Bmw Cars Are Problematic? High Maintenance Cost?

[Cobrabiker]

I have heard people saying about BMW cars are problematic and hard and expensive to service, only can be serviced at the dealer's workshop or others who have the expensive machinery to service it, exactly how difficult and expensive, I mean normal oil and filter change can it be done anywhere? And brake pads, engine tuning, power windows etc.. etc.

And also does it apply to all the series or only the high end model? What about the base model 318i (E46, yr 00-05 model)? Bimmer's owners or mechanics please share your experiences.

[Kwasaki]

In UK the BM's I went in had an excellent finish and they looked and lasted well too.

I still think they are and were way over top in price and people were paying for a badged brand.

That said some people seemed to change character behind the wheel of a BM and jokes followed.

What you say " only can be serviced at the dealer's workshop " is right, at " engine tuning " would say it stops there, I assume with the amount of technology that goes into them, only dealers have the codes to check the sensor readings received from the ECU, also a trained technician on site the spanners (mechanics) only change the oil etc.

[Cobrabiker]

So Kwasaki, oil change can be done at any shop right? Someone told me that the dealer needs to insert a tube to suck out the engine oil instead of draining it dry like other cars, is this correct?

Prices of a 10 year old Bmw depreciates fast, from 2.2m to around 700k, seems like older ones are more problematic.

[transam]

So Kwasaki, oil change can be done at any shop right? Someone told me that the dealer needs to insert a tube to suck out the engine oil instead of draining it dry like other cars, is this correct?

Prices of a 10 year old Bmw depreciates fast, from 2.2m to around 700k, seems like older ones are more problematic.

Sucking the oil out is purely a time saver, the McDonalds of oil changes.

[sotsira]

In europe you can buy good quality after sales parts and get service and repairs from most mechanics.

In Thailand though, i would use the main dealers.

I've owned a few, Bmw's in the past and would rate them on par with Mercs for quality and reliability,

so nothing to worry about there, if maintained well they go on for years, especially their engines.

[funcat]

In europe you can buy good quality after sales parts and get service and repairs from most mechanics.

In Thailand though, i would use the main dealers.

I've owned a few, Bmw's in the past and would rate them on par with Mercs for quality and reliability,

so nothing to worry about there, if maintained well they go on for years, especially their engines.

I would ad Audi to this group...great cars,but the older models are definitely mistreated and priced almost equally with Honda's,or Toyota's,but absolutely no comparison with the comfort and quality of the ride...

[wandrinstar]

Well Cobra, as i expected , many opinions to come from those who have never used one long term. I've had a U.K reg 3.0 Alpina Coupe years ago , for 2 years, a Second-hand 7, here 20 ago, and my Son had a knackered 3 Series that i loved. Up to You. All Cars IMO have been ruined by Modes and Chips. I Love the B.M except the Crap 4WD Things. You get 100K and 5 years free Waranty im told now. A Car getting a Blow Job. ?. Ah Well.

[JAS21]

I believe that BMW now offer 6years or 120,000Kms. I have a 2007 520d, never had a problem other than a new CD changer ... all under warranty so haven't had to splash any cash yet. Selling it soon if you may be interested.

Edited January 3, 2012 by JAS21

[Cobrabiker]

Well Cobra, as i expected , many opinions to come from those who have never used one long term. I've had a U.K reg 3.0 Alpina Coupe years ago , for 2 years, a Second-hand 7, here 20 ago, and my Son had a knackered 3 Series that i loved. Up to You. All Cars IMO have been ruined by Modes and Chips. I Love the B.M except the Crap 4WD Things. You get 100K and 5 years free Waranty im told now. A Car getting a Blow Job. ?. Ah Well.

So anything after the 100,000km mark, you are asking for trouble right? Well, I went digging for reviews and found out that a lot of them have problems, only few lucky ones don't, seems like these machines are only half good when new, and shall be disposed when old, and not as reliable as a Honda, or rugged as a beattle or the old grandfather mercs, I think mercs is much reliable, for the 700k, it will be a 1994 S280 or S320, good then, I need more research, well for the bimmers, I am too scared to take a gamble, may end up spending the price of a new Honda Jazz and end up with a big headache, when you are in a hurry, the car fail on you, and in the middle of the rain, the car won't start, and so here is what I found:

Potential Problem

• Electrical and steering rack have a potential problem, however if the user regularly maintain their car to an authorized workshop, the problem can be minimized.
  
