Some Questions Regarding Settlement Visa

[scottjbarrow]

Hi All,

I have read through most of the posts on this forum and have a good understanding of what is required for the settlement visa.

I however would like some specific answers regarding my circumstances.

I met my partner just over a year ago, and we have been together ever since, including a stay of months in the UK with my parents.

I am 29 and was made redundant from my last job in 2004, which is why I have been travelling for over 14 months (this was a planned break from work). The only work undertaken in this time was some temporary work when I returned to the UK, just to top my funds up.

This means I have no proof of income, I however will have a balance of approx £5000 when I apply for the visa. I may also have a letter confirming some work for me when I return to the UK.

I may also be able to get a letter stating that a place in my hometown would be interested in employing my partner if they have a position vacant on our return. This will not be a fake letter, but a letter from a business who has met my partner and expressed a wish that she work for them.

My Questions are:-

1. Would it be better to get married in Thailand before returning to the UK, we are currently engaged?

2. With my current situation, would I have problems getting a visa?

3. My parents and Sister are all willing to sponsor my partner as well, will this be of help?

4. We stayed with my parents when we returned to the UK for 5 months, would this accomodation be considered suitable to we find a place of our own?

5. Because we have been together since we first met, we have very little proof of relationship, phone calls, emails etc, because we live together, is this a problem? we can provide photos, us together, me and her family, my family and her etc, NHS card with her details.

6. Anything else that you think could help.

Thanks in advance.

Regards

Scott.

Edited November 28, 2005 by scottjbarrow

[GU22]

1. Would it be better to get married in Thailand before returning to the UK, we are currently engaged?

IMHO, yes. Not that applying for a spouse visa is any easier than a fiance visa, simply because it is cheaper. A fiance visa means that once married she will need to apply for Further Leave to Remain, at a cost (currently) of £335 by post or £500 in person. Marrying in Thailand cuts out this stage and so saves the fee.

2. With my current situation, would I have problems getting a visa?

3. My parents and Sister are all willing to sponsor my partner as well, will this be of help?

4. We stayed with my parents when we returned to the UK for 5 months, would this accommodation be considered suitable to we find a place of our own?

From what you have said your finances should be ok, £5000 should be enough especially if you can supply a letter offering you a job. Your parents will confirm that they can support you both if necessary? If so, they will need to provide proof of income etc. as well. For accommodation, a letter from them confirming that there is room for you both and that you can stay indefinitely, with proof of ownership or the landlords confirmation as appropriate.

5. Because we have been together since we first met, we have very little proof of relationship, phone calls, emails etc, because we live together, is this a problem? we can provide photos, us together, me and her family, my family and her etc, NHS card with her details.

How does she have an NHS card? Has she been resident in the UK before?

Do you have proof that you were living together in Thailand? Letters addressed to each of you at the same address etc.? Photos obviously and as many documents that you can find to show that you were cohabiting. The same things you used to prove the relationship when she applied for her visit visa.

6. Anything else that you think could help.

Not that springs to mind. Good luck.

Edited November 28, 2005 by GU22

[scottjbarrow]

"How does she have an NHS card? "

When she visited the UK on her visitors visa, she had to attend the local doctors and hospitals, when she registered for the doctors she was given a NHS card, however any treatment, cosultations had to be paid for.

No so cheap as it turns out;)

Both my parents and Sister will provide financial information.

[scottjbarrow]

Anyone else have any views on this?

[Duality]

sorry for jumping in here but my mother and sister will also be sponsoring my gf for a tourist visa but they don't work instead they recieve a pension and sick pay respectivley. is this a problem when it comes to being a financial sponsor?

they live comfortably and own their own homes and with my income too i feel there is enough to look after an upcountry thai girl for a few months. now i have read that sponsoring a tourist using money from benifits is not looked kindly upon.however how can it be frowned upon if no more money is being claimed by my mum or sister during my gf's holiday?

cheers.

[GU22]

When she visited the UK on her visitors visa, she had to attend the local doctors and hospitals, when she registered for the doctors she was given a NHS card, however any treatment, cosultations had to be paid for.

I see. It's not strictly necessary for a tourist to register with a GP in order to receive paid for treatment, but I guess, given your circumstances, the surgery thought they may as well get it sorted there and then.

