Why So Nationalistic?

[StreetCowboy]

^Cowboy you are out of your mind mate. You are saying I abuse posters

personally when it is you and a couple others you have insisted on trying

to criticize my thoughts rather than bring your own opinions and thoughts

to the forum.

As for being negative, I think you will find you and berkboy who have

instigated that.

We're none of us sane as we might sometimes pretend, but to avoid accusations of abuse we try to refrain from referring to our fellow posters as morons; otherwise people might realise how limited was our imagination and vocabulary.

Anyway, I posted previously an explanation of the nationalism that we perceive in Thailand and how the tourists encourage it.

And I explained why I felt some people might feel negatively towards it - either through jealousy or paranoid offence.

I suppose those of you who don't come from the greatest country in the world - or lack our certainty of it, could feel threatened.

C'est la vie

SC

[Scrubber]

To answer the OP's question based on what I've experienced here, I would put it down to the education system (as a previous poster pointed out) and also brainwashing in the media.

Every day on TV I see an advert for something 'made by Thais for Thais' (and a lot of the models are, ironically, 'luk-krungs'). How does this benefit the average Thai? Ok, I know it's obviously to sell the product or service, but seeing this day-in day-out just builds up this stupid sense of national pride. Why be proud of where you were born? A group of my uni students asked me if I was proud of my country and I asked them why should I be proud of something I didn't have a say in? Be proud of yourself is more important than to be proud of a country and government that doesn't give a sh*t about you. Even worse is that commercial they showed at cinemas before movies recently, the one that encourages people to love each other like they did in the past. When? When recently have the Thai people loved each other? You only have to go back a couple of generations and there were still villages fighting and killing each other.

I've talked about this many times with friends and colleagues. None of them are particularly proud of the country they were born in, nor are they patriotic.

If a Thai girl walked down the street with her European boyfriend in London, what would people think? Nothing. They wouldn't even notice. Is that the same here? I wish. The immediate reaction is 'prostitute'. I recently spoke to an ex-girlfriend who is now dating a boy at university. When he found out that she used to go out with me (a foreigner), he asked her why would she want to look like a prostitute? Amazing.

The Thais I know personally are smart and some of them can see through this BS forced upon them by the media and education system. It's just unfotunate that they had to study abroad for a few months to realise.

[Chunky1]

"If a Thai girl walked down the street with her European boyfriend in London, what would people think? Nothing. They wouldn't even notice. Is that the same here? I wish. The immediate reaction is 'prostitute'."

I wonder why.

[wintermute]

I don't view Thais as more nationalist than any other country on the map to be honest. A lot of the ones I have conversed with are actually pretty self critical about the state of politics and the general lackadaisical mentality with regards to corruption and other annoyances. Most people don't care about things either way and just want to live a comfortable life like anywhere else.

The individuals who spout nationalism here are actually pretty rare. Probably less rare in written or media form but rare in person. If you want to see a Thai person's eyes glaze over with boredom start talking about national politics.

[JimsKnight]

What harm did Thai nationalism the last 200 years to the world compared to the nationalism of : Germany, England, France, America, Japan, China, Israel, Russia, Turkey, Belgium, Dutch, Spain, Portuguese, Arabia etc. ?

Well said.

[eggomaniac]

Statistics lie. Most of the tourist income to the country is UNREPORTED.

It was what I was trying to write in my shaky English

My guess is that tourism related income is around 20/35% of the GDP

WHY does this wrong 'impression' keep popping up? Methinks it could be a pinned Topic. If people come to Thailand and only see farangs everywhere they go, they assume the other 95% of Thailand is like that, too.

A Thai Uni did a study of how much the 'underground' tourist economy would add up to. It came to 2/3%. Only 10% of the 6% was spent on the illegal sex trade. No matter how much y'all want to think how important you are to the survival and well being of Thailand, rice, fish products, cars appliances are BIGGEST suppliers of Foreign money.

