Drinking Binges

[Baa_Mango]

Although I usually don't look at this website in general in that great of a light - this subforum seems to help lots of people and give them a chance to voice their thoughts.

I am a fairly young (26) year old guy, who has been studying and living in Thailand for a while, that last 4 or 5 years in Bangkok, as I finish my uni degree. I love to drink and party and all that although over the last 2 years I have slowed down a lot, been bored of the club scene etc. My problem is all about drinking.. I can go weeks with out drinking and most recently took a solid 30 days off drinking - it was easy. The problem I have is when I do drink I am a serious binger. I prefer liquor to beer and this probably doesn't help. My main issue seems to be control problems. I drink very fast and in very large amounts. I often black out or even just fall asleep (unconscious). I am quite lucky I have not even fought any one, been injured(seriously) or other things.. although I am fed up with my self now because making my loved ones worry about me and most recently losing my laptop. When i stopped drinking for a month I really didn't miss it, I saved money, I had more time to exercise and do sports, which I very much enjoy. I am not sure if the right way to go is to just try to NEVER drink again or what..mostly what it comes down to me is the situation.. If i am on a date with my gf and we have some wine or a few drinks each I am always in control.. sometimes drinking with my drinking friends things will get out of control.. like I am having too much fun or something like that. I don't know why but I also do things fast.. ie if I have a glass of water, I will drink it completely,and pour another one. If I buy an ice coffee I will finish it with in a minute or two.. I am also confused how people eat dinner and have their water or drink glass 90% full. I am just tired of my self waking up in strange places, wasting money, MAKING problems for my gf. When i am very drink I become very easy - I will talk to anyone, do pretty much anything or be up for anything. Sober I am a fairly laid back person, and almost even a lil bit introverted around strangers or people who aren't too close with me. I am thinking I need to pick the situations that I may drink in a bit more carefully.. I feel good that I am realizing this crazy and erratic behavior needs to be fixed.. If anyone gave me ideas or maybe something to read or try it would be much appreciated.

thanks

[GrahamF]

When I was in my twenties my drinking was very much like you describe yours. I would binge, yet I could also be in control if the situation warranted it, having only a few drinks and stopping if need be. Not that I wanted to stop but knew I had to. I also drink very quickly, whether it was booze or now non-alcoholic drinks. If someone had asked me then and perhaps my friends if I/they thought I was an alcoholic the answer would have been no. Looking back, with what I know now, I would answer yes. Needless to say, my drinking escalated over the years to the point where I ended up drinking 24/7 and ended up in a detox.

Many of my friends in AA, and I agree with them, will tell you that there was a point in their lives where they probably could have stopped drinking with little or no problems. Due to lack of knowledge and desire, we didn't. I think it's a good thing that you are asking questions now and recognizing that you may have a problem. Do I think your drinking will escalate as time goes on, I would have to say, yeah I think it will. You remind me of me and look where I ended up. If you do decide that you have a problem and stop drinking then realize that it is for good and there's no going back. Controlled drinking doesn't work for alcoholics. If you've got more questions I would suggest going to an AA meeting and talking to some of the people there. Just be honest with them about how you drink and how you feel when you drink.

Best of luck to you!

[RickThai]

Baa_mango;

I think most alcoholics walked (staggered) in your shoes when they were younger.

As you get older you will find it harder to quit for long periods of time, and easier to think up reasons why you should drink.

If you want to enjoy your drinking for a long time, stop all binge drinking. If you have a couple/three beers a week, you can probably drink well into your eighties (provided you don't have other health issues), but heavy drinking over decades will eventually come with a heavy price.

Best of luck with your decisions on drinking.

RickThai

[GrahamF]

Baa_mango;

I think most alcoholics walked (staggered) in your shoes when they were younger.

As you get older you will find it harder to quit for long periods of time, and easier to think up reasons why you should drink.

If you want to enjoy your drinking for a long time, stop all binge drinking. If you have a couple/three beers a week, you can probably drink well into your eighties (provided you don't have other health issues), but heavy drinking over decades will eventually come with a heavy price.

Best of luck with your decisions on drinking.

