you say but are'nt these the very people who have been invited to participate in the five point national reconciliation road map.

[MikeyIdea]

We thought we lived in a tolerant and peaceful country, but apparently that is no longer the case

I was pretty new in Thailand when Sujinda did the military coup in 1992 and I thought: He will never be able to come back to Thaland after that, not after killing thousands of people. Yet, only a few years later, there he was and he even had his own police force attending to his needs

Just wait a while and people will forget... unless money talks again

I seriously doubt he killed thousands. Between 40 & 50 official deaths on the streets when the army fired on protesters & some others missing after that. Intervention by HM prevented what could easily have been 1,000s of deaths or civil war.

Off-topic but worth answering.

Time moves on but memories stay. The students at Chula and Thammasat where the crack downs on activists took place then are managers today. We have a few in the company I work for. I know only from Chula and Thammasat but there are probably more.

I have myself seen one of our managers get tears in her eyes when she thought of some of her university friends who disappeared. They just disappeared and no one ever heard of them again, their families never heard anything and it was never acknowledged why they disappeared although everybody know

Perhaps not thousands in plural, but thousand I do believe

[MikeyIdea]

We thought we lived in a tolerant and peaceful country, but apparently that is no longer the case

I was pretty new in Thailand when Sujinda did the military coup in 1992 and I thought: He will never be able to come back to Thaland after that, not after killing thousands of people. Yet, only a few years later, there he was and he even had his own police force attending to his needs

Just wait a while and people will forget... unless money talks again

I seriously doubt he killed thousands. Between 40 & 50 official deaths on the streets when the army fired on protesters & some others missing after that. Intervention by HM prevented what could easily have been 1,000s of deaths or civil war.

Off-topic but worth answering

Time moves on but memories stay. The students at Chula and Thammasat where the crack downs on activists took place then are managers today. We have a few in the company I work for. I know only Chula and Thammasat but there are probably more

I have myself seen one of our managers get tears in her eyes when she thought of some of her university friends who disappeared. They just disappeared and no one ever heard of them again, their families never heard anything and it was never acknowledged why they disappeared although everybody knew

Perhaps not thousands in plural, but thousand I do believe

Edited June 10, 2010 by MikeyIdea

[Capealava]

Judging from the leading peaceful countries, New Zealand and Iceland, it would seem the key to peacefullness is to be situated in a remote location with no bordering countries.

Indeed. Theres no disputing that.

Easy way out? Regarding this theory half he planets nations should have "red shirts" burning down the house!

I live on Ko Samui here is no "social strife".... but everyone can feel waht all this rioting for "genuine democracy" did... many gone out of business already and they are the "have not's", the seasonal workers, the soup stall owners, those who seell fruits and other goodies at the beach - those who should have "benefited" from all this, have been hit worst, through the action of their feinted "friends" buy the lies and empty promises of the con-men they put their trust into.....it's nut's, absolutely nut's!

It had the absolute reverse effects, it didn't help anyone, only a few swollen ego's... feel maybe "good" about the havoc they created!

I hope for the sake of this nation that this will never, ever be allowed to be repeated!

Koh Samui is hardly the picture of Thailand. It is a Farang Island being catered to by Thai's. You are obviously one of the those that benefit from the extreme low wages paid in Thailand. You enjoy being catered to on the beach by fruit sellers trying to scrape together 200 baht for the day. People have risen up against inequality from day one and you say that things should just go on the same. The rage that was shown in Bangkok did not come out of the air. It has festered for a long time. The history of the USA is strewn with riots and burnings and corporation and governments being forced into change that benefits all the people. I also hope it will not be repeated, but Thailand has to change, even if your idyllic Koh Samui retreat becomes as expensive as the South of France.

[Thaihog]

More bad press for Thailand and still the baht remains as strong as ever ..... does not compute......

[angiud]

Koh Samui is hardly the picture of Thailand. It is a Farang Island being catered to by Thai's.

We should add to Samui:

Bangkok, Pattaya, Phuket, Krabi, Phan-nga, Koh Lanta, Koh Samet, Hua Hin, Koh Phangan, Koh Tao, Kanchanaburi, Chiang Mai, Chiang Rai, Pai, Ayuthaya, just what I recall.

How many people loosing job we are talking??

[Capealava]

Peace only comes when there is prosperity, money makes the world go 'round, so the song goes!

Do you think that Thailand will change in our lifetime? A hundred years ago Thailand was entertaining the Tzar of Russia, there were unreleased slaves and many poor people, all this 4 years before WWI...What's the problem? The poor will always be with us, as will the dis-affected! If you don't like it, get out amongst it and be an instrument of change instead of just bleating about the "poor".

And if wealth distribution hits your pocketbook you will become "very annoyed" Love you people who come from developed countries where you would bitch to the high heavens if you where left out. You come to Thailand and enjoy all the benefits of low wages and economic discrimination against 40% of the population and then complain about the 'poor" or use "history ' as an excuse. Maybe you should check out the history of your home country.

[cmsally]

An excellent article on New Mandala about the military, for those that seem to forget they are a major part of the problem. Can't link to it as it touches on some dodgy subjects.

With the Thai military as it is, it will be very difficult to sort out the problem. Bit like trying to treat root disease by polishing the leaves.

[ChiangMaiFun]

Not to mention Northern Ireland ....

what about Northern Ireland? the only thing I would say is 'yesterdays terrorists are today's respected politicians'

[Nacho]

Judging from the leading peaceful countries, New Zealand and Iceland, it would seem the key to peacefullness is to be situated in a remote location with no bordering countries.