On top of all that Western tourism is only a small % compared to Asia tourism to Thailand, and the Asian tourists cause less troubles!

Tourism is promoted and advertised in Japan, Korea, and China, way more than in the West.

It was what I was trying to write in my shaky English

My guess is that tourism related income is around 20/35% of the GDP

No, the same under-reporting of income as you claim tourism industry has, is prevalent across all industries.

Tax dodging is a national sport here - not even counting that the lowest rung is also exempt from paying tax up to 90% of their income (stall owners for instance).

EGGsactly, any unwritten addition to tourism's GDP could be added to any other industry, too, BIG TIME.

When you see all of those factories and foreign goods for sale, just think how many unreported mega DOLLARS were paid to in bribe money to get import approval.

Farang tourist 'influence' on the Thai economy does not even amount to dwarfish in nature.

[Berkshire]

WHY does this wrong 'impression' keep popping up? Methinks it could be a pinned Topic. If people come to Thailand and only see farangs everywhere they go, they assume the other 95% of Thailand is like that, too.

A Thai Uni did a study of how much the 'underground' tourist economy would add up to. It came to 2/3%. Only 10% of the 6% was spent on the illegal sex trade. No matter how much y'all want to think how important you are to the survival and well being of Thailand, rice, fish products, cars appliances are BIGGEST suppliers of Foreign money.

On top of all that Western tourism is only a small % compared to Asia tourism to Thailand, and the Asian tourists cause less troubles!

Tourism is promoted and advertised in Japan, Korea, and China, way more than in the West.

Farang tourist 'influence' on the Thai economy does not even amount to dwarfish in nature.

You seem to have a much better grasp of reality than most. These other guys are somewhat, shall we say, delusional in their thinking.

[Berkshire]

Actually I do not have any problems in my life or with Thailand or Thai people as I do not even

live in Thailand. I opened this post in a light hearted manner just to learn more about

Thailand and how expats deal with living in a society where they are very much considered

outsiders by ALL parts of Thai society and find out more of why Thailand is so nationalistic.

Berkshire you must be American (USA) only a yank can be so naive. Thailand is Nationalist,

how can you say they are not?? You must be walking around Thailand in a dream like state my friend.

I genuinely have no problems with a country being nationalist, just when they seem to attract and

need so many tourists it seems strange and a bit off to me.

I just wanted to here some expats opinions. Also how have you deemed my posts as negative or

saying I have some sort of agenda???? Can we not discuss things??? Why do some morons

take every post as negative???

You don't even live in Thailand? And you're trying to convince everyone that you're an authority on this topic? Christ, kevoz, it's almost a waste of time trying to have a frank discussion with you. I'm supposed to believe that Thai's are nationalistic because you say so? And if someone else were to start a thread proclaiming that all male farangs who come to Thailand are perverts, I'm supposed to just believe THAT too? Your ignorance astounds me. And how about cutting out the sanctimonious crappola. You say you " just wanted to hear some expats opinions." Well I'm giving you some good and honest expat opinion, but you don't want to hear it because it differs from your warped, bigoted views.

I realize that you have to convince everyone that Thailand is nationalistic, otherwise this thread would be entirely pointless and you'd look rather foolish. Well I'm sorry to say, we're already well past that point.

[Berkshire]

So if someone doesnt think like you theyre delusional in their thinking?<br><br>Whereas earlier in this post you tried to deny the fact that they play the national anthem on a daily basis and that people have to stop what theyre doing, so anyone who believes this happens is deluded well thatll be everyone apart from you.<br><br>Oh yes you and what the &lt;deleted&gt; does you and your non deluded mate yapping on about us sex tourists have to do with the OP?<br><br><br><br>

First of all, get a grip man! It's an anonymous message board, for Christ's sake. Secondly, you're not being honest. You know what I said. If Thai's are stopping what they're doing twice a day, it ain't happening in the Thailand that I live/been to. Lastly, is this the best you can do? Bring up irrelevant points with a sprinkle of profanity? Rather uncomely...

