Fair Pay Is One Way To Root Out Corruption In Thailand

[webfact]

EDITORIAL

Fair pay is one way to root out corruption

By The Nation

Debt among civil servants is at an alarming level, explaining why many are tempted by the opportunity to take easy 'tea money'

The financial status of Thai civil servants is becoming alarming. The National Statistical Office (NSO) recently reported that the level of debt among civil servants has risen sharply since 2006. The average debt per household for civil servants this year topped Bt872,388 compared to 2006 when the average household debt was Bt657,449.

Unfortunately, the income of civil servants has not risen commensurate to their debts. In fact, 84.1 per cent of all civil servants are indebted, compared to 81.6 per cent in 2006. If this level of debt continues to rise, most Thai civil servants will be close to bankruptcy.

These figures are worrying indeed, as most civil servants are paid through taxpayers' money. A dire financial situation can lead any person - especially those with low morale and lower moral values - to abuse their authority. If they are in debt and have the opportunity to rectify that situation quickly, they are more likely to seek under-the-table commissions or "tea money" for services that should be provided as part of their public duty. The financial crisis and resulting credit crunch has shown how human beings can make unwise decisions and then resort to corruption to get them out of a bind.

On average, civil servant households receive a monthly income of Bt43,650, compared to expenditure of Bt32,386. However, the ratio of debt per household to monthly income has risen over time. The NSO survey did not reveal where the additional expenditure went to. Nevertheless, it is understandable how expenditure continues to rise and can get out of control. There are always new needs and wants such as the latest model car or mobile phone.

The debt figures also show the weakness in the payment structure for civil servants. Salaries for government officials are lower than in the private sector, and this is one reason why the public service is failing to attract the best people. But this is not to suggest that the government should increase the salaries of all civil servants. In fact, most of the government's budget already goes to civil service salaries.

A report last month from Siam Commercial Bank's Economic Intelligence Centre showed that over the past 10 years, budget spending on the salaries of civil servants and other mandatory costs to maintain the bureaucracy has jumped significantly, while the investment portion from the budget has hardly increased at all.

"Between 2001 and 2011, the size of the fiscal budget has increased from Bt910 billion to Bt2.07 trillion, or an expansion of Bt1.16 trillion," the report said. "During this period, the investment portion from the budget has risen by only Bt24 billion, while the fixed and mandatory and welfare spending has soared by Bt1.16 trillion."

To sum up, the quantity of civil servants does not always translate into quality of service to the public. Instead, the cost of maintaining civil servants has eaten into national development projects.

Worse still, many civil servants, as the statistics show, are now struggling with high debt, despite the fact that many government agencies have campaigned for financial moderation. Civil servants have found it easier than other professions to borrow from financial institutions, partly because of their job security in the public sector.

This situation should not be allowed to continue. First of all, the public sector will continue to lose talented personnel to the private sector because of the unrealistic pay structure for civil servants. The right people should be rewarded with commensurate salaries for their qualifications and performance. The payment of fair and sensible remuneration will also have the benefit of discouraging government officials from engaging in corrupt practices.

The government sector should be lean and effective, not a bloated bureaucracy in which officers have personal financial priorities to worry about and are subject to the temptations of graft. If the government does not address this long-standing issue, officials who are financially desperate will continue to fall into the hands of corrupt politicians who promise to spread a small share of tea money among co-conspirators.

-- The Nation 2010-09-16

[whybother]

Salaries for government officials are lower than in the private sector, and this is one reason why the public service is failing to attract the best people.

They should look to the rest of the world to see how they have handled this .........

..... but first they need to find a country that has.

[spiderleghead]

average income of a civil servant is what? civil servants include teachers right? and the salary of a goverment teacher starts at aroung 9,000 baht. so who the f*** is getting the superhigh salaries to make the average so high?

oh yes, sorry i forgot, corruption = high salary for low labour quality and a nice suit.

[craigt3365]

Before raising pay, they need to get rid of corruption at the highest level...otherwise they will still be corrupt...just richer.

[brahmburgers]

The average debt per household for civil servants this year topped Bt872,388 compared to 2006 when the average household debt was Bt657,449.

Granted, those #'s include house payment debts, but still, very big numbers indeed - and that's average! So the 16% or so who apparently have no debts are balanced out by a large # who have debts of millions (or tens of millions) of baht. Withering numbers. Plus, the amounts of loan shark debts and money borrowed from individuals/family is not on that ledger.

Methinks credit is too easily given to Thai gov't employees, and I shed not a tear for the banks and such who will never get paid back.

