Was I Ripped Off?

[BangTaoBoy]

He was basically charged the equivilant of the average national days wage in Thailand, for a 2 minute job.

Many people seem willing to repeatedly pay more than the national minimum wage for the services of Thais for far shorter time than a full days work.

Why do people keep making reference to the Thai minimum wage??

If you want to pay the Thai minimum wage, employ a Thai person!!

What a business owner charges you, and what he pays his staff, is completely irrelevent.

If a business is charging more than you want to pay, don't use it, it's as simple as that.

Oh, that's right, he was too stupid to ask the price first, so now he's trying to blame everybody else.

[ScubaBuddha]

As a previous poster mentioned, I thought the charge of liabel could only be acted upon if you were publicly stating false information about a business or individual.

That is the general definition of the term, but this is not so in Thailand. All that needs to be proved is that money was lost due to the negative comment/claim. Remember, Thailand is a developing country with a developing legal system which is different than what we might be used to. The separation between criminal and civil courts is not as delineated here. Laws are written and then interpreted by judges, which then becomes case law, just as back home, but judges are fallible and can be easily influenced in Thailand. Read much Thai news and you will see Thai's use libel suits against each other in order to advance their personal agenda just as they do the Les Mageste laws. IMO this is why the libel laws are the way they are in Thailand.

I thought it was only libelous if it was not true.

Does that include the written press and radio, if it does then doesn't that seems like a type of censorship?

Are you really surprised that censorship exists in this, a developing country?

What is the difference between "name and shame" and hotel, restaurant, cafe, bar, nightclub etc etc - "REVIEWS" which are all on TV and everywhere over the internet?

Actually, because of the laws in Thailand, reviewers have in fact gotten into trouble in Thailand. Talk to any reviewer in Thailand and they will be very well aware of the libel/slander laws in Thailand.

And elsewhere on Thaivisa you will see negative reviews of restaurants allowed to stay if they seem like reasonable observations.

[thaiwanderer]

I'm struggling to see how Thailand's legal system is developing rather than merely being different from other legal systems (in one sense all legal systems are developing, though civil versions like Thailand's are actually more fully formed and less developing by definition - but anyhow I don't think that was what Scubbabuddha meant by 'developing' anyway).

Edited January 8, 2011 by thaiwanderer

[NamKangMan]

As a previous poster mentioned, I thought the charge of liabel could only be acted upon if you were publicly stating false information about a business or individual.

That is the general definition of the term, but this is not so in Thailand. All that needs to be proved is that money was lost due to the negative comment/claim. Remember, Thailand is a developing country with a developing legal system which is different than what we might be used to. The separation between criminal and civil courts is not as delineated here. Laws are written and then interpreted by judges, which then becomes case law, just as back home, but judges are fallible and can be easily influenced in Thailand. Read much Thai news and you will see Thai's use libel suits against each other in order to advance their personal agenda just as they do the Les Mageste laws. IMO this is why the libel laws are the way they are in Thailand.

I thought it was only libelous if it was not true.

Does that include the written press and radio, if it does then doesn't that seems like a type of censorship?

Are you really surprised that censorship exists in this, a developing country?

What is the difference between "name and shame" and hotel, restaurant, cafe, bar, nightclub etc etc - "REVIEWS" which are all on TV and everywhere over the internet?

Actually, because of the laws in Thailand, reviewers have in fact gotten into trouble in Thailand. Talk to any reviewer in Thailand and they will be very well aware of the libel/slander laws in Thailand.

And elsewhere on Thaivisa you will see negative reviews of restaurants allowed to stay if they seem like reasonable observations.

Sorry, I forgot. Just be a good farang, be overcharged for everything with a smile, spend your money, and when it runs out, go home. :)

Edited January 8, 2011 by NamKangMan

[Benjie]

The guy who fixed your car obviously doesn't work every minute of the day fixing fuses, probably does a few jobs like that a day.

Besides the shop and/or business has overheads to pay.

