Thai Govt Bowing To PAD Pressure May Be A Big Mistake

[webfact]

BURNING ISSUE

Bowing to PAD pressure may be a big mistake

By Supalak Ganjanakhundee

The Nation

Settlement of the border dispute with Cambodia hit a critical point recently when Thailand’s chief of the Thai-Cambodian Joint Border Commission (JBC) Vasin Teeravechyan resigned.

His sudden departure is an indication that the Abhisit Vejjajiva government cannot fight the pressure from the nationalist People’s Alliance for Democracy (PAD) and is allowing this extremist group to dictate the direction the border demarcation deal takes.

Career diplomat Vasin quietly handed in his resignation on November 1, one day before the demarcation deal was to be debated in Parliament with PAD protests in the background.

“Resignation” is a very diplomatic and polite word to describe Vasin’s action. However, it is an open secret really that he was forced to step down because the hardline PAD was dissatisfied with his intellectual manner in dealing with the boundary issue.

Vasin started negotiating with Cambodia in 2008. As a professional and legal expert, he tried to de-politicise the issue, making it a technical problem that could be handled with legal instruments and modern geographic technology.

He explained that politicising the issue and making it nationalistic would only make things more complicated and create conflict.

Vasin led the JBC negotiation three times since 2008, and the outcome of the talks was pending Parliament consideration before the task could move ahead.

On November 2, conservative senator Khamnoon Sitthisamarn attacked Vasin in the Parliament debate, saying the diplomat’s attitude was more in favour of Cambodia and if he continued leading the JBC, Thailand risked losing territory.

Khamnoon accused Vasin of relying far too much on legal documents on the boundary demarcation that were signed over a century ago.

The senator and the PAD believe that the border with Cambodia, notably in the area adjacent to the temple of Preah Vihear, is clearly delineated by the watershed of the Dangrek mountain range, as mentioned in agreements between the then-Siamese government and France. They speak as if they know exactly where this watershed is.

According to them, France’s 1:200000-scale map, which indicates a border that is different from the 1907 Siam-Franco Treaty, is wrong or even fake.

Unfortunately, the International Court of Justice (ICJ) used this very map to rule that Preah Vihear is situated in a territory under the sovereignty of Cambodia.

To Khamnoon and PAD’s disappointment, the memorandum of understanding (MoU) on border demarcation signed with Cambodia in 2000 recognised the French map as a historical document for negotiations. They are now mounting pressure on Abhisit’s government to scrap this MoU.

Abhisit clearly is in a dilemma. He cannot make as quick a decision as he did on the other MoU signed in 2001 on a maritime deal during Thaksin Shinawatra’s time, because the 2000 MoU on land boundary was signed when the Democrat Party was in power and his mentor Chuan Leekpai was premier. On the other hand, he cannot fight PAD because this is the group that put him in power.

So, the only thing this well-educated premier can do is delay the JBC task, sacrifice Vasin and pave the way for PAD to propose its favourite to lead the JBC.

Abhisit and his crew look like they are going to make a mistake. They are eyeing a person to replace Vasin who lost the boundary battle in the ICJ nearly 50 years ago and knows nothing about the issue.

-- The Nation 2010-11-11

[Thai at Heart]

funny how in another thread, NGO's were told to shut up and contribute something to the country. Well here we have the PAD, (the nation's second most visible) NGO contributing very well the Thailand's international relations.

Vasin started negotiating with Cambodia in 2008. As a professional and legal expert, he tried to de-politicise the issue, making it a technical problem that could be handled with legal instruments and modern geographic technology.

Obviously they would prefer he used a jingoistic, emotional and nationlistic rationale for debating this issue.

On the other hand, he cannot fight PAD because this is the group that put him in power.

I am wondering if such a clearly worded statement/accusation such as this has ever been included in a Nation article before.

[Siripon]

The PAD are nothing these days, they were even criticized by Kasit recently over their border stance.

They served a vital role in the overthrow of Thaksin, but after that they lost many with their increasingly out of touch views.

The New Politics party is a joke as seen in the recent council elections.

[LomSak27]

I am wondering if such a clearly worded statement/accusation such as this has ever been included in a Nation article before.

No

[jayboy]

The PAD are nothing these days, they were even criticized by Kasit recently over their border stance.