Duality,

Reading your previous posts, I'm uncertain as to your current location. Are you currently working in the UK or are you in LOS?

If working in the UK, is your income not sufficient? Whilst it is possible for persons living on state benefits to sponsor a visitor, they must be able to show that they can do so without the need to claim any extra benefit.

[silomfan]

Anyone else have any views on this?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hi there,

For what its worth, my opinion (unlike it seems everyone else) is that you WILL have a problem getting a visa. The main problem i see is your financial position. Although you say you may have this and that , MAY is not good enough. You will need hard proof of a job waiting for you otherwise they will look at your savings. They may say that £5000 is not enough .. it is of course for a long while but you must remember, and i say this with all my posts, you are not dealing with people who want to help you. You are dealing with the British Embassy who will be looking actively for any reason to refuse and when they find one , its becomes like a steamroller,they will find loads.

They will not be satisfied that you have enough to support both of you " without recourse to public funds" - automatic refusal.

As if that wasn't bad enough , you have accomodation problems too. You may not know , but they will ask how many rooms your parents house has and use their own formula for calculating if this is enough for you to accomodate all of you to their satisfaction. Now if it happens they live in a big house you will be ok...but its another thing to bear in mind.

Lastly , by your own addmission, the proof of your relationship is patchy.

Your best bet is to marry in Thailand and then apply, tho even then i think you could struggle. Or you could continue living in Thailand for a mindboggling 4 years together and then you will get the visa , although even here the level of proof of the 4 years is high. Some of the time you have already spent together will count although only if you can prove it .

If you are lucky you may get one of the nice British Embassy staff , rumour has it there is one , but if you don't ... look out

Good luck anyway

SILOMFAN

[scottjbarrow]

Ok,

I see what your saying, but I have a couple of points, they will not be looking at my funds alone, my parents / sister are willing to act as second sponsor as well. As for the accomodation, they where quite happy for us to reside in my parents accomodation with the holiday visa which proved ok, why should this change. Its not a massive house, but fine for two couples, and its for a short time only.

Our proof of relationship is sketchy simply because we have spent the past year together, we can show our contracts for the places we have lived and we also spent 5 months of this in the UK. We have pictures, but not emails, phone bills etc.

[the scouser]

When in the UK as a visitor, you only need demonstrate you have a roof over your head but when seeking settlement you must satisfy the visa officer that you have a minimum of one bedroom for the exclusive use of you and your wife. Also, as a visitor, it's not a requirement to live together with your sponsor, which it is when a spouse.

However, the size of your parents' house is irrelevant, providing that there is one bedroom for the use of you and your wife and it's not considered to be overcrowded. I would suggest that a two-bedroomed property with your parents in one room and you and your wife in another is acceptable.

Employment-wise, it would help if you were able to obtain a firm job offer for either yourself or your wife and provide evidence of this. Failing that, if you are to rely on the support of family members, they will need to provide proof of their ability to do so.

Your wife will have to make it clear that you have little in the way of evidence of contact simply because you have spent your entire relationship living together. Do submit the contracts to which you referred, as well as photos, greetings cards etc. As GU22 said, the embassy has already accepted that you have a relationship as they issued your wife with a visit visa, so it will now be difficult for them to deny one exists.

Cheers,

Scouse.

[GU22]

Exactly!

I think you have a good chance.

£5000 should be enough, especially as you will have little in the way of living expenses. (Your parents should put in their offer of accommodation that it will be rent free until you start work.)

Basically, I'm afraid that the bulk of Silomfan's post is misinformed b*llocks.

[Duality]

gu22 i currently live and work in the uk and will be going to bangkok in 2 weeks to hopefully get a tourist visa for my gf. i have a letter from my employer stating that my employment is of an on-going nature and work will be there for me when i return next year.

i guess i'm worrying about nothing again my finances aren't astronomical but i can prove that i have saved roughlly 80% of my wages and spent very little on my outgoings in the last 3 years....except when i'm in LOS!

[Richard W]

gu22 i currently live and work in the uk and will be going to bangkok in 2 weeks to hopefully get a tourist visa for my gf. i have a letter from my employer stating that my employment is of an on-going nature and work will be there for me when i return next year.

i guess i'm worrying about nothing again my finances aren't astronomical but i can prove that i have saved roughlly 80% of my wages and spent very little on my outgoings in the last 3 years....except when i'm in LOS!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Think again. If she accompanies you back to England, why should she wish to return to Thailand? If you can't answer that, I don't see her getting a tourist visa.