RickThai

Whoa nelly!!!! Come on Rick, you're actually encouraging a potential alcoholic to try controlled drinking???? Especially as the OP is only beginning to question if he has a problem. He needs some time away from booze and to perhaps hit a few AA meetings and talk to some alcoholics about their experiences and come to a rational decision about whether he wants to stop drinking or not. If he is an alcoholic, you and I both know that telling him that he can have "a couple/three beers a week" is the perfect excuse for him to convince himself he has no problem and to start drinking again, and we know where that will probably lead to in the end. Alcoholics can rationalize having a drink pretty darn well. Do you think you could stick to a course of controlled drinking, I know that it never worked for me. Shame on you Rick, especially as your the guy who's alive today because of a donor liver......You of all people should know better!

OP, go out and get some information about alcoholism. Go to some AA meetings and talk to some alcoholics, post some more questions here, surf the web, whatever. Whether or not you drink again is up to you, but please talk to some people before you do!

[cheynewalk]

At my age i way up the pros and cons of drinking. The only pro i could ever see is the social aspect and how alcohol enhanced those good times. Of course, when i was young this factor overwhelmed the negatives such as health risks, both mental and physical, relationships (although drinking did aid my sex life when i was younger) and the economic factor. Now i'm in my fifties i find the social aspect is diminshing in importance and i can go for longer periods without drinking, or even engage in similar social activities without drinking alcohol. In hindsight, though i had some great times on the booze and met some great people, i wish i'd never started and therefore didn't know what i was missing.

[RickThai]

Baa_mango;

I think most alcoholics walked (staggered) in your shoes when they were younger.

As you get older you will find it harder to quit for long periods of time, and easier to think up reasons why you should drink.

If you want to enjoy your drinking for a long time, stop all binge drinking. If you have a couple/three beers a week, you can probably drink well into your eighties (provided you don't have other health issues), but heavy drinking over decades will eventually come with a heavy price.

Best of luck with your decisions on drinking.

RickThai

Whoa nelly!!!! Come on Rick, you're actually encouraging a potential alcoholic to try controlled drinking???? Especially as the OP is only beginning to question if he has a problem. He needs some time away from booze and to perhaps hit a few AA meetings and talk to some alcoholics about their experiences and come to a rational decision about whether he wants to stop drinking or not. If he is an alcoholic, you and I both know that telling him that he can have "a couple/three beers a week" is the perfect excuse for him to convince himself he has no problem and to start drinking again, and we know where that will probably lead to in the end. Alcoholics can rationalize having a drink pretty darn well. Do you think you could stick to a course of controlled drinking, I know that it never worked for me. Shame on you Rick, especially as your the guy who's alive today because of a donor liver......You of all people should know better!

OP, go out and get some information about alcoholism. Go to some AA meetings and talk to some alcoholics, post some more questions here, surf the web, whatever. Whether or not you drink again is up to you, but please talk to some people before you do!

GrahmF:

Although I appreciate your concerns with my post, to clarify:

I was just trying to be practical, based upon the information he provided. The fact that he is only 26 and can stop drinking for weeks at a time without any trouble, indicates to me that he doesn't have a strong, physical addiction to alcohol at this point in his life. His binge drinking (according to him) only occurs when he is out drinking hard with a bunch of "drinking buddies".

My post merely pointed out that a lot of alcoholics started out that way and that binge drinking will ultimately cause health problems. If he can control his drinking to 2 or 3 drinks a week (as he indicated in his post) having a glass of wine or two with a meal will probably not cause him to turn into an alcoholic.

If he in fact, cannot limit his drinking and continues to binge drink, then I agree with you 100% in that he should get help, and NEVER, EVER take another drink of alcohol.

Although, I realize that I can never drink alcohol again, I still believe that some people can drink alcohol responsibly (less than 3 or 4 drinks a week) and live a long, happy life, without any alcohol associated problems.

Unfortunately, many of us can't control our drinking and we have to make a choice of either giving up alcohol completely, or suffering horrible consequences.

At any rate, I apologize if anyone got the impression that I was encouraging him or anyone to drink, that was not my intent.

Rick

[Sheryl]

I strongly disagree, Rick. His post clearly states that once he starts drinking, he cannot control/moderate how much he drinks. That, more than a need to drink every day, is the medical definition of alcoholism. it is a physiological thing in which the first drink sets in motion an irrestible urge for the next drink and so on. Such people can never drink in moderation, and the key for them is accepting that fact.

