When Thai government runs out of excuses Saudi will likely give the full story to the world press.

And such a telling might also violate some notorious Thai laws on the books.

Mark did not loose face. The Saudi loose face and this press release is just the start of the face salvage of the camel riding Saudi.

Mark did not loose face. The Saudi loose face and this press release is just the start of the face salvage of the camel riding Saudi.

A typical myopic post, more will fly tomorrow when the other myopic national posters return to work.

....

What Mr. Ashri does not understand is that he should not dare to bring this subject up again and again as it is embarrassing to the 'high society" involved they should not be bothered with such trivial things as who committed which crimes - this is not the Thai way - after all they are above the law!

And the loss of face - in their eyes Mr. Ashri is the one who commits a crime here!

....

I would not be surprise that for some mechanical reason, the brake of this Benz jam due to lack of maintenance, or wiring in his home suddenly age and short circuit ... I am just thinking (making up) of a plot to write a friction.

Anyone familiar with Saudi support for the Wahabi brand of firebrand fundamentalist Islam might be forgiven for thinking there is a direct realpolitic link between this issue and the intractable (yet curiously unfocussed) problems in the South.

Make Thailand the victim, they should be careful half the Thai navy is on the way over there now.

The Saudi loose face and this press release is just the start of the face salvage of the camel riding Saudi.

The government should have you writing their statements and reasoning concerning this affair. Yours are slightly less risible.

ok it's neato for someone to have the immunity to say what he wants in Thailand....

And he sure says a lot of truth...

BUT can the Arab also to speak honestly of his own Kingdom???

same http://www.hrw.org/en/node/79258 same Thailand!!!

hey Pot the Kettle is black!

Edit; oh and saudis have their elite class who are above the law, TOO it's called 'wasta'

Saudi Arabia

Events of 2008

Human rights conditions remain poor in Saudi Arabia. International and domestic pressure to improve human rights practices remained feeble, and the government undertook no major reforms in 2008.

The government continues to treat women as legal minors, denying them a host of fundamental human rights.

Arbitrary Detention and Unfair Trials

Detainees, including children, are commonly the victims of systematic and multiple violations of due process and fair trial rights, including arbitrary arrest and torture and ill-treatment in detention. Saudi judges routinely sentence defendants to thousands of lashes, often carried out in public. In 2008 the kingdom carried out 88 executions as of mid-November (compared to 150 over the equivalent period in 2007), including for drug offenses.

Saudi Arabia has no law setting an age below which a child should not be tried as an adult,

Freedom of Expression

Freedom of expression in Saudi Arabia deteriorated in 2008. The government did not respond publicly when chief judge Salih al-Luhaidan in September endorsed the idea that owners of TV stations that broadcast allegedly lewd shows during Ramadan deserved to be killed. Nor did the government sanction prominent cleric Abd al-Rahman al-Barrak in March after he called for the killing of journalists Abdullah Bajad Utaibi and Yusif Aba al-Khair for articles criticizing extremist interpretations of Islam.

Freedom of Religion and Religious Discrimination

Saudi Arabia systematically discriminates against its religious minorities

This guy is becoming the second Hun Sen. I wonder how much Thaksin pays the Saudi government?

.. begin removed ..

The government continues to treat women as legal minors, denying them a host of fundamental human rights.

.. remainder removed ..

I can agree with most even the part quoted above. There are days though I think we should never have let them out of the kitchen. And yes I know, that makes me an M.C.P.

.. begin removed ..

The government continues to treat women as legal minors, denying them a host of fundamental human rights.

.. remainder removed ..

I can agree with most even the part quoted above. There are days though I think we should never have let them out of the kitchen. And yes I know, that makes me an M.C.P.

Why have women got smaller feet than us? So they can stand closer to the sink! Count me in the MCP club.

Mark did not loose face. The Saudi loose face and this press release is just the start of the face salvage of the camel riding Saudi.