[hansum]

So if someone doesnt think like you theyre delusional in their thinking?<br><br>Whereas earlier in this post you tried to deny the fact that they play the national anthem on a daily basis and that people have to stop what theyre doing, so anyone who believes this happens is deluded well thatll be everyone apart from you.<br><br>Oh yes you and what the &lt;deleted&gt; does you and your non deluded mate yapping on about us sex tourists have to do with the OP?<br><br><br><br>

First of all, get a grip man! It's an anonymous message board, for Christ's sake. Secondly, you're not being honest. You know what I said. If Thai's are stopping what they're doing twice a day, it ain't happening in the Thailand that I live/been to. Lastly, is this the best you can do? Bring up irrelevant points with a sprinkle of profanity? Rather uncomely...

So youre saying playing the national anthem twice daily is an irrelevant point when discussing nationalism.

But as you say it doesnt happen where you are so that means it doesnt happen.

[Berkshire]

So youre saying playing the national anthem twice daily is an irrelevant point when discussing nationalism.

But as you say it doesnt happen where you are so that means it doesnt happen.

Let me share with you what I posted earlier:

[The terms nationalism and patriotism are very similar, although the true meaning of each can differ profoundly. To put it simply, patriotism is love and devotion to one's country. Nationalism is that, COMBINED with a negative view of other races or cultures.]

So again, EVEN IF the playing of the national anthem was occurring everywhere in Thailand, and all Thai's were stopping in their tracks to recognize this, how can you interpret that to be "a negative view of other races or cultures."

[sk1max]

What harm did Thai nationalism the last 200 years to the world compared to the nationalism of : Germany, England, France, America, Japan, China, Israel, Russia, Turkey, Belgium, Dutch, Spain, Portuguese, Arabia etc. ?

Well said.

How has it benefited us? What have they contributed to the world of technology/medicine/education, etc???

[Chonburiram]

What harm did Thai nationalism the last 200 years to the world compared to the nationalism of : Germany, England, France, America, Japan, China, Israel, Russia, Turkey, Belgium, Dutch, Spain, Portuguese, Arabia etc. ?

Well said.

How has it benefited us? What have they contributed to the world of technology/medicine/education, etc???

sk1max, answering a question with a question is so lame :sleepy: , poor style indeed .

But here you go: " How has it ( Thai nationalism ) benefited us ( Farang? ) " ? This question is stupid past all belief .

What benefits do you get from the nationalism of any nation you are not a part of ?

[ProdigalSon]

What harm did Thai nationalism the last 200 years to the world compared to the nationalism of : Germany, England, France, America, Japan, China, Israel, Russia, Turkey, Belgium, Dutch, Spain, Portuguese, Arabia etc. ?

Well said.

How has it benefited us? What have they contributed to the world of technology/medicine/education, etc???

sk1max, answering a question with a question is so lame :sleepy: , poor style indeed .

But here you go: " How has it ( Thai nationalism ) benefited us ( Farang? ) " ? This question is stupid past all belief .

What benefits do you get from the nationalism of any nation you are not a part of ?

Chonburiram - What was the intention of your original question? To answer the OP? Lame indeed.

If you read sk1max's question carefully, you will see he asked about 'they' as in the Thais in general. It's a valid question. Many technological advances were developed during periods of nationalism within individual countries that the entire world benefits from today.

Edited July 1, 2010 by ProdigalSon

[Chonburiram]

Chonburiram - What was the intention of your original question? To answer the OP? Lame indeed.

If you read sk1max's question carefully, you will see he asked about 'they' as in the Thais in general. It's a valid question. Many technological advances were developed during periods of nationalism within individual countries that the entire world benefits from today.

You mean something like the Autobahn, Atomic bomb, Concentration camps etc?

[cdnvic]

Nothing positive going on here.