Honda Cbr 250R 2011

[Tiffer]

4 out of 5 from MCN.

http://www.motorcycl...R-2011-current/

UK price: over 180,000bht non abs of course...

Insurance group 13 Ouch!!

We are sooooooo lucky in Thailand!

[dave_boo]

4 out of 5 from MCN.

http://www.motorcycl...R-2011-current/

UK price: over 180,000bht non abs of course...

Insurance group 13 Ouch!!

We are sooooooo lucky in Thailand!

MCN lists the Ninja as group 9 but "Andy949494" seems to suggest that he had to get group 12 on the Ninja page...

[appropriate]

Interesting times on that Jap shoot out.

BTW the price in Denmark is 6,000 euro plus.... 250,000thb.

Just a tad of import tax.

[BigBikeBKK]

4 out of 5 from MCN.

http://www.motorcycl...R-2011-current/

UK price: over 180,000bht non abs of course...

Insurance group 13 Ouch!!

We are sooooooo lucky in Thailand!

MCN lists the Ninja as group 9 but "Andy949494" seems to suggest that he had to get group 12 on the Ninja page...

Is that the review that says the Ninjette is built in Taiwan?

[robblok]

Im not real long only 180cm but i do have a small comfort problem with the brake pedal. I have to angle my foot upwards to keep my foot above it. Does anyone have the same problem ?

[appropriate]

I'm 175cm, and nope.

[canuckamuck]

Im not real long only 180cm but i do have a small comfort problem with the brake pedal. I have to angle my foot upwards to keep my foot above it. Does anyone have the same problem ?

When I ride I rest my foot on the brake. Usually you have a bit of distance to push down before the brakes begin to squeeze. So it is no problem to use it as a bit of a rest. I haven't ridden the new CBR's though.

[robblok]

I'm 175cm, and nope.

Do you have the ABS version ? if so does your ABS light stay on or go off ?

[appropriate]

Have the standard model.

[jackjones]

Is there a way to adjust the brake pedal so it is sitting a bit lower?

[robblok]

Is there a way to adjust the brake pedal so it is sitting a bit lower?

Are you having the same problem as me... I cant rest my foo good on it i have to angle my foot upwards. Also i tried stepping on it a little just like some people said (thanks for that) But it still does not feel great

P.s do you have the ABS model ?

[snowflake]

Depending on where and how i ride i tend to put the ball of my foot on the peg... Though- riding where i require rear braking i just keep it slightly at an angle off to the side...

Ohh... I am 186cm tall...

[robblok]

Depending on where and how i ride i tend to put the ball of my foot on the peg... Though- riding where i require rear braking i just keep it slightly at an angle off to the side...

Ohh... I am 186cm tall...

That was what i started to do too. Still not perfect.. wonder if there are any adaptations. Good to see others have the same problems and im not a freak

[snowflake]

You know that we could all be freaks!

[thaicbr]

The few times i have ridden the CBR i found the same thing.. i thought the pedal to be to high, I didn't like it and would try and adjust /convert when i buy one.

Edited April 3, 2011 by thaicbr

[Richard-BKK]

4 out of 5 from MCN.

http://www.motorcycl...R-2011-current/

UK price: over 180,000bht non abs of course...

Insurance group 13 Ouch!!

We are sooooooo lucky in Thailand!

MCN lists the Ninja as group 9 but "Andy949494" seems to suggest that he had to get group 12 on the Ninja page...

Is that the review that says the Ninjette is built in Taiwan?

BigbikeBKK do you honestly believe that all Ninja 250R's are only build in Thailand? If that is so the Kawasaki Ninja 250R would probably be the worst selling 250 on the planet....

P.S. I not know if they manufactured in Taiwan, or not, but I know Kawasaki has a production facility in Taiwan...

[Richard-BKK]

Does anyone know the 1/4 mile and 0-60mph times?

Earlier in the thread there was a link (thanks taichiplanet!) to a Japanese shootout between the CBR and the Ninja; however it only lists the 0-400 m times (darn close to a 1/4 mile). I've included the actual picture.

Also interestingly they list (I'm assuming since I can't read Japanese) the Ninja as having a 7,64 km/h faster top end.

***EDIT***

Also, here's a post that has the links to a Youtube video for 0-100 kph (0-62 MPH).

