The Little Blue Book- Residency Registration

[df358]

I am on a yearly retirement visa and recently I brought a condo in Bangkok.

I have received 2 documents, the first one shows the ownership of the condo (I guess it is the deed), and the second one is a little dark blue booklet (slightly larger than the passport). I was told to go to a government office to add my name in this booklet. Would they add my name for someone who is on a yearly retirement visa? What is the benefits having my name on the blue book?

[doctormann]

I am on a yearly retirement visa and recently I brought a condo in Bangkok.

I have received 2 documents, the first one shows the ownership of the condo (I guess it is the deed), and the second one is a little dark blue booklet (slightly larger than the passport). I was told to go to a government office to add my name in this booklet. Would they add my name for someone who is on a yearly retirement visa? What is the benefits having my name on the blue book?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This sounds like it is your House Book, ot 'Tabien Baan'.

I believe that, in theory, everyone resident in Thailand (i.e. not just here for a holiday) should have their name entered in a Tabien Baan. However, there is a problem here because only persons of Thai nationality can have their names entered into the blue book. Company names (for companies set up to buy property) can however go in the book because the Company is, in theory, majority Thai owned.

I'm not 100% certain of the situation regarding condos. I own a house (through my Company) and the Company name is in the Tabien Baan - my name is not. I was told that I should obtain a special Tabien Baan for 'Farangs' - the yellow book -but my District Office (Banglamung) has been so obstructive about this that I have never finished the process. I was advised, subsequently, by a lawyer, that I dont need the yellow book anyway. At one time it would have been impossible to obtain a telephone, electricity etc. without it but now this only requires a non-O visa and a passport.

My knowledge here is a bit limited but no doubt someone will be able to tell you more.

DM

[Bobcat]

Yes, the blue book they gave you is the tabian baan. Unless you have permanent residence (PR), you will not be able to have your name put into the blue tabian baan book. However, as the previous poster mentions, there is a yellow tabian baan book for foreigners. Make sure you get your name into this book! Otherwise, if you sell your property in the future and at the time of sale you cannot show your name has been in a tabian baan (either yellow or blue) for at least one year before the sale date, you will have to pay 3.3% special business tax on the sale price - as opposed to 0.5% if you have your name in the tabian baan book for at least one year prior to the date of sale.

Cheers,

Bob

[Bobcat]

Also, just to clarify, the special business tax doesn't apply at all after you've held the property for 5 years.

[df358]

Also, just to clarify, the special business tax doesn't apply at all after you've held the property for 5 years.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thks for the info. Where would I get the yellow book? The khet office?

[doctormann]

Also, just to clarify, the special business tax doesn't apply at all after you've held the property for 5 years.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thks for the info. Where would I get the yellow book? The khet office?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You need to go to your district office, i.e the Amphur. Be prepared for a lot of bureaucratic hassle. You will need the usual photos, residence letter from immigration, passport / visa and anything else that you can think of. A bottle or two of JW Black may or may not help.

I'll be interested to hear how you get on. As I said previously, in my case the Banglamung Amphur have proved very obstructive. In addition to the documentation mentioned above I was asked to provide a translation of my passport, into Thai, notarised by the British Embassy and certified by the Thai Ministry of Foreign Affairs. Having provided that I was then required to provide the names of my parents' (dead for 40 years), translated into Thai.

Having provided all of this the Amphur then produced a two-page personal information form, all in Thai, which they said I had to fill in, in Thai, in handwriting. They categorically refused to fill out the form with me, which could have been done quite easily, I think. I ran the form past my lawyer who told me that it wanted information that the Amphur was not entitled to have and was akin to the sort of form that the police fill out when they are charging you with a serious offence! One question asked if I had ever been ordained as a Buddhist monk! I was advised to not provide the information and to let the application for the yellow book lapse, which I have done.

If you manage to succeed in your endeavour please PM me with the details - I might then try again.

Cheers

DM

[df358]

Also, just to clarify, the special business tax doesn't apply at all after you've held the property for 5 years.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thks for the info. Where would I get the yellow book? The khet office?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You need to go to your district office, i.e the Amphur. Be prepared for a lot of bureaucratic hassle. You will need the usual photos, residence letter from immigration, passport / visa and anything else that you can think of. A bottle or two of JW Black may or may not help.

I'll be interested to hear how you get on. As I said previously, in my case the Banglamung Amphur have proved very obstructive. In addition to the documentation mentioned above I was asked to provide a translation of my passport, into Thai, notarised by the British Embassy and certified by the Thai Ministry of Foreign Affairs. Having provided that I was then required to provide the names of my parents' (dead for 40 years), translated into Thai.

