Yingluck Dismisses Photo Of Her With Fugitive Red Shirt Arisman

[random]

A Nation Multimedia Group reporter remembered joining a cowboy party in Nakhon Ratchasima's Khao Yai Resort two years ago and said Arisman was trying to persuade Yingluck to dance with him.

and your point is??

If I am in a bar and trying to persuade a woman to go home with me does that mean we are together??? If I stop a woman from falling by reaching out and grabbing her while someone takes a picture does that mean we are together??

But the main thing you supposedly educated men keep missing is that at this point he was not even wanted for any offences so quite what you hope to achieve is beyond me, surely the fact she is the sister of Thailand biggest ever criminal (if some of you are to be believed) holds more sway than her refusing to dance with a guy at a party 2 years ago, before said man had committed any offences.

If some of you can not see this (I am sure you can and I can smell the desperation as you try to spin this, and tbh it is sad to see this) then I dispair for you and your hatred will just drag you down and down and down over the next few years as you fester with hatred.

I am saying that your characterizations of that event do not match the story. "Unsuspecting woman" seems to be a tactic you have now dropped. It isn't a "bar" it was a function. She isn't a random (pun intended) person and neither is he.

and you think because they know each other and are at the same function then she must have been expecting him to walk up behind her and grab him?/

How heinous, wow, two people share a joke, one is 2 years away from leading a political party (unbeknown to her) and one is 2 months away from getting involved in a bit of a kerfuffle

neither are wanted for crimes, both are enjoying a social event, both are married and probably there with there spouses, and some small mided bigots try to find fault 2 years later and in desperation try to use it for political gain, then when it is clear they are fighting a losing battle try and hint at things more sinister between the two people.

Shame on you and shame on the others so desperate to cast doubt on the future PM based on an innocent thing 2 years ago, if only you can see how ridiculous you are being right now i am sure as an educated man you will hang your head in shame.

Clearly the dems are worried, and rightly so.

[random]

and you know she didn't think it was her husband standing behind her?? and you know she was not angry when she discovered it was not her husband?? and you are now an expert on Thais and their mentality?? a picture is a moment in time, it is a split second, it can be misconstrued quite easily by the hard of thinking>

come on, be a man and admit just what you were hinting at. and at the end of the day it matters not one jot, as has been explained many times he was not even involved in crime at that tiime so its a little sad and desperate when we have grown men casting insinuations on an innocent women, the next P<M of the country we live in.

i think that is what hurts you most, you can not get at her politically so you have to resort to gutter press tactics

what a bunch of sad individuals inhabit this forum

With respect, you seem to be hard of reading.

You keep on with this be a man nonsense and admit what you were hinting, when i have been very clear about what i think the photo hints at - and that is a close relationship. How close, i have no idea. Neither do you. Stop getting your knickers in a twist. People see a photo like this, they speculate. I dare say, if there was a photo released tomorrow with Abhisit playfully tugging at Sondhi's wife's arms on the dance floor of some Bangkok nighclub, you too might offer some speculation of your own, don't you think?

not at all, but then again I am not a small minded bigot that needs to try and score political brownie points over a simply innocent event.

And as I have already pointed out, it does not hint at a close relationship, I have pictures of myself with people I hardly know showing more closeness than this picture, sadly the closeness is in your mind, not based in fact. i see a woman with her back to someone that has just walked over and grabbed her arms, she is polite, she smiles as she pulls away, i am sure the next picture will show this. isnt it amazing how 2 people can see 2 very different things, one based on desperation to smear someone, the other based on common sense.

[random]

Right gym time, I will leave the dems in the thread to continue their smear campaign

play nicely now.

[rixalex]

edit: what are normal thai social customs and interactions?? I don't buy into this nonsense, when people talk like this I just point out that girls down cowboy are also Thai, are you saying they are not normal Thai, what is normal Thai, who decides? you? based on your prejudice??

Normal Thai social customs and interactions do not include those between a hooker and a john down on Cowboy. How could you possibly think otherwise? Do you realise what you are saying? - That having your crotch squeezed is a normal Thai social custom! Not saying i wouldn't enjoy that, but sadly it has yet to catch on outside of the red light districts. The country isn't perfect.

[rixalex]

not at all, but then again I am not a small minded bigot that needs to try and score political brownie points over a simply innocent event.

You seem confused about the meaning of bigotry

And as I have already pointed out, it does not hint at a close relationship, I have pictures of myself with people I hardly know showing more closeness than this picture,

Which is meaningless as you are not Thai, and as i have already stated, Thai customs differ from Western ones.

she smiles as she pulls away, i am sure the next picture will show this. isnt it amazing how 2 people can see 2 very different things, one based on desperation to smear someone, the other based on common sense.