$6.50 is pretty cheap for a fuse and labour to fix it, it took 2 minutes this time it could take 30 minutes next time.

There's so much more to it that it seems infantile to suggest "I got charged X for 2 minutes work therefore he must have a weekly wage of X times 1200"

[jocko]

Why is naming and shaming banned, if we can post things and places that are of good value to OP's why can we not warn the same OP's about places that charge to much or have poor quality services, which is most places. I thought that was the whole point of a forum and yes I was born yesterday!

:angry:Spot on my friend i have posted on here about rip off's and the next thing you are accused of Thai bashing and go back to where you come from, nothing could be further from the truth i love this place with all it's faults i have traveled the world in my job and worked in mostly shit places and i know there is good and bad everywhere i think and hope that forums should be like standing in the pub talking and if you can help someone you will ,but even in the pub you get some bumholes

Yes you where ripped off, but as its legal to charge any price for any service and you forgot to ask the price before job started, you had it comming :lol:

Naming and shaming is against Forum rules, and the shop owner can claim you for major amount, so please dont tell us the name or location of this shop

Honda maindealer service is cheap, isnt it

[Kernow86]

The guy who fixed your car obviously doesn't work every minute of the day fixing fuses, probably does a few jobs like that a day.

Besides the shop and/or business has overheads to pay.

$6.50 is pretty cheap for a fuse and labour to fix it, it took 2 minutes this time it could take 30 minutes next time.

There's so much more to it that it seems infantile to suggest "I got charged X for 2 minutes work therefore he must have a weekly wage of X times 1200"

Who cares how much it is in $'s? We are in Thailand the currency is THB.

[katabeachbum]

Why is naming and shaming banned, if we can post things and places that are of good value to OP's why can we not warn the same OP's about places that charge to much or have poor quality services, which is most places. I thought that was the whole point of a forum and yes I was born yesterday!

:angry:Spot on my friend i have posted on here about rip off's and the next thing you are accused of Thai bashing and go back to where you come from, nothing could be further from the truth i love this place with all it's faults i have traveled the world in my job and worked in mostly shit places and i know there is good and bad everywhere i think and hope that forums should be like standing in the pub talking and if you can help someone you will ,but even in the pub you get some bumholes

Yes you where ripped off, but as its legal to charge any price for any service and you forgot to ask the price before job started, you had it comming :lol:

Naming and shaming is against Forum rules, and the shop owner can claim you for major amount, so please dont tell us the name or location of this shop

Honda maindealer service is cheap, isnt it

Naming and shaming is important for Thais, and thus have strict laws with unlimited financial liability and up to one year inprisonment for namer and shamer. As visitors or foreign residents in this country, we must respect that. Thus it is against Forum rules.

As long as shops/business/persons name and exact location is not mentioned, negative critics can usually be posted and accepted as not in breach of law.

[thaiwanderer]

Naming and shaming is important for Thais, and thus have strict laws with unlimited financial liability and up to one year inprisonment for namer and shamer. As visitors or foreign residents in this country, we must respect that. Thus it is against Forum rules.

As long as shops/business/persons name and exact location is not mentioned, negative critics can usually be posted and accepted as not in breach of law.

Although opely stating someone is a muderer is apparently fair comment.

Not a discussion on forum rules, merely an observation.

[katabeachbum]

Naming and shaming is important for Thais, and thus have strict laws with unlimited financial liability and up to one year inprisonment for namer and shamer. As visitors or foreign residents in this country, we must respect that. Thus it is against Forum rules.

As long as shops/business/persons name and exact location is not mentioned, negative critics can usually be posted and accepted as not in breach of law.

Although opely stating someone is a muderer is apparently fair comment.

Not a discussion on forum rules, merely an observation.

When Police has issued a warrant or made an arrest, it is Thai culture to go public with accuseds name, age, origin and photo. Law allows it as it in publics interest to be aware. When its been published by mainstream media, it can be posted on TV

[LivinLOS]

When its been published by mainstream media, it can be posted on TV

Just to ask then, why a picture, taken from MSM, that identified people in the case, was removed for this exact reason ??