In contrast, I have zero debt (and I don't have a pension or other payments coming in). Besides paying cash as I go, I also live within my means. I have an old crumby mobile phone and an old car and an old motorbike. I'm not proud of those things, but that's what I can afford. Perhaps I could go out on a limb and keep up with the neighbors who all have late-model gray colored SUV's and tiled roofed houses, but then I too would be in debt for a million or more baht. Oh, almost forgot, I'm a farang, so I can't get loans or buy things 'on time' here.

People who run up large debts are also people who are superstitious, who like to gamble, are irresponsible, and who drink alcoholic drinks. It fits with the OP and the subject matter.

[bannork]

One of my brothers-in-law's son has just got a job as a teacher in a government school, so he's now entitled to a loan over a million baht as he's got nearly 40 years employment ahead of him.

So his dad has plans to buy a pick-up outright with the loan. I asked who would be responsible for the repayments to the bank and he said his son as gratitude for being brought up by his old man.

Start work and owe 600,000 baht immediately!

[mdechgan]

First of all the civil service people chose their own destinies. The reasons for being a civil servant is it entitles them to a status and reputation preferred by many Thai families. They also have very good health insurance for their families and subsidies for their kid's schooling. Also 7 hours of work per day M-F + 1 hr for lunch.

You get what you put in. Let's say we remove the benefits and have them work M-Sat and 8 hours per day instead of 7 like the rest of us and double their salaries. Will there still be corruption. Sure. The problem with greed is people will become greedier.

My wife just became a civil servant and I criticise her every day about it. Like "you lazy civil servant."

She even agrees with me about it. There is a reason why civil servants are low pay. Would you believe the total tea money combined in her branch per month is actually more than her department's entire salary.

Want to know why most are in debt? Well if you make 20,000 baht per month but you drive a new Camry Hybrid and a new townhouse, and drink a bottle of jonnie walker swing every night of course you are going to be in debt.

[tomyummer]

Thailand should have been following Singapore as a model for the last few decades. The government workers make more than private industry on average which encourages the best and brightest to work for the government. This is also reflected in their education system which attracts the best teachers.

In Thailand, unless you are the few to hold high office, they don't care about the underlings. And because such a precedent has been in place for so long, you have low paid state employees of which many are incompetent robots. In some instances 5 doing the work of 1. The systems are archaic and even when newer institutions and facilities are built, the same dinosaur systems of operations and logistics still get put in place (ex. Suvarnabhumi, Government Complex at Changwattana, etc.). I love the 'new' immigration still using hand-written signs posted with tape.

It is no surprise that these workers have debt. The government levies and taxes on such things as automobiles doesn't allow much room for affordability.

And how do you expect a police officer to defend its citizens on a mere 6,000 or 7,000 baht salary? Would you jump in front of a bullet for that amount?

The only way to 'root out corruption' is first to admit it.

[tomyummer]

First of all the civil service people chose their own destinies. The reasons for being a civil servant is it entitles them to a status and reputation preferred by many Thai families. They also have very good health insurance for their families and subsidies for their kid's schooling. Also 7 hours of work per day M-F + 1 hr for lunch.

You get what you put in. Let's say we remove the benefits and have them work M-Sat and 8 hours per day instead of 7 like the rest of us and double their salaries. Will there still be corruption. Sure. The problem with greed is people will become greedier.

My wife just became a civil servant and I criticise her every day about it. Like "you lazy civil servant."

She even agrees with me about it. There is a reason why civil servants are low pay. Would you believe the total tea money combined in her branch per month is actually more than her department's entire salary.

Want to know why most are in debt? Well if you make 20,000 baht per month but you drive a new Camry Hybrid and a new townhouse, and drink a bottle of jonnie walker swing every night of course you are going to be in debt.

True. But one of the main reasons is to get into the 'system' and if you're lucky enough to have contacts within, make your way up to the upper echelon where you can get in on the 'action' or a percentage of tea money. And of course, if you come from a well known family, you're surely going to get coached to the top eventually. You imagine getting a piece of the 30% pie on each and every contract that passes through your ministry?! The most popular and hardest department to get into is.........the customs department. Need I explain?

[Thailand]

Corruption in Thailand is endemic, top to bottom, and is unlikely ever to be be stamped out no matter what the salaries incentives etc.

People will always want more and when they see senior politicians riding the various gravy trains they want their slice as well.

Graft is part of life here I don't see anything changing anytime soon.

