Why So Nationalistic?

[jonnyscot]

Same Same.

You'll struggle to find a Scot that says they like the English, regardless of how many English friends he has, and how long he's worked there.

SC

But surely that's got to do with with all scots having a chip on their shoulder

hehehehe,,, I find some of these posts so amusing,,, similar to the Germans apparently stealing all the Deckchairs whilst on holiday I guess, wonder what the Germans think??,,,, I wish some people would just have a look in the mirror ,,,,

[Heng]

 ...Multiply that by $100, and you have $5.67 billion.  Not a small amount, to be sure.  But in the context of the total GDP, that only raises the total contribution of foreign visitors to Thailand to a little over 8%.  

Since the whole point (presumably) is that they want to express their significance in terms of % of GDP by using foreign related unreported revenue, it stands to reason that they should also figure the total national (local) unreported revenue (all the bad stuff, too many things to list) as well and THEN come up with a rough number as a % of that total. Skipped a step in there methinks. Or maybe on purpose because then we're back to square one... a relatively insignificant % number.

[bonobo]

 ...Multiply that by $100, and you have $5.67 billion.  Not a small amount, to be sure.  But in the context of the total GDP, that only raises the total contribution of foreign visitors to Thailand to a little over 8%.  

Since the whole point (presumably) is that they want to express their significance in terms of % of GDP by using foreign related unreported revenue, it stands to reason that they should also figure the total national (local) unreported revenue (all the bad stuff, too many things to list) as well and THEN come up with a rough number as a % of that total.    Skipped a step in there methinks.   Or maybe on purpose because then we're back to square one... a relatively insignificant % number.  

Actually, the unreported local revenue tends to get swallowed up to varying degrees based on the national velocity of money.  A local karoke girl gets paid x baht for her services, then goes out and buys a Samsung cell phone.  A local yaaba dealer makes his money, then goes out and buys a Toyota.  So the unreported income does eventually get figured in to the totality of the economy.

It is the influx of foreign money which gets overstated here.  All that foreign money ends up as part of the GDP.  It is just a question of significance on the amount which originated from other countries.

[StreetCowboy]

It's a basic psychological need that local legislation takes away from a lot of people (just about everyone besides the independently wealthy). Thus the need to attempt to quantify one's self worth, even if it's by using one's entire demographic (tourists) as a proxy.

So what do you propose that we do to help them, or do you suggest that we let them suffer in their need?

Like the financially poor, I am afraid that they may be always with us, and ignoring them and hoping that they go away may prove futile

SC

[Heng]

 ...Multiply that by $100, and you have $5.67 billion.  Not a small amount, to be sure.  But in the context of the total GDP, that only raises the total contribution of foreign visitors to Thailand to a little over 8%.  

Since the whole point (presumably) is that they want to express their significance in terms of % of GDP by using foreign related unreported revenue, it stands to reason that they should also figure the total national (local) unreported revenue (all the bad stuff, too many things to list) as well and THEN come up with a rough number as a % of that total.    Skipped a step in there methinks.   Or maybe on purpose because then we're back to square one... a relatively insignificant % number.  

Actually, the unreported local revenue tends to get swallowed up to varying degrees based on the national velocity of money.  A local karoke girl gets paid x baht for her services, then goes out and buys a Samsung cell phone.  A local yaaba dealer makes his money, then goes out and buys a Toyota.  So the unreported income does eventually get figured in to the totality of the economy.

It is the influx of foreign money which gets overstated here.  All that foreign money ends up as part of the GDP.  It is just a question of significance on the amount which originated from other countries.

The point is that it's also unreported (and largely unaccounted for), it doesn't matter if it gets spent on a Toyota, because that's what happens to foreign revenue/foreign origin funds as well. It's unaccounted for during the previous transaction, which is indeed an exchange of funds for goods or services and thus should be included in unreported GDP.

4 groups of 'capital/revenue' here. Local unreported (L1), local reported (L2), foreign unreported (f1), foreign reported (f2). Some people are saying that f1 + f2 is a significant % of L2. IMO there's no reason to leave L1 out of the calculations.