Do you even know who you are talking about? The diplomat in question is not some uneducated boob "riding a camel". He is an experienced gentleman that has been posted around the world. He certainly has an education and work experience that qualifies him for the job and he doesn't have to wear a uniform with a lot of bogus medals and ribbons to have that credibility. Please read his biography; http://www.mofa.gov.sa/Detail.asp?

Only a fool would ingnore this man or insult him. He's got a plan and he's following it. The PM Abhisit has mishandled this file and he cannot run away from the mess. Here are some important facts to keep in mind;

-Thailand imports approximately 70% of its total energy supply.

- The Middle East provides approximately 80% of Thailand's oil imports.

- In 2006, the transportation sector consumed 72% of the nations oil from all sources.

Now, read this very closely; Anything that disrupts the supply of oil to Thailand or that increases the cost of petroleum to Thailand will knock Thailand flat on its arse. Thailand's economy could be seriously damaged if the Saudis get nasty and restrict trade with Thailand. Simply put, the country would see large rolling production shutdowns and the resulting labour and social unrest as key industrial sectors laid off personnel. Thailand's big money earner of rice exports would sit in storage since there would be no fuel available to power the trucks to transport the shipments. If the disruption came at harvest time, the rice could rot in the paddies if there was no fuel for the harvest equipment.

Are you even aware of Thailand's strategic reserves in the event of an emergency? The MOE has been struggling for years to cconvince everyone of the importance of a strategic reserve. No one listens. All ti will take is 1 month of turning off or reducing the oil supply to Thailand and the economy will be close to collapse. I don't think people appreciate how precarious Thailand's position is. The last thing Thailand needs are riots and panic caused by an energy supply crisis.

In case anyone needs some visual evidence. Here is one of many presentations made available by the MOE.The PM and cabinet must listen to the MOE planners.

http://www.iea.org/w...kok/sakunee.pdf

.. begin removed ..

The government continues to treat women as legal minors, denying them a host of fundamental human rights.

.. remainder removed ..

I can agree with most even the part quoted above. There are days though I think we should never have let them out of the kitchen. And yes I know, that makes me an M.C.P.

Kitchen? Or you you mean toilet. We scrub and clean the loo for you to sit it, and this is how you repay us?

.. begin removed ..

The government continues to treat women as legal minors, denying them a host of fundamental human rights.

.. remainder removed ..

I can agree with most even the part quoted above. There are days though I think we should never have let them out of the kitchen. And yes I know, that makes me an M.C.P.

Kitchen? Or you you mean toilet. We scrub and clean the loo for you to sit it, and this is how you repay us?

Sorry, when I say kitchen I mean kitchen. Now go back there.

I agree with most of your points.

However, the last 17 governments (including 1 dictator) could not solve the case.

That does not show, that Abhisit is not really in charge.

Just goes to show you how corrupt Thailand is. How can a policeman have dodged such a serious alligation risen to such a high level in society and for Abhisit to back him? I think the Saudis are entitled to fair justice. It also supports my view that Thailand is a very dangerous place to live and you can't expect fair justice. It also shows that Abhisit is not really in charge.

Mark did not loose face. The Saudi loose face and this press release is just the start of the face salvage of the camel riding Saudi.

Hey Troll, You are very naive

.. begin removed ..

The government continues to treat women as legal minors, denying them a host of fundamental human rights.

.. remainder removed ..

I can agree with most even the part quoted above. There are days though I think we should never have let them out of the kitchen. And yes I know, that makes me an M.C.P.

Kitchen? Or you you mean toilet. We scrub and clean the loo for you to sit it, and this is how you repay us?

Sorry, when I say kitchen I mean kitchen. Now go back there.

Seconded. Now go back to the kitchen, clean the toilet and close the door behind you.

Since it's a slow night and even mod's have a sense of humour (I hope)

My dear Chantorn, for you :

Rules by Men, all numbered one on purpose.

1. Learn to work the toilet seat. You're a big girl. If it's up, put it down. We need it up, you need it down. You don't hear us complaining about you leaving it down.