[Pib]

average income of a civil servant is what? civil servants include teachers right? and the salary of a goverment teacher starts at aroung 9,000 baht. so who the f*** is getting the superhigh salaries to make the average so high?

oh yes, sorry i forgot, corruption = high salary for low labour quality and a nice suit.

From looking at the NSO website and an older survery that had been translated to English (the most current survey appears to only be in Thai), "household income" refers to the combined income of the civil servant themselves and the income of their spouse; therefore, it's referred to as household income. Also, the stats are broken down into different levels of salary probably representing different pay grades for the civil servants, such as Level 1-2, Level 3-5, and Level 6-8. Don't know if the article is quoting an average of all the levels, an average of the upper level 6-8, but I expect the article is quoting an average household income of all levels.

[nikster]

How did Singapore stamp out corruption?

It's clearly the way to do it, however they did it (I honestly don't know).

PS: The article makes no sense at all, corruption has been endemic long before civil servants became more indebted than ever before. So yeah civil servants don't make enough money, and are in debt, and Thailand is very corrupt but frankly I don't see a connection.

Edited September 16, 2010 by nikster

[Thai at Heart]

Average of 43k, plus pension, plus health, plus possible early retirement, often free housing.

As an average number I find this figure very high for Thailand. Considering the amount of them that are on between 10 and 20k, there must be an awful lot of people above the average and then of course, the select few on gazillions.

This calculation is also a nonsense on the average is a nonsense from the point of view that civil servants includes such things as Thai airways, EGAT and the such. It would be interesting to know how many civil servants have take home pay and benefits that exceed the PM, and I also wonder how much the take home and benefits for say one of the very active Army generals is.

[Humphrey Bear]

It's not just Thailand - not just civil servants.

Credit is far to easy to come by. It is one of the reasons the world is in such a mess - money lent/spent by banks exceeded the total real money available in the world by a large factor.

Add up the value of every tangible asset in the world and that is the amount of real money there is. Add up what was lent/owed by the banks and there was no way on God's earth that this could all be recovered.

Banks are being reined-in in Europe, with stress tests. I trust that the rest of the world will folow suit and that credit will be a privilege, not a right, in the near future. Let people save to get the things they crave for, not go into debt at several times their annual salary.

Good, old-fashioned, anglo-saxon work ethic.

[Ricardo]

One must agree that jobs should be properly paid, with the other side of the coin being, "a fair day's work for a fair day's pay", they have to put some effort into it !

I'd also point out that people who have rising debts may perhaps sometimes have made unwise spending-choices, and should bear the consequences, not just be bailed-out by the poor taxpayer ! And that they're not perhaps the best people to have their hands on the public purse-strings, if they can't manage their own finances, properly !

[GarryP]

Average of 43k, plus pension, plus health, plus possible early retirement, often free housing.

As an average number I find this figure very high for Thailand. Considering the amount of them that are on between 10 and 20k, there must be an awful lot of people above the average and then of course, the select few on gazillions.

This calculation is also a nonsense on the average is a nonsense from the point of view that civil servants includes such things as Thai airways, EGAT and the such. It would be interesting to know how many civil servants have take home pay and benefits that exceed the PM, and I also wonder how much the take home and benefits for say one of the very active Army generals is.

"On average, civil servant households receive a monthly income of Bt43,650". That figure threw me too. It seems an awfully high average. With that amount of household income they would not need to seek "other" sources of income. It is way way above the national average and represents a very good income for Thailand. Something is definitely wrong with the figures here.

[TheBarbarian]

The Nation is always there to explain why nepotism and corruption is happening and why it is more or less okay. An income of 43,000 Bht a month is a huge income in comparison to all those millions of hard working Thai people in Izan and the North who feed those corrupted court, police and state officials. They work often for 10% or less of the monthly amount mentioned.The fact is that the Nation never misses an opportunity to lambast protestors looking for a better life while having a good word for civil servants on the take. I understand that in a police state you need millions of civil servants to spy or to report otherwise on the Thai voters who despise the ruling class. The problem is easily solved. By sending home 50% of the police force, 75% of all generals (Thailand is comparable with Napoleon's army to many officers no soldiers to do the fighting), by sending home 30% of the people in state enterprises the good people can be rewarded accordingly without letting the rice farmer pay the bill of bleeding a factory worker dry. instead of feeling sorry for the pay of civil servants the editor should change his leather designer shoes paid for by his family's fortune and switch them for sandals to look in the rice paddies how life is over there. Suddenly it is incredibly clear to me who are the real uneducated people here. It is the elite who always feel sorry for their friends on the take.