This isnt a mod comment.. More a clarification of the rules as thats different to what your explaining.

[thaiwanderer]

Naming and shaming is important for Thais, and thus have strict laws with unlimited financial liability and up to one year inprisonment for namer and shamer. As visitors or foreign residents in this country, we must respect that. Thus it is against Forum rules.

As long as shops/business/persons name and exact location is not mentioned, negative critics can usually be posted and accepted as not in breach of law.

Although opely stating someone is a muderer is apparently fair comment.

Not a discussion on forum rules, merely an observation.

When Police has issued a warrant or made an arrest, it is Thai culture to go public with accuseds name, age, origin and photo. Law allows it as it in publics interest to be aware. When its been published by mainstream media, it can be posted on TV

I won't attempt to derail this thread or criticise moderation but there is a world of difference between stating someone has been accused / warrant issued etc and the member comments that were made on a recent farang on farang alleged murder.

Intuitively strange that such comments were allowed but identifying a business that someone feels aggrevied about over tiny issues is such a no-no.

I will bear this in mind in the future.

[Wallaby]

Why do people keep making reference to the Thai minimum wage??

If you want to pay the Thai minimum wage, employ a Thai person!!

What a business owner charges you, and what he pays his staff, is completely irrelevent.

If a business is charging more than you want to pay, don't use it, it's as simple as that.

Oh, that's right, he was too stupid to ask the price first, so now he's trying to blame everybody else.

Oh I get it, because he doesn't ask a price beforehand it is ok to be overcharged. Hell, they should have asked for 10,000 baht then, and it wouldn't be considered overcharging.

[jdinasia]

Here we go again

Take a car in the UK for the same problem and expect a bill of at least 50 pounds. Here 4 pounds or around 2500 baht against 200 baht yet people still think they are being ripped off <deleted>!!!!

Either learn to change a fuse yourself or count yourself lucky you are not having to get the same thing done back home.

Its raining !

I think you're missing the point. HONDA where one would normally expect to be the most expensive was 79B, a quick and friendly job done along with a glass of water and a comfortable seat. The problem with people like you is that you don't know the value of the Baht, hence why many Thai people think farangs are stupid.I should have known better than to warn anyone on this forum, it ALWAYS brings out posters like you.

Ummm if you didn't ask "how much?" first then the Thais might be right about farang

[Wavefloater]

Here we go again

Take a car in the UK for the same problem and expect a bill of at least 50 pounds. Here 4 pounds or around 2500 baht against 200 baht yet people still think they are being ripped off <deleted>!!!!

Either learn to change a fuse yourself or count yourself lucky you are not having to get the same thing done back home.

Its raining !

I think you're missing the point. HONDA where one would normally expect to be the most expensive was 79B, a quick and friendly job done along with a glass of water and a comfortable seat. The problem with people like you is that you don't know the value of the Baht, hence why many Thai people think farangs are stupid.I should have known better than to warn anyone on this forum, it ALWAYS brings out posters like you.

I agree that these constant comparisons to the rip-off prices charged in Britland, Europe, and NA are annoying and ridiculous. People are basically saying, "Hey, we get gouged so badly in our home countries that you should just pay whatever price a Thai tells you to pay and be happy.

Perhaps those types of replies come from Phuket businessmen who know that bilking customers is the norm for what is the most overrated island in the world, and they hate it when people actually want some reasonable value for their money. So, whenever somebody complains about being ripped-off, they start their barrage of insults, claiming the OP must be a very mean (cheap) person.

Anyway, you were obviously ripped off, but I hope you learned the lesson that YOU SHOULD ALWAYS ASK "HOW MUCH?" IN THAILAND BEFORE COMMITTING TO A PURCHASE OF GOODS OR SERVICES.