Some people with this problem are also unable to stop drinking for any length of time without external assistance, but others can. There are alcoholics who only drink on weekends, alcoholics who only drink in the evenings, alcoholics who go on periodic benders and don 't drink in between. The medical condition of alcoholism is defined not by how often a person drinks but by the inability to control/moderate alcohol intake once drinking. Many alcoholics also have an irrestible urge to start drinking, but it is not uncommon to find ones who can easily abstain for blocks time.

OP: you are one of those people who simply can't drink and maintain control of how much they drink. There are plenty of folks like you, unfortunately though it is a minority and the majority of people who can do so never understand this and will misguidedly urge you to "just have one" and so forth, not understanding that you can no more do this than you can take wings and fly. These same people will be the first to blame you for "lack of self control" when you then go on to drink too much.

Your only option is to stop drinking alcohol completely, full stop. If you can do that unaided, great. If you need help/moral support to do so, it's easily found.

Even if you can stop (and stay stopped) on your own, you may find it helpful to get to know others with the same problem. Which you can do through this forum, or an AA group.

[rucus7]

You are a fairly young guy, all the more reason to quit now. Your style of drinking is very familiar to me. I also drank primarily hard liquor, although beer or wine in a pinch would do. Often drank to the black-out stage. I too would refrain for extended periods of two or three weeks. I wish I had quit drinking at 26 instead of my mid thirties.

Since you know you can stop for a month, consider the commitment of one year without alcohol. I felt so good after a year of not drinking, I had no real desire to go back to drinking. That one year gave me perspective on myself. AA works for some people, I have never tried it so I have no opinion of its value or success rate.

You may be pleasantly surprised that your friends support you in not drinking. It is socially acceptable not to drink.

[RickThai]

I strongly disagree, Rick. His post clearly states that once he starts drinking, he cannot control/moderate how much he drinks. That, more than a need to drink every day, is the medical definition of alcoholism. it is a physiological thing in which the first drink sets in motion an irrestible urge for the next drink and so on. Such people can never drink in moderation, and the key for them is accepting that fact.

Some people with this problem are also unable to stop drinking for any length of time without external assistance, but others can. There are alcoholics who only drink on weekends, alcoholics who only drink in the evenings, alcoholics who go on periodic benders and don 't drink in between. The medical condition of alcoholism is defined not by how often a person drinks but by the inability to control/moderate alcohol intake once drinking. Many alcoholics also have an irrestible urge to start drinking, but it is not uncommon to find ones who can easily abstain for blocks time.

OP: you are one of those people who simply can't drink and maintain control of how much they drink. There are plenty of folks like you, unfortunately though it is a minority and the majority of people who can do so never understand this and will misguidedly urge you to "just have one" and so forth, not understanding that you can no more do this than you can take wings and fly. These same people will be the first to blame you for "lack of self control" when you then go on to drink too much.

Your only option is to stop drinking alcohol completely, full stop. If you can do that unaided, great. If you need help/moral support to do so, it's easily found.

Even if you can stop (and stay stopped) on your own, you may find it helpful to get to know others with the same problem. Which you can do through this forum, or an AA group.

I agree he may be an alocholic, however he did state that when he was with his girlfriend, he always drank moderately (i.e. in control). To me it seemed more of a lifestyle issue (which could definitely lead to alcoholism), rather than being currently addicted to alcohol. I would hesitate to diagnose anyone as an alocholic or not, based upon a single post.

I agree the 'safest" thing would be for him not to drink ever, but I'm not convinced that is his only option based upon his post. Only he knows for sure if he has a drinking problem. If so, I agree with what you and GrahmF have posted.

Better safe than sorry.

Rick

[Chonburiram]

Baa_mango;

I think most alcoholics walked (staggered) in your shoes when they were younger.

As you get older you will find it harder to quit for long periods of time, and easier to think up reasons why you should drink.

If you want to enjoy your drinking for a long time, stop all binge drinking. If you have a couple/three beers a week, you can probably drink well into your eighties (provided you don't have other health issues), but heavy drinking over decades will eventually come with a heavy price.

Best of luck with your decisions on drinking.