You assume correct the Kawasaki Ninja 250R has standard a faster top end, but, the difference is in modifications. Take a standard Honda CBR250R and a Kawasaki Ninja 250R and change the exhaust pipe with a less restricted one. Do the test again and you will see different results. The standard Honda CBR250R exhaust system mounted is a very restricting exhaust system, while the PGM-FI (fuel-injection) system can deal with most exhaust and air-filter modifications.(The Honda CBR250R is the cleanest 250 on exhaust emission in the world, and that doesn't mix well with performance)

Also you not need to buy a Dynojet Power Commander for the Honda CBR250R to get better fueling, the heart of the CBR250R fueling is a PGM-FI "ProGramMable Fuel injection", which with a few tools can load several fuel maps on demand...

Edited April 3, 2011 by Richard-BKK

[dave_boo]

BigbikeBKK do you honestly believe that all Ninja 250R's are only build in Thailand? If that is so the Kawasaki Ninja 250R would probably be the worst selling 250 on the planet....

P.S. I not know if they manufactured in Taiwan, or not, but I know Kawasaki has a production facility in Taiwan...

The site being from the UK they probably meant Thailand, but considering that most of zee Anglish wouldn't know the difference between the Dutch and die duestchen Volk that's not a big surprise....

You assume correct the Kawasaki Ninja 250R has standard a faster top end, but, the difference is in modifications. Take a standard Honda CBR250R and a Kawasaki Ninja 250R and change the exhaust pipe with a less restricted one. Do the test again and you will see different results. The standard Honda CBR250R exhaust system mounted is a very restricting exhaust system, while the PGM-FI (fuel-injection) system can deal with most exhaust and air-filter modifications.(The Honda CBR250R is the cleanest 250 on exhaust emission in the world, and that doesn't mix well with performance)

Also you not need to buy a Dynojet Power Commander for the Honda CBR250R to get better fueling, the heart of the CBR250R fueling is a PGM-FI "ProGramMable Fuel injection", which with a few tools can load several fuel maps on demand...

AFAIK all ECUs are programmable; it's the ease of the job that makes the difference. For instance I had to disconnect three sets of plugs on my Ninja to install the Power Commander V. The O₂ and both fuel inectors. Hooking the unit in and I was done (there was one more IIRC that had to do with RPM...but I forget). Now I can see the map right in front of me and look at almost all the stats the stock ECU looks at but still override it. If I need to transfer the Power Commander over a new harness and free download of maps get's 'er done. Be kinda hard to more that tuned up ECU to a bigger bike....

[appropriate]

Also you not need to buy a Dynojet Power Commander for the Honda CBR250R to get better fueling, the heart of the CBR250R fueling is a PGM-FI "ProGramMable Fuel injection", which with a few tools can load several fuel maps on demand...

Sounds good.

[Richard-BKK]

BigbikeBKK do you honestly believe that all Ninja 250R's are only build in Thailand? If that is so the Kawasaki Ninja 250R would probably be the worst selling 250 on the planet....

P.S. I not know if they manufactured in Taiwan, or not, but I know Kawasaki has a production facility in Taiwan...

The site being from the UK they probably meant Thailand, but considering that most of zee Anglish wouldn't know the difference between the Dutch and die duestchen Volk that's not a big surprise....

You assume correct the Kawasaki Ninja 250R has standard a faster top end, but, the difference is in modifications. Take a standard Honda CBR250R and a Kawasaki Ninja 250R and change the exhaust pipe with a less restricted one. Do the test again and you will see different results. The standard Honda CBR250R exhaust system mounted is a very restricting exhaust system, while the PGM-FI (fuel-injection) system can deal with most exhaust and air-filter modifications.(The Honda CBR250R is the cleanest 250 on exhaust emission in the world, and that doesn't mix well with performance)

Also you not need to buy a Dynojet Power Commander for the Honda CBR250R to get better fueling, the heart of the CBR250R fueling is a PGM-FI "ProGramMable Fuel injection", which with a few tools can load several fuel maps on demand...

AFAIK all ECUs are programmable; it's the ease of the job that makes the difference. For instance I had to disconnect three sets of plugs on my Ninja to install the Power Commander V. The O₂ and both fuel inectors. Hooking the unit in and I was done (there was one more IIRC that had to do with RPM...but I forget). Now I can see the map right in front of me and look at almost all the stats the stock ECU looks at but still override it. If I need to transfer the Power Commander over a new harness and free download of maps get's 'er done. Be kinda hard to more that tuned up ECU to a bigger bike....