[stevenl]

I agree that these constant comparisons to the rip-off prices charged in Britland, Europe, and NA are annoying and ridiculous. People are basically saying, "Hey, we get gouged so badly in our home countries that you should just pay whatever price a Thai tells you to pay and be happy.

Perhaps those types of replies come from Phuket businessmen who know that bilking customers is the norm for what is the most overrated island in the world, and they hate it when people actually want some reasonable value for their money. So, whenever somebody complains about being ripped-off, they start their barrage of insults, claiming the OP must be a very mean (cheap) person.

Anyway, you were obviously ripped off, but I hope you learned the lesson that YOU SHOULD ALWAYS ASK "HOW MUCH?" IN THAILAND BEFORE COMMITTING TO A PURCHASE OF GOODS OR SERVICES.

Are you so angry you feel it necessary to shout at the whole world?

Bilking customers the norm? The most overrated island in the world?

[kropotkin]

We all are in Thailand because it is cheap.

Few exeptions.

Farang culture asumes the people we deal with are fare and honest - we would not cheat foreigners, just because they are foreigners that do not know the score.

Few exeptions.

19th century vs 21st century.

[BangTaoBoy]

We all are in Thailand because it is cheap.

Few exeptions.

Farang culture asumes the people we deal with are fare and honest - we would not cheat foreigners, just because they are foreigners that do not know the score.

Few exeptions.

19th century vs 21st century.

Whose Farang culture assumes that? Mine doesn't. You obviously grew up in a better town than me!

Across the board, I believe Thai people are more honest, decent, family oriented people than the average English person.

You people who think you know Thai people because you've been on holiday to Patong for a couple of months, and read a few stories about JJ the jet ski thug, crack me up.

How many Thai people do you know personally 'Kropotkin'? How many times a day do you interact with normal every day Thais?

The bloke was a fool, not to ask the price before the job was done, simple as that.

[Benjie]

The guy who fixed your car obviously doesn't work every minute of the day fixing fuses, probably does a few jobs like that a day.

Besides the shop and/or business has overheads to pay.

$6.50 is pretty cheap for a fuse and labour to fix it, it took 2 minutes this time it could take 30 minutes next time.

There's so much more to it that it seems infantile to suggest "I got charged X for 2 minutes work therefore he must have a weekly wage of X times 1200"

Who cares how much it is in s? We are in Thailand the currency is THB.

Not sure if you are aware of this but you can actually change money into different currencies.

So it's 250 baht, the price of lunch - Doesn't sound expensive for labour and parts to fix your car if you ask me.

If you are able to do it yourself and your time is worth less than that then why not simply do so, or complain at the time instead of going on the internet and whining after the fact.

[kropotkin]

We all are in Thailand because it is cheap.

Few exeptions.

Farang culture asumes the people we deal with are fare and honest - we would not cheat foreigners, just because they are foreigners that do not know the score.

Few exeptions.

19th century vs 21st century.

Whose Farang culture assumes that? Mine doesn't. You obviously grew up in a better town than me!

Across the board, I believe Thai people are more honest, decent, family oriented people than the average English person.

You people who think you know Thai people because you've been on holiday to Patong for a couple of months, and read a few stories about JJ the jet ski thug, crack me up.

How many Thai people do you know personally 'Kropotkin'? How many times a day do you interact with normal every day Thais?

The bloke was a fool, not to ask the price before the job was done, simple as that.

I see your point, but you are talking to the wrong person.

We live in Chanthaburi, no farangs around.

I interact exclusively with thai - mostly pleasant people.

But i hate having to ask prices first.

Forget to ask, and you pay more.

Even my thai wife gets overcharged when she forgets to ask the price first.

Because she is married to a farang.

She gets more upset about being overcharged then me.

I strongly resent that you call someone a FOOL for not asking the price first.

Asking the price first is - in my culture - an expression of distrust, and is considered rude.

At least when everyday, small purchases are concerned.

And i am not talking about sexpat areas - i have never been there, and i couldn't care less if foreigners get overcharged there.