[silomfan]

Exactly!

I think you have a good chance.

£5000 should be enough, especially as you will have little in the way of living expenses. (Your parents should put in their offer of accommodation that it will be rent free until you start work.)

Basically, I'm afraid that the bulk of Silomfan's post is misinformed b*llocks.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I would have expected more politeness from a senior member like GU22 . My posts are not misinformed b*llocks , i just like to put the realistic angle as there are far too many people here that , thru good intentions no doubt, like to boost everyone with over optimistic posts saying everything will be ok. If everything will be ok then why oh why are there so many people here with refusals and problems.?? The answer is because applying for any visa, unless you have a cast iron case (and most people here on this forum don't , thats why they are here) is a lottery at the British Embassy. I have been there over a dozen times with applicants and some of the staff are so nice its amazing and visa granted after a quick chat about the weather. Other times you can meet a real b*stard who can refuse on the tiniest inconsistancy in your application . Its up to the mood and character of the ECO and it shouldn't be . That is one of the unfair aspects of it all. They have immense power and can and do abuse it if they want to.

Now GU22 can insult my posts if he likes , but they are based on years of dealing with the Embassy and years of talking to rejected applicants.

I accept his point that your accomodation is PROBABLY ok but i was only pointing out it is another thing to be aware of . Thats all.

Or you can believe GU22 and his over optimistic posts and go merrrily along to the British Embassy only to leave an hour later with your heart broken.

SILOMFAN

[the gent]

What are your qualifications for representing visa applicants at the British E.?

I can understand the sentiment behind your posts but in reality only about 10% of applications are refused. Such a refusal rate does not justify your pessimism nor the wild accusations levelled against the Visa section.

[GU22]

gu22 i currently live and work in the uk and will be going to bangkok in 2 weeks to hopefully get a tourist visa for my gf. i have a letter from my employer stating that my employment is of an on-going nature and work will be there for me when i return next year.

i guess i'm worrying about nothing again my finances aren't astronomical but i can prove that i have saved roughlly 80% of my wages and spent very little on my outgoings in the last 3 years....except when i'm in LOS!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The ECO will look at your income and your outgoings and as long as you have sufficient left to support and accommodate her during the trip then the financial side will be satisfied. You don't need to be well off.

You have previously said that your g/f is employed, so she will need a letter from her employer confirming that the job will be kept open for her. This will show she has reason to return to Thailand.

[GU22]

Silomfan, not being American I do not refer to a spade as a "hand operated earth moving device!" If someone posts b*llocks, I will say so.

If you have "been there over a dozen times with applicants" then you should know that if the applicant shows that they meet the criteria then the visa will be issued. (I wonder why you have "been there over a dozen times with applicants?" Are you some sort of agent? Or do you simply have a lot of serial relationships? I am not surprised that the ECOs treat applicants sponsored by you with suspicion if there truly have been so many.)

As the gent says, over 90% of applications are successful, which proves that if one presents a properly prepared application that shows one meets the criteria are met then the visa will be issued.

Of course, the ECOs are only human and so capable of making mistakes. Sometimes chancers get through and sometimes genuine applicants get refused. But from what I have read from unsuccessful applicants both here and on other boards, together with my own experience of refusals, I can confidently state that in 99.9% of cases a refusal is due to something that the applicant did or didn't do, not some arbitrary whim of the ECO.

[the gent]

Silomfan

One awaits a response or is your powder wet?

[Duality]

her reason for returning to los will be that she has her own property and a job to go back too. however i suspect her "real" reason to return will be because of her craving for tom yum soup.

only 10 days now before we go to the embassy....watch this space

[silomfan]

What are your qualifications for representing visa applicants at the British E.?

I can understand the sentiment behind your posts but in reality only about 10% of applications are refused. Such a refusal rate does not justify your pessimism nor the wild accusations levelled against the Visa section.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Re your comment about the refusal rate , what you need to understand is that this figure is an overall one which includes all the thousands of high/medium class Thais who go for studying every year. Of course they are not refused. Nor the high/medium class tourists.