RickThai

Whoa nelly!!!! Come on Rick, you're actually encouraging a potential alcoholic to try controlled drinking???? Especially as the OP is only beginning to question if he has a problem. He needs some time away from booze and to perhaps hit a few AA meetings and talk to some alcoholics about their experiences and come to a rational decision about whether he wants to stop drinking or not. If he is an alcoholic, you and I both know that telling him that he can have "a couple/three beers a week" is the perfect excuse for him to convince himself he has no problem and to start drinking again, and we know where that will probably lead to in the end. Alcoholics can rationalize having a drink pretty darn well. Do you think you could stick to a course of controlled drinking, I know that it never worked for me. Shame on you Rick, especially as your the guy who's alive today because of a donor liver......You of all people should know better!

OP, go out and get some information about alcoholism. Go to some AA meetings and talk to some alcoholics, post some more questions here, surf the web, whatever. Whether or not you drink again is up to you, but please talk to some people before you do!

This is the " I drink too much " , NOT the " I am an Alcoholic " forum,

it gets a little old to see in every thread the AA zealots chanting their mantra...

Nothing wrong with RickThais input.

And yes, AA is always there to help you ( why do I have the feeling I have to say this ??)

[RickThai]

Baa_Mango;

I hope I have not muddied the water for you concerning my replies to GrahmF and Sheryl.

Sheryl, besides being a moderator, is a very valuable contributor whose knowledge and experience in health matters, and her willingness to share her wisdom on this forum, makes this a very helpful forum indeed.

GrahmF, has a lot of personal knowledge and experience with alcoholism and Alcohol Anonymous.

Both of their insights and replies are not to be taken lightly.

I have no firsthand knowledge of AA, other than knowing it has helped a lot of alcoholics to stop drinking, and more importantly, stay off the booze.

I was a functional alcoholic for years, and I too, could stop drinking for a week, or even 6 months one time. Behind each "stoppage" was the knowledge that ultimately I would start back drinking after a certain time limit. I guess I was trying to punish myself for some misconduct that I had done when drunk and/or proving to myself I was not an alcoholic.

The decades of abusive drinking, along with a liver disease (Hep C), eventually caught up with me and I went into full-blown end-stage liver disease at the age of 54. This is usually a fatal situation and I am alive today only by the most fortunate combinations of circumstances (I had a liver transplant).

The 8 months of severe pain that I suffered through during that timeframe (ESLD is a very miserable way to die), was a kind of super "aversion training". In that aspects I am lucky, since I now have absolutely no desire to drink anything alcoholic.

Other than when I am on this forum, I never talk about drinking or think about drinking. When I have friends over for dinner, I usually buy a good bottle of table wine for them to drink. It bothers me not one wit. If my wife orders a cocktail at dinner (she is an extremely light drinker) it doesn't bring up any desire for me to order one. I am happier than I have ever been in my life.

However, many alcoholics who have stopped drinking have to struggle and fight with that desire to drink almost every day. Being in that situation for the rest of your life, is a very tough thing to have to experience. My sympathy goes out to them.

I hope you make the right decision when it comes to your own drinking habits. If you decide to try and limit your drinking to no more than two or three drinks a day, you have to realize that this limit is for life with no exceptions.

If you can't do that, or even think you can't do that, then please do what GrahmF and Sheryl have recommended. Alcoholism is a serious condition that can ruin any chance of you having a long, happy, healthy, life.

Don't risk destroying your life and don't wait until your an old man with a bad liver before trying to take action.

Again, good luck.

RickThai

Edited August 18, 2011 by RickThai

[snarky66]

I am with Sheryl. Drinking is not something I gave up. It's something I got rid of.

About 15 years ago. Freedom. Ah.

[Sheryl]

This is the " I drink too much " , NOT the " I am an Alcoholic " forum,

it gets a little old to see in every thread the AA zealots chanting their mantra...

Nothing wrong with RickThais input.

And yes, AA is always there to help you ( why do I have the feeling I have to say this ??)

Don't be ridiculous. Of course you do not have to say that, and indeed, unless your own experience and take on what the OP posted suggest it to be appropriate, you shouldn't.

But one should, in posting responses to someone, be mindful of the particulars of that person's situation. What rings alarm bells in the OP's post is:

"I am a serious binger. I prefer liquor to beer and this probably doesn't help. My main issue seems to be control problems. I drink very fast and in very large amounts. I often black out or even just fall asleep (unconscious)."

Those are not the words of someone who simply "drinks too much", they are a classic description of someone with a physiologic predisposition towards alcoholism.

He may or may not need the help of AA to do so, but he surely needs to abstain totally from alcohol. Not the case with everyone who posts here, but definitely the case for this person based on his post.