[mca]

Over the years I've had a number of Thai associates tell me never to " lend " money to a teacher with a hard luck story ( not that I'd lend anyone any money anyhow ) as so many of them are up the Swannee financially.

[LivinLOS]

Average of 43k, plus pension, plus health, plus possible early retirement, often free housing.

As an average number I find this figure very high for Thailand. Considering the amount of them that are on between 10 and 20k, there must be an awful lot of people above the average and then of course, the select few on gazillions.

This calculation is also a nonsense on the average is a nonsense from the point of view that civil servants includes such things as Thai airways, EGAT and the such. It would be interesting to know how many civil servants have take home pay and benefits that exceed the PM, and I also wonder how much the take home and benefits for say one of the very active Army generals is.

"On average, civil servant households receive a monthly income of Bt43,650". That figure threw me too. It seems an awfully high average. With that amount of household income they would not need to seek "other" sources of income. It is way way above the national average and represents a very good income for Thailand. Something is definitely wrong with the figures here.

When you factor in plus health plus housing etc.. Thats not far off Euro levels of payment, thats over 1000 EUR per month plus perks.

I remember when in Holland their after taxation incomes were often around this number (as a result of crazy high levels of tax and social security).

[mdechgan]

I think we have to separate the police force, army, politicians, from the civil service departments because for example the police in Thailand does not serve the people, they just feed from them. Thailand should just fire everyone and subcontract the entire police department.

Civil servants like Thailand's bureaucracy the most greedy are they tax departments and the customs departments. Even the government knows there is corruption that is why they force changeovers every 6 months.

Are their pay low? Well compared to bank employees they are on par. But remember civil servants have retirement benefits.

My friend who is police officer makes 20,000 per month. He will retire next month before the fiscal budget is used in October. After he retires he will receive 13,000 per month. This is after he retires. So the Thai people have to pay him 13,000 per month for doing no work. Are the civil servants salary low? Not really if you calculate the benefits and retirements.

So who makes mroe money? A person that makes 8,000 baht per month 35 hours per week with free health care including pregnancy costs, free schooling for their children, free housing, and retirement benefits or someone who makes 15,000 baht per month 48 hours per week no benefits except for minimal social security health care.

[Cnxforever]

Before raising pay, they need to get rid of corruption at the highest level...otherwise they will still be corrupt...just richer.

[/quote

]

Exactly my view as well - the salary of somebody corrupt here does not matter that much - even if you double their salaries whenever they get a chance they will still put their hand in the cookie jar!

Corruption exists on every level here - any Thai in a position of power and authority will use this position to extract as much as possible as long as they can regardless of how much money they make legally . The only deterrent would be draconian laws like in China - and even there corruption can not be prevented besides the threat of the death penalty! and of course TIT who would enforce the law? The police?? 55555

Asking a Thai friend why somebody would become for example a policeman in this country - and expected something along the line of upholding the law, helping people e.g. - the answer was "Have a gun, power, above the law and can make a lot of money on the side. They know how much salary for policeman before they start - they already calculate in the extras"

Recently we drove in a car on a particular bad road just outside the city - I asked my Thai friend why the road was in such a bad condition when it had recently been repaired.

His answer was substandard - work and materials - officials must all get their cut - not much money left for road repair. I asked why Thailand would not start using inspectors like in other countries to check finished projects for their quality and materials used.

His answer was: "Road then even worse because inspectors would want their cut as well!"

That about sums it up why things will never change in Thailand!

[brahmburgers]

In my relatively small city of C.Rai, large swaths of downtown have government buildings. There are large gov't buildings outside town. Very little useful things are ever done in those buildings. Thousands of people go to work at dozens of buildings, ....but what really gets done? Essentially very little. The average building has a cavernous room, either filled with people (mostly young women) or empty. Take a close look at what any of the workers are doing. NOTHING. Just acting busy. Thai tradition hates to discipline or lay of any gov't person. Even if/when many of those gov't workers in debt don't pay their obligations, nothing serious will happen to them. Mark my words: there will be no real repercussions. Responsibility means nothing in Thailand.

First thing that should be done, is cut out 9 out of 10 of Thai bureaucrats. 2nd thing: cut the pay of top management in half. 3rd thing: make every worker responsible and productive.

Ok, I sound like a pie in the sky pot smoker. All for now. Over and out.

[likewise]

Corruption is a double edged sword, for the civil servants to take money there has to be someone offering it.

The police, don't get me started, it is a very complex organization.