You don't know what happens in the next picture, if there is one, and nor does anyone else apart from those present. It's called speculation. Live with it. It's part of life, and pretending that you are above it and have never done it, won't change that.

[Buchholz]

edit: what are normal thai social customs and interactions?? I don't buy into this nonsense, when people talk like this I just point out that girls down cowboy are also Thai, are you saying they are not normal Thai, what is normal Thai, who decides? you? based on your prejudice??

Normal Thai social customs and interactions do not include those between a hooker and a john down on Cowboy. How could you possibly think otherwise? Do you realise what you are saying?

As said earlier.... glaringly apparent.

Perspective certainly becomes abundantly clear when the realm of individual experiences focuses on Soi Cowboy. It's hopeless to try and point out other aspects of society to those with such limited experiences outside the bar girl environment.

.

Edited June 17, 2011 by Buchholz

[samurai]

Here's the point i was making. Normal Thai reaction to that situation you describe of grabbing a respectable woman would not elicit the response of a polite smile, nor indeed as in the photo, a rolling back of the head in seeming pleasure. The response rather would be a frosty one of "what are you doing touching me?- stop it". Perhaps not everyone here is that familiar with normal Thai social customs and interactions.

[Buchholz]

Here's the point i was making. Normal Thai reaction to that situation you describe of grabbing a respectable woman would not elicit the response of a polite smile, nor indeed as in the photo, a rolling back of the head in seeming pleasure. The response rather would be a frosty one of "what are you doing touching me?- stop it". Perhaps not everyone here is that familiar with normal Thai social customs and interactions.

are other posters seeing this for the above images?

[OzMick]

Familiarity breeds contempt.

Or is it guilt by association.

Certainly in most countries being seen in the company of a wanted terrorist would be an election killer photo.

He looks a bit too familier with her.

And she seems unworried about his overtly friendly hands on her. Particularly in ' not show physical affection publicly Thailand'. If you don't want inferences to be made, explain it, don't fall silent.

2 years ago and Arisaman was involved in the 1st set of Songkran riots and attempts at insurrection.

The photo is said to be made in February 2009 when k. Arisman was still reasonably respectable.

2 months later and he would be arrested for violating Article 116 of the Criminal Code by inciting insurrection by encouraging red-shirt protesters to seize Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva.

So i should avoid people at parties in case they decide to do something 2 months in the future

Some of you need to get a grip of yourselves, some of the straw clutching in here is embarrassing to be honest

Depends on what type of parties you go to. I'm sure k. Arisman was a really gentle soul, quietly spoken and well behaved before, he drank that potion and turning into a raving anarchist.

[rixalex]

Again, this goes back to being familiar with Thai social customs. A woman touching or hugging a man, as in the second picture, would be seen by many Thais, i think, as being quite innocent. If positions were reversed, and it was Abhisit with his arms around a seated woman, that would appear quite differently. Same goes if in the image above, Abhsisit didn't have his hands in his lap, but rather bent back behind his body and touching the woman - that would be odd let's say.

Explaining nuances of normal Thai customs can be hard. You really need to experience it his first hand. My working environment is 95% Thai, and a good percentage of that is female. Some can be quite tactile, and were i a fresh arrival, i might think it normal and natural to be tactile back. It is not. Men touching women has a very different connotation to women touching men.

As for the first photo, it's a bit difficult to see what is going on here. The finger touching is unusual i would say, but the fact that their bodies are a couple of metres apart, i think makes reading any more into it difficult.

Edited to add: Of course another factor when reading body language is age of respective individuals. This is true of all cultures i think. An old woman hugging a man young enough to be her son might be more likely to look like motherly love than romantic affection. If two parties are similar in age, the appearance of the situation changes. Anyway, none of this is really rocket science, is it?

Edited June 17, 2011 by rixalex

[OzMick]

From Wiki: A straw man is a component of an argument and is an informal fallacy based on misrepresentation of an opponent's position.^[1] To "attack a straw man" is to create the illusion of having refuted a proposition by substituting it with a superficially similar yet unequivalent proposition (the "straw man"), and refuting it, without ever having actually refuted the original position.

^{http://www.nizkor.or.../straw-man.html}

Description of Straw Man^{The Straw Man fallacy is committed when a person simply ignores a person's actual}

• Person A has position X.
• Person B presents position Y (which is a distorted version of X).
• Person B attacks position Y.
• Therefore X is false/incorrect/flawed.