[Livinginexile]

OP I completely relate to your post.

It's easy to stop drinking, I stop drinking every night when I finally crash out!

The real problem is staying stoped. For that I have come to realize I can't do it on my own.

I am not saying for a second that this aplies to you, only my own experience.

It's a question that can only be answered by yourself and only you.

For people like me drinking is a losers game, allways a downward slide. No ups and downs any more, only down and let me tell you, it gets steeper and steeper.

I stoped drinking 8 months ago and I feel soooo much better and my family/social/financial situation has improved 10 fold.

Right now I am sitting on a small Island in the Maldives building a resort earning fabulous money. 8 months ago this would have been impossible.

Anyway brother, try to take care of yourself and all the best in your battle.

PM me if you would like some support

[imjustagirl]

there are different types of alcoholics....binger, chronic and maintenace (i think) and believe me binger is a nasty one....i know exactly what you mean op, i can go months with out a drink then as soon as i have that fatal one or two - its time for a bender.

i currently am taking antabuse or more correctly anta-al which is the thai eqivalent and can be bought at the pharmacy. i was a far more frequent binge drinker than you...more weekly than monthly and when it started i couldnt stop it. i think the true way to tell an alcoholic is really to ask yourself these main questions.

does my alcohol drinking affect my personal relationships

does my drinking affect my work/study life

does my drinking affect my self esteem

does my drinking get me in trouble financially or with the law

if you answer yes to one or more of these then you have a drinking PROBLEM.

i have done 40 days now sober from antabuse help and it has really saved my state of mind but i do miss the social aspect. I am currently hunting down a drug that is called naltrexone. it works by blocking the endorphin release when you drink...this in turn means you can drink but you will not get that chasing the high reaction as there will be no happy high....you will get wibbly but even intoxicated but it will deprogram the never ending urge for another....

the really good news for us bingers is that it has a 76% success rate and that you dont have to take it all the time. simply take a pill one hour before you are planning to go out. Then drink away. it sounds like you can resist alcohol 99% of the time so this may be a really good choice for you.

oh and by the way i really like the online group smartrecovery.com and there approach to ways to combat alcohol dependence.

i will post any news of if i find naltrexone...i think i am close...spoke to a hospital yesterday and they think they will have it in bangkok - usually it is used for heroin addicts as it acts the same way on any drug involving endorphins

here is a really interesting article about it

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/health/article5484285.ece

:jap:

[GrahamF]

Here's a couple more articles on Naltrexone, what stands out to me is that it can exacerbate the effects of withdrawal, and from these two articles I get the impression that one should not be drinking or doing drugs whilst taking it. I'll gladly defer to Sheryl on this one!

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0000853/

http://alcoholism.about.com/od/meds/a/naltrexone.htm

[imjustagirl]

Here's a couple more articles on Naltrexone, what stands out to me is that it can exacerbate the effects of withdrawal, and from these two articles I get the impression that one should not be drinking or doing drugs whilst taking it. I'll gladly defer to Sheryl on this one!

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmedhealth/PMH0000853/

http://alcoholism.about.com/od/meds/a/naltrexone.htm

are you sure on that one and not mixing naltraxone with antabuse?

How does naltrexone work?

Naltrexone blocks the parts of your brain that “feel” pleasure when you use alcohol and narcotics. When these areas of the brain are blocked, you feel less need to drink alcohol, and you can stop drinking more easily. Unlike disulfiram, another medicine that is sometimes used to treat alcoholism, naltrexone does not make you feel sick if you drink alcohol while taking it.

for people like me who only have occasional urges and then go off on a bender this is ideal...i can wait an hour during an urge phase lol

http://familydoctor.org/online/famdocen/home/common/addictions/alcohol/130.html

and here is the wiki (but we all know how reliable that is!!) its called the sinclair method...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naltrexone

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinclair_Method

[GrahamF]

Here's a couple more articles on Naltrexone, what stands out to me is that it can exacerbate the effects of withdrawal, and from these two articles I get the impression that one should not be drinking or doing drugs whilst taking it. I'll gladly defer to Sheryl on this one!

http://www.ncbi.nlm....lth/PMH0000853/

http://alcoholism.ab.../naltrexone.htm

are you sure on that one and not mixing naltraxone with antabuse?

How does naltrexone work?