Your average police man "has to" bring in funds to his superintendent to fill the funds, if he wants to or not, it is part of his task. Indeed they do a very poor job on "protect and serve" the community, sadly enough I see no change in this in the future.

FIL is a copper (a clean one as long as his superiors allow it) so I know some inside stories that would make you want to vommit.

The problem is at the top.

[newermonkey]

No "fair pay" would not be enough to even come close to what they actually make - "on the make" for instance the police make a small fortune, one day out on traffic duty will net what you and I make in a month, No, Jail is the answer.

[likewise]

YEs, jail is the answer, so some more public servants can get paid to make things go away.

Or even worse, a guy is in jail didn't pay off the cops but is paying off to penitentiary staff so it seems like he is doing his time but actually he is roaming the streets in freedom :jap: .

Welcome to the land where money can buy you anything, get used to it because none of us can do a dam_n thing about it.

Edited September 16, 2010 by likewise

[craigt3365]

The Nation is always there to explain why nepotism and corruption is happening and why it is more or less okay. An income of 43,000 Bht a month is a huge income in comparison to all those millions of hard working Thai people in Izan and the North who feed those corrupted court, police and state officials. They work often for 10% or less of the monthly amount mentioned.The fact is that the Nation never misses an opportunity to lambast protestors looking for a better life while having a good word for civil servants on the take. I understand that in a police state you need millions of civil servants to spy or to report otherwise on the Thai voters who despise the ruling class. The problem is easily solved. By sending home 50% of the police force, 75% of all generals (Thailand is comparable with Napoleon's army to many officers no soldiers to do the fighting), by sending home 30% of the people in state enterprises the good people can be rewarded accordingly without letting the rice farmer pay the bill of bleeding a factory worker dry. instead of feeling sorry for the pay of civil servants the editor should change his leather designer shoes paid for by his family's fortune and switch them for sandals to look in the rice paddies how life is over there. Suddenly it is incredibly clear to me who are the real uneducated people here. It is the elite who always feel sorry for their friends on the take.

Where do you think a good part of the civil servants come from? Issan! And many are on the take. Ever tried to get something done at a government office there without paying tea money? Very hard to do. And that is Issan people ripping off Issan people...primarily poor farmers. Has nothing to do with the elite.

You mean the protesters who were getting paid 500B per day? My relatives went just for the money! It's the red leaders who despise the ruling elite...because they want to get back to the trough themselves.

Police state? Are you serious? I would say that about Cuba, but not about Thailand.

Corruption is all over Issan. Just wait until the elections come around again...money is spread all over. By those simple farmers from Issan.

[likewise]

Corruption is not just in isarn, it's all over Thailand, we got our fair share here in the South if you need something done at a government office.

[gregb]

The real problem with this is the changeover. You have many, many people at all levels of every Thai government organization who have paid substantial sums of money for their positions, and they expect to recover that investment and more. Are these "fair pay" salaries going to provide a reasonable return on the corruption paid to acquire a position? Not to mention the fact that a large part of the general public enjoys paying corruption to get preferential treatment. No, I'm not wrong. People with means truly enjoy splashing a little cash to be ushered to the head of the queue while the cattle have to sit and wait.

I don't believe any amount of money would be sufficient to root out corruption. Instead, you need a harsh and brutal crackdown that starts at the top, and punishment with real teeth. Both for anyone who pays corruption and anyone who accepts it. And it needs to be so all encompassing and invasive that people are afraid to even try to work schemes to get around this. After a few years this could be relaxed, but the only way to root out corruption is through fear and intimidation.

More money will simply be seen as a bonus, and the corruption payments will likely also have to increase because the government raised the stakes.

You really want to root out corruption? As newermonkey says, build bigger jails, and set up a special enforcement unit that works direct for someone outside the government who is honourable. That is the only way.

Edited September 16, 2010 by gregb

[rogerman]

One of my brothers-in-law's son has just got a job as a teacher in a government school, so he's now entitled to a loan over a million baht as he's got nearly 40 years employment ahead of him.

So his dad has plans to buy a pick-up outright with the loan. I asked who would be responsible for the repayments to the bank and he said his son as gratitude for being brought up by his old man.

Start work and owe 600,000 baht immediately!

He is only able to get loans IF he is a member of "Sahagon Khru"....If not then he's able to get Jack sh&^%

My wife is also a teacher in a Govt. school with 16 years experience and she is only able to get 600,000 so i think 1 million is going a bit too far.

[Piengrudee]

Fair pay? No such thing in Thailand. the rich will pay the poor what ever he (the rich) see fits.