1. Whenever possible, please say whatever you have to say during commercials.

1. A headache that lasts for 17 months is a problem. See a doctor.

1. Sunday = sports. It's like the full moon or the changing of the tides. Let it be.

1. Shopping is NOT a sport. And no, we are never going to think of it that way.

1. Crying is blackmail.

1. Ask for what you want. Let us be clear on this one: Subtle hints do not work! Strong hints do not work! Obvious hints do not work! Just say it!

1. Yes and No are perfectly acceptable answers to almost every question.

1. Come to us with a problem only if you want help solving it. That's what we do. Sympathy is what your girlfriends are for.

1. Anything we said 6 months ago is inadmissible in an argument. In fact, all comments become null and void after 7 days!

1. If you won't dress like the Victoria's Secret girls, don't expect us to act like soap opera guys.

1. If you think you're fat, you probably are. Don't ask us.

1. If something we said can be interpreted in two ways, and one of the ways makes you sad or angry, we meant the other one.

1. You can either ask us to do something or tell us how you want it done. Not both. If you already know best how to do it, just do it yourself.

1. Christopher Columbus did not need directions and neither do we.

1. ALL men see in only 16 colors, like Windows default settings. Peach, for example, is a fruit, not a color. Pumpkin is also a fruit. We have no idea what mauve is.

1. If it itches, it will be scratched. We do that.

1. If we ask what is wrong and you say "nothing," we will act like nothing's wrong. We know you are lying, but it's not worth the hassle.

1. If you ask a question you don't want an answer to, expect an answer you don't want to hear.

1. When we have to go somewhere, absolutely anything you wear is fine. Really.

1. Don't ask us what we're thinking - unless you are prepared to discuss such topics as baseball, sports, the shotgun formation, or monster trucks.

1. You have enough clothes.

1. You have too many shoes.

1. I am in shape. Round is a shape.

1. Thank you for reading this; Yes, I know, I have to sleep on the couch tonight, but did you know men really don't mind that, it's like camping

This Saudi guy's basically put in a nutshell the entire Thai authority's playbook on 'How To Deflect Criticism or Unwanted Attention'.

In general terms, the procedure is:

1) Give a contrived explanation involving issues the complainant isn't/can't be aware of, preferably involving the deliberate use of disengenious misinterperetations of obscure laws/guidelines.

2) Repeat with alternative contrivances until complainant is satisfied or sufficiently baffled into inaction.

3) Claim that you have given sufficient reasons/responses to the point where it now looks like the complainant is being obtuse and stubborn in the continued pursuit of truth/justice.

4) Claim the complainant has been misinformed so that he /she doesn't even know what they're talking about.

5) Claim the complainant just doesn't understand the culture/laws/issues at hand.

And by 'Thai Authority', I mean any kind of authority in this country at whatever level from the government down to the people who issue driving licenses.

Well before the end of this procedure, the complainant has usually given up. The interesting thing about this case is that the complainant very clearly isn't giving up. This is is one relationship that isn't going to be mended any time soon.

That Thai playbook is also well known by the bureaucrats of my country, Canada, and I daresay, many other countries.

But cheering on the Saudis? What's the matter with you? It's one of the most evil kingdoms on earth. They fund terrorism, abuse women and children, rape and murder foreign maids with impunity, and care nothing for the disadvantaged of the world. "Go Saudi." I say go to H***!

ok it's neato for someone to have the immunity to say what he wants in Thailand....

And he sure says a lot of truth...

BUT can the Arab also to speak honestly of his own Kingdom???

same http://www.hrw.org/en/node/79258 same Thailand!!!

hey Pot the Kettle is black!

Edit; oh and saudis have their elite class who are above the law, TOO it's called 'wasta'

Saudi Arabia

Events of 2008

Human rights conditions remain poor in Saudi Arabia. International and domestic pressure to improve human rights practices remained feeble, and the government undertook no major reforms in 2008.

The government continues to treat women as legal minors, denying them a host of fundamental human rights.