Naltrexone blocks the parts of your brain that "feel" pleasure when you use alcohol and narcotics. When these areas of the brain are blocked, you feel less need to drink alcohol, and you can stop drinking more easily. Unlike disulfiram, another medicine that is sometimes used to treat alcoholism, naltrexone does not make you feel sick if you drink alcohol while taking it.

for people like me who only have occasional urges and then go off on a bender this is ideal...i can wait an hour during an urge phase lol

http://familydoctor....lcohol/130.html

and here is the wiki (but we all know how reliable that is!!) its called the sinclair method...

http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Naltrexone

http://en.wikipedia....Sinclair_Method

I don't think I'm mixing them up. I googled Naltrexone. The top link is taken from the USA National Institute of Health, and both articles discuss Naltrexone.

[Sheryl]

Naltrexone is indicated only who have successfully abstained from drinking (in an outpatient setting, not just while in rehab or hospital!) for some time, and it is a serious drug which can only be used under close medical supervision.

There are pyschiatrists in Bangkok who specialize in addiicton disorders and would be conversant with its use.

Whether or not it really adds anything to the process of achieving lasting sobriety is I think up for debate. But some people may feel more confident that they can forgo alcohol if they are on some sort of medication and that alone may make a difference.

[StreetCowboy]

For me, drinking urges are, I believe, entirely psychological, and quite - high level. The challenge, for me, is to develop a lifestyle where my ambitions do not involve drinking and whoring. Since the drink appears to be the biggest problem, then developing a lifestyle that involves watching rugby and whoring... well, that didn't work!

Looking after the family and working hard...

The first thing was to understand that if I did not take the first drink, I would not get into trouble and wind up paralytic somewhere strange.

The second thing was to realise that even if I only had one - it would achieve nothing, it would cost me 100 Bht more than drinking water and I would be NO BETTER OFF UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES.

The third thing, and the most important, was to live a life where I no longer had empty spaces to fill with drinking.

SC

[RickThai]

For me, drinking urges are, I believe, entirely psychological, and quite - high level. The challenge, for me, is to develop a lifestyle where my ambitions do not involve drinking and whoring. Since the drink appears to be the biggest problem, then developing a lifestyle that involves watching rugby and whoring... well, that didn't work!

Looking after the family and working hard...

The first thing was to understand that if I did not take the first drink, I would not get into trouble and wind up paralytic somewhere strange.

The second thing was to realise that even if I only had one - it would achieve nothing, it would cost me 100 Bht more than drinking water and I would be NO BETTER OFF UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES.

The third thing, and the most important, was to live a life where I no longer had empty spaces to fill with drinking.

SC

SC:

I think you have hit the nail on the head! I started a thread on that very topic, but it didn't go very far.

Lifestyle choices can have a major impact on a person's addiction to alcolhol. Hanging out in bars routinely (whether there for the drinks or the girls) makes it very hard for someone to quit drinking and stay off the booze.

Re-focusing your life on something more worthy (work, family, spiritual growth, etc) can help get rid of old, harmful habits, and let you develop habits, that make you feel good about yourself and hopefully, make the world just a little better place for all of us.

It took me 55 years and a liver transplant to figure this out, and my life is fuller and richer than it has ever been before.

I wish there was a way to 'bottle' this insight and give it to every kid when they turn 13. I'm sure it would help many people have a much better life and save them from a lot of heartache and bad choices.

Rick

Edited August 22, 2011 by RickThai

[andrewbkk]

For me, drinking urges are, I believe, entirely psychological, and quite - high level. The challenge, for me, is to develop a lifestyle where my ambitions do not involve drinking and whoring. Since the drink appears to be the biggest problem, then developing a lifestyle that involves watching rugby and whoring... well, that didn't work!

Looking after the family and working hard...

The first thing was to understand that if I did not take the first drink, I would not get into trouble and wind up paralytic somewhere strange.

The second thing was to realise that even if I only had one - it would achieve nothing, it would cost me 100 Bht more than drinking water and I would be NO BETTER OFF UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES.

The third thing, and the most important, was to live a life where I no longer had empty spaces to fill with drinking.

SC

That's a really really good post.

[StreetCowboy]

For me, drinking urges are, I believe, entirely psychological, and quite - high level. The challenge, for me, is to develop a lifestyle where my ambitions do not involve drinking and whoring. Since the drink appears to be the biggest problem, then developing a lifestyle that involves watching rugby and whoring... well, that didn't work!