Probably you mean Deutsche Volk, trust me it has little to do with The Netherlands, but, all Europeans have a very high tolerance for Americans and the knowledge of the world around them... what can we says Americans have absolutely no culture of there own and history is counted in two or three digits...

Yes in pure theory all fuel-injection systems are programmable, but while the Kawasaki Ninja 250R needs relative expensive additional hardware in the form of a Dynojet Power Commander, the PGM-FI only needs an additional system if you want to switch fuel-maps on demand. You could load one modified fuel-map without installing any additional hardware.... I would be interested to see you do that to a standard "read only" Kawasaki fuel-injection system...

Edited April 3, 2011 by Richard-BKK

[dave_boo]

BigbikeBKK do you honestly believe that all Ninja 250R's are only build in Thailand? If that is so the Kawasaki Ninja 250R would probably be the worst selling 250 on the planet....

P.S. I not know if they manufactured in Taiwan, or not, but I know Kawasaki has a production facility in Taiwan...

The site being from the UK they probably meant Thailand, but considering that most of zee Anglish wouldn't know the difference between the Dutch and die duestchen Volk that's not a big surprise....

You assume correct the Kawasaki Ninja 250R has standard a faster top end, but, the difference is in modifications. Take a standard Honda CBR250R and a Kawasaki Ninja 250R and change the exhaust pipe with a less restricted one. Do the test again and you will see different results. The standard Honda CBR250R exhaust system mounted is a very restricting exhaust system, while the PGM-FI (fuel-injection) system can deal with most exhaust and air-filter modifications.(The Honda CBR250R is the cleanest 250 on exhaust emission in the world, and that doesn't mix well with performance)

Also you not need to buy a Dynojet Power Commander for the Honda CBR250R to get better fueling, the heart of the CBR250R fueling is a PGM-FI "ProGramMable Fuel injection", which with a few tools can load several fuel maps on demand...

AFAIK all ECUs are programmable; it's the ease of the job that makes the difference. For instance I had to disconnect three sets of plugs on my Ninja to install the Power Commander V. The O₂ and both fuel inectors. Hooking the unit in and I was done (there was one more IIRC that had to do with RPM...but I forget). Now I can see the map right in front of me and look at almost all the stats the stock ECU looks at but still override it. If I need to transfer the Power Commander over a new harness and free download of maps get's 'er done. Be kinda hard to more that tuned up ECU to a bigger bike....

Probably you mean Deutsche Volk, trust me it has little to do with The Netherlands, but, all Europeans have a very high tolerance for Americans and the knowledge of the world around them... what can we says Americans have absolutely no culture of there own and history is counted in two or three digits...

Yes in pure theory all fuel-injection systems are programmable, but while the Kawasaki Ninja 250R needs relative expensive additional hardware in the form of a Dynojet Power Commander, the PGM-FI only needs an additional system if you want to switch fuel-maps on demand. You could load one modified fuel-map without installing any additional hardware.... I would be interested to see you do that to a standard "read only" Kawasaki fuel-injection system...

It was a quick bang out and if I remember correctly the Reischstag had "Dem Deutschen Volke" carved above its doors. If you didn't get my gentle jab at the Brits (it's an English site I linked to) than it is not surprising that you got huffy (mokkend?) that I used the Dutch to illustrate my point (much as Mike Meyers did in his 'Goldmember' movie).

Let's see, you spend some 9000 THB on a power commander that gives you real time feedback and can be moved to a new vehicle or you follow something similar to this guide (and spend just as much on the PGM-FI Setting Tool) then hours or days at the dyno getting it dialed in.

[appropriate]

the PGM-FI only needs an additional system if you want to switch fuel-maps on demand. You could load one modified fuel-map without installing any additional hardware.

Keep talking...

Edited April 3, 2011 by appropriate

[bongiorgio]

Let's see, you spend some 9000 THB on a power commander that gives you real time feedback and can be moved to a new vehicle or you follow something similar to this guide (and spend just as much on the PGM-FI Setting Tool) then hours or days at the dyno getting it dialed in.

following the guide, i understand, you CAN change the air/fuel mapping and the ignition timing. BUT no convincing improvement is to be found there....

....is all the chip tuning an illusion then?

so to find my desired little extra power, i have to increase compression after all?

i realy had hoped, the airbox, cdi and pipe change would kick ass...