Having provided all of this the Amphur then produced a two-page personal information form, all in Thai, which they said I had to fill in, in Thai, in handwriting. They categorically refused to fill out the form with me, which could have been done quite easily, I think. I ran the form past my lawyer who told me that it wanted information that the Amphur was not entitled to have and was akin to the sort of form that the police fill out when they are charging you with a serious offence! One question asked if I had ever been ordained as a Buddhist monk! I was advised to not provide the information and to let the application for the yellow book lapse, which I have done.

If you manage to succeed in your endeavour please PM me with the details - I might then try again.

Cheers

DM

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hi DM,

I asked a Thai friend to call the Khet office. The procedure to get my name on a yellow book is similiar to what you described. I am not going to do it unless someone said it is important to have it done.

[Maestro]

Make sure you get your name into this book!  Otherwise, if you sell your property in the future and at the time of sale you cannot show your name has been in a tabian baan (either yellow or blue) for at least one year before the sale date, you will have to pay 3.3% special business tax on the sale price - as opposed to 0.5% if you have your name in the tabian baan book for at least one year prior to the date of sale. 

Also, just to clarify, the special business tax doesn't apply at all after you've held the property for 5 years.

Does the same special business tax apply to a Thai national when she sells a condo she owns?

[Firefan]

I found a very old thread here somewhere that mentioned that being (a foreigner) in the yellow book entitled one to a 30 Baht health care card? Anybody knows anything about that?

I am gonna pursue the yellow book tomorrow or monday and will bring (w. copies):

Passport/visa (non-em

Buy/selling contract

(above is the 2 only things my condo staff were told I needed but.....TIT...so:)

Also bringing:

Letter from embassy certifying my residence (1 wk old letter)

2 pictures (you never know..)

title deed

In addition my charming smile and polite (but limited) Thai language!

Wish me luck!

Cheers!

Edited August 25, 2005 by Firefan

[Maestro]

I am gonna pursue the yellow book tomorrow or monday and will bring (w. copies):

...

Wish me luck!

The best of luck to you!

Let's hear from you afterwards how it went.

[roiet]

I received my yellow tabian baan book today after a lot of bureaucratic hassle. Our small Amphur office asked for passport translation into Thai. I refused. Then they said another government office in Bangkok must do this. I refused. Then they said the Immigration must do all this. I refused and asked them to show my wife in which law book such instructions are written. Now things started moving swiftly: The law states that a falang with a long term visa is entitled to obtain a Tabian ban falang from Amphur offices.

Then I had to show the 90 day address confirmation from the immigration. They said its fake. Then they wanted an official Thai document to see my name in Thai. I showed them my marriage paper translated to Thai. All fine .

Bureaucratic hassle cut short pointing at the law.

[Firefan]

Some of the previous posters problems: name of parents (written in Thai) as well as ones OWN name in Thai is solved by the buying/selling contract (and title deed for own name too) as it contains BOTH. For people renting that is naturally a bit harder.

Cheers!

[sabaijai]

I received my yellow tabian baan book today after a lot of bureaucratic hassle. Our small Amphur office asked for passport translation into Thai. I refused. Then they said another government office in Bangkok must do this. I refused. Then they said the Immigration must do all this. I refused and asked them to show my wife in which law book such instructions are written. Now things started moving swiftly: The law states that a falang with a long term visa is entitled to obtain a Tabian ban falang from Amphur offices.

Then I had to show the 90 day  address confirmation from the immigration. They said its fake. Then they wanted an official Thai document to see my name in Thai. I showed them my marriage paper translated to Thai. All fine .

Bureaucratic hassle cut short pointing at the law.

I've used the same technique, i.e., pointing out the law, when I knew I was right, at the local (Chiang Mai) amphoe office, and it has worked for me as well.

I try not to 'refuse' to do anything, though, rather, politely ask 'Are you sure? Could you show me where it says this so that we can both be sure?' etc.

[Maestro]

I've used the same technique, i.e., pointing out the law, when I knew I was right, at the local (Chiang Mai) amphoe office, and it has worked for me as well.

I try not to 'refuse' to do anything, though, rather, politely ask 'Are you sure? Could you show me where it says this so that we can both be sure?' etc.

Unfortunately, the text of Thai laws are not available on the Internet but with the Prime Minister's flair for e-government it may yet happen. A good idea, in my opinion. Would whoever is going to have lunch with the PM next weave it into his/her conversation, please?

If anyone knows the exact title of the law in question, would he/she be so kind as to post it here? It could help others with the same problem.

[Bobcat]

Does the same special business tax apply to a Thai national when she sells a condo she owns?

Yes, this applies equally to foreigners and Thais - although it is easier for a Thai to get their name put into a tabian baan - as this thread shows.

[Maestro]

Does the same special business tax apply to a Thai national when she sells a condo she owns?

Yes, this applies equally to foreigners and Thais - although it is easier for a Thai to get their name put into a tabian baan - as this thread shows.