[Heng]

It's a basic psychological need that local legislation takes away from a lot of people (just about everyone besides the independently wealthy). Thus the need to attempt to quantify one's self worth, even if it's by using one's entire demographic (tourists) as a proxy.

So what do you propose that we do to help them, or do you suggest that we let them suffer in their need?

Like the financially poor, I am afraid that they may be always with us, and ignoring them and hoping that they go away may prove futile

SC

My plan was just to continue to make fun of them whenever convenient.

[bonobo]

4 groups of 'capital/revenue' here.   Local unreported (L1), local reported (L2), foreign unreported (f1), foreign reported (f2).   Some people are saying that f1 + f2 is a significant % of L2.   IMO there's no reason to leave L1 out of the calculations.  

If posters are saying that both unreported streams of revenue are significant or insignificant, then I agree. But as the thread is about nationalism and then what foreigners bring here, then only the foreign unreported is pertinent. 

As an aside, depending on which source you use, only around 5% of prostitutes in Thailand work in foreign-oriented establishments. And that says nothing about drug dealers, illegal betting, smugglers, etc.  Or even the local farmers who put up a roadside stand to sell some of their produce on the side. There is little doubt that local unreported revenue far exceeds that of foreign-originated unreported revenue.

[Heng]

4 groups of 'capital/revenue' here.   Local unreported (L1), local reported (L2), foreign unreported (f1), foreign reported (f2).   Some people are saying that f1 + f2 is a significant % of L2.   IMO there's no reason to leave L1 out of the calculations.  

If posters are saying that both unreported streams of revenue are significant or insignificant, then I agree. But as the thread is about nationalism and then what foreigners bring here, then only the foreign unreported is pertinent. 

As an aside, depending on which source you use, only around 5% of prostitutes in Thailand work in foreign-oriented establishments. And that says nothing about drug dealers, illegal betting, smugglers, etc.  Or even the local farmers who put up a roadside stand to sell some of their produce on the side. There is little doubt that local unreported revenue far exceeds that of foreign-originated unreported revenue.

I disagree that only the foreign unreported amount is pertinent because in these ad hoc arguments, they are making a point out of unreported foreign transactions as a potential percentage of *total* reported GDP. Ignoring unreported local transactions artificially *inflates the importance of foreign transactions* because it lowers the value of total GDP (not to mention that it's hypocritical on its own merits), which as per previous post #56 is for whatever reason the desired effect.

[bonobo]

Hypocritical? How so?  The topic is not the economic importance of Thai-patroned brothels.  It is whether the foreign tourist is really that significant to the Thai economy.

But you want to add in Thai unreported income?  You have any figures?   How about we say it is quadruple that of the foreign originated unreported income, just for grins.

270 billion plus  64 billion from native unreported.  This is  a huge swag, granted.  BUt that lowers the percentage from 8.4 % to 5.4%.  So does that 3% drop really make any difference to the issue, that the foreign input to the Thai economy just isn't that tremendous?

If you want to keep getting anal on this and quibble over a couple percentage points one way or the other, especially as the figures used are in no way exact, then fine. Have at it.  I'm done with this point.  I contend that that impact is not as great as others tend to feel.  Simple as that.  And no hypocrisy is involved with that contention.

[StreetCowboy]

It's a basic psychological need that local legislation takes away from a lot of people (just about everyone besides the independently wealthy). Thus the need to attempt to quantify one's self worth, even if it's by using one's entire demographic (tourists) as a proxy.

So what do you propose that we do to help them, or do you suggest that we let them suffer in their need?

Like the financially poor, I am afraid that they may be always with us, and ignoring them and hoping that they go away may prove futile

SC

My plan was just to continue to make fun of them whenever convenient.

Well, I suppose so long as you keep your posts obtuse, no harm done. No-one objects to a little gentle ribbing

(my sponsor required me to include that)

SC

[Tanaka]

From what I recall, the importance of tourism isn't so much it's percentage of GDP, but that it's the largest source of foreign currency.

Really? What about the cars and motorcycles manufactured in Thailand and exported worldwide; are they paid for in THB you mean?

It was what I was trying to write in my shaky English

My guess is that tourism related income is around 20/35% of the GDP

You guess. That is not very reassuring, do you have any facts to back up your guess?

