Thailand Rejects UN Visit To Temple In Cambodia Rift

[webfact]

Thailand rejects UN visit to temple in Cambodia rift

BANGKOK, February 10, 2011 (AFP) - Thailand opposes a proposed visit by the world heritage body UNESCO to inspect an ancient temple at the centre of a deadly border dispute with Cambodia, a government official said Thursday.

"Because of the current situation at the border, we believe that a UNESCO mission now would not be appropriate and could complicate the issue," said Thai foreign ministry spokesman Thani Thongphakdi.

"But if UNESCO wishes to visit the temple, it should seek the approval of Thailand as the mission would have to go through areas which are under our sovereignty," he told AFP.

The 11th-century Preah Vihear temple, built to honour the Hindu god Shiva, has been a source of contention between Thailand and Cambodia since it was granted UN World Heritage status in July 2008.

The World Court ruled in 1962 that the clifftop structure belonged to Cambodia but both countries claim ownership of a 4.6-square-kilometre (1.8-square-mile) surrounding area.

Cambodia said on Sunday that a wing of the temple had collapsed due to Thai artillery shelling.

An AFP photographer who visited the site following four days of cross-border shelling in the area said that shrapnel and artillery fire appeared to have scarred the temple but no major structural damage was visible.

UNESCO said Tuesday that it was planning a mission to the area "as soon as possible" to assess the state of the temple, the most celebrated example of ancient Khmer architecture outside of Cambodia's Angkor Wat.

Thai Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva blamed the UN World Heritage Committee for causing the dispute by making the temple a world heritage site, suggesting Thailand would like to see it stripped of its status.

He said the clashes occurred because Cambodia wanted the area around the Preah Vihear to be cleared of Thai troops so it could submit its plan for managing the temple to UNESCO.

"I think today the World Heritage committee is fully aware of the problem they have created so they should play role in tackling the problem," he said.

-- (c) Copyright AFP 2011-02-10

[WhySoSerious]

Thailand seems to be intent on undermining its own case.

[Buchholz]

Meanwhile...

UNESCO has canceled its plan to send its inspection team.

-- Tan Network 2011-02-10

[Asa]

There isn't a photo show shelling damages. only small bullet holes suggesting small arm shooting from within. Never mind that, but why UN and its ESCO want to go there and rush the listing of the Shrine for Cambodia to take over 4.6 KM2 which is inside Thai territory.

[webfact]

Reuters News Footage Shows Preah Vihear Safe from Clashes

Follow this link:

[SomTumTiger]

Reuters News Footage Shows Preah Vihear Safe from Clashes

Follow this link: http://www.thaivisa....ost__p__4209512

Yet another Hun Sen "exaggeration"? i.e. lie What a shocking development....not

[Nisa]

UNESCO said Tuesday that it was planning a mission to the area "as soon as possible" to assess the state of the temple, the most celebrated example of ancient Khmer architecture outside of Cambodia's

LOL -- kind of a funny way to put a quote because certainly UNESCO doesn't believe the temple is "outside Cambodia"

[jayboy]

Thailand seems to be intent on undermining its own case.

Does it have one outside the deranged nationalists and their cynical military allies?

So far the Thais have refused any kind of independent scrutiny.Clearly the Thaksinite precept "The UN is not my father" lives on in the minds of these PAD creeps (I suppose I should be more forgiving to the army of Sino-Thai grannies that follow Sondhi around).Actually if I was Sondhi I would be buckling on my armour proof underware again: the elite don't like yellows out of control any more than the reds.And poor little Abhisit, on whom I have a slight crush, has made himself look rather a fool playing to different audiences.A word of advice Mark when you're dealing with useless tossers you have to call them out.And as for fatty Kasit I suppose his antics on this issue have at least provided a modicum of amusement

[Chang_paarp]

I wonder what Thailand has to hide??

[Robby nz]

Was wondering about the UNESCO visit and how Hun Sen would handle things.