Thank you, that’s good to know.

My wife has a couple of condos in her name and we shall live in one of them. Once I go for the non-O, with subsequent extensions, I guess it will be helpful to show, as part of the supporting documents for the application for extension, my wife’s ownership of that condo with her name in the tabian baan.

Whether I get my own name into it, I do not care, although I may want to try if I should get in the mood, but that’s a long way down the road.

[samran]

Unfortunately, the text of Thai laws are not available on the Internet but with the Prime Minister's flair for e-government it may yet happen. A good idea, in my opinion. Would whoever is going to have lunch with the PM next weave it into his/her conversation, please? 

Had a word to Dr. T last night over quite beer.

Council of state website is the source for many laws in thailand.

http://internet.krisdika.go.th/home.jsp

[Maestro]

Council of state website is the source for many laws in thailand.

http://internet.krisdika.go.th/home.jsp

Thank you! I shall ask my wife to look at it and see if there is also the Cosmetics Act and possible subsequent Acts modifying it.

[samran]

The cosmetics act 1971 (ammendment) was watered down to allow big hair and shoulder pads as popularised by Imelda Marcos. This is not to be confused with the Khun Ying and yappy little mutt Act (1988) which allowed little sh*tty canines into the fresh food section of the supermarket.

[icecubes]

passport / visa and anything else that you can think of. A bottle or two of JW Black may or may not help.

With all due respect don?t give government employees inducements

There is enough corruption in this country with out us adding to it

Just stand your ground with the right paper work and be nice to them.

if you think a yellow book will help you .

[Sheryl]

Yes, the blue book they gave you is the tabian baan.  Unless you have permanent residence (PR), you will not be able to have your name put into the blue tabian baan book.  However, as the previous poster mentions, there is a yellow tabian baan book for foreigners.  Make sure you get your name into this book!  Otherwise, if you sell your property in the future and at the time of sale you cannot show your name has been in a tabian baan (either yellow or blue) for at least one year before the sale date, you will have to pay 3.3% special business tax on the sale price - as opposed to 0.5% if you have your name in the tabian baan book for at least one year prior to the date of sale. 

Cheers,

Bob

What is the yellow book called in Thai and how does one get it? No one in my ampur knows about it and I have endless problems over not being in a tabien baan. I have a retirement visa.

[Firefan]

Hi Sheryl,

What kind of problems is it giving you not to have the (yellow) book?

The officer I spoke with only refered to the yellow book as tabien bahn. So he used same name as for the blue.I have seen some posts here saying "tabien bahn farang".

Cheers!

[Phil Clark]

Yes, the blue book they gave you is the tabian baan.  Unless you have permanent residence (PR), you will not be able to have your name put into the blue tabian baan book.  However, as the previous poster mentions, there is a yellow tabian baan book for foreigners.  Make sure you get your name into this book!  Otherwise, if you sell your property in the future and at the time of sale you cannot show your name has been in a tabian baan (either yellow or blue) for at least one year before the sale date, you will have to pay 3.3% special business tax on the sale price - as opposed to 0.5% if you have your name in the tabian baan book for at least one year prior to the date of sale. 

Cheers,

Bob

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Bob,

Do you have a specific reference to the Thai Tax legislation that spells out this rule? I have recently spoken with two Thai lawyers who both claimed that the 3.3% business tax in the first five years applies regardless of who or who is not in the Tabian Baan. They said it was only to do with the legal ownership.

I obviously want to be absolutely clear on this before I go through the hassle of getting a yellow book and can assure you it is absolutely nothing to do with wanting to prove the lawyers wrong...

[Bobcat]

Well, I can assure you that the lawyers are totally wrong. Most Thai lawyers are clueless. I have just been through the entire process with the Land Department, and have reviewed all of the relevant laws and regulations in detail. I can assure you that if your name is in a tabian baan for one year prior to selling your apartment (and assuming you are selling within 5 years), you only need to pay 0.5%. I urge you to contact the Land Department and ask for copies of the relevant laws and regulations.

[Phil Clark]

Well, I can assure you that the lawyers are totally wrong.  Most Thai lawyers are clueless.  I have just been through the entire process with the Land Department, and have reviewed all of the relevant laws and regulations in detail.  I can assure you that if your name is in a tabian baan for one year prior to selling your apartment (and assuming you are selling within 5 years), you only need to pay 0.5%.  I urge you to contact the Land Department and ask for copies of the relevant laws and regulations.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks Bob.

I have actually been to the Land Office in Pattaya and was given short shrift. The best I could get out of them was to go to City Hall.

As you have already reviewed all of the relevant laws and regulations in detail, could you please provide me with a reference that I can quote? At least I will then have a base from which to start.

Thanks