[Heng]

Hypocritical? How so? The topic is not the economic importance of Thai-patroned brothels. It is whether the foreign tourist is really that significant to the Thai economy.

But you want to add in Thai unreported income? You have any figures? How about we say it is quadruple that of the foreign originated unreported income, just for grins.

270 billion plus 64 billion from native unreported. This is a huge swag, granted. BUt that lowers the percentage from 8.4 % to 5.4%. So does that 3% drop really make any difference to the issue, that the foreign input to the Thai economy just isn't that tremendous?

If you want to keep getting anal on this and quibble over a couple percentage points one way or the other, especially as the figures used are in no way exact, then fine. Have at it. I'm done with this point. I contend that that impact is not as great as others tend to feel. Simple as that. And no hypocrisy is involved with that contention.

Not sure why you're focused on brothels here. I'm talking about the underground economy as a whole.

It's hypocritical because of the suggested importance of the foreign contribution while selectively ignoring the very same, and likely much greater local contribution. However, including the former difficult to calculate/estimate 'foreign' figure with the latter 'local' figure would be self defeating to the original argument, hence it is conveniently left out and thus is hypocritical. Seems pretty obvious to me.

I'm not suggesting any figures because I'm simply pointing out a rather obvious flaw in this popular 'argument.'

Edited June 28, 2010 by Heng

[elkangorito]

I thought that this thread was about Nationalism & not about GDP.

Nationalism is a by-product of fear. GDP is a by-product of sales.

[Heng]

I thought that this thread was about Nationalism & not about GDP.

Nationalism is a by-product of fear. GDP is a by-product of sales.

These types of threads have a lot to do with Maslow and how the local environment often deprives folks (locals as well) of many of their needs... some that come to mind are self esteem, belonging, property, employment, family, respect. When people say some/many locals are nationalists, IMO it's more akin to 'I'm not appreciated.' Maybe these folks just looked over their property holdings and noticed everything is in their spouses' name? When people talk about their part in the overall contribution of their entire demographic to the local GDP, it's like saying 'I'm needed.' Maybe no one is talking to them at dinner?

Not saying locals don't have ego issues. They have a boat load as well. Here on TV though...

Edited June 28, 2010 by Heng

[kikoman]

I think the OP places to much emphasis on Tourism as the main stay of the Thai economy, and remember Asian contribute the overwhelming portion of that part of the economy, the economic make-up of the world is changing rapidly, with China and India in the forefront of that change.

I think the meat of the OPs post is "White" not getting the rights he feels they deserve, a focus on land ownership.

As for Thai history being bias, to the victor goes the facts of history, Look at the history of the US that I was taught, is mostly based on untrue, fabricated events, but lets not go there.

What is so bad about being patriotic and Nationalistic.

The poster that swiped at the Thai police, has not been a minority in those western countries, where the police force is given free hand in controlling those people, Like an unarmed black man being shot 24 times for resisting arrest in New York, vs tea money!

Cheers:

Edited June 28, 2010 by kikoman

[Pakboong]

With the 150,000 baht minimum income for tax reporting, a huge amount is considered unreported income. The controlling government doesn't really worry about it because those individuals, in the vast majority of cases, lack the know how and discipline to use their money to any financial advantage. They ultimately fritter it all away to the more capable, who don't report it either. It doesn't matter as the more capable always end up with all the money. The government over-represents those more capable and the unprepared poor get lost in the shuffle. The natural order of all things.

If everything works as planned, the final resting place for the 2,000 baht you paid Noi for sex last night will be a Chinese money lender's safe. It may have to pass through several hands on its way but the outcome is certain.

Edited June 29, 2010 by Pakboong

[kevozman1]

Another silly OP. Thais are Nationalistic - in what manner? I would venture to guess that the OP hasn't received the respect a Foreigner here in Thailand is owed.

In what manner?????????????????????????????

I dont know............... national flags flying everywhere, national anthems played daily on TV and before

every cinema movie, educational system which teaches only of Thailand, recent political parties called

THAI FOR THAI, banned non-Thai's from owning land in Thai soil, national parks openly pricing more

towards foreiners etc etc etc.