• The fuel quality is also can be a problem, to reach top performance BMW engine required minimum RON 95 fuel, however lots of BMW owner in Indonesia fill their car with lower RON fuel. Under specification fuel caused a lower performance and also increasing carbon deposits in cylinder head. The fuel consumption of 318i relatively higher than its competitor with the same engine displacement, around 1 ltr for 7 km for city driving and 1 : 9 for extra urban.
  
• The most common fault on the E46 3-Series is with the heater blower fan. The switch breaks, meaning the fan will only work on its fastest setting.
  
• Early 320d and 330d manuals could suffer warped clutch plates. Most will have been replaced, but listen for a scraping noise when releasing the clutch on low-mileage cars. Post-2000 cars have tougher clutches.
  
• Thermostats can fail, so keep an eye on the temperature gauge. Make sure the ventilation fan works on all speeds, too
  
• Ignition Coils, These vehicles have exhibited an unusually high failure of ignition coils. There is one coil for each cylinder, located above the spark plug. The symptom is a misfire and setting the “Service Engine Soon” warning. When we read out the fault codes, we see “Misfire on cylinder X”. They seem to exhibit the symptom most frequently after the engine is fully warm.
  
• Window Regulators, Several users have reported having one or more replaced under warranty. If the window stops moving or begins to make quite a bit of noise, do not continue to try to move it or the drive motor may also be damaged.
  
• PCV Valve, The vacuum valve on these cars has a higher failure rate than the one on the previous 3 Series. Its failure causes rough idling and sets the Service Engine Soon light. If your engine starts to make a honking noise, like a small goose, this valve is the culprit.
  
• Cam Position Sensor, The position sensor for the camshaft will go open, either intermittently or completely. If it fails completely, the engine won’t run. If intermittent, it will die, then restart, run for a while, and repeat the cycle. It usually sets the “Service Engine Soon” warning.
  

• 
  

Edited January 3, 2012 by Cobrabiker

[janverbeem]

Well Cobra, as i expected , many opinions to come from those who have never used one long term. I've had a U.K reg 3.0 Alpina Coupe years ago , for 2 years, a Second-hand 7, here 20 ago, and my Son had a knackered 3 Series that i loved. Up to You. All Cars IMO have been ruined by Modes and Chips. I Love the B.M except the Crap 4WD Things. You get 100K and 5 years free Waranty im told now. A Car getting a Blow Job. ?. Ah Well.

So anything after the 100,000km mark, you are asking for trouble right? Well, I went digging for reviews and found out that a lot of them have problems, only few lucky ones don't, seems like these machines are only half good when new, and shall be disposed when old, and not as reliable as a Honda, or rugged as a beattle or the old grandfather mercs, I think mercs is much reliable, for the 700k, it will be a 1994 S280 or S320, good then, I need more research, well for the bimmers, I am too scared to take a gamble, may end up spending the price of a new Honda Jazz and end up with a big headache, when you are in a hurry, the car fail on you, and in the middle of the rain, the car won't start, and so here is what I found:

Potential Problem

• Electrical and steering rack have a potential problem, however if the user regularly maintain their car to an authorized workshop, the problem can be minimized.
  
• The fuel quality is also can be a problem, to reach top performance BMW engine required minimum RON 95 fuel, however lots of BMW owner in Indonesia fill their car with lower RON fuel. Under specification fuel caused a lower performance and also increasing carbon deposits in cylinder head. The fuel consumption of 318i relatively higher than its competitor with the same engine displacement, around 1 ltr for 7 km for city driving and 1 : 9 for extra urban.
  
• The most common fault on the E46 3-Series is with the heater blower fan. The switch breaks, meaning the fan will only work on its fastest setting.
  
• Early 320d and 330d manuals could suffer warped clutch plates. Most will have been replaced, but listen for a scraping noise when releasing the clutch on low-mileage cars. Post-2000 cars have tougher clutches.
  
• Thermostats can fail, so keep an eye on the temperature gauge. Make sure the ventilation fan works on all speeds, too
  
• Ignition Coils, These vehicles have exhibited an unusually high failure of ignition coils. There is one coil for each cylinder, located above the spark plug. The symptom is a misfire and setting the “Service Engine Soon” warning. When we read out the fault codes, we see “Misfire on cylinder X”. They seem to exhibit the symptom most frequently after the engine is fully warm.
  
• Window Regulators, Several users have reported having one or more replaced under warranty. If the window stops moving or begins to make quite a bit of noise, do not continue to try to move it or the drive motor may also be damaged.
  