Ask yourself this...what do you think the percentage is for boy/girl friends that have been in a shortish relationship (lets say 6 months or less) with a UK citizen , who have a low paid or indeed no job, no property, litle money etc etc. You get the picture... guesses please for this one.

Of course this is unfair which is why i try to help the difficult cases not the ones that don't need help. All Thais can be both charming and devils at the same time, my point is it is wrong to discriminate against the ordinary Thais who are just as decent a people (or not as the case may be) as the high class Thais . That is what our wonderful British Embassy staff do .. discriminate against the weakest .

SILOMFAN

[silomfan]

Silomfan, not being American I do not refer to a spade as a "hand operated earth moving device!" If someone posts b*llocks, I will say so.

If you have "been there over a dozen times with applicants" then you should know that if the applicant shows that they meet the criteria then the visa will be issued. (I wonder why you have "been there over a dozen times with applicants?" Are you some sort of agent? Or do you simply have a lot of serial relationships? I am not surprised that the ECOs treat applicants sponsored by you with suspicion if there truly have been so many.)

As the gent says, over 90% of applications are successful, which proves that if one presents a properly prepared application that shows one meets the criteria are met then the visa will be issued.

Of course, the ECOs are only human and so capable of making mistakes. Sometimes chancers get through and sometimes genuine applicants get refused. But from what I have read from unsuccessful applicants both here and on other boards, together with my own experience of refusals, I can confidently state that in 99.9% of cases a refusal is due to something that the applicant did or didn't do, not some arbitrary whim of the ECO.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Read my reply to "the gent" for comments on the 90% pass rate... really GU22 i am surprised that an experienced poster as yourself can not work out how misleading that 90% figure is.

you say .... "if one presents a properly prepared application that shows one meets the criteria ... the visa will be issued.." what planet are you on ?? You know thats not true !! Where ordinary class Thais are concerned the British Embassy is activally looking for reasons to refuse . This comes from one of the most experienced immigration lawyers in the UK and also from local MP's. It is also my experience.

To compound your insulting reply .. you accuse me of being having serial relationships !! How can you accuse someone of that when you don't know ?? I have had just 2 in 12 years , all the other cases i refer to , not that it is any of your business, are Thai FRIENDS of my partner . Some of these tried to get a student visa to come to study in the UK. They fulfilled all the criteria , and were all high grade ex-university students in their mid twenties. They were all seen by the same officer who refused them because ... wait for it.... they waited too long after graduating (they all got good jobs for a year after graduating) for the ECO to believe they genuinely wanted to come to the UK to study.

Now maybe GU22 , who is so in love with those charming people at the British Embassy, would like to suggest that this is a fair refusal . Nothing in the rules says you can't leave University and get a job for a year and then go to the UK and why should it . Of course thats reasonable. Its the ECO who was not reasonable. And having refused one he had to go on to refuse the other 2 as well.

To state that 99.9% of cases of refusal are the applicants fault and not the whim of the ECO ?? NOW THAT IS B*LLOCKS !!!!!!!

SILOMFAN

[scottjbarrow]

Hi,

Reading this I understand there is always a chance I will get refused. What I wanted to know it that given my circumstances, that it wasn't a complete waste of time me trying.

Having read this I will go ahead with the application and provide all the information I possibly can, and hope the embassy views my situation as it is. If they refuse then I will have to go on to the UK alone and work and get my own accomodation before re-applying later.

Scott.

[charles]

Ask yourself this...what do you think the percentage is for boy/girl friends that have been in a shortish relationship (lets say 6 months or less) with a UK citizen , who have a low paid or indeed no job, no property, litle money etc etc. You get the picture... guesses please for this one.

......it is wrong to discriminate against the ordinary Thais who are just as decent a people (or not as the case may be) as the high class Thais . That is what our wonderful British Embassy staff do  .. discriminate against the weakest .

SILOMFAN

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't think it is discrimination, it is just common sense. I doubt embassy staff think that high class Thais are more "decent" people or even "superior", it's just that high class Thais have the evidence to show they can pay for their trip and are most likely to return to Thailand! Those are the critieria they work on, therefore it is hardly suprising that someone with "no money", "low paid or indeed no job" and no long-term relationship with someone who could support them is refused a visa. In fact, one could argue that these type of applicants make life much more difficult than it otherwise would be for "decent" hard-working middle class Thais with good jobs.