[kevozman1]

As for posters saying I think I should be treated better than Thai's

I would have to say you do not know me so please take you pety

hate somewhere else. Never been a hater, had friends from all

over the world, my girlfreind is Thai and I do not think I am better

than her.

I find countries like Thailand strange. I grew up in London, as anybody

will tell you who has lived there it is probably the most multi-cultural

place on Earth, it would then be in bad taste to be hugely nationalistic.

That is my point;is it right to have a nationalistic society to the levels of

Thailand and then attract a large number of tourists??

[StreetCowboy]

As for posters saying I think I should be treated better than Thai's I would have to say you do not know me so please take you pety hate somewhere else. Never been a hater, had friends from all over the world, my girlfreind is Thai and I do not think I am better than her. I find countries like Thailand strange. I grew up in London, as anybody will tell you who has lived there it is probably the most multi-cultural place on Earth, it would then be in bad taste to be hugely nationalistic. That is my point;is it right to have a nationalistic society to the levels of Thailand and then attract a large number of tourists??

I'm guessing that you suffer from a complex because your head of state is a commoner. I suppose we just take these things for granted, and don't see how others might suffer from their absence. We have a dirge of an anthem, but the English suffer it more than we do...

I can't see the objection about flying the flag - I think maybe we should do it more than we do. I can understand the twice-daily public anthem could become frustrating, but I can't see any grounds to criticise it other than on grounds of practicality. And as for the legal subtleties of which complain, all countries have laws which are inconvenient, and the restrictions on land ownership I find less troublesome than the restrictions on the hours when I can buy beer; but I learnt long ago to keep a stiff upper lip and bear such troubles with grace - again, it's not unusual...

I'm sure a more erudite poster will provide us with the correct psychiatric term for someone who suffers from unreasonable envy of the crown, and also for people who suffer from less troubles and grounds to grumble than they need.

In order to show I am not being deliberately contrary, I agree wholeheartedly that you are not better than your girlfriend; not by a long chalk

SC

Edit: Tried to put the carriage returns back in: Do they get lost when you preview?

2nd edit

Reading again, I see you could well be English, having grown up in London - it is possible, for all you doubters who've never met an English person there. There are some, and in times gone by I'm told they were commonplace; so it must just be the lack of troubles and woes to which we can apportion your grumbling

Edited June 29, 2010 by StreetCowboy

[GarryP]

As has been mentioned numerous times, tourism really isn't a major factor in the GDP. Without toursim Thailand would not collapse. I do, however, find it strange that Thailand is so nationalistic. It is often excessive and you sometimes have to be very careful what you say in case of upsetting the locals. Since I came here over 25 years ago things have not really got less so. In fact, I would tend to say things have got worse because it has become so politicised.

It does tend to be very convenient though when anything goes wrong in the economy, society, etc. They have a standing scapegoat, the "outside influence", them foreigners.

PS a lot of what has been raised is not nationalism, but rather patriotism. There is nothing wrong with that unless it is enforced patriotism.

Edited June 29, 2010 by GarryP

[kevozman1]

As for posters saying I think I should be treated better than Thai's I would have to say you do not know me so please take you pety hate somewhere else. Never been a hater, had friends from all over the world, my girlfreind is Thai and I do not think I am better than her. I find countries like Thailand strange. I grew up in London, as anybody will tell you who has lived there it is probably the most multi-cultural place on Earth, it would then be in bad taste to be hugely nationalistic. That is my point;is it right to have a nationalistic society to the levels of Thailand and then attract a large number of tourists??

I'm guessing that you suffer from a complex because your head of state is a commoner. I suppose we just take these things for granted, and don't see how others might suffer from their absence. We have a dirge of an anthem, but the English suffer it more than we do...

I can't see the objection about flying the flag - I think maybe we should do it more than we do. I can understand the twice-daily public anthem could become frustrating, but I can't see any grounds to criticise it other than on grounds of practicality. And as for the legal subtleties of which complain, all countries have laws which are inconvenient, and the restrictions on land ownership I find less troublesome than the restrictions on the hours when I can buy beer; but I learnt long ago to keep a stiff upper lip and bear such troubles with grace - again, it's not unusual...