He has publicly stated that a wing of the temple has been destroyed by Thai fire.

However reports seem to show this is not the case.

So if UNESCO turned up and and there was no damage as stated by Hun Sen that would make him into either a lier or badly missinformed.

With his son being in charge on the ground it should not be the latter.

Would it be beyond him to blow up a bit of it to save face?

Was also thinking there should somewhere be satalite photos of all that is going on, or isnt it important enough for that?

[Felt 35]

Thai Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva blamed the UN World Heritage Committee for causing the dispute by making the temple a world heritage site

Again and now the PM

[ballpoint]

I wonder what Thailand has to hide??

What indeed has Thailand got to hide? Up till a few years ago you could walk through the disputed land to visit the temple. At its approach you would have found Thai and Cambodian stall holders selling snacks, drinks and general junk. Happy times for all. Then Cambodia does a back room deal with Noppadom, the temple is declared a World Heritage Site, Cambodia gets upset by the Thais selling of goods near it, declares itself to be the sole owner of the disputed land, threatens to shoot any Thai who goes near the border, threatens to mobilise artilliary and tanks and then makes allegations of "serious damage" done to the temple, and the use of cluster munitions, by Thailand. Now they have been caught out using the temple as a firing base from which to attack Thailand. All the while a bunch of people, for whatever reason, who have never been near the temple in their lives, have never seen the previous co-operation between the local Thai and Cambodian populations, and wouldn't even know how to get to the temple from either side of the border, are trying to glorify Hun Sen and his "military experience", when, truth be told, the mass slaughter of millions of defenceless people by bamboo staves, exhaustion, starvation and other acts of extreme cowardly brutality can in no way be classed as war, but rather genocide. Cambodia has far more to hide than Thailand.

[stepenwolf1958]

Was wondering about the UNESCO visit and how Hun Sen would handle things.

He has publicly stated that a wing of the temple has been destroyed by Thai fire.

However reports seem to show this is not the case.

So if UNESCO turned up and and there was no damage as stated by Hun Sen that would make him into either a lier or badly missinformed.

With his son being in charge on the ground it should not be the latter.

Would it be beyond him to blow up a bit of it to save face?

Was also thinking there should somewhere be satalite photos of all that is going on, or isnt it important enough for that?

You said:"He has publicly stated that a wing of the temple has been destroyed by Thai fire."

Yes it's true and his statement is CONFIRMED by Thai commander. He admited Thai side made it and he gave some explanation why. It was published. How come you missed it?

[DP25]

"But if UNESCO wishes to visit the temple, it should seek the approval of Thailand as the mission would have to go through areas which are under our sovereignty," he told AFP.

Not exactly true. If Cambodia has a working helicopter, they could use that.

[stepenwolf1958]

Was wondering about the UNESCO visit and how Hun Sen would handle things.

Why bother? So far, Cambodians winning in diplomatic battle. He has no need to handle anything now.

He has publicly stated that a wing of the temple has been destroyed by Thai fire.

And Thais field admit it. Published in Bangkok Post. A few days ago.

However reports seem to show this is not the case.

In your dream. Read above.

So if UNESCO turned up and and there was no damage as stated by Hun Sen that would make him into either a lier or badly missinformed.

That man is anything you say but not misinformed.

With his son being in charge on the ground it should not be the latter.

Would it be beyond him to blow up a bit of it to save face?

Very true, some one will lose the face but if you ask me, that will not be him.

Was also thinking there should somewhere be satalite photos of all that is going on, or isnt it important enough for that?

No need for satellite, as Thais admit all of it.

P.S. Is this your part time job here? Are you well paid for to be on that side, even when something is so obvious?

[stepenwolf1958]

"But if UNESCO wishes to visit the temple, it should seek the approval of Thailand as the mission would have to go through areas which are under our sovereignty," he told AFP.

Not exactly true. If Cambodia has a working helicopter, they could use that.