[dave_boo]

following the guide, i understand, you CAN change the air/fuel mapping and the ignition timing. BUT no convincing improvement is to be found there....

....is all the chip tuning an illusion then?

so to find my desired little extra power, i have to increase compression after all?

i realy had hoped, the airbox, cdi and pipe change would kick ass...

It's actually all about what you want to do. They mentioned in the article that they detuned the down low end of the RPM to reduce the ferocity of the 450 on take off (don't want the rear tyre digging for China but moving you forward) but there wasn't much improvement overall.

Now a CRF 450 is an off road bike. Meaning that, and a big assumption it has any, emission standards for it are really low and Honda did a good job getting the bike tuned for the stock exhaust setup.

A CBR 250R is a road going bike and will be much more choked percentage wise than the CRF in stock form simply because of the road going bike emission standards. Just going with a Power Commander style setup (or even using the PGM-FI tool) you can gain some HP, but you're quickly going to run into the issue of the cat, restrictive exhaust, etc. Remove those problems and you should get decent numbers out of the mod.

Also be careful about airbox mods; airboxes are basically Helmholtz resonators (same thing that makes stringed instruments louder). You start messing around with the design and you can drastically move the peak power of the bike all over the RPM spread (read up on it here...not too technical of an article).

[Richard-BKK]

It was a quick bang out and if I remember correctly the Reischstag had "Dem Deutschen Volke" carved above its doors. If you didn't get my gentle jab at the Brits (it's an English site I linked to) than it is not surprising that you got huffy (mokkend?) that I used the Dutch to illustrate my point (much as Mike Meyers did in his 'Goldmember' movie).

Let's see, you spend some 9000 THB on a power commander that gives you real time feedback and can be moved to a new vehicle or you follow something similar to this guide (and spend just as much on the PGM-FI Setting Tool) then hours or days at the dyno getting it dialed in.

We have in Thailand a small company, who did revolutionary changed the way should look at the PGM-FI, most classic idea's found for big bikes is to simply bypass the fueling-information similar to the Dynojet Power Commander system. Therefore the similar pricing.

A.P.I. Tech, first introduced the programming of the original PGM-FI fuel-map with the Honda PCX 125, and with some additional software this will also work for the Honda CBR250R and in a later time for the Honda CBR150R.

The programming station, which is not needed for every rider will probably cost around 8 to 10,000 THB, the idea is that you as a Honda CBR250R owner go to your dealer and ask to load a new fuel-map for a few hundred THB, if you want to be able to change several fuel-maps on demand, you probably pay about 2,000 to 4,000 THB, but this will give you the same ability of some other aftermarket alternative fueling systems as the Dynojet Power Commander for halve the price.

Edited April 3, 2011 by Richard-BKK

[dave_boo]

It was a quick bang out and if I remember correctly the Reischstag had "Dem Deutschen Volke" carved above its doors. If you didn't get my gentle jab at the Brits (it's an English site I linked to) than it is not surprising that you got huffy (mokkend?) that I used the Dutch to illustrate my point (much as Mike Meyers did in his 'Goldmember' movie).

Let's see, you spend some 9000 THB on a power commander that gives you real time feedback and can be moved to a new vehicle or you follow something similar to this guide (and spend just as much on the PGM-FI Setting Tool) then hours or days at the dyno getting it dialed in.

We have in Thailand a small company, who did revolutionary changed the way should look at the PGM-FI, most classic idea's found for big bikes is to simply bypass the fueling-information similar to the Dynojet Power Commander system. Therefore the similar pricing.

A.P.I. Tech, first introduced the programming of the original PGM-FI fuel-map with the Honda PCX 125, and with some additional software this will also work for the Honda CBR250R and in a later time for the Honda CBR150R.

The programming station, which is not needed for every rider will probably cost around 8 to 10,000 THB, the idea is that you as a Honda CBR250R owner go to your dealer and ask to load a new fuel-map for a few hundred THB, if you want to be able to change several fuel-maps on demand, you probably pay about 2,000 to 4,000 THB, but this will give you the same ability of some other aftermarket alternative fueling systems as the Dynojet Power Commander for halve the price.

So basically when you stated "You could load one modified fuel-map without installing any additional hardware" you meant that you could take it some place, have the ECU flashed and then may or may not need to go back if that flashing doesn't work perfectly with your bike?