I'm sure a more erudite poster will provide us with the correct psychiatric term for someone who suffers from unreasonable envy of the crown, and also for people who suffer from less troubles and grounds to grumble than they need.

In order to show I am not being deliberately contrary, I agree wholeheartedly that you are not better than your girlfriend; not by a long chalk

SC

Edit: Tried to put the carriage returns back in: Do they get lost when you preview?

2nd edit

Reading again, I see you could well be English, having grown up in London - it is possible, for all you doubters who've never met an English person there. There are some, and in times gone by I'm told they were commonplace; so it must just be the lack of troubles and woes to which we can apportion your grumbling

Yet again jumping to conclusions (you guys get boring) I never said I was

English, as a matter of fact I travel on a Irish passport!

By the way cowboy, was you drunk writing this post???

How I am objecting to Thai people flying flags just by merely mentioning it and I

never critised anything, only that I find it strange, if you think stating that you find

something strange is critical and that somehow I am objecting to it then maybe its time to join the sesame street forum.

Unreasonable envy of the crown.................. ????

My head of state is a commoner................... ????

As for stating that my girlfriend is better than me.................<deleted> how can you make

such a stupid statement over a internet forum when you do not personally know me

or my girl. Wait a minute cowboy just relax and crack open another chang eh.

Edited June 29, 2010 by kevozman1

[StreetCowboy]

As for posters saying I think I should be treated better than Thai's I would have to say you do not know me so please take you pety hate somewhere else. Never been a hater, had friends from all over the world, my girlfreind is Thai and I do not think I am better than her. I find countries like Thailand strange. I grew up in London, as anybody will tell you who has lived there it is probably the most multi-cultural place on Earth, it would then be in bad taste to be hugely nationalistic. That is my point;is it right to have a nationalistic society to the levels of Thailand and then attract a large number of tourists??

I'm guessing that you suffer from a complex because your head of state is a commoner. I suppose we just take these things for granted, and don't see how others might suffer from their absence. We have a dirge of an anthem, but the English suffer it more than we do...

I can't see the objection about flying the flag - I think maybe we should do it more than we do. I can understand the twice-daily public anthem could become frustrating, but I can't see any grounds to criticise it other than on grounds of practicality. And as for the legal subtleties of which complain, all countries have laws which are inconvenient, and the restrictions on land ownership I find less troublesome than the restrictions on the hours when I can buy beer; but I learnt long ago to keep a stiff upper lip and bear such troubles with grace - again, it's not unusual...

I'm sure a more erudite poster will provide us with the correct psychiatric term for someone who suffers from unreasonable envy of the crown, and also for people who suffer from less troubles and grounds to grumble than they need.

In order to show I am not being deliberately contrary, I agree wholeheartedly that you are not better than your girlfriend; not by a long chalk

SC

Edit: Tried to put the carriage returns back in: Do they get lost when you preview?

2nd edit

Reading again, I see you could well be English, having grown up in London - it is possible, for all you doubters who've never met an English person there. There are some, and in times gone by I'm told they were commonplace; so it must just be the lack of troubles and woes to which we can apportion your grumbling

Yet again jumping to conclusions (you guys get boring) I never said I was

English, as a matter of fact I travel on a Irish passport!

By the way cowboy, was you drunk writing this post???

How I am objecting to Thai people flying flags just by merely mentioning it and I

never critised anything, only that I find it strange, if you think stating that you find

something strange is critical and that somehow I am objecting to it then maybe its time to join the sesame street forum.

Unreasonable envy of the crown.................. ????

My head of state is a commoner................... ????

As for stating that my girlfriend is better than me.................<deleted> how can you make

such a stupid statement over a internet forum when you do not personally know me

or my girl. Wait a minute cowboy just relax and crack open another chang eh.

I feel quite calm, thanks. Do you reckon we should fly our flags more?

Sorry for your misinterpretation - maybe I should have repeated the original clause of your text with which I was agreeing -

"I do not think I am better than her". Almost certainly true.

The great thing about anonymous fora is that quite possibly we do know one another...