This sort of "reasoning" is fallacious because attacking a distorted version of a position simply does not constitute an attack on the position itself. One might as well expect an attack on a poor drawing of a person to hurt the person.

......................................................

So by trying to twist the argument to theoretically and incorrectly, resemble someone else's positions, and equating them to the original post out of actual context, it is a strawman argument.

A better example would be when Yingluk was recently cleared by the SEC, and all the usual red trumpets started cheering. In fact, she was cleared of breaking SEC regs, not of perjury or conspiracy to defraud issues that arose from the case.

[chuang]

The photo is said to be made in February 2009 when k. Arisman was still reasonably respectable.

The Ahbisit government is grapping at straws...

[OzMick]

Go to a Thai night club and the guys are all over the women, no different at this level, probably less respect for women.

Might I suggest, that if you tried to grab Ms Shinawatra in the same way, somebody would quite probably shoot you.

[OzMick]

Well i guess you don't make habit of going round grabbing unsuspecting women and then have some idiots use it 2 years later totally out of context to try and score some brownie points in an election in which you have fallen way behind,

Now how about my other question about what you are intimating in your other post??

You are making statements that just aren't in the story, Random. Nothing said "unsuspecting" ... and she looks FAR from uncomfortable. The picture suggests the opposite to me. It suggests that they know each other and that they are having fun. Other people will read into it what they may, but it is obviously relevant in light of who the two people are (and his wife's position on the party-list).

However an independent reporter from the Nation that was there says otherwise and says exactly what happened, but I guess you know best considering you were not even there

A picture is worth a 1,000 words, even more when they are your words repeated in finitum ad nauseum. Still working on "blanket" are we?

[Lite Beer]

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[Buchholz]

Again, this goes back to being familiar with Thai social customs. A woman touching or hugging a man, as in the second picture, would be seen by many Thais, i think, as being quite innocent. If positions were reversed, and it was Abhisit with his arms around a seated woman, that would appear quite differently. Same goes if in the image above, Abhsisit didn't have his hands in his lap, but rather bent back behind his body and touching the woman - that would be odd let's say.

Explaining nuances of normal Thai customs can be hard. You really need to experience it his first hand. My working environment is 95% Thai, and a good percentage of that is female. Some can be quite tactile, and were i a fresh arrival, i might think it normal and natural to be tactile back. It is not. Men touching women has a very different connotation to women touching men.

As for the first photo, it's a bit difficult to see what is going on here. The finger touching is unusual i would say, but the fact that their bodies are a couple of metres apart, i think makes reading any more into it difficult.

Edited to add: Of course another factor when reading body language is age of respective individuals. This is true of all cultures i think. An old woman hugging a man young enough to be her son might be more likely to look like motherly love than romantic affection. If two parties are similar in age, the appearance of the situation changes. Anyway, none of this is really rocket science, is it?

Thank you for taking the time to point out what I had apparently mistaken for common knowledge amongst expats residing in Thailand.

I had earlier thought some were just playing a ficticious role in their responses, but it's becoming increasingly obvious that at least several posters truly do struggle tremendously to comprehend what is, in reality, the basics of a Thai 101-type introductory course.

Again, thanks for your patience to expounding for those less experienced. It really isn't rocket science.

.

Edited June 17, 2011 by Buchholz

[rixalex]

Thank you for taking the time to point out what I had apparently mistaken for common knowledge amongst expats residing in Thailand.

I had earlier thought some were just playing a ficticious role in their responses, but it's becoming increasingly obvious that at least several posters truly do struggle tremendously to comprehend what is, in reality, the basics of a Thai 101-type introductory course.

Again, thanks for your patience to expounding for those less experienced. It really isn't rocket science.

.

No problem.

I think you are right;.some people here clearly do genuinely have distorted ideas about what Thai social customs are... to the point where they would even get indignant at the idea that social customs and ettiquettes in evidence down in Patpong, Cowboy or wherever, not be considered normal Thai behaviour.

I mean, come on, behaviour in these areas is so not Thai, it really is beyond comprehension that anyone living here for any length of time could think that, unless of course they spent all their time totally immersed in that environment. Hard to imagine but it's the only explanation i can think of.

[lanna2011]

The photo is said to be made in February 2009 when k. Arisman was still reasonably respectable.

The Ahbisit government is grapping at straws...

sign of abstract fear - digging up an old photo - what about all the photos of Ghadafi with top USA officials in the past? and Mugabe? - grasping at straws as you say

[rixalex]

sign of abstract fear - digging up an old photo - what about all the photos of Ghadafi with top USA officials in the past? and Mugabe? - grasping at straws as you say

And do you not think those people photographed with Ghadafi are now looking a bit silly and like they lacked some good judgement?