Looking after the family and working hard...

The first thing was to understand that if I did not take the first drink, I would not get into trouble and wind up paralytic somewhere strange.

The second thing was to realise that even if I only had one - it would achieve nothing, it would cost me 100 Bht more than drinking water and I would be NO BETTER OFF UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES.

The third thing, and the most important, was to live a life where I no longer had empty spaces to fill with drinking.

SC

That's a really really good post.

If only advice was as easy to follow as to give...

[Johnniey]

Naltrexone is indicated only who have successfully abstained from drinking (in an outpatient setting, not just while in rehab or hospital!) for some time, and it is a serious drug which can only be used under close medical supervision.

There are pyschiatrists in Bangkok who specialize in addiicton disorders and would be conversant with its use.

Whether or not it really adds anything to the process of achieving lasting sobriety is I think up for debate. But some people may feel more confident that they can forgo alcohol if they are on some sort of medication and that alone may make a difference.

I was given this drug as an outpatient in a top UK hospital. I was still drinking with it.

I believe this drug enables an alcoholic to drink as a normal person does. I had no idea that it would help an alcoholic that had quit for some time, and stuill can't see how it would help.

This drug would have no benefit for someone who drinks too much but is not an alcoholic as their body does not produce the "natural opiates" that happens in an alcoholic's body.

[chops]

I'm a binge drinker. Once I have that one beer, it's over for the night! 10-20 follow until I am wasted and stumbling around Pattaya. Yeah, that's me you see..

You just have to keep away from buying that one beer. I enjoy my binges, but I try to keep them to a minimum(2 times a month). I just cannot drink one beer and be satisfied. Doesn't work like that for me.

[Ijustwannateach]

Aside from incidents of losing control or losing memory, OP has also pointed out that people he knows have expressed concern about him, that he has 'caused trouble' to others, and he has tangible losses already as a result of drinking (losing a laptop). All of these pop up as big red flags in my view; I would tend to agree that OP should regard himself as being at risk of even worse circumstances if he continues.

I've stated before here that alcohol is not my big issue, though I am struggling with some other addictions. But when I was a sophomore in college- long time ago now- I had my first couple of blackout experiences with alcohol, too, and it wasn't just a first midjudged experience, either. Both times I said things to people that I didn't remember later, though fortunately they were not offensive or ill-judged, and I wasn't hostile or annoying to anyone, thankfully. I also drank to the point that I was quite ill on weekends, and managed to be sick enough to puke up in a student cafeteria at one point the next day. It was when I sent a very frightening email revealing some very depressed feelings of mine to a friend (fortunately someone who was benevolent and approached me with concern the next day) and didn't even remember having done so, that I was scared enough to look at my drinking at that time as a problem. I was definitely using it as an escape, and moving towards that escape with alarming speed.

So I took a hard look at myself, decided that I wasn't going to go out that way, and stopped drinking completely for a good 4-5 months. When I did finally drink again, it was with the understanding (with myself) that if I ever did so to the point of blackout or serious physical illness that I would have to consider an even longer dry spell or more extreme discipline.

I think now, that I was lucky that I apparently do not have a really big *physical* or *physiological* tendency towards alcohol addiction, because it is not through any merit of my own that I got through that period in my life without developing such a tendency into maximum disaster. When I was ready to calm down, take a break, and re-examine my life in a more healthy way, I wasn't handicapped by the physical trap of addiction. I certainly had been abusing it psychologically as much as I could manage at the time.

One difference I perceive when I read the stories others have posted, such as OP, is that I don't feel anything like "I've gotta have one more" when I drink, for which I am very grateful- it seems, as others here have said, this feeling is a telltale sign of troubles ahead. During those binge days of mine in college, I was simply trying to drink enough not to feel anymore, and that took a lot. Unfortunately, I've developed some other troublesome feeling-avoidance mechanisms in my repertoire that work a lot better for me (and against me, too) than alcohol did, but I'm glad not to have that as one more thing on my list of challenges.

[StreetCowboy]

Aside from incidents of losing control or losing memory, OP has also pointed out that people he knows have expressed concern about him, that he has 'caused trouble' to others, and he has tangible losses already as a result of drinking (losing a laptop). All of these pop up as big red flags in my view; I would tend to agree that OP should regard himself as being at risk of even worse circumstances if he continues.