They served a vital role in the overthrow of Thaksin, but after that they lost many with their increasingly out of touch views.

The New Politics party is a joke as seen in the recent council elections.

The PAD was always just an organization that while having some initial worthwhile even noble aims ultimately had its main significance in the elite interests that supported it and financed it.While it had some useful attack dog purpose (particularly the thuggish element in the yellow shirts) it flourished.When that need was less evident it was marginalised, sometimes in the case of its leadership (Sondhi) rather brutally.As you say the movement is quiescent now but I think it could be resuscitated again if the elite feels frightened or threatened by the inevitable - hopefully peaceful - shift in power balance.In other words a middle class movement with decent was aims subverted first by its disgusting quasi - fascist leadership and then by amart interests.I think the latter, given the appropriation of the proles by Thaksin, hoped the armed wing of the yellow shirts could mutate into some latter day version of the 1976 Red Gaurs.It didn't work out but its important to understand the amart will resort to violence without hesitation if their interests demand it, firstly through the army of course but simultaneously through civilian thugs.

[hammered]

The PAD are nothing these days, they were even criticized by Kasit recently over their border stance.

They served a vital role in the overthrow of Thaksin, but after that they lost many with their increasingly out of touch views.

The New Politics party is a joke as seen in the recent council elections.

The PAD was always just an organization that while having some initial worthwhile even noble aims ultimately had its main significance in the elite interests that supported it and financed it.While it had some useful attack dog purpose (particularly the thuggish element in the yellow shirts) it flourished.When that need was less evident it was marginalised, sometimes in the case of its leadership (Sondhi) rather brutally.As you say the movement is quiescent now but I think it could be resuscitated again if the elite feels frightened or threatened by the inevitable - hopefully peaceful - shift in power balance.In other words a middle class movement with decent was aims subverted first by its disgusting quasi - fascist leadership and then by amart interests.I think the latter, given the appropriation of the proles by Thaksin, hoped the armed wing of the yellow shirts could mutate into some latter day version of the 1976 Red Gaurs.It didn't work out but its important to understand the amart will resort to violence without hesitation if their interests demand it, firstly through the army of course but simultaneously through civilian thugs.

Also dont forget that when the Dems came to power many soft PAD supporters were contented. I think it woukld be hard for them to resucitate it as a middle class movement as things have changed and it is hard now to find many PAD supporters although the more working class ones are still around

Interesting aside but several ex-red gaur we know from the North are now red gaurds and it isnt because of any polticial awakening. Still I guess the yellow guards also included such people as rent a thug is usually from a limited group.

[jayboy]

Interesting aside but several ex-red gaur we know from the North are now red gaurds and it isnt because of any polticial awakening.

That's really intersting and is just another example of teaching one (me in this instance)not to underestimate the complexity and ironies which abound.

[ianbaggie]

"Red Guards" - isnt that Thaksin talk for murdering terrorists that fire grenades at people shopping and then deny they exist?

[LomSak27]

hammered, on 2010-11-11 10:21, said:

Interesting aside but several ex-red gaur we know from the North are now red gaurds and it isnt because of any polticial awakening.

Jayboy

That's really intersting and is just another example of teaching one (me in this instance)not to underestimate the complexity and ironies which abound

So are these ex red gaurs in their late 50's or pushing 70 ? Does someone wheel them around or do they shuffle?

[hammered]

hammered, on 2010-11-11 10:21, said:

Interesting aside but several ex-red gaur we know from the North are now red gaurds and it isnt because of any polticial awakening.

Jayboy

That's really intersting and is just another example of teaching one (me in this instance)not to underestimate the complexity and ironies which abound

So are these ex red gaurs in their late 50's or pushing 70 ? Does someone wheel them around or do they shuffle?

I dunno their exact ages (would guess late 50s early 60s) but the few we know, or more correctly the few that are known in the communities where we have family are more the organiser of small groups of younger guys. Nopt everyone in their late 50s or early 60s needs the old bathchair you know;) Whenever an event requires security or some heavies are needed they get a group of ten to twenty together. It is a fairly standard way people organize even security for entertainment or meetings outsode of poltics. What is interesting about it in this aspect is that they have worked during their careers for different poltical persuasions and yet without their own ideas changing. However, they do figure in local power structures (quite low down) and they do know local people, so I gues it makes sense to use them.