• PCV Valve, The vacuum valve on these cars has a higher failure rate than the one on the previous 3 Series. Its failure causes rough idling and sets the Service Engine Soon light. If your engine starts to make a honking noise, like a small goose, this valve is the culprit.
  
• Cam Position Sensor, The position sensor for the camshaft will go open, either intermittently or completely. If it fails completely, the engine won’t run. If intermittent, it will die, then restart, run for a while, and repeat the cycle. It usually sets the “Service Engine Soon” warning.
  

• 
  

I think you have axe to grind with BMW judging from your posts.When i lived in the western world I have driven Bmw for 15 years at a ratio of more than 100.000 Km a year.Never had any significant issues.

Of course I bought them new and seviced them at the dealer instead of buying a 25th hand beamer and getting it serviced with somchai only to show off to friends that I can afford a beamer.

[funcat]

I guess,it comes down to this..."if you can't stand the heat"...don't buy something you can't afford to maintain !...BTW,if you "feel" good in the Honda,maybe this is what you should be driving

[Cobrabiker]

Well, I am refering to this 318i (E46), other models and generations may have perform differently.

[wandrinstar]

JAS21. You are most likely correct, my info was from a Gray Area Firm the offered 100K. and Free Maintainance. They muddle me when they display the Vovo next to BM that are not Gray. As for most of the other comments, as expected .never had one, to expensive , unreliable, my truck never lets me down, and im a Sun Reader.,with a Chang Vest. I Cop for one expert about twice a month.

[Naam]

So Kwasaki, oil change can be done at any shop right? Someone told me that the dealer needs to insert a tube to suck out the engine oil instead of draining it dry like other cars, is this correct?

Prices of a 10 year old Bmw depreciates fast, from 2.2m to around 700k, seems like older ones are more problematic.

Sucking the oil out is purely a time saver, the McDonalds of oil changes.

i'd put a few notches below McDonalds at the level of a street vendor who uses disposed engine oil to fry the chicken feet.

[Naam]

i am extremely happy with my BMW... except when a spare part is needed (happened twice) which is not available in Thailand

[Cobrabiker]

Mixed reviews, I see some happy owners here, I guess just got to be real careful when choosing a used one, and to choose a honest and experience bmw workshop that are capable to solve the problems.

Hi Naam, what year is your car? Is the agent able to order the parts for your car?

[Cobrabiker]

I guess,it comes down to this..."if you can't stand the heat"...don't buy something you can't afford to maintain !...BTW,if you "feel" good in the Honda,maybe this is what you should be driving

Thanks for your advice. I prefer to base my buying decision on facts and not what and how I feel.

[ignis]

Thai friend buys a new car every 10 years, his last a 523 was good and no problems for 6 years, always maintained by BMW, then he stated to have problems, all electrical, all small but many times had to order a new part, he ended up selling before the 10 years and now has a Camry [Toyota ]

I have a older Audi A6 same with small electrical faults, thankfully know someone Thai that fixes them + cheap.

[funcat]

I guess,it comes down to this..."if you can't stand the heat"...don't buy something you can't afford to maintain !...BTW,if you "feel" good in the Honda,maybe this is what you should be driving

Thanks for your advice. I prefer to base my buying decision on facts and not what and how I feel.

No offense...but I "feel" good in my Audi and take it for fun rides...I also have a Honda for shopping and use it during the times,when I need to wait for some spare part..

[Naam]

Mixed reviews, I see some happy owners here, I guess just got to be real careful when choosing a used one, and to choose a honest and experience bmw workshop that are capable to solve the problems.

Hi Naam, what year is your car? Is the agent able to order the parts for your car?

my 850 is an old lady built in 1991 and imported from U.K. to Thailand in 1992. some parts are available in Thailand, others have to be ordered abroad. until now i was rather lucky but waiting two or three weeks for a water pump or another essential part is not funny.

for "younger" models spare parts shouldn't be a problem.

[Cobrabiker]

Thai friend buys a new car every 10 years, his last a 523 was good and no problems for 6 years, always maintained by BMW, then he stated to have problems, all electrical, all small but many times had to order a new part, he ended up selling before the 10 years and now has a Camry [Toyota ]

I have a older Audi A6 same with small electrical faults, thankfully know someone Thai that fixes them + cheap.

A good example of an agent maintained car and yet, problems after problems. I read about an article many years ago about a higher end model Bimmer got into an accident and the safety feature did not allow the driver to release the safety belt, and was trapped.