I've stated before here that alcohol is not my big issue, though I am struggling with some other addictions. But when I was a sophomore in college- long time ago now- I had my first couple of blackout experiences with alcohol, too, and it wasn't just a first midjudged experience, either. Both times I said things to people that I didn't remember later, though fortunately they were not offensive or ill-judged, and I wasn't hostile or annoying to anyone, thankfully. I also drank to the point that I was quite ill on weekends, and managed to be sick enough to puke up in a student cafeteria at one point the next day. It was when I sent a very frightening email revealing some very depressed feelings of mine to a friend (fortunately someone who was benevolent and approached me with concern the next day) and didn't even remember having done so, that I was scared enough to look at my drinking at that time as a problem. I was definitely using it as an escape, and moving towards that escape with alarming speed.

So I took a hard look at myself, decided that I wasn't going to go out that way, and stopped drinking completely for a good 4-5 months. When I did finally drink again, it was with the understanding (with myself) that if I ever did so to the point of blackout or serious physical illness that I would have to consider an even longer dry spell or more extreme discipline.

I think now, that I was lucky that I apparently do not have a really big *physical* or *physiological* tendency towards alcohol addiction, because it is not through any merit of my own that I got through that period in my life without developing such a tendency into maximum disaster. When I was ready to calm down, take a break, and re-examine my life in a more healthy way, I wasn't handicapped by the physical trap of addiction. I certainly had been abusing it psychologically as much as I could manage at the time.

One difference I perceive when I read the stories others have posted, such as OP, is that I don't feel anything like "I've gotta have one more" when I drink, for which I am very grateful- it seems, as others here have said, this feeling is a telltale sign of troubles ahead. During those binge days of mine in college, I was simply trying to drink enough not to feel anymore, and that took a lot. Unfortunately, I've developed some other troublesome feeling-avoidance mechanisms in my repertoire that work a lot better for me (and against me, too) than alcohol did, but I'm glad not to have that as one more thing on my list of challenges.

I wish I was as intolerant of my own failings...

Or, phrasing that in a more constructive manner, I should develop a similar commitment to improvement...

SC

[Ijustwannateach]

^Thanks- but there was a long way for me to go, 'cause I'm still at it! However, a lot more honest with myself and others about what I am doing now.

[ukrules]

I was given this drug as an outpatient in a top UK hospital. I was still drinking with it.

I believe this drug enables an alcoholic to drink as a normal person does. I had no idea that it would help an alcoholic that had quit for some time, and stuill can't see how it would help.

This drug would have no benefit for someone who drinks too much but is not an alcoholic as their body does not produce the "natural opiates" that happens in an alcoholic's body.

You're correct when you say this. Naltrexone has absolutely no benefit to someone who doesn't drink as many studies have shown. The only studies in which it worked were the ones where people continued to drink alcohol.

This process is known as 'pharmacological extinction' and only occurs when people drink while taking the naltrexone.

Detailed information : http://www.thesinclairmethod.net

Studies : http://sites.google.com/site/boozebusters/annotated-bibliography-sinclair-method-naltrexone-alcohol

There's a book on this subject as well. I've been reading it recently and it's a pretty interesting read.

There is more recent information available than that which has been mentioned in this topic.

[GrahamF]

I was given this drug as an outpatient in a top UK hospital. I was still drinking with it.

I believe this drug enables an alcoholic to drink as a normal person does. I had no idea that it would help an alcoholic that had quit for some time, and stuill can't see how it would help.

This drug would have no benefit for someone who drinks too much but is not an alcoholic as their body does not produce the "natural opiates" that happens in an alcoholic's body.

You're correct when you say this. Naltrexone has absolutely no benefit to someone who doesn't drink as many studies have shown. The only studies in which it worked were the ones where people continued to drink alcohol.

This process is known as 'pharmacological extinction' and only occurs when people drink while taking the naltrexone.

Detailed information : http://www.thesinclairmethod.net

Studies : http://sites.google....trexone-alcohol

There's a book on this subject as well. I've been reading it recently and it's a pretty interesting read.

There is more recent information available than that which has been mentioned in this topic.

Out of pure curiosity, would this brief article be considered a reasonable summation of the sinclair method or treatment of alcoholism with naltrexone? http://hamsnetwork.org/naltrexone/