Anyway, getting back on topic, I imagine that Thais believe their country to be the greatest in the world on the basis that so many foreigners want to come and holiday or live there - they choose to separate out the desire of so many thais to leave, separating out country and economy - I don't know many thais that want to go overseas for better weather, political freedoms, food, though I know plenty who have gone overseas to work. I imagine they assume that foreigners appreciate the same things about Thailand that they themselves enjoy.

SC

[Berkshire]

Another silly OP. Thais are Nationalistic - in what manner? I would venture to guess that the OP hasn't received the respect a Foreigner here in Thailand is owed.

In what manner?????????????????????????????

I dont know............... national flags flying everywhere, national anthems played daily on TV and before

every cinema movie, educational system which teaches only of Thailand, recent political parties called

THAI FOR THAI, banned non-Thai's from owning land in Thai soil, national parks openly pricing more

towards foreiners etc etc etc.

Boy, kevozman, you just don't seem to get it. Most of the examples that you cited can just as easily explain PATRIOTISM, not nationalism. Yet, you keep wanting to label Thai's as nationalistic. You obviously have a personal agenda. Have you been screwed over by a Thai woman, lately? Lost a lot of money in Thailand? Feeling blue because the Thai's don't roll out the red carpet for you everywhere you go? What is it, exactly? It can't be this nationalistic nonsense because you don't make any sense.

[orosee]

Has anyone bothered to look up "Nationalism" in the dictionary? There are always several definitions given, the vast majority is positive. So is the historic move from city-state or feudal territory towards a nation. Nationalistic can be used in a negative way (although most of the times, the term "ultra-nationalist" is used) but might as well be identical in meaning to "patriotic".

My theory why Thailand practices a Thai nationalism: the country is multi-ethnic (not as much as Malaysia, where my theory would also apply) and as can be seen from cases such as the former Yugoslavia or the Kurds, certain nationalistic ways can rip a state apart. The government then uses a strong Thai nationalism to counteract these separatist trends, creating the feeling of a group of 60 million to cancel out movements of groups of, say, one million.

Imagine what would happen to China without a feeling of comprehensive Chinese nationalism...

I guess once Pattaya or Phuket hit the threshold of say 2 million permanently residing foreign retirees, a case can be made to separate from Thailand as a new nation or city state (kind of like an Anti-Singapore) by democratic or other means, under UN supervision. Who knows, perhaps that will be when the whining finally stops?

[Chunky1]

Patriotism and Nationalism are just means of control over the masses. Stand up when we tell you to. Here, hold this flag/symbol of our unity. Hey, it's time for a war and time for you to die for those principles... You didn't see Thaksin's children hurling Molotov cocktails and you didn't Abhisit's children storming Rachaprasong.

Edited June 30, 2010 by Chunky1

[Chunky1]

Imagine what would happen to China without a feeling of comprehensive Chinese nationalism...

People would eat, sleep, drink and provide a service in exchange for a form of currency with which they could purchase/barter food, water, shelter and other basic needs of survival?

[Berkshire]

Has anyone bothered to look up "Nationalism" in the dictionary?

The terms nationalism and patriotism are very similar, although the true meaning of each can differ profoundly. To put it simply, patriotism is love and devotion to one's country. Nationalism is that, COMBINED with a negative view of other races or cultures. So in a sense, we can say that patriotism is generally accepted as "good," while nationalism is viewed as "bad."

This is where the OP's logic perplexes me. Nearly all the Thai's that I meet—and I mean "normal" Thai's, not those catering to tourists—almost universally view foreigners in a positive light. This is absolutely the opposite of what the OP is suggesting, if we are to go by the true definition of what nationalism is. If Thai's do demonstrate a certain love and devotion to their country, how can the OP immediately interpret that to be nationalism and not patriotism? What evidence does he have that Thai's have a "negative view of other races or cultures?" Unless he was simply attempting to mislead and/or attack the average Thai's for his own personal agenda. Seems to be a lot of that going around these days.

[Chunky1]

If a group of 14,000,000 expats gain citizenship and buy up all the business worth having and control the total of government it should occasionally get a mention.

Once you stop speaking Chinese and have completely immigrated what does it even matter?

It's like calling Leonardo DiCaprio an Italian because his great-whomever got off a boat at Ellis Island in 1894.