[LivinLOS]

Whose Farang culture assumes that? Mine doesn't. You obviously grew up in a better town than me!

Well mine does, and we came from the same country I believe..

Right now theres a Thai girl living in my mums house in UK.. She goes about her life not asking prices, paying exactly the same as the locals, to my knowledge no one, not once has given her a dud price, under delivered on a single promise, or short cut a deal. She recieves the salary she was promised to recieve, hasnt paid for any fake licenses or fines, etc etc.

Compare that the the style of life I have, or even the regularity of times my own Thai wife gets ripped off, theres no comparison. The times my wife started a job and then got paid about 2/3rds the promised pay after the month was worked, or had a the cost of uniforms deducted without telling her it would be, or one of multiple reasons why she never, not one, got paid what was promised.

Its the Thai way.

Across the board, I believe Thai people are more honest, decent, family oriented people than the average English person.

And I believe that comment is totally false. Truth is honesty, and Thais dont have a problem with saying things totally untrue, for face, for profit, for many reasons.. How many women do you know who would rather be drinking and partying than raise their own kids, and how many in the uk palm them off on grandma.. And please dont give me the 'poor things, they need to do it to support the child' <deleted>.. They do it because it easier than other work, because its 'sanuk' and getting pissed with your mates is easier than working in a factory.. Because they can have the latest cellphone and motorbike (otherwise please expalin uni girls from middle class families hooking for a new iPhone).. 9 from 10 times thats the case.

Family oriented !! Their kids are usually 1000 kms from them !!

How many Thai people do you know personally 'Kropotkin'? How many times a day do you interact with normal every day Thais?

100's.. 1000's.. A decade full time on the island.. And you ?? Still in the RTG phase I guess.

Edited January 13, 2011 by LivinLOS

[LivinLOS]

The bloke was a fool, not to ask the price before the job was done, simple as that.

Surely living among these 'more honest' people thats unnecessary, its certainly not necessary in my home country where they are apparently 'less honest', yet you call him a fool for not doing it..

Why is it necessary if they are so honest ??

[stevenl]

Knock it off the 2 of you, again ruining a thread.

[LivinLOS]

Knock it off the 2 of you, again ruining a thread.

Fair enough, tho it IS a thread on scams and honesty (over pennies tho, I mean its a fuse for a couple hundred baht, hardly a biggie).

But maintaining Thailand is more honest, while at the same time calling anyone that isnt hyper vigilant and on their guard (petrol stations also) a fool, just doesnt fit. In Thailand scams and rip off are commonplace, honesty (telling the truth) is less so, I see that as just a fact, its not something to gnash and wail about, its just a reality you need to deal with. Claiming otherwise seems dishonest to me and hence I call it.

Edited January 13, 2011 by LivinLOS

[Wavefloater]

<br />

I agree that these constant comparisons to the rip-off prices charged in Britland, Europe, and NA are annoying and ridiculous. People are basically saying, "Hey, we get gouged so badly in our home countries that you should just pay whatever price a Thai tells you to pay and be happy. <br /><br />Perhaps those types of replies come from Phuket businessmen who know that bilking customers is the norm for what is the most overrated island in the world, and they hate it when people actually want some reasonable value for their money. So, whenever somebody complains about being ripped-off, they start their barrage of insults, claiming the OP must be a very mean (cheap) person.<br /><br />Anyway, you were obviously ripped off, but I hope you learned the lesson that YOU SHOULD ALWAYS ASK "HOW MUCH?" IN THAILAND BEFORE COMMITTING TO A PURCHASE OF GOODS OR SERVICES.<br />

<br />Are you so angry you feel it necessary to shout at the whole world?<br /><br />Bilking customers the norm? The most overrated island in the world?<br />

<br /><br /><br />

Not at all angry, but very sorry to learn that Thaivisa is the whole world for you. That really is quite sad. You have my sympathy.

I was just making sure that people got that message loud and clear, which is especially important when one is on Scam Island (aka Phuket). And yes, IMO it is extremely overrated.