By the way, I am not saying all reds are paid, loonie rightists etc. Just that things are complex. I would also think that guards are going to not reflect the average person at a rally and a slong as they can protect, oragnise, defend and probably attack when required that organisers arent overly worried what their politics are. Having said that the CM51 group are as reactionary in their opinions as many harder yellow groups. I think it was Gramsci who said when you get periods of change unlikely and even unexpected alliances spring up and that things are not just cut and dried left and right. I probably dont do Gramsci justice there.

[SergeiY]

Interesting aside but several ex-red gaur we know from the North are now red gaurds and it isnt because of any polticial awakening.

That's really intersting and is just another example of teaching one (me in this instance)not to underestimate the complexity and ironies which abound.

these 1976 Red Gaurs where nothing else but a movement with the strongest loyalty to the King.

Anyway this thread is about the PAD. Funny how some people want to try to drag the red shirt into this, but they have nothing to do with it.

[geovalin]

The PAD are nothing these days, they were even criticized by Kasit recently over their border stance.

....

The New Politics party is a joke as seen in the recent council elections.

So why "nothing" does manage the country / give order to the PM in such sensitive issues.

BECAUSE THEY HAVE STRONG SUPPORT above the gvt: in the army and in the occult powers who, indeed, run the country...

These people WANT war and they'll have it.

[Roadman]

The PAD are nothing these days, they were even criticized by Kasit recently over their border stance.

....

The New Politics party is a joke as seen in the recent council elections.

So why "nothing" does manage the country / give order to the PM in such sensitive issues.

BECAUSE THEY HAVE STRONG SUPPORT above the gvt: in the army and in the occult powers who, indeed, run the country...

These people WANT war and they'll have it.

Woo Woo .. the occult's...woo woo, pibob's and all. Someone open the asylum doors? War is coming...woo, woo

[jonclark]

The PAD are nothing these days, they were even criticized by Kasit recently over their border stance.

....

The New Politics party is a joke as seen in the recent council elections.

So why "nothing" does manage the country / give order to the PM in such sensitive issues.

BECAUSE THEY HAVE STRONG SUPPORT above the gvt: in the army and in the occult powers who, indeed, run the country...

These people WANT war and they'll have it.

Woo Woo .. the occult's...woo woo, pibob's and all. Someone open the asylum doors? War is coming...woo, woo

:lol: Well said roadman

[asiawatcher]

"... Abhisit clearly is in a dilemma. He cannot make as quick a decision as he did on the other MoU signed in 2001 on a maritime deal during Thaksin Shinawatra’s time, because the 2000 MoU on land boundary was signed when the Democrat Party was in power and his mentor Chuan Leekpai was premier. On the other hand, he cannot fight PAD because this is the group that put him in power."

Since when is it up to the Premier to make this decision. What a ridiculous article. This border dispute will always be decided by outside third party courts.

[jayboy]

these 1976 Red Gaurs where nothing else but a movement with the strongest loyalty to the King.

Sometimes one just doesn't know where to begin, except to say perhaps "against stupidity, the Gods themselves struggle in vain"

[yellow1red1]

Interesting aside but several ex-red gaur we know from the North are now red gaurds and it isnt because of any polticial awakening.

That's really intersting and is just another example of teaching one (me in this instance)not to underestimate the complexity and ironies which abound.

these 1976 Red Gaurs where nothing else but a movement with the strongest loyalty to the King.

Anyway this thread is about the PAD. Funny how some people want to try to drag the red shirt into this, but they have nothing to do with it.

Supporters of red or yellow should be tested for brain wave activity.

Truth is stronger than censorship.

Bullets and jails can only slow down freedom.

Who kills the Press; loses the People.

Stampeding with Violence is not a Road to Justice.

Don't trust ANYbody who owns private jets.

[LomSak27]

Have no idea what you're talking about yellow1red1

But if that gibberish fails to deflect and confuse try

"All Roads lead to Munich"

[Siam Simon]

Related report, with photos, by Nick Nostitz here:

http://asiapacific.anu.edu.au/newmandala/2010/11/05/nick-nostitz-on-the-pad’s-third-coming/

The report (as always on this particular medium) has comments, including further input by Nick (as usual).