Also, you make it sound like the ECOs are completely unaccountable but I doubt this is the case. Even when there is no easy avenue to appeal (e.g. visitors visas) they've still got to justify themselves to their superiors. I expect any ECO acting out of line would soon be found out.

Edited December 2, 2005 by charles

[the gent]

What are your qualifications for representing visa applicants at the British E.?

I can understand the sentiment behind your posts but in reality only about 10% of applications are refused. Such a refusal rate does not justify your pessimism nor the wild accusations levelled against the Visa section.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Re your comment about the refusal rate , what you need to understand is that this figure is an overall one which includes all the thousands of high/medium class Thais who go for studying every year. Of course they are not refused. Nor the high/medium class tourists.

Ask yourself this...what do you think the percentage is for boy/girl friends that have been in a shortish relationship (lets say 6 months or less) with a UK citizen , who have a low paid or indeed no job, no property, litle money etc etc. You get the picture... guesses please for this one.

Of course this is unfair which is why i try to help the difficult cases not the ones that don't need help. All Thais can be both charming and devils at the same time, my point is it is wrong to discriminate against the ordinary Thais who are just as decent a people (or not as the case may be) as the high class Thais . That is what our wonderful British Embassy staff do .. discriminate against the weakest .

SILOMFAN

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Oh dear. The thing about perspective is that it really does depend on what end of the telescope you happen to be looking through. Sadly, in your case your comprehension of the UK visa regime seems to be limited by your own first hand experience and those of your chums which, quite naturally I suppose, has led to your somewhat bizarre conclusions.

Further argument is I think pointless since entrenched views based on personal prejudice are seldom given up easily but for the benefit of those who may be following this thread it may be more edifying if you were to check the UK Visas web site and click on the Facts and Figures page.

From this you will see that in the year 2004/2005 the Bankok visa section refused 4.7% of visitor applications, a category which does not include students, family visitors or work permit applicants. For the same period settlement applications were refused at the rate of 12%.

I think it is a fact of life that, worldwide, visa regimes operated by the more affluent countries tend to exclude those who could be reasonably considered as simply economic migrants without prospects in their own country of origin. The reasoning behind such a policy requires little explanation.

[silomfan]

What are your qualifications for representing visa applicants at the British E.?

I can understand the sentiment behind your posts but in reality only about 10% of applications are refused. Such a refusal rate does not justify your pessimism nor the wild accusations levelled against the Visa section.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Re your comment about the refusal rate , what you need to understand is that this figure is an overall one which includes all the thousands of high/medium class Thais who go for studying every year. Of course they are not refused. Nor the high/medium class tourists.

Ask yourself this...what do you think the percentage is for boy/girl friends that have been in a shortish relationship (lets say 6 months or less) with a UK citizen , who have a low paid or indeed no job, no property, litle money etc etc. You get the picture... guesses please for this one.

Of course this is unfair which is why i try to help the difficult cases not the ones that don't need help. All Thais can be both charming and devils at the same time, my point is it is wrong to discriminate against the ordinary Thais who are just as decent a people (or not as the case may be) as the high class Thais . That is what our wonderful British Embassy staff do .. discriminate against the weakest .

SILOMFAN

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Oh dear. The thing about perspective is that it really does depend on what end of the telescope you happen to be looking through. Sadly, in your case your comprehension of the UK visa regime seems to be limited by your own first hand experience and those of your chums which, quite naturally I suppose, has led to your somewhat bizarre conclusions.

Further argument is I think pointless since entrenched views based on personal prejudice are seldom given up easily but for the benefit of those who may be following this thread it may be more edifying if you were to check the UK Visas web site and click on the Facts and Figures page.

From this you will see that in the year 2004/2005 the Bankok visa section refused 4.7% of visitor applications, a category which does not include students, family visitors or work permit applicants. For the same period settlement applications were refused at the rate of 12%.