Arbitrary Detention and Unfair Trials

Detainees, including children, are commonly the victims of systematic and multiple violations of due process and fair trial rights, including arbitrary arrest and torture and ill-treatment in detention. Saudi judges routinely sentence defendants to thousands of lashes, often carried out in public. In 2008 the kingdom carried out 88 executions as of mid-November (compared to 150 over the equivalent period in 2007), including for drug offenses.

Saudi Arabia has no law setting an age below which a child should not be tried as an adult,

Freedom of Expression

Freedom of expression in Saudi Arabia deteriorated in 2008. The government did not respond publicly when chief judge Salih al-Luhaidan in September endorsed the idea that owners of TV stations that broadcast allegedly lewd shows during Ramadan deserved to be killed. Nor did the government sanction prominent cleric Abd al-Rahman al-Barrak in March after he called for the killing of journalists Abdullah Bajad Utaibi and Yusif Aba al-Khair for articles criticizing extremist interpretations of Islam.

Freedom of Religion and Religious Discrimination

Saudi Arabia systematically discriminates against its religious minorities

The saudis are not the ones on trial here. Feel free to open another thread about the problems of Sharia law. The issue is about the trial of a rather undeserving policeman (though to call him such does any cop with a shred of decency a great diservice). Anybody who was even slightly concerned about the integrity of his station would stand down immediately (with pay given retrospectively when the 'inevitable' not guilty arrives) and await trial.

Mark did not loose face. The Saudi loose face and this press release is just the start of the face salvage of the camel riding Saudi.

Do you even know who you are talking about? The diplomat in question is not some uneducated boob "riding a camel". He is an experienced gentleman that has been posted around the world. He certainly has an education and work experience that qualifies him for the job and he doesn't have to wear a uniform with a lot of bogus medals and ribbons to have that credibility. Please read his biography; http://www.mofa.gov.sa/Detail.asp?

Only a fool would ingnore this man or insult him. He's got a plan and he's following it. The PM Abhisit has mishandled this file and he cannot run away from the mess. Here are some important facts to keep in mind;

-Thailand imports approximately 70% of its total energy supply.

- The Middle East provides approximately 80% of Thailand's oil imports.

- In 2006, the transportation sector consumed 72% of the nations oil from all sources.

Now, read this very closely; Anything that disrupts the supply of oil to Thailand or that increases the cost of petroleum to Thailand will knock Thailand flat on its arse. Thailand's economy could be seriously damaged if the Saudis get nasty and restrict trade with Thailand. Simply put, the country would see large rolling production shutdowns and the resulting labour and social unrest as key industrial sectors laid off personnel. Thailand's big money earner of rice exports would sit in storage since there would be no fuel available to power the trucks to transport the shipments. If the disruption came at harvest time, the rice could rot in the paddies if there was no fuel for the harvest equipment.

Are you even aware of Thailand's strategic reserves in the event of an emergency? The MOE has been struggling for years to cconvince everyone of the importance of a strategic reserve. No one listens. All ti will take is 1 month of turning off or reducing the oil supply to Thailand and the economy will be close to collapse. I don't think people appreciate how precarious Thailand's position is. The last thing Thailand needs are riots and panic caused by an energy supply crisis.

In case anyone needs some visual evidence. Here is one of many presentations made available by the MOE.The PM and cabinet must listen to the MOE planners.

http://www.iea.org/w...kok/sakunee.pdf

Spot on!

And I am very glad that someone has the balls and the clout to stand up and say <deleted>! This kind of pressure can only (in the long term not the short) help mould this country into a more free less corrupt state.

Now can we get a Saudi to get rid of those bent traffic cops on the rail tracks under the bridge on Sukhumvit rd! (someone get a camera on them it will make for great youtube.

What has happened to them (Saudis) is an injustice that happens in varying degrees across this country every day. I wish their kingdom the best of luck in their effort to help this kingdom.

Saudi Sioux sioux!

So all the @#$%&$# high society people have to do is open their safes, return the jewels, and all will be well again.

If you do some google searching you will see someone wearing a very similar blue diamond, i wouldnt have thought itd be possible to ask for it back.