And no, having several fuel maps hard coded to a switch is NOT the same as having a power commander. What happens if you want to lean up a certain area or enrich it a bit to get that perfect balance? Oh, that's right you have to go back and hope they flash your ECU properly with the correct data....

Finally, if your bike breaks down and you take it into Honda without a reflash I can guess what would happen to your warranty. On the other hand I can have the power commander out within 15 minutes...

[Richard-BKK]

First, yes, in the near future you would be able to go to selected motorcycle shops to hook up your Honda CBR250R to load a new fuel map... And I'm sure like many bad fuel maps you can find online for other fueling systems, you will in the future find bad fuel maps online for the Honda CBR250R.

But nobody reasonable wants to win in the upcoming Moto3 racing class, and therefore not much problems are expected from a few changes in the fueling system. Honda went green a few years ago, but they never closed the door for modification. Actually “how to program the Honda PGM-FI system” is available from Honda support. And Honda is actively supporting “Thai” aftermarket manufacturers, with detail engine specification, like exhaust compression, air-box-air-flow, and many more details to get the Honda CBR250R ahead of the Kawasaki Ninja 250R in aftermarket parts.

And it works, if we compare how many aftermarket parts were available one month after the Kawasaki Ninja 250R and one month after the Honda CBR250R hit the market... The Honda CBR250R is clearly winning in aftermarket products.... Sure now-a-day, you can find lots of imported aftermarket products for the Ninja 250R “Kawasaki Thailand seems even be proud to charge extreme high prices, because it's imported”, Honda Thailand has set its target to support the Thai production of aftermarket products.

[Richard-BKK]

And while the Kawasaki Ninja 250R version of the Dynojet Power Commander asks you to disconnect the exhaust sensor, the modified Honda CBR250R system doesn't needs anything similar. With all sensors in place, including the exhaust sensor, the modified Honda PGM-FI system can actual sense incorrect fueling.

Do MotoGP bikes have Exhaust sensors and are they actively used, yes they are

The rule with imperfection is to shutdown the control, the Dynojet Power Commander for the Kawasaki Ninja follows that pattern.

Edited April 3, 2011 by Richard-BKK

[appropriate]

First, yes, in the near future you would be able to go to selected motorcycle shops to hook up your Honda CBR250R to load a new fuel map...

Sounds good.

Any idea how far into the near future they're looking at?

[dave_boo]

First, yes, in the near future you would be able to go to selected motorcycle shops to hook up your Honda CBR250R to load a new fuel map... And I'm sure like many bad fuel maps you can find online for other fueling systems, you will in the future find bad fuel maps online for the Honda CBR250R.

But nobody reasonable wants to win in the upcoming Moto3 racing class, and therefore not much problems are expected from a few changes in the fueling system. Honda went green a few years ago, but they never closed the door for modification. Actually "how to program the Honda PGM-FI system" is available from Honda support. And Honda is actively supporting "Thai" aftermarket manufacturers, with detail engine specification, like exhaust compression, air-box-air-flow, and many more details to get the Honda CBR250R ahead of the Kawasaki Ninja 250R in aftermarket parts.

And it works, if we compare how many aftermarket parts were available one month after the Kawasaki Ninja 250R and one month after the Honda CBR250R hit the market... The Honda CBR250R is clearly winning in aftermarket products.... Sure now-a-day, you can find lots of imported aftermarket products for the Ninja 250R "Kawasaki Thailand seems even be proud to charge extreme high prices, because it's imported", Honda Thailand has set its target to support the Thai production of aftermarket products.

Ridiculous. The first aftermarket part for the Ninja 250R was listed on 2fiddy.com 09 Apr 08. You stated that the Ninja was available 13 Aug 08 in Thailand. In fact there are 13 pages worth of mods there on that site that were out before the bike was released here in LOS!

Please provide a handful of links detailing all these aftermarket parts that you're claiming are out....

And while the Kawasaki Ninja 250R version of the Dynojet Power Commander asks you to disconnect the exhaust sensor, the modified Honda CBR250R system doesn't needs anything similar. With all sensors in place, including the exhaust sensor, the modified Honda PGM-FI system can actual sense incorrect fueling.

Do MotoGP bikes have Exhaust sensors and are they actively used, yes they are

Yes the power commander disconnects the lambda sensor and provides a false reading to the ECU. With accessories (wideband sensor) it does everything the stock ECU does, but better, and is easily removable....plus makes it really hard to get your warranty revoked.