[stevenl]

It is not easy , submitting a normal post without <br>, />, shouting, insults, etc.

[BangTaoBoy]

I see your point, but you are talking to the wrong person.

We live in Chanthaburi, no farangs around.

I interact exclusively with thai - mostly pleasant people.

But i hate having to ask prices first.

Forget to ask, and you pay more.

Even my thai wife gets overcharged when she forgets to ask the price first.

Because she is married to a farang.

She gets more upset about being overcharged then me.

I strongly resent that you call someone a FOOL for not asking the price first.

Asking the price first is - in my culture - an expression of distrust, and is considered rude.

At least when everyday, small purchases are concerned.

And i am not talking about sexpat areas - i have never been there, and i couldn't care less if foreigners get overcharged there.

If that's the case then you should know better than most, than to label Thai people as a whole, as being from the 19th century, and by default be programmed to try and steel money!!

If you know every day people, you will know full well that isn't the case, and it's normally people with less experience in this country than you, that talk such rubbish.

As for asking the price first, being a sign of distrust?? I don't get that logic. If you don't ask first, how do you know weather the service is good value for money or weather you should go to a different company down the road. To me that is automatic, everyday protocol when buying something.

If I as an English man, rolled in to a garage in a tourist area of the US, do you really think it would be beyond them to whack the price of a couple of beers on top of the cost? If you do then you are very naive.

[BangTaoBoy]

Knock it off the 2 of you, again ruining a thread.

What are you talking about?

My last two posts were aimed at 'Kropotkin' and were very much on topic. I haven't discussed anything with 'LivinLOS' (Yet).

As it happens 'LivinLOS' reply was also on topic, as the ethics of Thai people is what the OP was calling in to question, so if it's all the same to you, I think I will reply to it, and if you don't want to read it, I suggest you look for the little down arrow key on your keyboard, and scroll past.

[BangTaoBoy]

And I believe that comment is totally false. Truth is honesty, and Thais dont have a problem with saying things totally untrue, for face, for profit, for many reasons.. How many women do you know who would rather be drinking and partying than raise their own kids, and how many in the uk palm them off on grandma.. And please dont give me the 'poor things, they need to do it to support the child' &lt;deleted&gt;.. They do it because it easier than other work, because its 'sanuk' and getting pissed with your mates is easier than working in a factory.. Because they can have the latest cellphone and motorbike (otherwise please expalin uni girls from middle class families hooking for a new iPhone).. 9 from 10 times thats the case.

Family oriented !! Their kids are usually 1000 kms from them !!

How many Thai people do you know personally 'Kropotkin'? How many times a day do you interact with normal every day Thais?

100's.. 1000's.. A decade full time on the island.. And you ?? Still in the RTG phase I guess.

Firstly, it is quite clear for most to see, that the name right before the question mark is 'Kropotkin', which means the question was addressed to him. We all know you have millions of friends. I'm sure you know 3/4 of CM already!

So this Thai girl in the UK, and yourself, would happily walk in to a garage that you've never been in to before, ask for a new gear box, and then walk out without asking how much it's going to cost? You then come back the next day waving your cash about, knowing that you'll be happy with the price when they hand you the invoice? And you're a self titled entrepreneur ?? That's no way to do business I assure you.

How does anybody on this thread know how much that company would have charged if the OP asked the price first? They may well have quoted the exact same price, which means he wasn't ripped off at all, he just didn't ask the price first.

You then write a paragraph in response to my comment on every day Thai people, entirely about prostitutes!! If that doesn't sum up my point perfectly I don't know what does. Those factories that the bar girls are too lazy to work in, who's in them then. They must be empty?? Those factories are full to the brim with young parents, men and women, who are grafting every day in a &lt;deleted&gt; job, so they can afford to take care of their children. That will often mean kids being left with grand parents, or whole extended families, moving to live together in BKK. I'm talking about every day normal Thais, and you're talking about bar girls, need I say more. It's the same mentality that people use when they use the word Phuket when they mean the word Patong.