Of course you are right. But after so much arrogant attitude, to reject International body in helping mission, i would not be surprised that helicopter some one open fire to it.

Absurd situation as some one is incapable(or don't want to)to solve problem but rejecting help of UN body. Incredible.

[whybother]

Was wondering about the UNESCO visit and how Hun Sen would handle things.

Why bother? So far, Cambodians winning in diplomatic battle. He has no need to handle anything now.

He has publicly stated that a wing of the temple has been destroyed by Thai fire.

And Thais field admit it. Published in Bangkok Post. A few days ago.

However reports seem to show this is not the case.

In your dream. Read above.

So if UNESCO turned up and and there was no damage as stated by Hun Sen that would make him into either a lier or badly missinformed.

That man is anything you say but not misinformed.

With his son being in charge on the ground it should not be the latter.

Would it be beyond him to blow up a bit of it to save face?

Very true, some one will lose the face but if you ask me, that will not be him.

Was also thinking there should somewhere be satalite photos of all that is going on, or isnt it important enough for that?

No need for satellite, as Thais admit all of it.

P.S. Is this your part time job here? Are you well paid for to be on that side, even when something is so obvious?

Given that Cambodia is saying that the temple was extensively damaged, but independent sources are saying that there is only minor damage, and Cambodia is saying that they don't have any military around the temple, but independent sources are showing Cambodian military camped IN the temple area, I would think that Cambodia would be having trouble with the diplomatic battle.

[whybother]

Thailand seems to be intent on undermining its own case.

Does it have one outside the deranged nationalists and their cynical military allies?

So far the Thais have refused any kind of independent scrutiny.Clearly the Thaksinite precept "The UN is not my father" lives on in the minds of these PAD creeps (I suppose I should be more forgiving to the army of Sino-Thai grannies that follow Sondhi around).Actually if I was Sondhi I would be buckling on my armour proof underware again: the elite don't like yellows out of control any more than the reds.And poor little Abhisit, on whom I have a slight crush, has made himself look rather a fool playing to different audiences.A word of advice Mark when you're dealing with useless tossers you have to call them out.And as for fatty Kasit I suppose his antics on this issue have at least provided a modicum of amusement

The Thais have said there should be bilateral talks. ASEAN agrees.

[stepenwolf1958]

Was wondering about the UNESCO visit and how Hun Sen would handle things.

Why bother? So far, Cambodians winning in diplomatic battle. He has no need to handle anything now.

He has publicly stated that a wing of the temple has been destroyed by Thai fire.

And Thais field admit it. Published in Bangkok Post. A few days ago.

However reports seem to show this is not the case.

In your dream. Read above.

So if UNESCO turned up and and there was no damage as stated by Hun Sen that would make him into either a lier or badly missinformed.

That man is anything you say but not misinformed.

With his son being in charge on the ground it should not be the latter.

Would it be beyond him to blow up a bit of it to save face?

Very true, some one will lose the face but if you ask me, that will not be him.

Was also thinking there should somewhere be satalite photos of all that is going on, or isnt it important enough for that?

No need for satellite, as Thais admit all of it.

P.S. Is this your part time job here? Are you well paid for to be on that side, even when something is so obvious?

Given that Cambodia is saying that the temple was extensively damaged, but independent sources are saying that there is only minor damage, and Cambodia is saying that they don't have any military around the temple, but independent sources are showing Cambodian military camped IN the temple area, I would think that Cambodia would be having trouble with the diplomatic battle.

I can agree with all you said but the fact is Thais admit they bombed, ruined one side of temple. The reason they said was as Cambodians stationed troops in that wing from where they opened fire and i believe that.But it is out of the question now, Thais bombed temple or not. Statement is given by Chief Commander and it is published in Bangkok Post.