I think it is a fact of life that, worldwide, visa regimes operated by the more affluent countries tend to exclude those who could be reasonably considered as simply economic migrants without prospects in their own country of origin. The reasoning behind such a policy requires little explanation.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

YES i agree with what the gent has just said in his last sentance . There is discrimination against the poorer Thais, many of whom are the partners of UK citizens currently writing on this forum. That is what he is saying. And what i am saying is because this discrimination exists (which he has just acknowledged) you can forget what the rules say you must provide as evidence. They say one thing but the reality is , if you fall into this class of person , they will be actively looking for ways to refuse . Thats all i was saying.

SILOMFAN

[GU22]

Oh dear, someone is very upset that we are not all falling to our knees and worshipping at the fount of his superior knowledge!

you accuse me of being having serial relationships !!

Do you know what '?' means? (there it is again!) I asked an either/or question, you have only answered part of it so does that mean you are some sort of agent? (there's that squiggle again!) Apparently a very poor one, if so.

The examples you gave I cannot pass comment upon, unless you are prepared to quote verbatim the refusal notices given to these people. Your obviously biased interpretation of the case is worthless if one wants the true picture. Facts are much better, will you share the facts on these cases?

Facts, in this post I broke down the non-settlement figures for last year, and you can see that visitors have a very high success rate, 95.3% in fact. Students 93.2% successful, fact. But you don't like facts, do you? Prejudice and assumption seem much more to your liking.

I also gave reasons why many applications from "girlfriends" fail in this thread. and again here.

If one doesn't meet the criteria, or one lies about the reason for the visit (student when wants to work for example) or how one met their sponsor (e.g. met in the market when really bargirl and punter) or something else, then one is 99% certain to be caught in the lie and so fail.

Whatever the reason for the failure of the applications you have been involved with, one thing is certain. The fault lies either with a poorly prepared application or with the applicant not being truthful. Accept it. learn from it and you will then do better next time. Stamping your little foot, screwing up your face and wailing "It's so unfair!" will achieve nothing.

[silomfan]

Oh dear, someone is very upset that we are not all falling to our knees and worshipping at the fount of his superior knowledge!

you accuse me of being having serial relationships !!

Do you know what '?' means? (there it is again!) I asked an either/or question, you have only answered part of it so does that mean you are some sort of agent? (there's that squiggle again!) Apparently a very poor one, if so.

The examples you gave I cannot pass comment upon, unless you are prepared to quote verbatim the refusal notices given to these people. Your obviously biased interpretation of the case is worthless if one wants the true picture. Facts are much better, will you share the facts on these cases?

Facts, in this post I broke down the non-settlement figures for last year, and you can see that visitors have a very high success rate, 95.3% in fact. Students 93.2% successful, fact. But you don't like facts, do you? Prejudice and assumption seem much more to your liking.

I also gave reasons why many applications from "girlfriends" fail in this thread. and again here.

If one doesn't meet the criteria, or one lies about the reason for the visit (student when wants to work for example) or how one met their sponsor (e.g. met in the market when really bargirl and punter) or something else, then one is 99% certain to be caught in the lie and so fail.

Whatever the reason for the failure of the applications you have been involved with, one thing is certain. The fault lies either with a poorly prepared application or with the applicant not being truthful. Accept it. learn from it and you will then do better next time. Stamping your little foot, screwing up your face and wailing "It's so unfair!" will achieve nothing.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

GU22 , i do actually agree with some of what you say. NO i am not an agent..where did that come from ? We are all here on this forum to try and help each other by referance to our experience /s , but i do think that we should try to be polite to each others posts when they are done with the best of intentions.

I think "the scouser" is an example to everyone. Obviously i haven't read all his posts but enough of them to know he has terrific knowledge and shares it freely. His posts are polite and respectful even when the original post is quite absurd. I don't always agree with him as i feel he is often a little over-optimistic with what are hopeless cases , but i do respect him for the time and effort he puts in. Well done to "the scouser" !!

I suggest we call a truce on this issue and work together to help people, which is the point of this forum. I won't post details here of the 3 student visa refusals i referred to (and which incidently i had NO involvment with except to read their details after the refusals) but will keep them for a future relevant post when someone asks a pertinent question that this relates to.

Whether you can bring yourself to believe that my posts do contain an element of truth i don't know. I suspect that i have seen more of the inner workings of the Embassy and their relationship with UK Visas than most here , and i can tell you all is not as fair as their websites indicate.

Have a nice weekend GU22

I'm sure we will do battle on another thread in the future

SILOMFAN