The people at that garage did nothing worse than any other garage would have done, anywhere else in the world, but people who know nothing about anything will jump all over it, and take the moral high ground.

Finally, as for your RTG phase comment. As I have said before, I have been married for a decade. That means normal life, normal Thai people for ten years. How much of the ten years you spent on Phuket was in a stable relationship, and how much of it was in bars and clubs, mixing with the kind of people that you now constantly refer to? Lots of people on this forum have been in long healthy relationships, and have lived on Phuket happily for long periods of time. Surely they would be in the best position to discuss Phuket and Thai people? No of course not, silly me, it's the people who don't live in Phuket because they don't like it, and the people who think all girls are bar girls!

[F1fanatic]

And I believe that comment is totally false. Truth is honesty, and Thais dont have a problem with saying things totally untrue, for face, for profit, for many reasons.. How many women do you know who would rather be drinking and partying than raise their own kids, and how many in the uk palm them off on grandma.. And please dont give me the 'poor things, they need to do it to support the child' &lt;deleted&gt;.. They do it because it easier than other work, because its 'sanuk' and getting pissed with your mates is easier than working in a factory.. Because they can have the latest cellphone and motorbike (otherwise please expalin uni girls from middle class families hooking for a new iPhone).. 9 from 10 times thats the case.

Family oriented !! Their kids are usually 1000 kms from them !!

How many Thai people do you know personally 'Kropotkin'? How many times a day do you interact with normal every day Thais?

100's.. 1000's.. A decade full time on the island.. And you ?? Still in the RTG phase I guess.

Firstly, it is quite clear for most to see, that the name right before the question mark is 'Kropotkin', which means the question was addressed to him. We all know you have millions of friends. I'm sure you know 3/4 of CM already!

So this Thai girl in the UK, and yourself, would happily walk in to a garage that you've never been in to before, ask for a new gear box, and then walk out without asking how much it's going to cost? You then come back the next day waving your cash about, knowing that you'll be happy with the price when they hand you the invoice? And you're a self titled entrepreneur ?? That's no way to do business I assure you.

How does anybody on this thread know how much that company would have charged if the OP asked the price first? They may well have quoted the exact same price, which means he wasn't ripped off at all, he just didn't ask the price first.

You then write a paragraph in response to my comment on every day Thai people, entirely about prostitutes!! If that doesn't sum up my point perfectly I don't know what does. Those factories that the bar girls are too lazy to work in, who's in them then. They must be empty?? Those factories are full to the brim with young parents, men and women, who are grafting every day in a &lt;deleted&gt; job, so they can afford to take care of their children. That will often mean kids being left with grand parents, or whole extended families, moving to live together in BKK. I'm talking about every day normal Thais, and you're talking about bar girls, need I say more. It's the same mentality that people use when they use the word Phuket when they mean the word Patong.

The people at that garage did nothing worse than any other garage would have done, anywhere else in the world, but people who know nothing about anything will jump all over it, and take the moral high ground.

Finally, as for your RTG phase comment. As I have said before, I have been married for a decade. That means normal life, normal Thai people for ten years. How much of the ten years you spent on Phuket was in a stable relationship, and how much of it was in bars and clubs, mixing with the kind of people that you now constantly refer to? Lots of people on this forum have been in long healthy relationships, and have lived on Phuket happily for long periods of time. Surely they would be in the best position to discuss Phuket and Thai people? No of course not, silly me, it's the people who don't live in Phuket because they don't like it, and the people who think all girls are bar girls!

Yes, anybody working in a factory would abandon their kids to their parents...

Not the point of this post though - the OP may have been 'ripped off', but its to be expected.

Admittedly I've only lived here for coming up to 5 years, but I know better than to believe that I'll get the same deal as a Thai.

BUT, there are times we are v lucky and follow friends and find local people that provide a good service at a reasonable price.