Cambodians winning in diplomatic battle so far, and you know that might to change easily. Thais became silly as on Monday they sent a letter to UN with complaining and on Thursday they rejected Commission, body of UN which should to investigate about all and to report to Secretary General so he could know steps to help to Thais about their complain. That is why i said Cambodians winning in diplomacy but also to remind you Cambodians complained to UN on Saturday-Thais was slower and di it on Monday. Also, i am not some expert about International Law but i don't think UN nations in peace keeping missions should to ask any allowance from any government in this world, so what Thais told about it, sounds so arrogant. I hope i wrong.

[Buchholz]

I can agree with all you said but the fact is Thais admit they bombed, ruined one side of temple. The reason they said was as Cambodians stationed troops in that wing from where they opened fire and i believe that.But it is out of the question now, Thais bombed temple or not. Statement is given by Chief Commander and it is published in Bangkok Post.

A review of all temple articles reported in the Bangkok Post since Feb. 1, 2011 failed to reveal any article as you describe.

Could you please provide the name of the "Chief Commander" or some other identifying information to help locate it?

Or if possible, just PM the link to me, please.

Thank you.

[whybother]

I can agree with all you said but the fact is Thais admit they bombed, ruined one side of temple. The reason they said was as Cambodians stationed troops in that wing from where they opened fire and i believe that.But it is out of the question now, Thais bombed temple or not. Statement is given by Chief Commander and it is published in Bangkok Post.

Cambodians winning in diplomatic battle so far, and you know that might to change easily. Thais became silly as on Monday they sent a letter to UN with complaining and on Thursday they rejected Commission, body of UN which should to investigate about all and to report to Secretary General so he could know steps to help to Thais about their complain. That is why i said Cambodians winning in diplomacy but also to remind you Cambodians complained to UN on Saturday-Thais was slower and di it on Monday. Also, i am not some expert about International Law but i don't think UN nations in peace keeping missions should to ask any allowance from any government in this world, so what Thais told about it, sounds so arrogant. I hope i wrong.

I haven't been able to find a Bangkok Post article showing that. Can you please PM me a link (I know you are not allowed to post a link, but there is no problem with a PM)?

The Cambodians DID complain to the UN before the Thais. But does that show anything? Especially since in their complaints, they talk about an extensively damaged temple and no Cambodian troops in the temple, but independent media report that both are not true.

Edited February 10, 2011 by whybother

[whybother]

I can agree with all you said but the fact is Thais admit they bombed, ruined one side of temple. The reason they said was as Cambodians stationed troops in that wing from where they opened fire and i believe that.But it is out of the question now, Thais bombed temple or not. Statement is given by Chief Commander and it is published in Bangkok Post.

A review of all temple articles reported in the Bangkok Post since Feb. 1, 2011 failed to reveal any article as you describe.

Could you please provide the name of the "Chief Commander" or some other identifying information to help locate it?

Or if possible, just PM the link to me, please.

Thank you.

Thanks. I am sure your searching abilities are better than mine, but I couldn't find anything either.

[MikeOboe57]

Maybe it is this commander?

"A wing of our Preah Vihear Temple has collapsed as a direct result of the Thai artillery bombardment," a commander based near the 900-year-old temple was quoted as saying by Cambodia's Press and Quick Reaction Unit (PRU) of the Office of the Council of Ministers. "The Thai army began shooting at us first, we are taking self- defense and retaliatory measures, now," the commander said, stressing that the Thais had not honored the ceasefire of Saturday.

PRU did not give the name of the commander.

The commander also said that the Thai army has used gas shell as they fired 130 mm artillery rounds at Cambodian soldiers.

Source: link

There are a few more, just search "temple damaged by thailand"

As the above commander states that "the Thai army began shooting at us first [...]" one can safely assume that he is not belonging to the Thai army.

edit: typo

Edited February 10, 2011 by MikeOboe57

[stepenwolf1958]

I can agree with all you said but the fact is Thais admit they bombed, ruined one side of temple. The reason they said was as Cambodians stationed troops in that wing from where they opened fire and i believe that.But it is out of the question now, Thais bombed temple or not. Statement is given by Chief Commander and it is published in Bangkok Post.