[samurai]

Thank you for taking the time to point out what I had apparently mistaken for common knowledge amongst expats residing in Thailand.

I had earlier thought some were just playing a ficticious role in their responses, but it's becoming increasingly obvious that at least several posters truly do struggle tremendously to comprehend what is, in reality, the basics of a Thai 101-type introductory course.

Again, thanks for your patience to expounding for those less experienced. It really isn't rocket science.

.

No problem.

I think you are right;.some people here clearly do genuinely have distorted ideas about what Thai social customs are... to the point where they would even get indignant at the idea that social customs and ettiquettes in evidence down in Patpong, Cowboy or wherever, not be considered normal Thai behaviour.

I mean, come on, behaviour in these areas is so not Thai, it really is beyond comprehension that anyone living here for any length of time could think that, unless of course they spent all their time totally immersed in that environment. Hard to imagine but it's the only explanation i can think of.

OMG & a capital F. Is that all true? I didn't knew that.

Will she now lose the election? :blink:

[samurai]

He looks a bit too familier with her.

And she seems unworried about his overtly friendly hands on her. Particularly in ' not show physical affection publicly Thailand'. If you don't want inferences to be made, explain it, don't fall silent.

Missing in the photo and the article commentary is any mention of Yingluck's husband or Arisaman's wife at said Pheu Thai Party cowboy party.

.

[Who, me ?]

He looks a bit too familier with her.

And she seems unworried about his overtly friendly hands on her. Particularly in ' not show physical affection publicly Thailand'. If you don't want inferences to be made, explain it, don't fall silent.

Missing in the photo and the article commentary is any mention of Yingluck's husband or Arisaman's wife at said Pheu Thai Party cowboy party.

.

Really?? Photoshopped??? How can it be? Yingluck did not deny this pictures being actually taken ....

[jdinasia]

sign of abstract fear - digging up an old photo - what about all the photos of Ghadafi with top USA officials in the past? and Mugabe? - grasping at straws as you say

And do you not think those people photographed with Ghadafi are now looking a bit silly and like they lacked some good judgement?

Why would they, if it was in the performance of official duties? Then again a political rally at Khao Yai .........

[rixalex]

sign of abstract fear - digging up an old photo - what about all the photos of Ghadafi with top USA officials in the past? and Mugabe? - grasping at straws as you say

And do you not think those people photographed with Ghadafi are now looking a bit silly and like they lacked some good judgement?

Why would they, if it was in the performance of official duties? Then again a political rally at Khao Yai .........

That's a point, although i would personally question why their official duties put them in that position in the first place... but anyway, we digress.

[lannarebirth]

The Dems are really desperate now aren't they. This really is no news and as usual Yingluck has dealt with it in the appropriate manner.

You are So right. I remember seeing pics of Obama hanging out with the Unabomber. The other party was like, WHOA, that ain't right!. But I was just thinking hey, what's the matter with two dudes chillin out together. Haters gonna hate. Am I right?

[rixalex]

OMG & a capital F. Is that all true? I didn't knew that.

Will she now lose the election? :blink:

Well there you go, now you do knew that.

Will she now lose the election? I don't know, but if she does, doubt this photo will have anything to do with it.

[moobaan]

all this focus on a political rally 2 years ago where a lucky camera shot get's her? this is the stuff of the Dems tactics? talk about scrapping the barrel - they must be really, really worried - let it be - it's pathetic and strengthen's PT's support

[jdinasia]

all this focus on a political rally 2 years ago where a lucky camera shot get's her? this is the stuff of the Dems tactics? talk about scrapping the barrel - they must be really, really worried - let it be - it's pathetic and strengthen's PT's support

It's a News paper article --- not a Democrat poster story Is the background of a potential leader of the entire country relevant? You betcha!

[samurai]

all this focus on a political rally 2 years ago where a lucky camera shot get's her? this is the stuff of the Dems tactics? talk about scrapping the barrel - they must be really, really worried - let it be - it's pathetic and strengthen's PT's support

I am not sure if the Dems try to make anything of that photo. Just the soi-disant expert of the interwebs and the farang family man community might try that.

[mrtoad]

The Dems are really desperate now aren't they. This really is no news and as usual Yingluck has dealt with it in the appropriate manner.

You are So right. I remember seeing pics of Obama hanging out with the Unabomber. The other party was like, WHOA, that ain't right!. But I was just thinking hey, what's the matter with two dudes chillin out together. Haters gonna hate. Am I right?