[kevozman1]

Another silly OP. Thais are Nationalistic - in what manner? I would venture to guess that the OP hasn't received the respect a Foreigner here in Thailand is owed.

In what manner?????????????????????????????

I dont know............... national flags flying everywhere, national anthems played daily on TV and before

every cinema movie, educational system which teaches only of Thailand, recent political parties called

THAI FOR THAI, banned non-Thai's from owning land in Thai soil, national parks openly pricing more

towards foreiners etc etc etc.

Boy, kevozman, you just don't seem to get it. Most of the examples that you cited can just as easily explain PATRIOTISM, not nationalism. Yet, you keep wanting to label Thai's as nationalistic. You obviously have a personal agenda. Have you been screwed over by a Thai woman, lately? Lost a lot of money in Thailand? Feeling blue because the Thai's don't roll out the red carpet for you everywhere you go? What is it, exactly? It can't be this nationalistic nonsense because you don't make any sense.

Actually I do not have any problems in my life or with Thailand or Thai people as I do not even

live in Thailand. I opened this post in a light hearted manner just to learn more about

Thailand and how expats deal with living in a society where they are very much considered

outsiders by ALL parts of Thai society and find out more of why Thailand is so nationalistic.

Berkshire you must be American (USA) only a yank can be so naive. Thailand is Nationalist,

how can you say they are not?? You must be walking around Thailand in a dream like state my friend.

I genuinely have no problems with a country being nationalist, just when they seem to attract and

need so many tourists it seems strange and a bit off to me.

I just wanted to here some expats opinions. Also how have you deemed my posts as negative or

saying I have some sort of agenda???? Can we not discuss things??? Why do some morons

take every post as negative???

[StreetCowboy]

<BR>

<BR>

<BR>

<BR>Another silly OP.  Thais are Nationalistic - in what manner?  I would venture to guess that the OP hasn't received the respect a Foreigner here in Thailand is owed.<BR>

<BR><BR>In what manner?????????????????????????????<BR><BR>I dont know............... national flags flying everywhere, national anthems played daily on TV and before<BR>every cinema movie, educational system which teaches only of Thailand, recent political parties called<BR>THAI FOR THAI, banned non-Thai's from owning land in Thai soil, national parks openly pricing more<BR>towards foreiners etc etc etc.<BR>

<BR><BR>Boy, kevozman, you just don't seem to get it.  Most of the  examples that you cited can just as easily explain PATRIOTISM, not  nationalism.  Yet, you keep wanting to label Thai's as  nationalistic.  You obviously have a personal agenda.  Have you been screwed over by a Thai woman, lately?  Lost a  lot of money in Thailand?  Feeling blue because the Thai's  don't roll out the red carpet for you everywhere you go?  What  is it, exactly?  It can't be this nationalistic nonsense  because you don't make any sense.<BR>

<BR><BR><BR>Actually I do not have any problems in my life or with Thailand or Thai people as I do not even<BR>live in Thailand. I opened this post in a light hearted manner just to learn more about<BR>Thailand and how expats deal with living in a society where they are very much considered<BR>outsiders by ALL parts of Thai society and find out more of why Thailand is so nationalistic.<BR><BR>Berkshire you must be American (USA) only a yank can be so naive. Thailand is Nationalist,<BR>how can you say they are not?? You must be walking around Thailand in a dream like state my friend.<BR>I genuinely have no problems with a country being nationalist, just when they seem to attract and<BR>need so many tourists it seems strange and a bit off to me. <BR><BR>I just wanted to here some expats opinions. Also how have you deemed my posts as negative or <BR>saying I have some sort of agenda???? Can we not discuss things??? Why do some morons<BR>take every post as negative???<BR>

<BR><BR>They probably automatically assume you are being negative because you abuse them personally.<BR>But bearing in mind that only some morons react thus, how do the rest of the morons react?<BR>What about that small minority of Thaivisa members who are pedants rather than morons?<BR>And the half-wits, and the nut-cases, and the psychos?<BR><BR>I know you mean to flatter us, but really, I find 'half-wit' more directly flattering, as I can then objectively gauge your over-estimation of my capabilities<BR><BR>SC<BR>