A review of all temple articles reported in the Bangkok Post since Feb. 1, 2011 failed to reveal any article as you describe.

Could you please provide the name of the "Chief Commander" or some other identifying information to help locate it?

Or if possible, just PM the link to me, please.

Thank you.

Thanks. I am sure your searching abilities are better than mine, but I couldn't find anything either.

Yes, today i will find this, or this weekend and i will scan that page even, so we all can see

[GeorgeO]

UNESCO said Tuesday that it was planning a mission to the area "as soon as possible" to assess the state of the temple, the most celebrated example of ancient Khmer architecture outside of Cambodia's

LOL -- kind of a funny way to put a quote because certainly UNESCO doesn't believe the temple is "outside Cambodia"

You try to make your point by quoting only part of the full sentence.

"outside of Cambodia's Ankor Wat" simply means located elsewhere.

[whybother]

Maybe it is this commander?

"A wing of our Preah Vihear Temple has collapsed as a direct result of the Thai artillery bombardment," a commander based near the 900-year-old temple was quoted as saying by Cambodia's Press and Quick Reaction Unit (PRU) of the Office of the Council of Ministers. "The Thai army began shooting at us first, we are taking self- defense and retaliatory measures, now," the commander said, stressing that the Thais had not honored the ceasefire of Saturday.

PRU did not give the name of the commander.

The commander also said that the Thai army has used gas shell as they fired 130 mm artillery rounds at Cambodian soldiers.

Source: link

There are a few more, just search "temple damaged by thailand"

As the above commander states that "the Thai army began shooting at us first [...]" one can safely assume that he is not belonging to the Thai army.

edit: typo

That isn't the "Thais admit[ting that] they bombed, ruined one side of temple".

@stepenwolf - much appreciated

Edited February 11, 2011 by whybother

[Nisa]

UNESCO said Tuesday that it was planning a mission to the area "as soon as possible" to assess the state of the temple, the most celebrated example of ancient Khmer architecture outside of Cambodia's

LOL -- kind of a funny way to put a quote because certainly UNESCO doesn't believe the temple is "outside Cambodia"

You try to make your point by quoting only part of the full sentence.

"outside of Cambodia's Ankor Wat" simply means located elsewhere.

Actually the rest of the wording wasn't there when I posted that. The last word in the OP was "Cambodia's" .... I assumed the " 's" was a typo.

[DP25]

I can agree with all you said but the fact is Thais admit they bombed, ruined one side of temple. The reason they said was as Cambodians stationed troops in that wing from where they opened fire and i believe that.But it is out of the question now, Thais bombed temple or not. Statement is given by Chief Commander and it is published in Bangkok Post.

A review of all temple articles reported in the Bangkok Post since Feb. 1, 2011 failed to reveal any article as you describe.

Could you please provide the name of the "Chief Commander" or some other identifying information to help locate it?

Or if possible, just PM the link to me, please.

Thank you.

Thanks. I am sure your searching abilities are better than mine, but I couldn't find anything either.

Yes, today i will find this, or this weekend and i will scan that page even, so we all can see

It's irrelevant even if you can find it, as he would have only been commenting based on the info given by the Cambodians, who were the only ones in the temple at the time. It turns out the Cambodians were lying about the damage, the temple is not ruined, as is now clear.

[animatic]

Fog of war made foggier by vested interests and propaganda as sources of information. if UNESCO comes in then both sides propaganda is shown for what it is, hard to corral nationalist ferver if journalists have access to actual facts.

[Insight]

If anybody has any sites showing damage to any part of Cambodia in this recent "war" please share them. Have seen enough evidence from various media sources and blogs of damage in Thailand (this one caught my attention recently) and it would be nice to have some perspective on this issue.