Indeed. Theres no disputing that.

Easy way out? Regarding this theory half he planets nations should have "red shirts" burning down the house!

I live on Ko Samui here is no "social strife".... but everyone can feel waht all this rioting for "genuine democracy" did... many gone out of business already and they are the "have not's", the seasonal workers, the soup stall owners, those who seell fruits and other goodies at the beach - those who should have "benefited" from all this, have been hit worst, through the action of their feinted "friends" buy the lies and empty promises of the con-men they put their trust into.....it's nut's, absolutely nut's!

It had the absolute reverse effects, it didn't help anyone, only a few swollen ego's... feel maybe "good" about the havoc they created!

I hope for the sake of this nation that this will never, ever be allowed to be repeated!

Koh Samui is hardly the picture of Thailand. It is a Farang Island being catered to by Thai's. You are obviously one of the those that benefit from the extreme low wages paid in Thailand. You enjoy being catered to on the beach by fruit sellers trying to scrape together 200 baht for the day. People have risen up against inequality from day one and you say that things should just go on the same. The rage that was shown in Bangkok did not come out of the air. It has festered for a long time. The history of the USA is strewn with riots and burnings and corporation and governments being forced into change that benefits all the people. I also hope it will not be repeated, but Thailand has to change, even if your idyllic Koh Samui retreat becomes as expensive as the South of France.

I belive he was only trying to point out that the people that were hurt most by the protests were the same people who were fighting for change. Violence is never the best answer.

Also the USA is hardly the best role model for equality. Australia, New Zealand and Canada are all countries of a similar age who have gotten to where they are today with a fairly peacefull history as far as I am aware, and New Zealand tops the chart in referance to this thread.

Edited June 10, 2010 by Nacho

[MikeyIdea]

People have risen up against inequality from day one and you say that things should just go on the same. The rage that was shown in Bangkok did not come out of the air. It has festered for a long time.

That was funny Capealava. Thais don't rise up against inequality, they never have. They have been led to rise up against inequality though, not quite the same thing. From day one of the strategic plan of whoever orchestrated the move that time. Not quite the same thing, again.

The parents of the people you talk about taught them, their own children that it is bad to question and criticize since before they could walk... They don't start wars or take any action even unless they are lead to it. They had parents who deliberately suppressed self confidence, creativity and initiative in them without thinking, to make the children easy to handle and to protect them from dangers. The solution lies in changing what the poor Thais themselves don't want to change, imagine poor Thais teaching their children not to blindly accept what they say and do... What you think happened will not happen from the poor the next generation either because this generation of the poor still teach their children the same way

You are right that the rage that was shown in Bangkok did not come out of the air, I work at Central World so I was there and I heard it, it came out of loudspeakers at full blast. Burn, Burn, Burn and the crowds were cheering

You support that?

Edited June 10, 2010 by MikeyIdea

[Capealava]

Maybe so. Sorry if I offended someone. But the facts remain change does not happen by itself. There are many in "history" who have 'sacrificed there own well being to construct change. Look at the protests against the Vietnam war in the USA. We stopped that war with our minds, hearts, and bodies. 56.000 USA dead-millions of Vietnamese. Violence ??? Off the subject --I am out of here.

Edited June 11, 2010 by cdnvic
removed excessive nested quotes

[Capealava]

People have risen up against inequality from day one and you say that things should just go on the same. The rage that was shown in Bangkok did not come out of the air. It has festered for a long time.

That was funny Capealava. Thais don't rise up against inequality, they never have. They have been led to rise up against inequality though, not quite the same thing. From day one of the strategic plan of whoever orchestrated the move that time. Not quite the same thing, again.

The parents of the people you talk about taught them, their own children that it is bad to question and criticize since before they could walk... They don't start wars or take any action even unless they are lead to it. They had parents who deliberately suppressed self confidence, creativity and initiative in them without thinking, to make the children easy to handle and to protect them from dangers. The solution lies in changing what the poor Thais themselves don't want to change, imagine poor Thais teaching their children not to blindly accept what they say and do... What you think happened will not happen from the poor the next generation either because this generation of the poor still teach their children the same way

You are right that the rage that was shown in Bangkok did not come out of the air, I work at Central World so I was there and I heard it, it came out of loudspeakers at full blast. Burn, Burn, Burn and the crowds were cheering

You support that?

I was there also --so my opinion is different than your. So be it. You are putting word in my mouth. I am out here. No use discussing the issue with you.

[Valentine]

There were 2 crackdowns during the 70's when many were killed. At this time Samak was the interior minister & the troops were told the students were staging a communist uprising. What role, if any, Suchinda had in those I have no idea. He did stage a coup in 1991 & was about to be announced as PM in 1992 when the protests, led by Chamlong, came to a head & the troops were ordered to fire upon them. I feel Anupong's role in the current turmoil will be looked upon much more kindly than Suchinda, for his efforts in the early 90s, & those involved in the bloody crackdowns of the 70s.

Edited June 11, 2010 by cdnvic
removed excessive nested quotes

[kek]

Not to mention Northern Ireland ....

what about Northern Ireland? the only thing I would say is 'yesterdays terrorists are today's respected politicians'

Peter Robinson

[MikeyIdea]

I can't say that I wish the bloody crackdowns in the early 70's hadn't happened, if I consider how other communist countries around here look today compared to Thailand.