Well, maybe the older BMW with not so much high tech ECU programs, are still reliable, and durable.

[Cobrabiker]

The more complicated a car, the more things are likely to go wrong with it. This usually means that the more money you spend on a car, the more problems you'll have, since more expensive cars have more options. I was shocked to read a review of a new $200,000 Aston Martin that rattled like hell. Then there are the Land Rovers that tend to catch fire that rich people leave on the sides of the road, like Arab sheiks who drive cars until they break and then go buy new ones.

Consumer Reports rightly reports that cars with fewer options, aka "really boring cars," are more reliable. This is no surprise. What's unfortunate is what I see as a rapid quality decline of premium brands, where you pay top dollar and expect high levels of reliability. Mercedes is a good example of a former bulletproof manufacturer now producing shoddy products. BMW is there too, with amazing sales figures that provides them little incentive to change their ways.

I also wonder if the SUV craze contributes to the lowering quality standards of luxury automobiles. Americans are spending $40,000-$50,000 on American made trucks, glorified pick ups made with cheap materials of dubious reliability. What does it mean when people unload this kind of cash on such junk?

If my garage caught fire right this moment and I had to buy a new car, it would likely be Japanese:

Nissan 350Z

Infiniti G35 Coupe

Subaru Impreza WRX

etc.

[wandrinstar]

Ive found a new battery solves many stupid probs. When my battery is tired the left window wont go down without the ignition on first stage. A new battery sets of the warning lights ive never noticed before , so theres an extra ten glowing leds that mean nothing.!!.The Battery Cooling fans blows a cloud of dust in your face, plus loads of clikking solenoids that again you never heard from for a year or so...now theres Technical for you. .

[Cobrabiker]

Hi funcat, Audi is a good car, just like benz, I think I will get a benz, as I know how they perform over time. My grandparent had an old 200, my father drove benz all his life, my brother had a S320 before, and all never have much issue like electrical or other major problems.

Older days and the new lower end BMW are what I beleive still reliable, thanks all for the inputs.

[funcat]

Hi funcat, Audi is a good car, just like benz, I think I will get a benz, as I know how they perform over time. My grandparent had an old 200, my father drove benz all his life, my brother had a S320 before, and all never have much issue like electrical or other major problems.

Older days and the new lower end BMW are what I beleive still reliable, thanks all for the inputs.

Good choice....you can always stick a Toyota motor in it... ...and keep the bike for fun !

[Cobrabiker]

That will missed out all the fun, the best thing about driving a benz is to be able to listen to its engine sound, just beautiful, not too loud, not too powerful, just nice.

[Kwasaki]

So Kwasaki, oil change can be done at any shop right? Someone told me that the dealer needs to insert a tube to suck out the engine oil instead of draining it dry like other cars, is this correct?

Prices of a 10 year old Bmw depreciates fast, from 2.2m to around 700k, seems like older ones are more problematic.

Yes you can do the oil change yourself, same as any car.

Sucking oil out instead of draining it is wrong IMO.

From what I have read BM's hold there price better here than England, so initial cost Thailand probably due to import taxes.

As for buying cars go I would stick with the ones assembled in Thailand, eg. Taxi firms could tell you what's best.

Edited January 4, 2012 by Kwasaki

[Kwasaki]

Mixed reviews, I see some happy owners here, I guess just got to be real careful when choosing a used one, and to choose a honest and experience bmw workshop that are capable to solve the problems.

Hi Naam, what year is your car? Is the agent able to order the parts for your car?

my 850 is an old lady built in 1991 and imported from U.K. to Thailand in 1992. some parts are available in Thailand, others have to be ordered abroad. until now i was rather lucky but waiting two or three weeks for a water pump or another essential part is not funny.

for "younger" models spare parts shouldn't be a problem.

850 my favourite of all BM's is it a V12.

[culicine]

Hi funcat, Audi is a good car, just like benz, I think I will get a benz, as I know how they perform over time. My grandparent had an old 200, my father drove benz all his life, my brother had a S320 before, and all never have much issue like electrical or other major problems.

Older days and the new lower end BMW are what I beleive still reliable, thanks all for the inputs.

Good choice....you can always stick a Toyota motor in it... ...and keep the bike for fun !

Plenty of old BMW's with 1/2JZ's in them. I'd imagine those engine parts would be easier to source; plus plenty of options for modifications. I recall a poster here had a 330 BMW and had electrical problems. I seem to recall it cost 130K to get it sorted.