No luck with googling, could you elaborate?

Give it a rest, its 20 years old

Are you serious? He has some very valid concerns. Actually, the Gov't of Thailand should be concerned as well. They are being taken to task, and coming out looking pretty stupid.......3rd worldish...you know, stuff that an "emerging" community wouldn't want the world to know about it....you know, the level of corruption that is becoming apparent,; and not only that, acceptable, defendable, justifiable.

Yeah way to go Thailand.....mismanagement at it's finest display. Bunch of idiots running this country.....

SomTumTiger,

I'm glad someone else began with exactly the same thought that I had in my mind when I read your nonsensical remark!

Do you have some knowledge of a statutue of limitations on murder than the rest of us are unaware of? I would suggest that you think before posting, or are you just another one of those who comments merely to boost his post count?!

One post removed. Please no more blanket accusations against Thais and their government.

So in a nutshell, only in the past 8 months Thailand managed to anger USA , Russia, Cambodia and Saudi Arabia and we still have 3 months left in this year, so perhaps there is still a chance to upset a few more.

Well with the hospital over charging fiasco(not at government level yet) but i have a feeling will get there shortly

the Chargé d'Affairs as "ill-informed" and according to H.E. Mr. Abhisit, that he seemed to have "insufficient information about the matter" of the promotion of Pol. Maj. Gen. Somkid Boonthanom

Obviously they know a few things about Gen Somkid, and coverup or no they will have their say. Thats the problem when the victim becomes the King of Saudi.

Som Tum Tiger posted

Give it a rest, its 20 years old

I'm sure that is what Abhisit and MP's are whinging, but methinks the Saudis want their pound of flesh. You make your bed you sleep in it.

Mark did not loose face. The Saudi loose face and this press release is just the start of the face salvage of the camel riding Saudi.

i hope they shake the tree hard and get rid of the bad fruit.

This Saudi guy's basically put in a nutshell the entire Thai authority's playbook on 'How To Deflect Criticism or Unwanted Attention'.

In general terms, the procedure is:

1) Give a contrived explanation involving issues the complainant isn't/can't be aware of, preferably involving the deliberate use of disengenious misinterperetations of obscure laws/guidelines.

2) Repeat with alternative contrivances until complainant is satisfied or sufficiently baffled into inaction.

3) Claim that you have given sufficient reasons/responses to the point where it now looks like the complainant is being obtuse and stubborn in the continued pursuit of truth/justice.

4) Claim the complainant has been misinformed so that he /she doesn't even know what they're talking about.

5) Claim the complainant just doesn't understand the culture/laws/issues at hand.

And by 'Thai Authority', I mean any kind of authority in this country at whatever level from the government down to the people who issue driving licenses.

Well before the end of this procedure, the complainant has usually given up. The interesting thing about this case is that the complainant very clearly isn't giving up. This is is one relationship that isn't going to be mended any time soon.

Excellent summary, should be made into a flow chart and included in the rough guide. The only way to break out of the loop is to die of old age or separate the facts from the gordian knot of obfuscation and present these publicly.

I suspect we come then to the following.

6) Having been shown up by points 1-5 being seen as delaying tactics the only thing which remains is the irrational tantrum which comes with losing face. This is delightfully circular in it's own right as by claiming to have suffered an ad-hominim attack the 'victim' launches similar attacks themselves and refuses to even engage in any further discusions about the original issue.

The only way to break out of this second loop is to have clout which you can and are prepared to use. Face is not the sacrosanct element of the Thai culture it's portrayed as. The quick capitulation to the Japanese in WWII or the horse trading land for independance with colonial powers proves this - However I suspect we will soon go to item 6 on the list and to break out of that the Saudi's will need to block oil exports to Thailand, something they have failed to do for 20 years.

"I'm well-informed, not ill-informed," he thundered in a statement responding to Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva's comments on Saturday after meeting with him at Ban Phitsanulok. Hahahahahaha loose face? who? Mark? Thailand? hahahahaha 555